From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Thu Jun 12 18:48:33 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K6qpb-3A9knw-04-Adc.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Thu, 12 Jun 2008 18:48:33 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K6qpb-3A9knw-04-Adc; Thu, 12 Jun 2008 17:43:27 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.210] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K6qpb-3A9knw-04 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Thu, 12 Jun 2008 17:43:27 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K6qpa-0000tc-ML for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Thu, 12 Jun 2008 17:43:27 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 994DB85EA34; Thu, 12 Jun 2008 13:43:25 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 11112-10; Thu, 12 Jun 2008 13:43:25 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 1D7FA85EFD7; Thu, 12 Jun 2008 13:43:25 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Thu, 12 Jun 2008 13:42:45 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id B5C9085E2F9 for ; Thu, 12 Jun 2008 09:45:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 12760-04 for ; Thu, 12 Jun 2008 09:45:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.91]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 81A0485E172 for ; Thu, 12 Jun 2008 09:45:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([62.49.20.172]) by anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 4.67) id 1K6n7c-000LBL-CQ for davidpilling@freelists.org; Thu, 12 Jun 2008 13:45:49 +0000 Message-ID: Date: Thu, 12 Jun 2008 14:43:53 +0100 To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: David Pilling Subject: [softwarelist] Converting documents to Quark References: <4fa253dd79chris@highpath.net> <4fa7c1ff54rkp@par.me.uk> <$0Y1kEDV0UQIFweu@pilling.demon.co.uk> <1C29EE614F1E490CB44C84BEE9477A11@PC01> <4fa9072a08chris@highpath.net> <4faa95cd8dchris@highpath.net> In-Reply-To: <4faa95cd8dchris@highpath.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-S () X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 741 X-Approved-By: flist@pilling.demon.co.uk X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: david@pilling.demon.co.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=soJmbx_OIcsA:10 a=PvIxqy8V1SMA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=dqhQn4rJAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=4kKp12NNWYV4bY1ohMUA:9 a=x1kQsyywlXtEP82MR4cA:7 a=ro9lXtxNScBZteR2lHGKlYnL-TEA:4 a=50e4U0PicR4A:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.3.0/1499] Hi, Someone has approached me with a book he has done in Impression. His publishers want it in Quark format. The book is structured as lots of frames with text in - there's no large body text that flows through the document, instead each page has four non-linked frames with text in. I wondered if anyone has any suggestions as to how to tackle this problem. I'm considering writing some software to help, if I do that I want to make the software useful for the users of Ovation Pro. I can load the documents into Ovation Pro, the question is what format to save them out in? Approaches I have tried and discarded are - print to PDF, PDF to Word conversion (loses all the style information), save text as DDF, DDF to Word using Techwriter (hard work because there are so many stories). -- David Pilling email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.davidpilling.net post: David Pilling P.O. Box 22 Thornton Cleveleys Blackpool. FY5 1LR UK fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Fri Jun 13 11:38:52 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K6upS-4J4000-08-FAH.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 11:38:52 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K6upS-4J4000-08-FAH; Thu, 12 Jun 2008 21:59:34 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.245] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K6upS-4J4000-08 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Thu, 12 Jun 2008 21:59:34 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K6upR-0005iC-8w for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Thu, 12 Jun 2008 21:59:34 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id BDF118600AE; Thu, 12 Jun 2008 17:59:32 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 05209-01; Thu, 12 Jun 2008 17:59:32 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 370B386008A; Thu, 12 Jun 2008 17:59:32 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Thu, 12 Jun 2008 17:58:54 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 70FEA860081 for ; Thu, 12 Jun 2008 17:58:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 05074-07 for ; Thu, 12 Jun 2008 17:58:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: from smtp.talktalk.net (smtp-out-4.talktalk.net [62.24.128.234]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 1F5B286007B for ; Thu, 12 Jun 2008 17:58:53 -0400 (EDT) X-Path: TTSMTP X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AvlMAE84UUhZ8vRrPGdsb2JhbACBP5BUAQEBAS2cZg Received: from unknown (HELO Iyonix.) ([89.242.244.107]) by smtp.talktalk.net with ESMTP; 12 Jun 2008 22:58:51 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: William Lack To: davidpilling@freelists.org Date: Thu, 12 Jun 2008 22:58:47 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] Converting documents to Quark Message-ID: <4fae7a6338williamlack@clara.net> In-Reply-To: References: <4fa253dd79chris@highpath.net> <4fa7c1ff54rkp@par.me.uk> <$0Y1kEDV0UQIFweu@pilling.demon.co.uk> <1C29EE614F1E490CB44C84BEE9477A11@PC01> <4fa9072a08chris@highpath.net> <4faa95cd8dchris@highpath.net> User-Agent: Pluto/3.04e (RISC-OS/5.13) Content-Type: text/plain X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 742 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: williamlack@clara.net Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=soJmbx_OIcsA:10 a=PvIxqy8V1SMA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=pZPhcQmMAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=zOnD_fZl17L2KHvr-rgA:9 a=iRReamGWLxXZ62SN21MA:7 a=z6g5NpvrvfbO6EyifjB7FZp5VbgA:4 a=nRm1o29pdjkA:10 a=LY0hPdMaydYA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.3.0/1499] On 12 Jun, David Pilling wrote: > Hi, > Someone has approached me with a book he has done in Impression. His > publishers want it in Quark format. The book is structured as lots of > frames with text in - there's no large body text that flows through the > document, instead each page has four non-linked frames with text in. > I wondered if anyone has any suggestions as to how to tackle this > problem. > I'm considering writing some software to help, if I do that I want to > make the software useful for the users of Ovation Pro. > I can load the documents into Ovation Pro, the question is what format > to save them out in? > Approaches I have tried and discarded are - print to PDF, PDF to Word > conversion (loses all the style information), save text as DDF, DDF to > Word using Techwriter (hard work because there are so many stories). David Breakwell's !MakeRTF (which runs well uner Aemulor) would make a good job at converting the styles but would probably ignore the frame information. -- William Lack --------------------- williamlack@clara.net County Series: http://home.clara.net/williamlack/index.htm To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Fri Jun 13 11:38:59 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K6w6U-3Mhknw-02-DtF.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 11:38:59 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K6w6U-3Mhknw-02-DtF; Thu, 12 Jun 2008 23:21:14 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.210] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K6w6U-3Mhknw-02 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Thu, 12 Jun 2008 23:21:14 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K6w6T-0002CZ-BQ for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Thu, 12 Jun 2008 23:21:13 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 68A2985FCCF; Thu, 12 Jun 2008 19:21:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 10408-07; Thu, 12 Jun 2008 19:21:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id E195C85FD1B; Thu, 12 Jun 2008 19:21:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Thu, 12 Jun 2008 19:20:33 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id C95F585FCCF for ; Thu, 12 Jun 2008 19:20:33 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 10299-07 for ; Thu, 12 Jun 2008 19:20:33 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mail4.webfaction.com (mail4.webfaction.com [74.52.233.2]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 5A57085FC94 for ; Thu, 12 Jun 2008 19:20:32 -0400 (EDT) Received: from abacus.local (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by mail4.webfaction.com (8.13.1/8.13.3) with ESMTP id m5CNKOYp023336 for ; Thu, 12 Jun 2008 18:20:27 -0500 From: David Boddie To: davidpilling@freelists.org Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Converting documents to Quark Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2008 01:20:22 +0200 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.6 (enterprise 0.20070907.709405) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200806130120.22487.david@boddie.org.uk> X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 743 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: david@boddie.org.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=9IXqiQiop7cA:10 a=6AePAfrS9bgA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=hc1URTY5BZPIwHikHCUA:9 a=8ehjAbkNYBfMH74eFmAA:7 a=-mcBhtRXZu60k8MTQM0e-45LHrUA:4 a=LY0hPdMaydYA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.3.0/1499] On Thu, 12 Jun 2008 14:43:53 +0100, David Pilling wrote: > Someone has approached me with a book he has done in Impression. His > publishers want it in Quark format. The book is structured as lots of > frames with text in - there's no large body text that flows through the > document, instead each page has four non-linked frames with text in. > > I wondered if anyone has any suggestions as to how to tackle this problem. The non-linked text problem or the interoperability with Quark problem? > I'm considering writing some software to help, if I do that I want to make > the software useful for the users of Ovation Pro. > > I can load the documents into Ovation Pro, the question is what format to > save them out in? I suppose you'll either have to choose another intermediate format that can keep the layout information or - if you have access to Quark running on a Mac - hope that Quark has some kind of automation interface you can use to insert the text in the right places. > Approaches I have tried and discarded are - print to PDF, PDF to Word > conversion (loses all the style information), save text as DDF, DDF to Word > using Techwriter (hard work because there are so many stories). Is there any chance the publisher can accept another format that Quark can import fairly reliably? David To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Fri Jun 13 11:53:46 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K76mi-3Czknw-08-BjX.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 11:53:46 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K76mi-3Czknw-08-BjX; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 10:45:32 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.211] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K76mi-3Czknw-08 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 10:45:32 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K76mi-0005oz-1R for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 10:45:32 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 8BAC8860218; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 06:45:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 23573-07; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 06:45:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 083328602D1; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 06:45:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Fri, 13 Jun 2008 06:44:52 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 2746486025A for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 05:56:53 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 20095-02 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 05:56:53 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mx7.orcon.net.nz (mx7.orcon.net.nz [219.88.242.57]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id D2BA785F3E5 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 05:56:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: from Debian-exim by mx7.orcon.net.nz with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1K761a-0006FB-2I for davidpilling@freelists.org; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 21:56:50 +1200 Received: from [60.234.184.59] (helo=mysteriousmrf.my.home) by mx7.orcon.net.nz with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1K761Z-0006Ew-JY for davidpilling@freelists.org; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 21:56:49 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Robert Greenfield To: davidpilling@freelists.org Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2008 21:58:20 +1200 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Converting documents to Quark Message-ID: <4faebc43c0monster@caverock.net.nz> In-Reply-To: References: <4fa253dd79chris@highpath.net> <4fa7c1ff54rkp@par.me.uk> <$0Y1kEDV0UQIFweu@pilling.demon.co.uk> <1C29EE614F1E490CB44C84BEE9477A11@PC01> <4fa9072a08chris@highpath.net> <4faa95cd8dchris@highpath.net> User-Agent: Pluto/3.04c (RISC-OS/4.39) Content-Type: text/plain X-DSPAM-Check: by mx7.orcon.net.nz on Fri, 13 Jun 2008 21:56:50 +1200 X-DSPAM-Result: Innocent X-DSPAM-Processed: Fri Jun 13 21:56:50 2008 X-DSPAM-Confidence: 0.9898 X-DSPAM-Probability: 0.0000 X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 744 X-Approved-By: flist@pilling.demon.co.uk X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: monster@caverock.net.nz Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=9IXqiQiop7cA:10 a=6AePAfrS9bgA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=an63MGxJAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=lguLTVsQ9u5dMk1QfTEA:9 a=2eswI0Lxvph89WHSotYA:7 a=NM4b2R6FuFGjom7gzb1tFQxOy1EA:4 a=LY0hPdMaydYA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.3.0/1501] On 13 Jun, David Pilling wrote: > I'm considering writing some software to help, if I do that I want to > make the software useful for the users of Ovation Pro. > I can load the documents into Ovation Pro, the question is what format > to save them out in? I don't use any DTP/graphics apps except on RISC OS so from my idealistic viewpoint: A few months ago I mooted the possibility of Ovation Pro and Artworks interacting more closely and could a possible route to Quark be: OvPro -> Artworks -> Xara product that can open Artworks file -> into Quark This idea relies on Xara reading multipage Artworks2 files. My other question (again from my idealistic viewpoint) - could the publishers really not handle using OvationPro themselves? I really like using OvationPro (and Artworks), so I concede that I am quite biased... regards, -- Robert Greenfield via RISC OS - http://www.webmonster.co.nz/ To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Fri Jun 13 12:08:47 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K76zB-2W0Vbs-01-BX4.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 12:08:47 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K76zB-2W0Vbs-01-BX4; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 10:58:25 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.95] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K76zB-2W0Vbs-01 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 10:58:25 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K76z8-0002oP-H7 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 10:58:25 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 535C58603D2; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 06:58:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 24672-09; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 06:58:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id B63828603CF; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 06:58:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Fri, 13 Jun 2008 06:57:40 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 18120860357 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 06:57:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 24192-08 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 06:57:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.186]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id B2130860283 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 06:57:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: from bach (88-134-110-213-dynip.superkabel.de [88.134.110.213]) by mrelayeu.kundenserver.de (node=mrelayeu2) with ESMTP (Nemesis) id 0MKwtQ-1K76yP3q61-0004XQ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 12:57:38 +0200 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Converting documents to Quark To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: Martin Wuerthner X-Editor: EmailEdit 1.50 Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2008 12:52:19 +0200 Message-ID: References: <4fa253dd79chris@highpath.net> <4fa7c1ff54rkp@par.me.uk> <$0Y1kEDV0UQIFweu@pilling.demon.co.uk> <1C29EE614F1E490CB44C84BEE9477A11@PC01> <4fa9072a08chris@highpath.net> <4faa95cd8dchris@highpath.net> <4faebc43c0monster@caverock.net.nz> In-Reply-To: <4faebc43c0monster@caverock.net.nz> X-Organization: MW Software User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/5.12 (MsgServe/3.42) (RISC-OS/5.11) POPstar/2.05 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX1/obcqo7OUn8qzoFsUEciFzUC0/ozHrA66d8C+ +2vZw35ElERehrYkf8RtPAHUqxWh+S0A0xzfyxWhBrsZvarQF7 MOvApXZyMyk50Wpj2XEOJAVm+XK04bw X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 745 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: public@mw-software.com Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=9IXqiQiop7cA:10 a=6AePAfrS9bgA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=kFP67zsVP_RntQSkb8QA:9 a=kQFXibVal23ui0P93VUA:7 a=CNOBO7LaZID9IgqDMzl2Y_mCOi0A:4 a=fl4ZfBcLCrEA:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.3.0/1501] In message <4faebc43c0monster@caverock.net.nz> Robert Greenfield wrote: > A few months ago I mooted the possibility of Ovation Pro and Artworks > interacting more closely and could a possible route to Quark be: > OvPro -> Artworks -> Xara product that can open Artworks file -> into Quark Sorry, but not a single one of these steps works. > This idea relies on Xara reading multipage Artworks2 files. Xara does not even read single page ArtWorks files. However, your suggestion t also relies on ArtWorks reading OvationPro files and it relies on Quark reading Xara files and none of these assumptions is correct. The only theoretical route from OvationPro to Xara is via PDF and that would not involve ArtWorks. Simply print to PDF from OvationPro and import into Xara. But what then? The whole thing really boils down to the question of what Quark can import. As long as we have not established that, everything else is pointless guesswork. Martin -- --------------------------------------------------------------------- Martin Wuerthner MW Software martin@mw-software.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Fri Jun 13 12:08:51 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K76zD-4Dxknw-06-BX2.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 12:08:51 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K76zD-4Dxknw-06-BX2; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 10:58:27 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.210] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K76zD-4Dxknw-06 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 10:58:27 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K76z8-0006XX-SI for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 10:58:27 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id AEADA860283; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 06:58:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 24684-04-4; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 06:58:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 24A548603A8; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 06:58:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Fri, 13 Jun 2008 06:57:40 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 48374860283 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 06:57:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 24246-03 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 06:57:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.171]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id E01B1860355 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 06:57:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: from bach (88-134-110-213-dynip.superkabel.de [88.134.110.213]) by mrelayeu.kundenserver.de (node=mrelayeu2) with ESMTP (Nemesis) id 0MKwtQ-1K76yQ2ZeH-0004XQ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 12:57:38 +0200 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Converting documents to Quark To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: Martin Wuerthner X-Editor: EmailEdit 1.50 Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2008 12:57:41 +0200 Message-ID: References: <4fa253dd79chris@highpath.net> <4fa7c1ff54rkp@par.me.uk> <$0Y1kEDV0UQIFweu@pilling.demon.co.uk> <1C29EE614F1E490CB44C84BEE9477A11@PC01> <4fa9072a08chris@highpath.net> <4faa95cd8dchris@highpath.net> In-Reply-To: X-Organization: MW Software User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/5.12 (MsgServe/3.42) (RISC-OS/5.11) POPstar/2.05 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX18TWzVBzKu1qKA7pO8agoqLyhaXKLsrGdRRQHE 373VxJnewvDg3nI6A+APeC3TAsWWjjk+SDKMJJmRMdP5ldS+iy msJqsLskDloskEUTnE3S6IWexLKIXY3 X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 746 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: public@mw-software.com Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=9IXqiQiop7cA:10 a=6AePAfrS9bgA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=z7ZbZVfPsuc4-kd-OFoA:9 a=tUUGcpBuh8QeLsjEDY8A:7 a=BSprTrTFTySKIPICXkTcI7e6seAA:4 a=fl4ZfBcLCrEA:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.3.0/1501] In message David Pilling wrote: > Someone has approached me with a book he has done in Impression. His > publishers want it in Quark format. The book is structured as lots of > frames with text in - there's no large body text that flows through the > document, instead each page has four non-linked frames with text in. > I wondered if anyone has any suggestions as to how to tackle this > problem. > I'm considering writing some software to help, if I do that I want to > make the software useful for the users of Ovation Pro. > I can load the documents into Ovation Pro, the question is what format > to save them out in? The best approach would be to output Quark's own tagged DDL format, but such a converter would be rather specialized. > Approaches I have tried and discarded are - print to PDF, PDF to Word > conversion (loses all the style information), save text as DDF, DDF to > Word using Techwriter (hard work because there are so many stories). RTF output is probably the only solution that retains the style information. Martin -- --------------------------------------------------------------------- Martin Wuerthner MW Software martin@mw-software.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Fri Jun 13 12:08:51 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K76zP-4F5knw-06-BWq.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 12:08:51 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K76zP-4F5knw-06-BWq; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 10:58:39 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.106] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K76zP-4F5knw-06 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 10:58:39 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K76zN-0004Li-Fq for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 10:58:39 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 71702860373; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 06:58:35 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 24772-07; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 06:58:35 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id E5D898603C9; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 06:58:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Fri, 13 Jun 2008 06:57:55 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 737CD860373 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 06:57:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 24273-08 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 06:57:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: from smtp01.altohiway.com (smtp01.altohiway.com [195.12.4.238]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 1C8ED860389 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 06:57:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: from websrv.quantel.com ([195.12.20.34]) by smtp01.altohiway.com (8.13.6/8.13.7) with ESMTP id m5DAvmcS030874 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 11:57:48 +0100 In-Reply-To: <4faebc43c0monster@caverock.net.nz> To: davidpilling@freelists.org Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Converting documents to Quark MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: From: Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2008 11:57:45 +0100 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 747 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: Andy.Ling@Quantel.Com Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=9IXqiQiop7cA:10 a=6AePAfrS9bgA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=ldqt4VukAAAA:8 a=6D-Hy7tQAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=dJnavhzFDdIwLf_pE78A:9 a=5CxVnujLIAGesLSdn7EA:7 a=IU3wsE7863szBJetx3XWXQ35AucA:4 a=jOOiQbAeiJwA:10 a=LY0hPdMaydYA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.3.0/1501] On 13 Jun, David Pilling wrote: > I'm considering writing some software to help, if I do that I want to > make the software useful for the users of Ovation Pro. Something like this might help :- http://www.iwriteiam.nl/QX.html Although it is a bit old and probably wont help for anything other than Quark > I can load the documents into Ovation Pro, the question is what format > to save them out in? XML springs to mind. It might be worth looking at this :- http://tinyurl.com/3gvemu It looks like Quark could import XML and this may be useful for other situations. Andy Ling -- This e-mail is intended for the named addressees only. Its contents may be privileged or confidential and should be treated as such. If you are not an intended recipient please notify the sender immediately; do not copy, distribute, or take any action based on this e-mail; and then delete it. In the pursuit of its legitimate business activities and its conformance with relevant legislation, Quantel Ltd. may access any e-mail (including attachments) it originates and receives, for potential scrutiny. To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Fri Jun 13 12:23:52 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K77FN-43kVbs-01-BGs.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 12:23:52 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K77FN-43kVbs-01-BGs; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 11:15:09 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.72] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K77FN-43kVbs-01 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 11:15:09 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K77FJ-0000lj-4S for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 11:15:08 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 92E5E85F907; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 07:15:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 25963-06; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 07:15:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id F384E85F583; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 07:15:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Fri, 13 Jun 2008 07:14:25 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 9B5C785F907 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 07:14:25 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 25866-10 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 07:14:25 -0400 (EDT) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.187]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 4724685F8C3 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 07:14:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: from bach (88-134-110-213-dynip.superkabel.de [88.134.110.213]) by mrelayeu.kundenserver.de (node=mrelayeu7) with ESMTP (Nemesis) id 0ML2xA-1K77Ed43td-0005mN; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 13:14:24 +0200 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Converting documents to Quark To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: Martin Wuerthner X-Editor: EmailEdit 1.50 Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2008 13:14:53 +0200 Message-ID: <9c45c3ae4f.martin@bach.planiverse.com> References: In-Reply-To: X-Organization: MW Software User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/5.12 (MsgServe/3.42) (RISC-OS/5.11) POPstar/2.05 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX1+FgblpYXLK4CbshCZ1bql45AvaYI6tWSOwVm9 tDPmIkccjnqMl80Kb7tG1UYCAOjgzQutsRFp3zzexNWW8yqNJ/ 7Eevu6vw5NGcXyBzRJVhaJrar0rnOYA X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 748 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: public@mw-software.com Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=9IXqiQiop7cA:10 a=6AePAfrS9bgA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=ldqt4VukAAAA:8 a=6D-Hy7tQAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=7wvTIznthyJcxplVbJ4A:9 a=H95BT_QY6ZP1bJhur0kA:7 a=_ps43JNKbU4sw9eEPwGDNhxVvEIA:4 a=jOOiQbAeiJwA:10 a=Skpf-qo106oA:10 a=fl4ZfBcLCrEA:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.3.0/1501] In message Andy.Ling@Quantel.Com wrote: > On 13 Jun, David Pilling wrote: >> I'm considering writing some software to help, if I do that I want to >> make the software useful for the users of Ovation Pro. > Something like this might help :- > http://www.iwriteiam.nl/QX.html > Although it is a bit old and probably wont help for anything other > than Quark Also, it would be completely mad to try and *write* that format when Quark has a perfectly well documented text based DDL format that was created for precisely the purpose of interoperability. The only merit in reverse engineering the binary format is in being able to *read* Quark binary files. >> I can load the documents into Ovation Pro, the question is what format >> to save them out in? > XML springs to mind. It might be worth looking at this :- > http://tinyurl.com/3gvemu > It looks like Quark could import XML and this may be useful > for other situations. XML is not a file format, it is just an underlying structure for defining file formats. So, writing a converter that creates QXML files, the XML based Quark file format, would still only be useful for one particular situation, namely converting to Quark. Martin -- --------------------------------------------------------------------- Martin Wuerthner MW Software martin@mw-software.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Fri Jun 13 12:23:54 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K77NL-1iSVbs-02-B8u.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 12:23:54 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K77NL-1iSVbs-02-B8u; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 11:23:23 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.210] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K77NL-1iSVbs-02 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 11:23:23 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K77NH-0000bZ-0l for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 11:23:23 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 4BD01860199; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 07:23:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 26576-01; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 07:23:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id B81A68600D4; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 07:23:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Fri, 13 Jun 2008 07:22:40 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 0827085FF58 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 07:22:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 26407-06 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 07:22:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: from anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.87]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id C998D85F913 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 07:22:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([62.49.20.172]) by anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 4.68) id 1K77Mb-0005Go-Nf for davidpilling@freelists.org; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 11:22:37 +0000 Message-ID: Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2008 12:21:33 +0100 To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: David Pilling Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Converting documents to Quark References: <4faebc43c0monster@caverock.net.nz> In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-S () X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 749 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: flist@pilling.demon.co.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=9IXqiQiop7cA:10 a=6AePAfrS9bgA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=ldqt4VukAAAA:8 a=6D-Hy7tQAAAA:8 a=dqhQn4rJAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=qInVw--bF8Mu4uUVu3oA:9 a=YK4mnzTqXivgMwOt6JAA:7 a=K1h1dsj3AN1sPUk7zA0NY_xyKmUA:4 a=jOOiQbAeiJwA:10 a=Skpf-qo106oA:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.3.0/1501] In message , Andy.Ling@Quantel.Com writes >http://www.iwriteiam.nl/QX.html That's awesome (someone has reverse engineered the Quark file format), I could have had fun with that once. >XML springs to mind. It might be worth looking at this :- >http://tinyurl.com/3gvemu Actually that is the perfect solution, I'd been wondering if such a thing existed (a text format for entire Quark documents). My inclination this morning is to provide a new option "save all stories as RTF" on the grounds it is simple and easy to get working. -- David Pilling email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.davidpilling.net post: David Pilling P.O. Box 22 Thornton Cleveleys Blackpool. FY5 1LR UK fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Fri Jun 13 12:38:47 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K77TD-1Tn000-07-B32.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 12:38:47 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K77TD-1Tn000-07-B32; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 11:29:27 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.211] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K77TD-1Tn000-07 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 11:29:27 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K77T8-0002IE-Ii for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 11:29:27 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 0AD518600D4; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 07:29:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 26837-06; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 07:29:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 84D9E8601C1; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 07:29:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Fri, 13 Jun 2008 07:28:44 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id E343B860163 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 07:28:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 26715-07 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 07:28:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: from anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.87]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id AF739860156 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 07:28:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([62.49.20.172]) by anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 4.68) id 1K77SU-0003AQ-OR for davidpilling@freelists.org; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 11:28:43 +0000 Message-ID: Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2008 12:27:17 +0100 To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: David Pilling Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Converting documents to Quark References: <200806130120.22487.david@boddie.org.uk> In-Reply-To: <200806130120.22487.david@boddie.org.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-S () X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 750 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: flist@pilling.demon.co.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=9IXqiQiop7cA:10 a=6AePAfrS9bgA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=dqhQn4rJAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=v4b77FUp4c6MWGSKJaEA:9 a=-G-1vF0HNi6cajdmp1EA:7 a=0_J5TI4H5B3xzIWK_01JtYo3FdQA:4 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.3.0/1501] In message <200806130120.22487.david@boddie.org.uk>, David Boddie writes >The non-linked text problem or the interoperability with Quark problem? Well both. I know I wrote OP so that you can't link two frames which both contain text - what a stupid limitation... >I suppose you'll either have to choose another intermediate format that can >keep the layout information That format being? >Is there any chance the publisher can accept another format that Quark can >import fairly reliably? Well yes. One reason I ask the question here is that it gives you a chance to say what you'd like, if I'm going to do any work it might as well be useful to everyone. You might know what works well with Quark, or what would be useful in general. -- David Pilling email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.davidpilling.net post: David Pilling P.O. Box 22 Thornton Cleveleys Blackpool. FY5 1LR UK fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Fri Jun 13 16:08:54 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K7Aod-1RkVbs-03-GE8.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:08:54 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K7Aod-1RkVbs-03-GE8; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 15:03:47 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.210] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K7Aod-1RkVbs-03 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 15:03:47 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K7AoX-0005hD-NQ for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 15:03:47 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 25A93860058; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 11:03:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 16819-03; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 11:03:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 89636860105; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 11:03:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Fri, 13 Jun 2008 11:03:02 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id CE962860078 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 11:03:02 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 16713-05 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 11:03:02 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mail.o2.co.uk (yoda.london.02.net [82.132.130.151]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 7160186006E for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 11:03:02 -0400 (EDT) Received: from [192.168.1.68] (78.86.89.89) by mail.o2.co.uk (8.0.013.3) (authenticated as phillipmarsden@o2.co.uk) id 4851DD95001ADA6A for davidpilling@freelists.org; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:03:00 +0100 Message-ID: <48528C22.7000007@btinternet.com> Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:02:58 +0100 From: Phillip Marsden User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 (Windows/20080421) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: davidpilling@freelists.org Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Converting documents to Quark References: <4fa253dd79chris@highpath.net> <4fa7c1ff54rkp@par.me.uk> <$0Y1kEDV0UQIFweu@pilling.demon.co.uk> <1C29EE614F1E490CB44C84BEE9477A11@PC01> <4fa9072a08chris@highpath.net> <4faa95cd8dchris@highpath.net> <4faebc43c0monster@caverock.net.nz> In-Reply-To: <4faebc43c0monster@caverock.net.nz> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 751 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: phillip.marsden@btinternet.com Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=9IXqiQiop7cA:10 a=6AePAfrS9bgA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=Qyztg64fU8K2pArAv4kA:9 a=raAJAX2eAW0LAW_00dcA:7 a=p1r1H4y7AhvWc01FyY6FN5uxqEQA:4 a=Nr7Pmq0tdocA:10 a=Dqp-bWOt5EsA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.3.0/1501] Robert Greenfield wrote: > On 13 Jun, David Pilling wrote: > > >> I'm considering writing some software to help, if I do that I want to >> make the software useful for the users of Ovation Pro. >> > > >> I can load the documents into Ovation Pro, the question is what format >> to save them out in? >> > > I don't use any DTP/graphics apps except on RISC OS so from my idealistic > viewpoint: > > A few months ago I mooted the possibility of Ovation Pro and Artworks > interacting more closely and could a possible route to Quark be: > > OvPro -> Artworks -> Xara product that can open Artworks file -> into Quark > > This idea relies on Xara reading multipage Artworks2 files. > > My other question (again from my idealistic viewpoint) - could the > publishers really not handle using OvationPro themselves? > I really like using OvationPro (and Artworks), so I concede that I am > quite biased... > Biased and over-idealistic. Mr Pilling was asking for practical suggestions. As for expecting the publisher to cope with Ovation Pro (which, for all its delights, is a very minor player and one which the publisher has probably never heard of) I despair that you could even make the suggestion. :o( -- Regards, Phillip Marsden For quality bespoke acoustic guitars phillip.marsden@btinternet.com To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Fri Jun 13 20:39:01 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K7F1r-09mknw-07-C0u.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 20:39:01 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K7F1r-09mknw-07-C0u; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 19:33:43 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.210] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K7F1r-09mknw-07 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 19:33:43 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K7F1q-0001n5-FB for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 19:33:43 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id BE89485FA71; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 15:33:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 10266-07; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 15:33:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 3C4BE85FB96; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 15:33:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Fri, 13 Jun 2008 15:33:03 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 5FCEA85FB5B for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 15:33:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 10230-01 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 15:33:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mtaout03-winn.ispmail.ntl.com (mtaout03-winn.ispmail.ntl.com [81.103.221.49]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id DBBB285FA71 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 15:33:02 -0400 (EDT) Received: from aamtaout02-winn.ispmail.ntl.com ([81.103.221.35]) by mtaout03-winn.ispmail.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20080613193832.OHLR16629.mtaout03-winn.ispmail.ntl.com@aamtaout02-winn.ispmail.ntl.com> for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 20:38:32 +0100 Received: from risco.home ([81.111.57.237]) by aamtaout02-winn.ispmail.ntl.com with SMTP id <20080613193607.BETY29365.aamtaout02-winn.ispmail.ntl.com@risco.home> for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 20:36:07 +0100 Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2008 20:28:17 +0100 (BST) From: Anthony Hilton Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Converting documents to Quark To: Ovation Pro List In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 752 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: ajh@tinshill.f9.co.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=9IXqiQiop7cA:10 a=6AePAfrS9bgA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=eS9rpW3SGjTkiDU01qEA:9 a=IdfR1hcMrW-mY5OjVhkA:7 a=H9wF1J4ZwUa4N5TnjTFXUMM3JHgA:4 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.3.0/1501] In on Thu 12 Jun, David Pilling wrote: > Hi, > > Someone has approached me with a book he has done in Impression. His > publishers want it in Quark format. The book is structured as lots of > frames with text in - there's no large body text that flows through the > document, instead each page has four non-linked frames with text in. > > I wondered if anyone has any suggestions as to how to tackle this > problem. > > I'm considering writing some software to help, if I do that I want to > make the software useful for the users of Ovation Pro. > > I can load the documents into Ovation Pro, the question is what format > to save them out in? > > Approaches I have tried and discarded are - print to PDF, PDF to Word > conversion (loses all the style information), save text as DDF, DDF to > Word using Techwriter (hard work because there are so many stories). I would have expected PDF to be the one which would best preserve layout and fonts, and I would expect Quark can import PDF. Why have you rejected that option? My next thought would be PS - can Quark import PostScript? It may require EPS and I don't think we've got a way of generating EPS except via Ghostscript and EPS is a single-page format so no help for this document. I don't know Impression so the following is purely my thought processes which you may already have been through :-) >From a DDF file is it possible to get the text into a single 'story'? Is it possible to save all the text from Impression in a single operation? Even if it resulted in multiple files combining them into one would be quite simple. Is it possible to remove the story end and start tags from a DDF file to make a single story? Back to the OPro theme - the Save as RTF I have (!MakeRTF from David Breakwell I believe) saves all stories into one file. A couple of test documents saved as RTF and read into OPro, and Techwriter on RISC OS and then Word 2003, Wordpad, and OpenOffice Writer on WinXP all have problems. Only OpenOffice Writer gets the layout of a single page letter with 2 stories nearly correct. None of them import the whole of the second test file - OPro displays all except the last page (2 stories), Techwriter, Wordpad and OpenOffice Writer stop at the same point (on page 4 of 18 in the original OPro doc) and Word only displays the paragraph which the others fail in the middle of, stopping at the same point. If you (David) are writing anything for OPro I would appreciate any improvement you can make to the Save as RTF option. Anthony -- ajh@tinshill.f9.co.uk To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Fri Jun 13 20:54:02 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K7FGq-1aeGPo-06-Blv.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 20:54:02 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K7FGq-1aeGPo-06-Blv; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 19:49:12 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.72] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K7FGq-1aeGPo-06 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 19:49:12 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K7FGo-0003fN-5h for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 19:49:12 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 3AEA185F720; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 15:49:06 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 11749-05; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 15:49:06 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id A27E685FB37; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 15:49:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Fri, 13 Jun 2008 15:48:26 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 59A1385F720 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 15:48:26 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 11498-05 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 15:48:26 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com (mtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com [81.103.221.47]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id D689185FB81 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 15:48:25 -0400 (EDT) Received: from aamtaout03-winn.ispmail.ntl.com ([81.103.221.35]) by mtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20080613195238.HWLQ28496.mtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com@aamtaout03-winn.ispmail.ntl.com> for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 20:52:38 +0100 Received: from iyonix.ntlworld.com ([82.1.169.32]) by aamtaout03-winn.ispmail.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20080613195745.MTUH8797.aamtaout03-winn.ispmail.ntl.com@iyonix.ntlworld.com> for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 20:57:45 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Converting documents to Quark To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: Dr Alan Leighton X-Editor: EmailEdit 1.50 Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2008 20:50:43 +0100 Message-ID: <727ff2ae4f.alan@ntlworld.com> References: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/5.12 (MsgServe/3.42) (RISC-OS/5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 753 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: alan.leighton2@ntlworld.com Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=9IXqiQiop7cA:10 a=6AePAfrS9bgA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=Q-qYJwSi-BMwVH_McM4A:9 a=PmiaLOOs2s-vFlabt2cA:7 a=9cCqkeakN-V2-jt2N8voZStF-lQA:4 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.3.0/1501] In message Anthony Hilton wrote: > In on Thu 12 Jun, David Pilling wrote: >> Hi, >> >> Someone has approached me with a book he has done in Impression. His >> publishers want it in Quark format. The book is structured as lots of >> frames with text in - there's no large body text that flows through the >> document, instead each page has four non-linked frames with text in. >> >> I wondered if anyone has any suggestions as to how to tackle this >> problem. >> >> I'm considering writing some software to help, if I do that I want to >> make the software useful for the users of Ovation Pro. >> >> I can load the documents into Ovation Pro, the question is what format >> to save them out in? >> >> Approaches I have tried and discarded are - print to PDF, PDF to Word >> conversion (loses all the style information), save text as DDF, DDF to >> Word using Techwriter (hard work because there are so many stories). > I would have expected PDF to be the one which would best preserve layout and > fonts, and I would expect Quark can import PDF. Why have you rejected that > option? > My next thought would be PS - can Quark import PostScript? It may require EPS > and I don't think we've got a way of generating EPS except via Ghostscript > and EPS is a single-page format so no help for this document. > I don't know Impression so the following is purely my thought processes which > you may already have been through :-) > From a DDF file is it possible to get the text into a single 'story'? > Is it possible to save all the text from Impression in a single operation? > Even if it resulted in multiple files combining them into one would be quite > simple. > Is it possible to remove the story end and start tags from a DDF file to make > a single story? > Back to the OPro theme - the Save as RTF I have (!MakeRTF from David > Breakwell I believe) saves all stories into one file. A couple of test > documents saved as RTF and read into OPro, and Techwriter on RISC OS and then > Word 2003, Wordpad, and OpenOffice Writer on WinXP all have problems. Only > OpenOffice Writer gets the layout of a single page letter with 2 stories > nearly correct. None of them import the whole of the second test file - > OPro displays all except the last page (2 stories), Techwriter, Wordpad and > OpenOffice Writer stop at the same point (on page 4 of 18 in the original > OPro doc) and Word only displays the paragraph which the others fail in the > middle of, stopping at the same point. > If you (David) are writing anything for OPro I would appreciate any > improvement you can make to the Save as RTF option. > Anthony Gosh David that would really help, Alan (happy to donate) -- To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Fri Jun 13 21:39:03 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K7Fzy-0UX000-02-B2n.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 21:39:03 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K7Fzy-0UX000-02-B2n; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 20:35:50 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.77] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K7Fzy-0UX000-02 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 20:35:50 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K7Fzs-0001AU-7L for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 20:35:50 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 2495985FED3; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:35:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 16423-06; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:35:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 9376F85FF87; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:35:37 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:34:59 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 90A4D85FED3 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:34:59 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 16059-09 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:34:59 -0400 (EDT) Received: from anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.87]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 4341A85FE66 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:34:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([62.49.20.172]) by anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 4.68) id 1K7Fz7-0005jx-PO for davidpilling@freelists.org; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 20:34:58 +0000 Message-ID: Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2008 21:33:41 +0100 To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: David Pilling Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Converting documents to Quark References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-S () X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 754 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: flist@pilling.demon.co.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=9IXqiQiop7cA:10 a=6AePAfrS9bgA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=dqhQn4rJAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=BpemzMJUwNMOKwlJ25cA:9 a=ArZYNZf5MB6FA3uPcSoA:7 a=JfiBMZiVKkzizjydSrTwY0EOyt0A:4 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.3.0/1501] In message , Anthony Hilton writes >I would have expected PDF to be the one which would best preserve layout and >fonts, and I would expect Quark can import PDF. Why have you rejected that >option? In one sense PDF is 100% perfect, the problem is that it lacks understanding, for example it doesn't know about styles. >My next thought would be PS - can Quark import PostScript? PS and PDF are similar enough. >Is it possible to save all the text from Impression in a single operation? >Even if it resulted in multiple files combining them into one would be quite >simple. Paul Beverley used to maintain that one of the best features about Impression was that the folder/directory document format allowed easy extraction of all text. These days of course he maintains that MS Word is a good thing ;-) >If you (David) are writing anything for OPro I would appreciate any >improvement you can make to the Save as RTF option. Yes... -- David Pilling email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.davidpilling.net post: David Pilling P.O. Box 22 Thornton Cleveleys Blackpool. FY5 1LR UK fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Fri Jun 13 21:39:03 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K7G1v-2pGknw-07-B0q.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 21:39:03 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K7G1v-2pGknw-07-B0q; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 20:37:51 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.223] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K7G1v-2pGknw-07 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 20:37:51 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K7G1o-0000Db-Ht for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 20:37:51 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 192C685FE69; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:37:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 16686-03; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:37:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 897CC85FF73; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:37:35 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:36:57 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 0490885FE69 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:36:57 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 16552-08 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:36:56 -0400 (EDT) Received: from anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.91]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id BF6C385FE66 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:36:56 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([62.49.20.172]) by anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 4.67) id 1K7G11-0006pd-BW for davidpilling@freelists.org; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 20:36:55 +0000 Message-ID: <7tWkCbC$ntUIFwPd@pilling.demon.co.uk> Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2008 21:35:11 +0100 To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: David Pilling Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Converting documents to Quark References: <4fa253dd79chris@highpath.net> <4fa7c1ff54rkp@par.me.uk> <$0Y1kEDV0UQIFweu@pilling.demon.co.uk> <1C29EE614F1E490CB44C84BEE9477A11@PC01> <4fa9072a08chris@highpath.net> <4faa95cd8dchris@highpath.net> <4faebc43c0monster@caverock.net.nz> <48528C22.7000007@btinternet.com> In-Reply-To: <48528C22.7000007@btinternet.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-S () X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 755 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: flist@pilling.demon.co.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=9IXqiQiop7cA:10 a=6AePAfrS9bgA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=dqhQn4rJAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=qInVw--bF8Mu4uUVu3oA:9 a=IWYysUcXqqzQVNQJJ3YA:7 a=PyPt7TbJtqoQdW-FHdqj0Ja54-QA:4 a=Nr7Pmq0tdocA:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.3.0/1501] In message <48528C22.7000007@btinternet.com>, Phillip Marsden writes >> My other question (again from my idealistic viewpoint) - could the >> publishers really not handle using OvationPro themselves? >As for expecting the publisher to cope with Ovation Pro (which, for all >its delights, is a very minor player and one which the publisher has >probably never heard of) I despair that you could even make the >suggestion. :o( Actually they did seriously consider that (I didn't expect that either), as of today it looks like supplying a PDF may be good enough - obviously generating PDF is trivial. -- David Pilling email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.davidpilling.net post: David Pilling P.O. Box 22 Thornton Cleveleys Blackpool. FY5 1LR UK fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Fri Jun 13 21:39:03 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K7G2Z-4SI000-03-B0C.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 21:39:03 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K7G2Z-4SI000-03-B0C; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 20:38:31 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.77] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K7G2Z-4SI000-03 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 20:38:31 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K7G2X-0003S8-AP for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 20:38:31 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id EC98B85FEAF; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:38:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 16853-06; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:38:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 7150785FF03; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:38:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:37:43 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id A2F6185FEAF for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:37:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 16702-03 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:37:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: from anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.87]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id A95BA85FF7F for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:37:42 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([62.49.20.172]) by anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 4.68) id 1K7G1g-00014V-Ok for davidpilling@freelists.org; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 20:37:36 +0000 Message-ID: <89mlG7C+otUIFwvr@pilling.demon.co.uk> Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2008 21:36:14 +0100 To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: David Pilling Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Converting documents to Quark References: <9c45c3ae4f.martin@bach.planiverse.com> In-Reply-To: <9c45c3ae4f.martin@bach.planiverse.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-S () X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 756 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: flist@pilling.demon.co.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=9IXqiQiop7cA:10 a=6AePAfrS9bgA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=dqhQn4rJAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=qInVw--bF8Mu4uUVu3oA:9 a=b8-QIbeXT2i8KPLG9OMA:7 a=1d42arToqIDDiY7rk7_idVzmoA0A:4 a=fl4ZfBcLCrEA:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.3.0/1501] In message <9c45c3ae4f.martin@bach.planiverse.com>, Martin Wuerthner writes >Quark has a perfectly well documented text based DDL format that was >created for precisely the purpose of interoperability. Martin, are you thinking about QXML above, or some other format? -- David Pilling email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.davidpilling.net post: David Pilling P.O. Box 22 Thornton Cleveleys Blackpool. FY5 1LR UK fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Fri Jun 13 21:54:04 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K7GAq-0ue000-08-Arv.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 21:54:04 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K7GAq-0ue000-08-Arv; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 20:47:04 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.210] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K7GAq-0ue000-08 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 20:47:04 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K7GAo-0007W0-KV for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 20:47:04 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 508C285FC41; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:46:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 18052-06; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:46:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id C838985FE5A; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:46:57 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:46:19 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 66F0A85FC41 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:46:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 17924-10 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:46:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sif.is.scarlet.be (sif.is.scarlet.be [193.74.71.28]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id E77EC85F9EE for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 16:46:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hobbes (ip-81-11-160-30.dsl.scarlet.be [81.11.160.30]) by sif.is.scarlet.be (8.14.2/8.14.2) with ESMTP id m5DKkE9i030133 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 22:46:15 +0200 Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2008 22:46:07 +0200 From: John Tytgat To: davidpilling@freelists.org Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Converting documents to Quark Message-ID: References: In-Reply-To: X-Organization: BASS User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.62 (MsgServe/2.05) (RISC-OS/6.11) POPstar/2.05 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-DCC-scarlet.be-Metrics: sif 20001; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 757 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: John.Tytgat@aaug.net Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=9IXqiQiop7cA:10 a=6AePAfrS9bgA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=7mELct32FYNU2S0oFHsA:9 a=dYTy4n07JyVgNbfJ__8A:7 a=ukpXc43Y0TYwVeqCB6zukPaxtsAA:4 a=O6VgNENP0SsA:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.3.0/1501] In message you wrote: > In message , Anthony Hilton > writes > > >My next thought would be PS - can Quark import PostScript? > > PS and PDF are similar enough. Similar in concept yes, apart from PS being a real language which needs an interpreter while PDF being a 'dead' file format which makes PS parsing at least an order of magnitude more difficult to get it right. John. -- John Tytgat, in his comfy chair at home BASS John.Tytgat@aaug.net ARM powered, RISC OS driven To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Sun Jun 15 11:59:17 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K7IdS-11hknw-02-Gvp.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Sun, 15 Jun 2008 11:59:17 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K7IdS-11hknw-02-Gvp; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 23:24:46 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.210] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K7IdS-11hknw-02 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 23:24:46 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K7IdR-0005il-UY for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 23:24:46 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 0DD6885F87A; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 19:24:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 02319-08; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 19:24:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 7942485FAF9; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 19:24:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Fri, 13 Jun 2008 19:24:05 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 174CE85F87A for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 19:24:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 02276-06 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 19:24:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mail4.webfaction.com (mail4.webfaction.com [74.52.233.2]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id D8BD085F82B for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 19:24:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: from abacus.local (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by mail4.webfaction.com (8.13.1/8.13.3) with ESMTP id m5DNO13v032385 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 18:24:02 -0500 From: David Boddie To: davidpilling@freelists.org Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Converting documents to Quark Date: Sat, 14 Jun 2008 01:23:59 +0200 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.6 (enterprise 0.20070907.709405) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200806140123.59508.david@boddie.org.uk> X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 758 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: david@boddie.org.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=9IXqiQiop7cA:10 a=6AePAfrS9bgA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=6effzY4tXdU6n2dqLZIA:9 a=6Un7BxamjUwV9TCDCJkA:7 a=HK25e2ah_8tYGtvNEjb-G7UGWMsA:4 a=LY0hPdMaydYA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.3.0/1503] On Fri, 13 Jun 2008 12:27:17 +0100, David Pilling wrote: > In message <200806130120.22487.david@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>, David Boddie > writes > > The non-linked text problem or the interoperability with Quark problem? > > Well both. I know I wrote OP so that you can't link two frames which both > contain text - what a stupid limitation... :-( > > I suppose you'll either have to choose another intermediate format that > > can keep the layout information > > That format being? Good question! If the publisher can accept the QXML format that Andy mentioned then maybe that's the way to go. > > Is there any chance the publisher can accept another format that Quark > > can import fairly reliably? > > Well yes. One reason I ask the question here is that it gives you a chance > to say what you'd like, if I'm going to do any work it might as well be > useful to everyone. Fair enough. You might find it useful to write an exporter to produce files in a custom XML-based format for OP documents. That way other people can struggle with the task of targeting specific file formats without disturbing you too much - or perhaps you like doing this kind of conversion work. :-) > You might know what works well with Quark, or what would be useful in > general. Actually, I don't, but your question made me go and check to see what formats (if any) Scribus can export to, but I didn't see anything of use. It also made me remember a demonstration of application automation I'd seen, involving a DTP package on Windows, but that approach would require that _you_ are running Quark (on a Mac, I presume) and I didn't want to suggest that. ;-) David To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Sun Jun 15 11:59:18 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K7Ieu-43Cknw-01-GuN.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Sun, 15 Jun 2008 11:59:18 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K7Ieu-43Cknw-01-GuN; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 23:26:16 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.95] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K7Ieu-43Cknw-01 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 23:26:16 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K7Iet-0000yT-KY for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 23:26:16 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id C161A85F935; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 19:26:14 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 02578-08; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 19:26:14 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 4500385FAD6; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 19:26:14 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Fri, 13 Jun 2008 19:25:36 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 8AD9685F935 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 19:25:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 02494-03 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 19:25:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mail6.inspire.net.nz (mail6.inspire.net.nz [203.114.168.6]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 3917D85F8E1 for ; Fri, 13 Jun 2008 19:25:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mail5.inspire.net.nz (unknown [10.0.168.5]) by mail6.inspire.net.nz (Postfix) with ESMTP id DB17A2AAE6E for ; Sat, 14 Jun 2008 11:25:34 +1200 (NZST) Received: from localhost (unknown [10.0.168.8]) by mail5.inspire.net.nz (Postfix) with ESMTP id C8DA6DBA97 for ; Sat, 14 Jun 2008 11:25:34 +1200 (NZST) Received: from mail5.inspire.net.nz ([10.0.168.5]) by localhost (mail8.inspire.net.nz [10.0.168.8]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id lsINo8rkm5Fv for ; Sat, 14 Jun 2008 11:21:25 +1200 (NZST) Received: from freja.khnet.nz (203-114-180-66.dsl.sta.inspire.net.nz [203.114.180.66]) by mail5.inspire.net.nz (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B9ACDBA7C for ; Sat, 14 Jun 2008 11:25:34 +1200 (NZST) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Keith Hopper To: davidpilling@freelists.org Date: Sat, 14 Jun 2008 11:26:34 +1200 Subject: [softwarelist] Unwanted font definitions Message-ID: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> User-Agent: Pluto/3.04c (RISC-OS/5.11) Content-Type: text/plain X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 759 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: asgard@inspire.net.nz Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=JWsgKG8mJtRzwiF2OSUA:9 a=M0Hhp9vuQrejQ33gAhAA:7 a=bt2VUxqdHoIFU4SDgt35_3DnAUQA:4 a=SKpDKCWXRSQA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.3.0/1503] Greetings, I realise that I should have known this before - but didn't. When the only font referred to in a document is NOT Trinity, OvnPro puts out a font list (in a DDL file and a Postscript file anyway) including Trinity Medium/Bold/Italic. I only discovered this when a document wouldn't convert to PDF with PDFmaker (a Ghostscript error). Although the Postscript printed happily and converted with other converters PDFmaker objected. I tracked this down to the presence of Trinity Italic Smallcaps (with Rcomp Andrew's help) which was the 'default' italic for Trinity - which wasn't used in the document at all and was not referrred to in any style or any effect! Am I being obtuse in thinking that the font list should only include fonts which are actually used in the document - after all it just unnecessarily bloats output files?? Puzzled!! Keith -- Inspired! To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Sun Jun 15 11:59:22 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K7TXU-1kpVbs-01-EYJ.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Sun, 15 Jun 2008 11:59:22 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K7TXU-1kpVbs-01-EYJ; Sat, 14 Jun 2008 11:03:20 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.245] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K7TXU-1kpVbs-01 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 14 Jun 2008 11:03:20 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K7TXT-0005qc-Ho for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 14 Jun 2008 11:03:20 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 032C285FC92; Sat, 14 Jun 2008 07:03:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 10983-04; Sat, 14 Jun 2008 07:03:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 7E9F585FD10; Sat, 14 Jun 2008 07:03:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Sat, 14 Jun 2008 07:02:40 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 8504185FC92 for ; Sat, 14 Jun 2008 07:02:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 10925-03 for ; Sat, 14 Jun 2008 07:02:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: from ipmail04.adl2.internode.on.net (ipmail04.adl2.internode.on.net [203.16.214.57]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id E1E9085FC56 for ; Sat, 14 Jun 2008 07:02:39 -0400 (EDT) X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: Au0AAMtBU0h5LAKu/2dsb2JhbAAIrRU X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.27,643,1204464600"; d="scan'208";a="133939459" Received: from ppp121-44-2-174.lns10.syd7.internode.on.net (HELO [127.0.0.1]) ([121.44.2.174]) by ipmail04.adl2.internode.on.net with ESMTP; 14 Jun 2008 20:32:36 +0930 Message-ID: <4853A54E.3000101@internode.on.net> Date: Sat, 14 Jun 2008 21:02:38 +1000 From: Peter Prewett User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 (Windows/20080421) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: davidpilling@freelists.org Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Converting documents to Quark References: <200806140123.59508.david@boddie.org.uk> In-Reply-To: <200806140123.59508.david@boddie.org.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 760 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: pprewett@internode.on.net Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=9IXqiQiop7cA:10 a=6AePAfrS9bgA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=3I-uBpoh-vkl_P0HpwQA:9 a=EBfbFyo05pQsHcXPCVUA:7 a=_uQhOkkRE1yn0Ut-fIxodRBH4yoA:4 a=gi0PWCVxevcA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.3.0/1503] I have struggled to get my creations to other platforms and wonder if the new/proposed open standard is the best option to be implemented. Peter -- Peter Prewett, Tumut, New South Wales To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Sun Jun 15 14:14:21 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K7rzu-0Rj000-02-FfR.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Sun, 15 Jun 2008 14:14:21 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K7rzu-0Rj000-02-FfR; Sun, 15 Jun 2008 13:10:18 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.210] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K7rzu-0Rj000-02 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sun, 15 Jun 2008 13:10:18 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K7rzu-00025P-7G for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sun, 15 Jun 2008 13:10:18 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id B7B7F85FD13 for ; Sun, 15 Jun 2008 09:10:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 24433-08 for ; Sun, 15 Jun 2008 09:10:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 8C88785FD95 for ; Sun, 15 Jun 2008 09:10:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Sun, 15 Jun 2008 09:09:38 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 98A0D85FD13 for ; Sun, 15 Jun 2008 09:09:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 24391-02 for ; Sun, 15 Jun 2008 09:09:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: from anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.87]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 6129685E0E0 for ; Sun, 15 Jun 2008 09:09:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([62.49.20.172]) by anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 4.68) id 1K7rzF-00024S-O3 for davidpilling@freelists.org; Sun, 15 Jun 2008 13:09:37 +0000 Message-ID: Date: Sun, 15 Jun 2008 14:08:02 +0100 To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: David Pilling Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> In-Reply-To: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-S () X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 761 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: flist@pilling.demon.co.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=dqhQn4rJAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=7O1lIW1slf7aLosoPHYA:9 a=9DQHPW1czgysHj2GRXkA:7 a=zWOBW_5Ih5Csq7KrJk_u1_bNyQkA:4 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.3.0/1503] In message <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz>, Keith Hopper writes > I realise that I should have known this before - but didn't. When the >only font referred to in a document is NOT Trinity, OvnPro puts out a font >list (in a DDL file and a Postscript file anyway) including Trinity >Medium/Bold/Italic. There is a long running bug, where OPro thinks documents use fonts which they don't - it arises because OPro loses count, you know you once used Trinity in a document but deleted all the uses and OPro still sees it as used. One problem with this bug is that it can have many causes and even when some of the causes are fixed, old documents are not fixed. Incidentally there is also of course the situation where you do use Trinity, but you don't notice it - an empty frame somewhere. Saving the document as DDL will firstly let you see what fonts OPro thinks are used, but also will let you see where various fonts are used - notice the name given to the font, and then look for uses of that name. I think that save as DDL, reload DDL will recount the fonts. Plan B, is uninstall the font, load the document (OPro will complain about the missing font), then save the document. -- David Pilling email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.davidpilling.net post: David Pilling P.O. Box 22 Thornton Cleveleys Blackpool. FY5 1LR UK fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 17 11:49:52 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K8PQB-2Bqknw-08-GLE.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 11:49:52 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K8PQB-2Bqknw-08-GLE; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 00:51:39 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.210] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K8PQB-2Bqknw-08 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 00:51:39 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K8PQB-0006ta-7I for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 00:51:39 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 5DE2085F7A6 for ; Mon, 16 Jun 2008 20:51:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 03466-06 for ; Mon, 16 Jun 2008 20:51:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 32EEC860DA2 for ; Mon, 16 Jun 2008 20:51:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Mon, 16 Jun 2008 20:50:59 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 5FABB860B9F for ; Mon, 16 Jun 2008 20:50:59 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 03383-02 for ; Mon, 16 Jun 2008 20:50:59 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mail6.inspire.net.nz (mail6.inspire.net.nz [203.114.168.6]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id D0E01860226 for ; Mon, 16 Jun 2008 20:50:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mail5.inspire.net.nz (unknown [10.0.168.5]) by mail6.inspire.net.nz (Postfix) with ESMTP id 770F02AB0AD for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 12:50:56 +1200 (NZST) Received: from localhost (unknown [10.0.168.8]) by mail5.inspire.net.nz (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6719CDBAD2 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 12:50:56 +1200 (NZST) Received: from mail5.inspire.net.nz ([10.0.168.5]) by localhost (mail8.inspire.net.nz [10.0.168.8]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0EFUmqhmPYu8 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 12:46:43 +1200 (NZST) Received: from freja.khnet.nz (203-114-180-66.dsl.sta.inspire.net.nz [203.114.180.66]) by mail5.inspire.net.nz (Postfix) with ESMTP id C1CC1DBAA8 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 12:50:55 +1200 (NZST) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Keith Hopper To: davidpilling@freelists.org Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2008 12:51:58 +1200 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions Message-ID: <4fb099961easgard@inspire.net.nz> In-Reply-To: References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> User-Agent: Pluto/3.04c (RISC-OS/5.11) Content-Type: text/plain X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 762 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: asgard@inspire.net.nz Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=6QPBqKu_3M-TWeyFbeMA:9 a=n6hdrVq9-Ix97TYrwK8A:7 a=TWc5yZBIpM-T0TiuiU84kEJlsN8A:4 a=SKpDKCWXRSQA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.3.0/1503] Greetings, In response to my note - > In message <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz>, Keith Hopper > writes > > I realise that I should have known this before - but didn't. When the > >only font referred to in a document is NOT Trinity, OvnPro puts out a font > >list (in a DDL file and a Postscript file anyway) including Trinity > >Medium/Bold/Italic. David responded, writing - > There is a long running bug, where OPro thinks documents use fonts which > they don't - it arises because OPro loses count, you know you once used > Trinity in a document but deleted all the uses and OPro still sees it as > used. > One problem with this bug is that it can have many causes and even when > some of the causes are fixed, old documents are not fixed. > Incidentally there is also of course the situation where you do use > Trinity, but you don't notice it - an empty frame somewhere. > Saving the document as DDL will firstly let you see what fonts OPro > thinks are used, but also will let you see where various fonts are used > - notice the name given to the font, and then look for uses of that > name. > I think that save as DDL, reload DDL will recount the fonts. > Plan B, is uninstall the font, load the document (OPro will complain > about the missing font), then save the document. Unfortunately neither Plan A nor Plan B work. If I take the default (empty) document, remove every reference to Trinity from every style - in fact not setting font changes in any except the Body (which I set to LondonA - an EFF font) - and save as default. If I load this saved default and save as DDL then Trinity flavours appear in the font list (together with the one for LondonA) - BUT nowhere else in the DDL document - which is empty, of course! LondonA appears, as expected, in the Bodytext style. This does not appear to be a case of deleting fonts leaving something around in memory which OvnPro writes out. I just load the default - save as DDL - with the results I describe above. It doesn't matter even if I quit and reload OvnPro between saving the default and loading it again. If I delete the unused font references from the DDL, quit OvnPro - and reload the DDL file - then save it out again as DDL - the Trinity font references appear again. Interesting! No?! Keith -- Inspired! To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 17 11:50:11 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K8XNF-3NKVbs-04-Gug.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 11:50:11 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K8XNF-3NKVbs-04-Gug; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 09:21:09 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.210] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K8XNF-3NKVbs-04 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 09:21:09 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K8XND-0003DN-TC for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 09:21:09 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 99E0886115D for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:21:06 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 13639-09 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:21:06 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 7AC078611AB for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:21:06 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:20:27 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 84BD886115D for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:20:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 13556-08 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:20:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: from smtp4.clear.net.nz (smtp4.clear.net.nz [203.97.37.64]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 3907C861115 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:20:26 -0400 (EDT) Received: from Iyonix (121-72-169-114.dsl.telstraclear.net [121.72.169.114]) by smtp4.clear.net.nz (CLEAR Net Mail) with ESMTP id <0K2L00GJKOJL1DX2@smtp4.clear.net.nz> for davidpilling@freelists.org; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 21:18:58 +1200 (NZST) Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2008 21:18:54 +1200 From: "lists (ww)" Subject: [softwarelist] OPro Printing to PDF Problem To: davidpilling@freelists.org Message-id: <4fb0c7ff97lists@ww.co.nz> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain User-Agent: Pluto/3.04c (RISC-OS/5.13) POPstar/2.06-ds.4 X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 763 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: lists@ww.co.nz Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=3r2UrHLz308A:10 a=uSkscsncRCUA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=Xce4iIkDaGQW-Pvn8YMA:9 a=r5OkTxxkiSHuQWm1uXwA:7 a=jy_a6EjAyKoAQCgB08bmEF4YNiwA:4 a=-VkOLjBb71gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.3.0/1505] OPro crashes my Iyonix when I go to print a file to PDF. 'Ovation Pro ... internal error ... type 5 ...' and the machine becomes useless. On one occasion I was faced with a red screen and with filer windows faintly visible. A reset is required each time. Whereas, another OPro file I have prints successfully to PDF. To check this, I just tried it again now. So it's apparently the actual document. I tried saving it as DDL. Same error - machine crashes. How can I 'clean up' this problematic OPro document? OPro 2.77 PrintPDF v0.45 then upgraded to PrintPDF v0.52 same result GPL Ghostscript 8.54 - RISC OS 1.04 Printers v1.72 PrintSpool v2.14 RO 5.13 Brian -- Auckland NEW ZEALAND To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 17 11:50:12 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K8XRo-1rPGPo-03-Gq7.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 11:50:12 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K8XRo-1rPGPo-03-Gq7; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 09:25:52 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.77] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K8XRo-1rPGPo-03 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 09:25:52 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K8XRn-0003DN-Jd for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 09:25:52 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 0A81D860D96 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:25:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 14076-03 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:25:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id DDDCD861275 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:25:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:25:12 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 18EB286128A for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:25:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 13943-07 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:25:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from smtp4.clear.net.nz (smtp4.clear.net.nz [203.97.37.64]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id C53D28611C0 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:25:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: from Iyonix (121-72-169-114.dsl.telstraclear.net [121.72.169.114]) by smtp4.clear.net.nz (CLEAR Net Mail) with ESMTP id <0K2L00GF0OTY14S1@smtp4.clear.net.nz> for davidpilling@freelists.org; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 21:25:11 +1200 (NZST) Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2008 21:24:58 +1200 From: "lists (ww)" Subject: [softwarelist] Re: OPro Printing to PDF Problem In-reply-to: <4fb0c7ff97lists@ww.co.nz> To: davidpilling@freelists.org Message-id: <4fb0c88da3lists@ww.co.nz> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain References: <4fb0c7ff97lists@ww.co.nz> User-Agent: Pluto/3.04c (RISC-OS/5.13) POPstar/2.06-ds.4 X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 764 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: lists@ww.co.nz Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=19xg_O8F3_cA:10 a=UHMdWZNeLDkA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=zQg0Z5CDAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=3UNdf22dZ9c6Ka1Bd98A:9 a=Ah_OkJawi9uM8EOHM1wA:7 a=WG6C1AyqCJYbtiMRR8Zo7gsxnhEA:4 a=LY0hPdMaydYA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.3.0/1505] On 17 Jun, lists@ww.co.nz wrote: > OPro crashes my Iyonix In case it helps, here's the file: Brian -- Brian Adam Auckland NEW ZEALAND ph +64 9 817 6816 brian@adam.co.nz www.adam.co.nz To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 17 11:50:12 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K8XZP-3LMVbs-06-GiW.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 11:50:12 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K8XZP-3LMVbs-06-GiW; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 09:33:43 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.211] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K8XZP-3LMVbs-06 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 09:33:43 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K8XZL-0003nf-Py for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 09:33:43 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id EFE2086120E for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:33:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 14702-07 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:33:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id C9A9E861320 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:33:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:32:59 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 510DD86120E for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:32:59 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 14529-08 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:32:59 -0400 (EDT) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.187]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id E6D7E8612B8 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:32:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: from bach ([91.66.127.197]) by mrelayeu.kundenserver.de (node=mrelayeu3) with ESMTP (Nemesis) id 0MKxQS-1K8XYf3ISy-00011p; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 11:32:57 +0200 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: Martin Wuerthner X-Editor: EmailEdit 1.50 Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2008 11:33:05 +0200 Message-ID: References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> In-Reply-To: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> X-Organization: MW Software User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/5.12 (MsgServe/3.42) (RISC-OS/5.11) POPstar/2.05 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX1+mf+6jZBJ3sUThItM+6562ezJJPjEgubuGrKg fAXy7aqn5bmFCsStAPavMrRer3oVFUu9wRR4j8Bp+WLm46L8vD HPH22fvhOZfc77CCnhygju4oe4G874i X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 765 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: public@mw-software.com Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=MbxN5axi5Ssu9obYp7YA:9 a=7QAUuNiukc-sJQhLWTYA:7 a=EgL1gWlxylHpRyvfcCX9EiDYZT8A:4 a=fl4ZfBcLCrEA:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.3.0/1505] In message <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> Keith Hopper wrote: > I realise that I should have known this before - but didn't. When the > only font referred to in a document is NOT Trinity, OvnPro puts out a font > list (in a DDL file and a Postscript file anyway) including Trinity > Medium/Bold/Italic. > I only discovered this when a document wouldn't convert to PDF with > PDFmaker (a Ghostscript error). Although the Postscript printed happily and > converted with other converters PDFmaker objected. I tracked this down to > the presence of Trinity Italic Smallcaps (with Rcomp Andrew's help) which > was the 'default' italic for Trinity - which wasn't used in the document at > all and was not referrred to in any style or any effect! While it may be an annoyance that the font is considered used even though it is not, why should that cause any problems with PDF generation? What error does Ghostscript display? Martin -- --------------------------------------------------------------------- Martin Wuerthner MW Software martin@mw-software.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 17 11:50:12 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K8XZQ-1dnGPo-01-GiV.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 11:50:12 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K8XZQ-1dnGPo-01-GiV; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 09:33:44 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.211] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K8XZQ-1dnGPo-01 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 09:33:44 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K8XZQ-0003qO-8e for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 09:33:44 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id AD17F8611EA for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:33:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 14720-05 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:33:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 8A1468612B8 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:33:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:33:04 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id D506C8611EA for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:33:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 14547-09 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:33:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.177]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 78F928612FD for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:33:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: from bach ([91.66.127.197]) by mrelayeu.kundenserver.de (node=mrelayeu3) with ESMTP (Nemesis) id 0MKxQS-1K8XYf1jEt-00011p; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 11:32:57 +0200 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: OPro Printing to PDF Problem To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: Martin Wuerthner X-Editor: EmailEdit 1.50 Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2008 11:30:14 +0200 Message-ID: <3109c9b04f.martin@bach.planiverse.com> References: <4fb0c7ff97lists@ww.co.nz> In-Reply-To: <4fb0c7ff97lists@ww.co.nz> X-Organization: MW Software User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/5.12 (MsgServe/3.42) (RISC-OS/5.11) POPstar/2.05 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX187swmO4jlfsjNY7GF4LIHzjn1qdde/uypLozE Jc2A2jlaY/n9s1SoMPBhnGsa/sjgzHWSnZ6E0IBSqgSYsZxD0t px9vE1UvDZSsRJJWbZAO5mcbh6M8rJL X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 766 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: public@mw-software.com Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=19xg_O8F3_cA:10 a=UHMdWZNeLDkA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=xGziP2Yt5CxBzklUXxsA:9 a=TL02Bx17OYBHMhGxG2kA:7 a=kR2H5GgjftJi6UO-oBBBEs40h44A:4 a=fl4ZfBcLCrEA:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.3.0/1505] In message <4fb0c7ff97lists@ww.co.nz> "lists (ww)" wrote: > OPro crashes my Iyonix when I go to print a file to PDF. 'Ovation Pro > ... internal error ... type 5 ...' and the machine becomes useless. On > one occasion I was faced with a red screen and with filer windows > faintly visible. A reset is required each time. > Whereas, another OPro file I have prints successfully to PDF. To > check this, I just tried it again now. > So it's apparently the actual document. > I tried saving it as DDL. Same error - machine crashes. So, it looks like the document is broken and it might not be connected with PDF at all. For instance, have you tried printing it using a different printer driver? Martin -- --------------------------------------------------------------------- Martin Wuerthner MW Software martin@mw-software.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 17 11:50:13 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K8Xei-35W000-07-GdD.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 11:50:13 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K8Xei-35W000-07-GdD; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 09:39:12 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.72] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K8Xei-35W000-07 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 09:39:12 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K8Xei-0005ed-57 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 09:39:12 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 7ECB986135F for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:39:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 15200-03 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:39:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 54574861357 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:39:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:38:32 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 407058612A3 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:38:32 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 15083-02 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:38:32 -0400 (EDT) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.188]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id E20328611B0 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:38:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from bach ([91.66.127.197]) by mrelayeu.kundenserver.de (node=mrelayeu6) with ESMTP (Nemesis) id 0ML29c-1K8Xe22TcP-0004iz; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 11:38:30 +0200 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: OPro Printing to PDF Problem To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: Martin Wuerthner X-Editor: EmailEdit 1.50 Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2008 11:39:02 +0200 Message-ID: <3ed7c9b04f.martin@bach.planiverse.com> References: <4fb0c7ff97lists@ww.co.nz> <4fb0c88da3lists@ww.co.nz> In-Reply-To: <4fb0c88da3lists@ww.co.nz> X-Organization: MW Software User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/5.12 (MsgServe/3.42) (RISC-OS/5.11) POPstar/2.05 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX19C6fFviMh/cfIUgjb+JwETYnM3gtgqXVEfUNT B8Iulsj2o5WaTihqqWEloj/JCiWF9tz5gOqHAR+cXgCI7LL+gR FQq5WPU5MK+q0JUnPs8JHEEOwnWtdF/ X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 767 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: public@mw-software.com Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=19xg_O8F3_cA:10 a=UHMdWZNeLDkA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=zQg0Z5CDAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=VdWJmBLOb4P0I0OLKeEA:9 a=7V05qMrLeqaJeTz3tjEA:7 a=TZChzwbiIy83glDGzgeXqhJ3OREA:4 a=fl4ZfBcLCrEA:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.3.0/1505] In message <4fb0c88da3lists@ww.co.nz> "lists (ww)" wrote: > On 17 Jun, lists@ww.co.nz wrote: >> OPro crashes my Iyonix > In case it helps, here's the file: > Prints to PDF and saves as DDL fine here (with the Gen.XCrumble font being substituted though because I do not have it). OP2.77. Iyonix RISC OS 5.11. The most likely candidate for causing the problem is the font. Martin -- --------------------------------------------------------------------- Martin Wuerthner MW Software martin@mw-software.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 17 11:50:16 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K8YTz-4fX000-03-Fnw.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 11:50:16 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K8YTz-4fX000-03-Fnw; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 10:32:11 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.223] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K8YTz-4fX000-03 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 10:32:11 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K8YTz-0002Ik-Aq for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 10:32:11 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id C82DA861122 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 06:32:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 19064-08 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 06:32:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 9E8C8861194 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 06:32:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Tue, 17 Jun 2008 06:31:31 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 7C9F4861122 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 06:31:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 18989-06 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 06:31:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.92]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 47E53860D6A for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 06:31:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from watsnees.demon.co.uk ([80.177.152.227] helo=panther) by anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 4.67) id 1K8YTH-00056P-Fv for davidpilling@freelists.org; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 10:31:30 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Frank Watkinson To: davidpilling@freelists.org Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2008 11:31:19 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: OPro Printing to PDF Problem Message-ID: <4fb0cea080frank@aaug.net> In-Reply-To: <4fb0c7ff97lists@ww.co.nz> References: <4fb0c7ff97lists@ww.co.nz> User-Agent: Pluto/3.04c (RISC-OS/5.10) POPstar/2.04-pre2 Content-Type: text/plain X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 768 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: frank@aaug.net Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=19xg_O8F3_cA:10 a=UHMdWZNeLDkA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=HkQvZcby1pRLe4SVWR0A:9 a=5ptfln_OzAiJfVg3wJcA:7 a=LxXi_XnbC2mrcu7dzXSf1Vr6mo8A:4 a=GFAvb1UtWpQA:10 a=O6VgNENP0SsA:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.3.0/1505] In article <4fb0c7ff97lists@ww.co.nz>, lists (ww) wrote: > OPro crashes my Iyonix when I go to print a file to PDF. 'Ovation Pro > ... internal error ... type 5 ...' and the machine becomes useless. On > one occasion I was faced with a red screen and with filer windows > faintly visible. A reset is required each time. > Whereas, another OPro file I have prints successfully to PDF. To > check this, I just tried it again now. > So it's apparently the actual document. > I tried saving it as DDL. Same error - machine crashes. > How can I 'clean up' this problematic OPro document? > OPro 2.77 > PrintPDF v0.45 then upgraded to > PrintPDF v0.52 same result > GPL Ghostscript 8.54 - RISC OS 1.04 > Printers v1.72 > PrintSpool v2.14 > RO 5.13 > Brian No problem here, but this may be due to the font substitution necessary because of the absence of 2 fonts (Gen.XCrumble ... ). The "..." presumably represents the second font to be substituted. The temporary replacement fonts in the document tested here, are 12pt London A (for two styles), and 10pt Trinity (for the third style). Have you used !FontPrint either to map the non-standard fonts in your document to some other PostScript font , or to specifically "Download" them to the PostScript printer driver when starting up !Printers? PrintPDF 0.45 OPro 2.77 (2-June-2006) AFPL GhostScript 8.53 - RISC OS 1.03 (21-Apr-06) Printers 1.72 PostScript Level 2 RISC OS 5.10 Are the above differences significant? The resulting file/pdf loads satisfactorily in !RiScript, !PDF and Acrobat Reader 8.0.0 (on Windows via UniLaunch - part of UniPrint). Regards. Frank. -- Frank Watkinson. email: Using !Pluto 3.04c on Iyonix 5.10. Also VARPC-Adjust on laptop. Still RPC-SA (4.39 Adjust) for some things. To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 17 12:19:12 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K8ZD9-3ijknw-03-F4m.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 12:19:12 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K8ZD9-3ijknw-03-F4m; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 11:18:51 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.72] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K8ZD9-3ijknw-03 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 11:18:51 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K8ZD8-0004pB-MA for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 11:18:51 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 169208610E3 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 07:18:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 23272-01 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 07:18:49 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id DFCBE86073D for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 07:18:49 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Tue, 17 Jun 2008 07:18:11 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 2E385860D98 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 07:18:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 23119-09 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 07:18:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: from anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.87]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id F04BE860B0B for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 07:18:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([62.49.20.172]) by anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 4.68) id 1K8ZCT-0004uI-Nz for davidpilling@freelists.org; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 11:18:09 +0000 Message-ID: Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2008 12:16:32 +0100 To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: David Pilling Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb099961easgard@inspire.net.nz> In-Reply-To: <4fb099961easgard@inspire.net.nz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-S () X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 769 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: flist@pilling.demon.co.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=dqhQn4rJAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=uPP9lgsL02eD5l_uXMcA:9 a=aYNwKY87mXA4gTMlEl0A:7 a=RHc7XiJcKhbdAEpRZ8L0h2f-AjgA:4 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.3.0/1505] In message <4fb099961easgard@inspire.net.nz>, Keith Hopper writes > Unfortunately neither Plan A nor Plan B work. If I take the default >(empty) document, remove every reference to Trinity from every style - in >fact not setting font changes in any except the Body (which I set to >LondonA - an EFF font) - and save as default. If I load this saved default >and save as DDL then Trinity flavours appear in the font list (together >with the one for LondonA) - BUT nowhere else in the DDL document - which is >empty, of course! LondonA appears, as expected, in the Bodytext style. You're right. I think the problem is that Trinity is a special case, when DDL is loaded a very basic document is created and the DDL then overwrites it, Trinity is the default font for that document. I don't understand why "flavours" of Trinity are used, in my test it is just one weight. Plan A would have worked for any font other than this default. I did find that Plan B worked, the only catch there I can think of is that I used OP on Windows. (Plan B is easy on Windows, the OPW font manager lets you ignore fonts, on RISC OS it would involve removing font files and then rebooting the computer, given the font is Trinity you might find the machine wouldn't reboot...) There is a case to be made that this doesn't matter - Trinity maps to Times which is a font I assume is present in all PostScript printers and does not need to be saved in the PostScript. However for you maybe it comes back to the weights - all the weights being used, and I guess you having an odd version of the font installed i.e. one with a smallcaps weight. >DDL - with the results I describe above. It doesn't matter even if I quit >and reload OvnPro between saving the default and loading it again. Counts are per document so quiting and reloading should not make any differentce. Maybe on RISC OS !FontPrint would be a quick fix, use it to map Trinity.SmallCaps to Trinity.Italic, a harmless reference will be added to your PostScript. -- David Pilling email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.davidpilling.net post: David Pilling P.O. Box 22 Thornton Cleveleys Blackpool. FY5 1LR UK fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 17 20:21:39 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K8gX8-3JX000-08-GHJ.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 20:21:39 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K8gX8-3JX000-08-GHJ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 19:07:58 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.211] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K8gX8-3JX000-08 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 19:07:58 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K8gX5-0003cK-5y for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 19:07:57 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 061BE8616E5; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 15:07:53 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 15246-01; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 15:07:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id CC1F886166B; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 15:07:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Tue, 17 Jun 2008 15:07:12 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id C062A861656 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 15:07:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 14973-04 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 15:07:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from smtp801.mail.ird.yahoo.com (smtp801.mail.ird.yahoo.com [217.146.188.61]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with SMTP id 4DF47861608 for ; Tue, 17 Jun 2008 15:07:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 48392 invoked from network); 17 Jun 2008 19:07:09 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=btinternet.com; h=Received:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:Subject:To:From:X-Editor:Date:Message-ID:References:In-Reply-To:User-Agent:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=6fXdCD5MwuVfDpBpQ+AQfFg8Rm/gzbi/6uVmvhFIZaJb/m4btDp56hopws2kGkn9kTcaMKjEPns8ugmGEMSMlAMW7qjv91h5mRuCw9rYhS+jPzxJtRMSEpqUozgoqWzRtnyKI6txhBq7OiZxnPwG4HeE6LmPBz6TwSR9/rcGSXk= ; Received: from unknown (HELO MyIyonix.btinternet.com) (bryanpage1@btinternet.com@86.153.246.138 with login) by smtp801.mail.ird.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Jun 2008 19:07:08 -0000 X-YMail-OSG: 2wQyud8VM1l94FXpcjm9.oq7fq27rHa5svIJqeFhw_ZacA6Bc_mRlrx7nnXKYi.Eg4fDYy74YTYiFSDUHyKrEnfW1YBcAbZS30Xmus9vCRFlSOH5G0VPINkrOu73DfMVprQeIbDm6cVsCw5gyzFrVnR1 X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: OPro Printing to PDF Problem To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: Bryan X-Editor: EmailEdit 1.50 Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2008 20:05:56 +0100 Message-ID: <2bbefdb04f.Bryan@btinternet.com> References: <4fb0c7ff97lists@ww.co.nz> <4fb0c88da3lists@ww.co.nz> In-Reply-To: <4fb0c88da3lists@ww.co.nz> User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/5.12 (MsgServe/3.42) (RISC-OS/5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 770 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: bryanpage1@btinternet.com Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=19xg_O8F3_cA:10 a=UHMdWZNeLDkA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=zQg0Z5CDAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=VdWJmBLOb4P0I0OLKeEA:9 a=mORqSfqaYZQh5oGni38A:7 a=2fAMJbCbojnakn38arUG9R7B5FUA:4 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.3.0/1505] In message <4fb0c88da3lists@ww.co.nz> "lists (ww)" wrote: > On 17 Jun, lists@ww.co.nz wrote: >> OPro crashes my Iyonix > In case it helps, here's the file: > > Brian [snip] I've just loaded your Ovation Pro document and written it to a PDF file with no problem at all, using: Iyonix (Aria Cube) RO 5.13 Ovation Pro 2.77 PrintPDF 0.32 Ghostscript 8.45 Printers 1.72 Bryan -- Using an Iyonix Aria Cube running Risc OS 5.13 and Virtual RPC AdjustSA running RO 6.10 on a PC. To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Wed Jun 18 11:40:35 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K8pYH-39tknw-03-Fmg.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 11:40:35 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K8pYH-39tknw-03-Fmg; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 04:45:45 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.77] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K8pYH-39tknw-03 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 04:45:45 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K8pYH-0007gC-45 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 04:45:45 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 82049860990 for ; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 00:45:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 25057-05 for ; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 00:45:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 6329386098C for ; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 00:45:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Wed, 18 Jun 2008 00:45:05 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id AA3E2860990 for ; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 00:45:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 24933-05 for ; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 00:45:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from smtp3.clear.net.nz (smtp3.clear.net.nz [203.97.33.64]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 5BD7386068F for ; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 00:45:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from Iyonix (121-72-174-128.dsl.telstraclear.net [121.72.174.128]) by smtp3.clear.net.nz (CLEAR Net Mail) with ESMTP id <0K2N004176J33940@smtp3.clear.net.nz> for davidpilling@freelists.org; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 16:45:04 +1200 (NZST) Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2008 16:44:53 +1200 From: "lists (ww)" Subject: [softwarelist] Re: OPro Printing to PDF Problem In-reply-to: <3109c9b04f.martin@bach.planiverse.com> To: davidpilling@freelists.org Message-id: <4fb132bef6lists@ww.co.nz> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain References: <4fb0c7ff97lists@ww.co.nz> <3109c9b04f.martin@bach.planiverse.com> User-Agent: Pluto/3.04c (RISC-OS/5.13) POPstar/2.06-ds.4 X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 771 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: lists@ww.co.nz Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=19xg_O8F3_cA:10 a=UHMdWZNeLDkA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=5Vmu9-n7JnGelM7afyEA:9 a=MAh-jbWpTohs00PcZx0A:7 a=NwEHjPCHia5ZJuDT0VUhKdqzzbEA:4 a=fl4ZfBcLCrEA:10 a=LY0hPdMaydYA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.3.0/1505] On 17 Jun, Martin Wuerthner wrote: > So, it looks like the document is broken and it might not be > connected with PDF at all. For instance, have you tried printing it > using a different printer driver? > Martin Yes. Sprinter 'prints' it. I have now decided that it is the funny fonts in my document that caused the problem with this file (though I don't see why OP crashes taking the OS down as well). I have now removed them in the OPro doc and edited out or substituted LondonA in the DDL file. Then it converted to pdf. Thanks to all. Brian -- Auckland NEW ZEALAND To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Wed Jun 18 11:40:40 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K8sTj-0sd000-07-CrE.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 11:40:40 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K8sTj-0sd000-07-CrE; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 07:53:15 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.72] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K8sTj-0sd000-07 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 07:53:15 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K8sTf-0007c9-I8 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 07:53:15 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 0840F860A8C for ; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 03:53:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 02876-10 for ; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 03:53:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id DCD7E860375 for ; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 03:53:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Wed, 18 Jun 2008 03:52:32 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id D84C7860A8C for ; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 03:52:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 02841-01 for ; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 03:52:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.171]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 7668285FB85 for ; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 03:52:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from bach (88-134-52-30-dynip.superkabel.de [88.134.52.30]) by mrelayeu.kundenserver.de (node=mrelayeu7) with ESMTP (Nemesis) id 0ML2xA-1K8sT00ARv-0005US; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 09:52:30 +0200 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: OPro Printing to PDF Problem To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: Martin Wuerthner X-Editor: EmailEdit 1.50 Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2008 09:48:30 +0200 Message-ID: <878e43b14f.martin@bach.planiverse.com> References: <4fb0c7ff97lists@ww.co.nz> <3109c9b04f.martin@bach.planiverse.com> <4fb132bef6lists@ww.co.nz> In-Reply-To: <4fb132bef6lists@ww.co.nz> X-Organization: MW Software User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/5.12 (MsgServe/3.42) (RISC-OS/5.11) POPstar/2.05 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX18osn9qBQc/y5zoGBZWot9fCT05yF/DWirleBV ibA1uK8ng6o93CMuTi4kx6P3HOqtVI5570K+1glAJh3Ir7tb0e hWtSYrZoMcp6hPM1n2dClbIF8PqeNKy X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 772 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: public@mw-software.com Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=19xg_O8F3_cA:10 a=UHMdWZNeLDkA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=NeczVMBWGUkmSga7RcgA:9 a=k1I14GoVtLMn0KjsZ18A:7 a=wO1OkczCH8-f6QYFwfzpc3bU6PoA:4 a=fl4ZfBcLCrEA:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.3.0/1505] In message <4fb132bef6lists@ww.co.nz> "lists (ww)" wrote: > On 17 Jun, Martin Wuerthner wrote: >> So, it looks like the document is broken and it might not be >> connected with PDF at all. For instance, have you tried printing it >> using a different printer driver? >> Martin > Yes. Sprinter 'prints' it. > I have now decided that it is the funny fonts in my document that > caused the problem with this file (though I don't see why OP crashes > taking the OS down as well). That is probably not OP's fault. At a guess, it is the printer driver crashing, and this is almost bound to take down the OS. I would like to see this font, could you send it to me please? Martin -- --------------------------------------------------------------------- Martin Wuerthner MW Software martin@mw-software.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Thu Jun 19 12:00:03 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K95sD-2IoGPo-01-GVm.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2008 12:00:03 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K95sD-2IoGPo-01-GVm; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 22:11:25 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.77] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K95sD-2IoGPo-01 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 22:11:25 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K95sD-0000Ut-0Z for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 22:11:25 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 72EA0861F40 for ; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 18:11:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 17316-06 for ; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 18:11:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 523C98620F3 for ; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 18:11:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Wed, 18 Jun 2008 18:10:44 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 45768861F40 for ; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 18:10:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 17213-09 for ; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 18:10:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.188]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 5A2BB861929 for ; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 18:10:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: from bach (88-134-174-48-dynip.superkabel.de [88.134.174.48]) by mrelayeu.kundenserver.de (node=mrelayeu6) with ESMTP (Nemesis) id 0ML29c-1K95rR1Q8p-0004uk; Thu, 19 Jun 2008 00:10:37 +0200 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: OPro Printing to PDF Problem To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: Martin Wuerthner X-Editor: EmailEdit 1.50 Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2008 00:11:05 +0200 Message-ID: <618792b14f.martin@bach.planiverse.com> References: <4fb0c7ff97lists@ww.co.nz> <3109c9b04f.martin@bach.planiverse.com> <4fb132bef6lists@ww.co.nz> In-Reply-To: <4fb132bef6lists@ww.co.nz> X-Organization: MW Software User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/5.12 (MsgServe/3.42) (RISC-OS/5.11) POPstar/2.05 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX1/IUZ7G4xhIpJN3DLHk3uiut3E1FSSoUsnBrzV A93gV+uYwb6LdCcbPANX85z2FqUQTd47/PChD+uOST2/sFSYLw pXMyHvEpVTN7mKyicnT9ubz+CjJr/lr X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 773 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: public@mw-software.com Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=19xg_O8F3_cA:10 a=UHMdWZNeLDkA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=SqkqpzWlYVH61suWFSsA:9 a=WQdPtLf6uI5XUWqlirsA:7 a=heWLrKZM6pKmixi-v3PKT--kw5oA:4 a=fl4ZfBcLCrEA:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.4.0/1509] In message <4fb132bef6lists@ww.co.nz> "lists (ww)" wrote: > On 17 Jun, Martin Wuerthner wrote: >> So, it looks like the document is broken and it might not be >> connected with PDF at all. For instance, have you tried printing it >> using a different printer driver? > Yes. Sprinter 'prints' it. > I have now decided that it is the funny fonts in my document that > caused the problem with this file Yes, this Gen.XCrumble font always brings the machine down when printing to the PostScript driver no matter from which application you print. It crashes Draw as well. So, it is neither a problem with OP nor with this particular document. Martin -- --------------------------------------------------------------------- Martin Wuerthner MW Software martin@mw-software.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Thu Jun 19 12:00:30 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K99ZT-1SBGPo-03-CoW.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2008 12:00:30 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K99ZT-1SBGPo-03-CoW; Thu, 19 Jun 2008 02:08:19 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.210] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K99ZT-1SBGPo-03 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Thu, 19 Jun 2008 02:08:19 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K99ZS-00035n-Sy for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Thu, 19 Jun 2008 02:08:19 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 8A570861FD3 for ; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 22:08:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 01518-03 for ; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 22:08:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 60E53861FA9 for ; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 22:08:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Wed, 18 Jun 2008 22:07:38 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id B2B24862077 for ; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 22:07:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 01349-10 for ; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 22:07:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mail6.inspire.net.nz (mail6.inspire.net.nz [203.114.168.6]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 32F9E862089 for ; Wed, 18 Jun 2008 22:07:37 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mail5.inspire.net.nz (unknown [10.0.168.5]) by mail6.inspire.net.nz (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC3942AAC44 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2008 14:07:35 +1200 (NZST) Received: from localhost (unknown [10.0.168.8]) by mail5.inspire.net.nz (Postfix) with ESMTP id D49423823E3 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2008 14:07:35 +1200 (NZST) Received: from mail5.inspire.net.nz ([10.0.168.5]) by localhost (mail8.inspire.net.nz [10.0.168.8]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ktJq27BkIYOd for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2008 14:03:20 +1200 (NZST) Received: from freja.khnet.nz (203-114-180-66.dsl.sta.inspire.net.nz [203.114.180.66]) by mail5.inspire.net.nz (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6879B3823E2 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2008 14:07:35 +1200 (NZST) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Keith Hopper To: davidpilling@freelists.org Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2008 14:08:40 +1200 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions Message-ID: <4fb1a847abasgard@inspire.net.nz> In-Reply-To: References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb099961easgard@inspire.net.nz> User-Agent: Pluto/3.04c (RISC-OS/5.11) Content-Type: text/plain X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 774 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: asgard@inspire.net.nz Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=bgbntynrthHiG4Pb6eAA:9 a=4vEimKcKenPsH8zSdboA:7 a=g5yWwbO04D8yopgygVFMRDdkvScA:4 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.4.0/1509] In article , David Pilling wrote: > In message <4fb099961easgard@inspire.net.nz>, Keith Hopper > writes > > Unfortunately neither Plan A nor Plan B work. If I take the default > >(empty) document, remove every reference to Trinity from every style - in > >fact not setting font changes in any except the Body (which I set to > >LondonA - an EFF font) - and save as default. If I load this saved default > >and save as DDL then Trinity flavours appear in the font list (together > >with the one for LondonA) - BUT nowhere else in the DDL document - which is > >empty, of course! LondonA appears, as expected, in the Bodytext style. > You're right. I think the problem is that Trinity is a special case, > when DDL is loaded a very basic document is created and the DDL then > overwrites it, Trinity is the default font for that document. I don't > understand why "flavours" of Trinity are used, in my test it is just one > weight. The DDL file contains // Text styles etc. FONT_29e={font "Trinity.Medium.Italic"} FONT_8f3b={font "Trinity.Medium"} FONT_948e={font "Trinity.Bold"} FONT_a99c={font "Londona"} I note with interest that others trying to print to PDF (I presume with something like PDFMaker) are having similar problems to me. Sometimes a document with LondonA will print, sometimes not and I think this is something to do with the fonts generated in the Postscript. > There is a case to be made that this doesn't matter - Trinity maps to > Times which is a font I assume is present in all PostScript printers and > does not need to be saved in the PostScript. However for you maybe it > comes back to the weights - all the weights being used, and I guess you > having an odd version of the font installed i.e. one with a smallcaps > weight. [snip] > Maybe on RISC OS !FontPrint would be a quick fix, use it to map > Trinity.SmallCaps to Trinity.Italic, a harmless reference will be added > to your PostScript. An interesting suggestion. I hadn't come across !FontPrint before. I have, however, temporarily removed the Smallcaps fonts until the PDF printing problem (which certainly doesn't like those 'flavours') is resolved. -- Inspired! To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Thu Jun 19 21:01:02 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K9LY5-4Mpknw-04-9MQ.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2008 21:01:02 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K9LY5-4Mpknw-04-9MQ; Thu, 19 Jun 2008 14:55:41 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.211] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K9LY5-4Mpknw-04 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Thu, 19 Jun 2008 14:55:41 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K9LXq-0002rj-VK for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Thu, 19 Jun 2008 14:55:41 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 2392C863229 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2008 10:54:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 03252-04 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2008 10:54:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 0046D862E3C for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2008 10:54:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Thu, 19 Jun 2008 10:54:04 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 95BEB863256 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2008 10:54:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 03159-08 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2008 10:54:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: from alpha.arachsys.com (alpha.arachsys.com [91.203.57.7]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 0CBE78631F1 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2008 10:53:49 -0400 (EDT) Received: from i-195-137-122-84.freedom2surf.net ([195.137.122.84] helo=Iyo) by alpha.arachsys.com with esmtpa (Exim 4.52) id 1K9LW1-0004t1-Hw for davidpilling@freelists.org; Thu, 19 Jun 2008 15:53:33 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: "Torrens (lists)" To: davidpilling@freelists.org Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2008 15:42:24 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions Message-ID: <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> In-Reply-To: References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> User-Agent: Pluto/3.04c (RISC-OS/4.39) POPstar/2.06-ds.5 Content-Type: text/plain X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 775 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: Lists@torrens.org.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=DxU3NYB9X85IQMtv-IUA:9 a=2rwzOTMxCfiNDa04i80A:7 a=rNeR6RYMFuBp3UnoDTBtaSwhTEwA:4 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.4.0/1509] In article , David Pilling wrote: > Saving the document as DDL will firstly let you see what fonts OPro > thinks are used, but also will let you see where various fonts are used > - notice the name given to the font, and then look for uses of that > name. Curious, I did this and found a reference to Cien. But there was no text (that I could see) associated. So I went to the O-Pro doc in the appropriate place, did a few 'remove all styles' on line ends in that area, and Cien went! > I think that save as DDL, reload DDL will recount the fonts. But that looses any nice page layout etc. > Plan B, is uninstall the font, load the document (OPro will complain > about the missing font), then save the document. Works, but a pain... Plan C? Would it be possible to put in a font name in the 'Find' dialogue? To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Thu Jun 19 21:15:46 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K9QVJ-1oRknw-07-Cvi.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2008 21:15:46 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K9QVJ-1oRknw-07-Cvi; Thu, 19 Jun 2008 20:13:09 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.95] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K9QVJ-1oRknw-07 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Thu, 19 Jun 2008 20:13:09 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K9QVF-00047f-OE for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Thu, 19 Jun 2008 20:13:09 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 75915862759 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2008 16:12:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 07659-04 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2008 16:12:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 492638629D8 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2008 16:12:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Thu, 19 Jun 2008 16:12:19 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 62931862759 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2008 16:12:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 07554-03 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2008 16:12:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from anchor-post-30.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-30.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.88]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 1CBDA862758 for ; Thu, 19 Jun 2008 16:12:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([62.49.20.172]) by anchor-post-30.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 4.67) id 1K9QUT-0003e7-0m for davidpilling@freelists.org; Thu, 19 Jun 2008 20:12:17 +0000 Message-ID: Date: Thu, 19 Jun 2008 21:10:50 +0100 To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: David Pilling Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> In-Reply-To: <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-S () X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 776 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: flist@pilling.demon.co.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=dqhQn4rJAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=KYY5J0T0sMG-YODYZKIA:9 a=R1zbMUJLtzccE-XTE78A:7 a=tfvLMsG9-KQtWiePwQ5NRAKkFZIA:4 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.93 [270.4.0/1509] In message <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk>, "Torrens (lists)" writes >In article , > David Pilling wrote: >> Saving the document as DDL will firstly let you see what fonts OPro >> thinks are used, but also will let you see where various fonts are used >> - notice the name given to the font, and then look for uses of that >> name. > >Curious, I did this and found a reference to Cien. But there was no text >(that I could see) associated. > >So I went to the O-Pro doc in the appropriate place, did a few 'remove all >styles' on line ends in that area, and Cien went! I would interpret this as, you didn't look hard enough in the DDL for the font references. That is a bit harsh of me because DDL is not documented and even if it was you need to think like a programmer. >> I think that save as DDL, reload DDL will recount the fonts. >But that looses any nice page layout etc. No! It is a common misconception that Ovation Pro DDL is just like Impression DDF. It is not. DDL is supposed to be an exact representation of the document, pages, frames, pictures, the lot. There are two pities about DDL, one is that it was done before XML became popular, and the other is that if the computers back then had been more powerful, DDL would have been the only option for saving documents. Had I adopted DDL in 1995 I would have faced a bunch of whingers "oooh the documents are bigger than Impression and they load so slowly" - hence you're stuck with the horrors of a binary format 8-) >Plan C? >Would it be possible to put in a font name in the 'Find' dialogue? Being able to search for text styles (which includes fonts) is a great idea. It is a major omission. However it would not necessarily help, because the font use may be somewhere that Find does not look. -- David Pilling email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.davidpilling.net post: David Pilling P.O. Box 22 Thornton Cleveleys Blackpool. FY5 1LR UK fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Fri Jun 20 14:40:25 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K9d2h-1ddVbs-06-8uq.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 14:40:25 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K9d2h-1ddVbs-06-8uq; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 09:36:27 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.106] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K9d2h-1ddVbs-06 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 09:36:27 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K9d2f-0003SR-Lg for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 09:36:27 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 2E38E862F08 for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 05:36:25 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 31682-01 for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 05:36:25 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 02A61862E2D for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 05:36:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Fri, 20 Jun 2008 05:35:46 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 3FF78862E58 for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 05:35:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 31495-10 for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 05:35:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mk-outboundfilter-5.mail.uk.tiscali.com (mk-outboundfilter-5.mail.uk.tiscali.com [212.74.114.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id E7BC0862E45 for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 05:35:45 -0400 (EDT) X-Trace: 46738670/mk-outboundfilter-5.mail.uk.tiscali.com/F2S/$ACCEPTED/freedom2Surf-customers/195.137.122.84 X-SBRS: None X-RemoteIP: 195.137.122.84 X-IP-MAIL-FROM: Lists@torrens.org.uk X-IP-BHB: Once X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: ApoEACwWW0jDiXpU/2dsb2JhbACvVwM X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.27,678,1204502400"; d="scan'208";a="46738670" X-IP-Direction: IN Received: from i-195-137-122-84.freedom2surf.net (HELO lab) ([195.137.122.84]) by smtp.f2s.tiscali.co.uk with ESMTP; 20 Jun 2008 10:35:44 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: "Torrens (lists)" To: davidpilling@freelists.org Date: Fri, 20 Jun 2008 09:40:34 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions Message-ID: <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> In-Reply-To: References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/3.04c (RISC-OS/4.39) POPstar/2.06-ds.5 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 777 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: Lists@torrens.org.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=Q2MTwp5kAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=-AddEfDYlsY30Tjs1BcA:9 a=RGcrtlbZnD_-Qw4V4ksA:7 a=pGgv5h60Hmka_WmZ7U1Iv4oj3UUA:4 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.129 [270.4.0/1509] In article , David Pilling wrote: > >So I went to the O-Pro doc in the appropriate place, did a few 'remove > >all styles' on line ends in that area, and Cien went! > I would interpret this as, you didn't look hard enough in the DDL for > the font references. That is a bit harsh of me because DDL is not > documented and even if it was you need to think like a programmer. OK. The original document is at: www.torrens.org.uk/Opera/Rossini/Cenerentola.dpd Looking at the DDL, the only line containing the reference to FONT_7bff is in the bit below. {newpara}{remuserstyle STYLE_13}{adduserstyle STYLE_15} "(stup=E9fait et prenant un air important)" {align 0}{newpara}{remuserstyle STYLE_15}{bold 1}{italic 0}{reverse 0} {super 0}{sub 0} FONT_7bff {textsize 36000}{bold}{italic}{reverse}{sub}{font} {textsize}{align} "Mes filles, que dites-vous!" Scanning around this point in the O-Pro file (page 15), letter by letter I find no Cien font. So to what is the font referring? > >> I think that save as DDL, reload DDL will recount the fonts. > >But that looses any nice page layout etc. > No! It is a common misconception that Ovation Pro DDL is just like > Impression DDF. It is not. DDL is supposed to be an exact representation > of the document, pages, frames, pictures, the lot. Well, the original is a pamphlet. Saving as a DDL looses that information. To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Fri Jun 20 17:24:31 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K9jE6-0au000-02-BFx.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 17:24:31 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K9jE6-0au000-02-BFx; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 16:12:38 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.77] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K9jE6-0au000-02 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 16:12:38 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K9jE2-00007u-TD for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 16:12:38 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 6E66B8625AF for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 12:12:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 08086-08 for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 12:12:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 44EA58626BC for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 12:12:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Fri, 20 Jun 2008 12:11:55 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 081B78625AF for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 12:11:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 07650-09 for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 12:11:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: from anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.92]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 7A94686279F for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 12:11:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([62.49.20.172]) by anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 4.67) id 1K9jDM-0007vq-FG for davidpilling@freelists.org; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 16:11:52 +0000 Message-ID: Date: Fri, 20 Jun 2008 17:10:51 +0100 To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: David Pilling Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> In-Reply-To: <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1;format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-S () X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 778 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: flist@pilling.demon.co.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=dqhQn4rJAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=FDnFfS0k7MHhCugwUwsA:9 a=BWQWEw9BiB9xOeKEmjEA:7 a=cbkr0M0mmG2iba0j5lu-pR4Rhy8A:4 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.129 [270.4.0/1509] In message <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk>, "Torrens (lists)"=20 writes >{newpara}{remuserstyle STYLE_13}{adduserstyle STYLE_15} >"(stup=E9fait et prenant un air important)" >{align 0}{newpara}{remuserstyle STYLE_15}{bold 1}{italic 0}{reverse 0} >{super 0}{sub 0} FONT_7bff {textsize >36000}{bold}{italic}{reverse}{sub}{font} >{textsize}{align} >"Mes filles, que dites-vous!" > >Scanning around this point in the O-Pro file (page 15), letter by letter I >find no Cien font. So to what is the font referring? That is another sort of font reference bug, there is a reference to a=20 font, but no text in that font. I'm a bit surprised by that... the DDL=20 code should clean up such things, perhaps after a DDL load there would=20 not be the reference? >Well, the original is a pamphlet. Saving as a DDL looses that information. That is true, the entire document is preserved but not any details about=20 rendering it on screen or printer. I am inclined to think that was not a=20 good idea. --=20 David Pilling email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.davidpilling.net post: David Pilling P.O. Box 22 Thornton Cleveleys Blackpool. FY5 1LR UK fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Fri Jun 20 21:06:21 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K9mOy-0ImGPo-08-Gbb.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 21:06:21 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K9mOy-0ImGPo-08-Gbb; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 19:36:04 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.77] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K9mOy-0ImGPo-08 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 19:36:04 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K9mOx-0005xl-RW for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 19:36:04 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 627E6862DF0 for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 15:36:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 29978-07 for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 15:36:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 3DBAD862F9F for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 15:36:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Fri, 20 Jun 2008 15:35:23 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 94135862DF0 for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 15:35:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 29885-07 for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 15:35:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mk-outboundfilter-5.mail.uk.tiscali.com (mk-outboundfilter-5.mail.uk.tiscali.com [212.74.114.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 494C8862FF2 for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 15:35:22 -0400 (EDT) X-Trace: 47027134/mk-outboundfilter-5.mail.uk.tiscali.com/F2S/$ACCEPTED/freedom2Surf-customers/195.137.122.84 X-SBRS: None X-RemoteIP: 195.137.122.84 X-IP-MAIL-FROM: Lists@torrens.org.uk X-IP-BHB: Once X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: ApoEAOCiW0jDiXpU/2dsb2JhbACwBwM X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.27,681,1204502400"; d="scan'208";a="47027134" X-IP-Direction: IN Received: from i-195-137-122-84.freedom2surf.net (HELO lab) ([195.137.122.84]) by smtp.f2s.tiscali.co.uk with ESMTP; 20 Jun 2008 20:35:21 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: "Torrens (lists)" To: davidpilling@freelists.org Date: Fri, 20 Jun 2008 20:17:28 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions Message-ID: <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk> In-Reply-To: References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/3.04c (RISC-OS/5.12) POPstar/2.06-ds.5 Content-Type: text/plain X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 779 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: Lists@torrens.org.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=Ufu18saPW0DxxSo7tsMA:9 a=uFjz7oqTkqQ9X1ayvvYA:7 a=Q5BfxQLU6B2Qm9YUr8DgYi7YPmUA:4 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.129 [270.4.0/1509] In article , David Pilling wrote: > >Scanning around this point in the O-Pro file (page 15), letter by > >letter I find no Cien font. So to what is the font referring? > That is another sort of font reference bug, there is a reference to a > font, but no text in that font. I'm a bit surprised by that... the DDL > code should clean up such things, perhaps after a DDL load there would > not be the reference? How easy would it be, when O-Pro complains about a missing font, to allow the user to control the font used as a replacement? To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Fri Jun 20 21:36:20 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K9n7S-3i0Vbs-01-Ft7.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 21:36:20 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K9n7S-3i0Vbs-01-Ft7; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 20:22:02 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.210] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K9n7S-3i0Vbs-01 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 20:22:02 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K9n7N-0001sU-S7 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 20:22:02 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 4AC58862DFF for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 16:21:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 02585-05 for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 16:21:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 260C6862D1B for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 16:21:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Fri, 20 Jun 2008 16:21:12 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id BC72386262C for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 16:21:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 02340-09 for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 16:21:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.87]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 82789862609 for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 16:21:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([62.49.20.172]) by anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 4.68) id 1K9n6d-0003Ie-Mq for davidpilling@freelists.org; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 20:21:11 +0000 Message-ID: Date: Fri, 20 Jun 2008 21:19:58 +0100 To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: David Pilling Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk> In-Reply-To: <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-S () X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 780 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: flist@pilling.demon.co.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=dqhQn4rJAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=qInVw--bF8Mu4uUVu3oA:9 a=rLP4inb_fakQUhfve5sA:7 a=7WUPYWgCAXMtS6GXzMeDOGHGMDwA:4 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.129 [270.4.0/1509] In message <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk>, "Torrens (lists)" writes >How easy would it be, when O-Pro complains about a missing font, to >allow the user to control the font used as a replacement? Essentially the Windows version of OP allows this. Doing anything for RISC OS is difficult because I've had 20 years of aversion therapy... -- David Pilling email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.davidpilling.net post: David Pilling P.O. Box 22 Thornton Cleveleys Blackpool. FY5 1LR UK fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Sat Jun 21 11:37:47 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K9oEP-13R000-06-EmA.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:37:47 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K9oEP-13R000-06-EmA; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 21:33:17 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.245] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K9oEP-13R000-06 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 21:33:17 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K9oEP-0002rS-1M for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 21:33:17 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 631ED86286F for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 17:33:16 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 08002-05 for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 17:33:16 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id C14228627BD for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 17:33:14 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Fri, 20 Jun 2008 17:32:34 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id B590D86286F for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 17:32:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 07880-05 for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 17:32:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: from zen.orpheusnet.co.uk (zen.orpheusnet.co.uk [194.93.128.18]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 6B24E862760 for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 17:32:33 -0400 (EDT) Received: from Iyonix.pnyoung.ormail.co.uk ([88.202.192.149]) by zen.orpheusnet.co.uk (8.14.2/8.14.2) with ESMTP id m5KLWE5Y011969 for ; Fri, 20 Jun 2008 22:32:15 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: Dr Peter Young X-Editor: EmailEdit 1.50 Date: Fri, 20 Jun 2008 22:32:18 +0100 Message-ID: <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk> In-Reply-To: X-Organization: Home User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/5.12 (MsgServe/3.42) (RISC-OS/5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 781 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: pnyoung@ormail.co.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=CKwIYTfOAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=mNfE0COh9TacJaTrMrQA:9 a=uFEl-Ogf5dT2v7cNUWAA:7 a=JuTZC01Ts0oNUO69nDJAVxugEI8A:4 a=LY0hPdMaydYA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.129 [270.4.0/1509] On 20 Jun 2008 David Pilling wrote: > In message <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk>, "Torrens (lists)" > writes >>How easy would it be, when O-Pro complains about a missing font, to >>allow the user to control the font used as a replacement? > Essentially the Windows version of OP allows this. > Doing anything for RISC OS is difficult because I've had 20 years of > aversion therapy... That's one of the saddest things that I've read for ages. I do hope that we ordinary RISC OS users aren't the source of the aversion, as we have a /very/ great deal to be thankful to David for. With best wishes, Peter. -- Peter \ / zfc Er \ Prestbury, Cheltenham, Glos. GL52 Anne \/ __ __ \ England. and / / \ | | |\ | / _ \ http://pnyoung.orpheusweb.co.uk family / \__/ \_/ | \| \__/ \______________ pnyoung@ormail.co.uk. To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Sat Jun 21 11:37:58 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K9xft-3s5Vbs-08-DrC.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:37:58 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K9xft-3s5Vbs-08-DrC; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:38:17 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.72] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K9xft-3s5Vbs-08 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:38:17 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K9xft-0002vO-81 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:38:17 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id ACAF68631F8 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 03:38:16 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 16927-02 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 03:38:16 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 8082F8632D3 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 03:38:16 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Sat, 21 Jun 2008 03:37:37 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 9DA168631F8 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 03:37:37 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 16772-02 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 03:37:37 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com (mtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com [81.103.221.47]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 2EFE1863151 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 03:37:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: from aamtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com ([81.103.221.35]) by mtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20080621074200.EJRR28496.mtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com@aamtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 08:42:00 +0100 Received: from iyonix.ntlworld.com ([82.1.169.32]) by aamtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20080621074328.EUNQ16854.aamtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com@iyonix.ntlworld.com> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 08:43:28 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: Dr Alan Leighton X-Editor: EmailEdit 1.50 Date: Sat, 21 Jun 2008 08:40:11 +0100 Message-ID: References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk> <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/5.12 (MsgServe/3.42) (RISC-OS/5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 782 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: alan.leighton2@ntlworld.com Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=fDx3lXa77J6jUNJbHyIA:9 a=RUo3CQxkPEW0d5c2FXMA:7 a=DFO5P7tty0S36Fcg40s8vID4qpgA:4 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.129 [270.4.0/1509] In message <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> Dr Peter Young wrote: > On 20 Jun 2008 David Pilling wrote: >> In message <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk>, "Torrens (lists)" >> writes >>>How easy would it be, when O-Pro complains about a missing font, to >>>allow the user to control the font used as a replacement? >> Essentially the Windows version of OP allows this. >> Doing anything for RISC OS is difficult because I've had 20 years of >> aversion therapy... > That's one of the saddest things that I've read for ages. I do hope > that we ordinary RISC OS users aren't the source of the aversion, as > we have a /very/ great deal to be thankful to David for. I would like to back Peter 100% in what he says. After watching the program about Bill Gates yesterday I am so grateful for our operating system and those who support it like David. Best wishes Alan -- To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Sat Jun 21 11:37:58 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K9xtp-1OsVbs-01-DdG.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:37:58 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K9xtp-1OsVbs-01-DdG; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:52:41 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.210] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K9xtp-1OsVbs-01 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:52:41 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K9xto-0004cq-JW for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:52:41 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id C1B50863282 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 03:52:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 17997-02 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 03:52:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 99547862D56 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 03:52:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Sat, 21 Jun 2008 03:52:01 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 090E7862AC6 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 03:52:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 17808-06 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 03:52:00 -0400 (EDT) Received: from slave.orpheusnet.co.uk (slave.orpheusnet.co.uk [194.93.128.26]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 97A7D862D12 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 03:51:59 -0400 (EDT) Received: from panther (backup.vigay.com [82.163.120.21]) by slave.orpheusnet.co.uk (8.14.1/8.14.1) with ESMTP id m5L7pjQ5016957 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 08:51:45 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Paul Vigay To: davidpilling@freelists.org Date: Sat, 21 Jun 2008 08:51:47 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions Message-ID: <4fb2cf5dcalists-nospam@vigay.com> In-Reply-To: References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk> <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/3.04c (RISC-OS/5.13) POPstar/2.06-ds.5 X-No-Archive: yes Sensitivity: Private Content-Type: text/plain X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 783 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: lists-nospam@vigay.com Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=0xqhCTqKAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=hiQIgXWcM41XFb76xO0A:9 a=-eEOL3zlahchLhL6GM4A:7 a=ZE-EThEHmhDlfdUpon2d_ySM2ZIA:4 a=4SztSTlPBk4A:10 a=_dQi-Dcv4p4A:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.129 [270.4.0/1509] In a dim and distant universe , Dr Alan Leighton enlightened us thusly: > I would like to back Peter 100% in what he says. After watching the > program about Bill Gates yesterday I am so grateful for our operating > system and those who support it like David. Yeah. That programme made me feel sick. The guy is a megalomaniac psychopath - and thinks he can buy appreciation by chucking money at charities. My disliking for him just reached new heights! He can't even start to buy a better world for all the suffering he's caused in the past 25 years. That's like a paedophile trying to make people like him by donating money to a childrens charity. Just sick if you ask me! Thinking he can 'buy' a Nobel peace prize, sums his mentality up I think. Paul Vigay Editor, www.RISCOS.org -- Using, programming and promoting RISC OS - the most productive computer system in the world. Check it out now, and change your view of computers!! To reply/email, visit http://www.riscos.org/feedback/ "Stewardesses" is the longest word typed with only the left hand. With your right, "lollipop." To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Sat Jun 21 11:38:00 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K9zXf-1MsVbs-04-BzQ.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:38:00 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K9zXf-1MsVbs-04-BzQ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 09:37:55 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.72] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K9zXf-1MsVbs-04 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 09:37:55 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K9zXe-0003NY-SZ for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 09:37:55 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 60C3786245B for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 05:37:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 23654-07 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 05:37:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 36BD6862663 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 05:37:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Sat, 21 Jun 2008 05:37:15 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 58F3C86245B for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 05:37:15 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 23511-08 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 05:37:15 -0400 (EDT) Received: from anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.87]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 25C64862459 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 05:37:14 -0400 (EDT) Received: from charleshope.demon.co.uk ([80.177.174.79] helo=iyonix) by anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 4.68) id 1K9zX0-0002D5-N7 for davidpilling@freelists.org; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 09:37:14 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: charles To: davidpilling@freelists.org Date: Sat, 21 Jun 2008 10:36:57 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions Message-ID: <4fb2d8fe83charles@charleshope.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4fb2cf5dcalists-nospam@vigay.com> References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk> <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <4fb2cf5dcalists-nospam@vigay.com> User-Agent: Pluto/3.04c (RISC-OS/5.11) POPstar/2.05 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-15 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 784 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: charles@charleshope.demon.co.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=JFnGBH3ydCJ4VirNHOgA:9 a=a88FyAC6dhHss883ym8A:7 a=pKTxiIRQPSgFGkJceNKxG1YGmj4A:4 a=MVlnOHnAQ0oA:10 a=_dQi-Dcv4p4A:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.129 [270.4.0/1509] In article <4fb2cf5dcalists-nospam@vigay.com>, Paul Vigay wrote: > In a dim and distant universe , > Dr Alan Leighton enlightened us thusly: > > I would like to back Peter 100% in what he says. After watching the > > program about Bill Gates yesterday I am so grateful for our operating > > system and those who support it like David. > Yeah. That programme made me feel sick. The guy is a megalomaniac > psychopath - and thinks he can buy appreciation by chucking money at > charities. My disliking for him just reached new heights! Just because you dislike Microsoft products is no reason to dismiss Gates' donations to charity. A hundred years ago, Andrew Carnegie made a personal fortune out of the steel industry in the USA and, on retiring, gave millions* to charity. He is considered a philanthropist. * considered to be the equivalent of $4.3 billion at current prices --=20 >From KT24 - in "Leafy Surrey" Using a RISC OS computer running v5.11 To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Sat Jun 21 11:38:00 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1K9zpu-0hH000-06-BhB.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:38:00 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1K9zpu-0hH000-06-BhB; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 09:56:46 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.223] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1K9zpu-0hH000-06 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 09:56:46 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1K9zpt-0002zR-Os for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 09:56:46 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 5021E86253A for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 05:56:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 24793-04 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 05:56:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 24D3086253D for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 05:56:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Sat, 21 Jun 2008 05:56:06 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 3368B86253A for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 05:56:06 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 24638-07 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 05:56:06 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mtaout02-winn.ispmail.ntl.com (mtaout02-winn.ispmail.ntl.com [81.103.221.48]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id C45318622EB for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 05:56:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from aamtaout02-winn.ispmail.ntl.com ([81.103.221.35]) by mtaout02-winn.ispmail.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20080621100041.HFVM7070.mtaout02-winn.ispmail.ntl.com@aamtaout02-winn.ispmail.ntl.com> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:00:41 +0100 Received: from iyonix.ntlworld.com ([82.1.169.32]) by aamtaout02-winn.ispmail.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20080621095915.DXET29365.aamtaout02-winn.ispmail.ntl.com@iyonix.ntlworld.com> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 10:59:15 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: Dr Alan Leighton X-Editor: EmailEdit 1.50 Date: Sat, 21 Jun 2008 10:58:44 +0100 Message-ID: References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk> <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <4fb2cf5dcalists-nospam@vigay.com> <4fb2d8fe83charles@charleshope.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4fb2d8fe83charles@charleshope.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/5.12 (MsgServe/3.42) (RISC-OS/5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 785 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: alan.leighton2@ntlworld.com Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=cV5G1uv4K5nnvxGpKHkA:9 a=Ecii8iqnyuCzCHK_iU4A:7 a=UTtzpQOcGrkPSW9p4_rhub_DP4MA:4 a=MVlnOHnAQ0oA:10 a=_dQi-Dcv4p4A:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.129 [270.4.0/1509] In message <4fb2d8fe83charles@charleshope.demon.co.uk> charles wrote: > In article <4fb2cf5dcalists-nospam@vigay.com>, > Paul Vigay wrote: >> In a dim and distant universe , >> Dr Alan Leighton enlightened us thusly: >>> I would like to back Peter 100% in what he says. After watching the >>> program about Bill Gates yesterday I am so grateful for our operating >>> system and those who support it like David. >> Yeah. That programme made me feel sick. The guy is a megalomaniac >> psychopath - and thinks he can buy appreciation by chucking money at >> charities. My disliking for him just reached new heights! > Just because you dislike Microsoft products is no reason to dismiss Gates' > donations to charity. A hundred years ago, Andrew Carnegie made a personal > fortune out of the steel industry in the USA and, on retiring, gave > millions* to charity. He is considered a philanthropist. > * considered to be the equivalent of $4.3 billion at current prices I have no trouble with this. I actually like some MS products, Power Point being one. However the way they ruthlessly wiled out competition really made me happy for our good old RISC OS. By the way I do not consider Big Bill as a megalomaniac psychopath but hope he gives his money to where it really is needed and although he longs for the Nobel Peace Prize I hope it goes elsewhere as there are plenty more deserving cases. Alan 8=) Alan -- To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Sat Jun 21 11:38:01 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KA0TY-06WVbs-07-B3X.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:38:01 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KA0TY-06WVbs-07-B3X; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 10:37:44 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.245] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KA0TY-06WVbs-07 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 10:37:44 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KA0TX-0005Nl-U8 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 10:37:44 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id A59CC862740 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 06:37:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 27174-06 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 06:37:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 7D1258629A7 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 06:37:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Sat, 21 Jun 2008 06:36:57 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id C8FB0862740 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 06:36:57 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 27103-01 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 06:36:57 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mail.o2.co.uk (jabba.london.02.net [82.132.130.169]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 4BA74862686 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 06:36:57 -0400 (EDT) Received: from [192.168.1.64] (78.86.89.89) by mail.o2.co.uk (8.0.013.3) (authenticated as phillipmarsden@o2.co.uk) id 4851DD9501865A94 for davidpilling@freelists.org; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:36:56 +0100 Message-ID: <485CD9C7.2010709@btinternet.com> Date: Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:36:55 +0100 From: Phillip Marsden User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 (X11/20080505) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: davidpilling@freelists.org Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk> <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <4fb2cf5dcalists-nospam@vigay.com> <4fb2d8fe83charles@charleshope.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4fb2d8fe83charles@charleshope.demon.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-15; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 786 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: phillip.marsden@btinternet.com Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=qJrJCzTo8e-LFtub0pIA:9 a=on6zOTDouitAQas1cCoA:7 a=pPo2mForJGGxz4qJM69NKHmV1ioA:4 a=MVlnOHnAQ0oA:10 a=_dQi-Dcv4p4A:10 a=Nr7Pmq0tdocA:10 a=z4H2JRWSBuQA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.129 [270.4.0/1509] charles wrote: > In article <4fb2cf5dcalists-nospam@vigay.com>, > Paul Vigay wrote: > >> In a dim and distant universe , >> Dr Alan Leighton enlightened us thusly: >> > > >>> I would like to back Peter 100% in what he says. After watching the >>> program about Bill Gates yesterday I am so grateful for our operating >>> system and those who support it like David. >>> > > >> Yeah. That programme made me feel sick. The guy is a megalomaniac >> psychopath - and thinks he can buy appreciation by chucking money at >> charities. My disliking for him just reached new heights! >> > > Just because you dislike Microsoft products is no reason to dismiss Gates' > donations to charity. A hundred years ago, Andrew Carnegie made a personal > fortune out of the steel industry in the USA and, on retiring, gave > millions* to charity. He is considered a philanthropist. > > * considered to be the equivalent of $4.3 billion at current prices > > Although this thread has wandered somewhat from the original topic, I feel that I must respond and agree with Charles. My apologies to David Pilling for mis-using his forum. I don't know what Alan Leighton had in mind, as his statement seemed a bit vague and woolly, but Paul Vigay's statement was very clear. It was the usual invective and it makes me wonder what world Paul is living in. The business tactics of Microsoft have been ruthless, but many companies have been like this in the past. Why single out Microsoft for special treatment? It is quite possible that Bill Gates has been profoundly affected by his wife on the matter of charity. It is not proven that he is trying to buy a Nobel Peace Prize. That was simply the view of Robert Cringeley. If Bill Gates can make a difference in places such as Africa (where the majority of rulers are corrupt and milking money out of the country and from Aid donations) then more power to his elbow! Update: Alan Leighton has made his position clearer in a later posting, and his position certainly does not match that of Paul. -- Regards, Phillip Marsden For quality bespoke acoustic guitars phillip.marsden@btinternet.com To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Sat Jun 21 12:07:48 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KA0tj-0CiGPo-04-AdM.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 12:07:48 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KA0tj-0CiGPo-04-AdM; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:04:47 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.72] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KA0tj-0CiGPo-04 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:04:47 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KA0ti-0004Ir-WE for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:04:47 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 6E97F86252F for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:04:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 28638-06 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:04:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 4C0C0862846 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:04:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:04:07 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 39CB386252F for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:04:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 28520-05 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:04:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.90]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 0668E862521 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:04:06 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([62.49.20.172]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 4.67) id 1KA0t3-000Mvp-9J for davidpilling@freelists.org; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:04:06 +0000 Message-ID: Date: Sat, 21 Jun 2008 12:02:50 +0100 To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: David Pilling Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk> <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-S () X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 787 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: flist@pilling.demon.co.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=dqhQn4rJAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=mR_juDwe7l-300AKwHwA:9 a=LLKQSZTSewvOlSgNZggA:7 a=nUfhVNBBhT7Yq3CbsA2o1Qpizk8A:4 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.130 [270.4.1/1511] In message <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk>, Dr Peter Young writes >On 20 Jun 2008 David Pilling wrote: >> Doing anything for RISC OS is difficult because I've had 20 years of >> aversion therapy... >That's one of the saddest things that I've read for ages. I do hope Yes well maybe that was overdoing it. I certainly had 10 very happy years working on RISC OS (1988-1998). As to Microsoft... the thing is that after 10 years of using Windows (1998-2008) and really trying, I find I don't like it. Eventually something will replace Windows. -- David Pilling email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.davidpilling.net post: David Pilling P.O. Box 22 Thornton Cleveleys Blackpool. FY5 1LR UK fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Sat Jun 21 12:22:48 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KA12l-36Hknw-03-AUK.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 12:22:48 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KA12l-36Hknw-03-AUK; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:14:07 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.245] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KA12l-36Hknw-03 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:14:07 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KA12k-0001a2-II for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:14:06 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 18999862286 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:14:06 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 29424-04 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:14:06 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id ED34486275C for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:14:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:13:27 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 3F1AF862286 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:13:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 29306-01 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:13:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pih-relay04.plus.net (pih-relay04.plus.net [212.159.14.131]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 074DB86215B for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:13:26 -0400 (EDT) Received: from [80.229.238.131] (helo=ASCENSION) by pih-relay04.plus.net with esmtpa (Exim) id 1KA125-0001eG-Um for davidpilling@freelists.org; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 12:13:26 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Ned Abell To: davidpilling@freelists.org Date: Sat, 21 Jun 2008 12:09:37 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions Message-ID: <4fb2e17a71nedabell@weatherpost.org.uk> In-Reply-To: References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk> <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/3.04c (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.06-ds.5 Content-Type: text/plain X-Plusnet-Relay: af84e3d0a783612a896fbfa47ec84ada X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 788 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: nedabell@weatherpost.org.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=XWfWxRDAzHe-SjP83o0A:9 a=d0ju7GpRZlPNBjHlK48A:7 a=AyX8AsaRoI3Z2OPD3QISPCWGAoEA:4 a=LY0hPdMaydYA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.130 [270.4.1/1511] On 21 Jun, David Pilling wrote: > In message <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk>, Dr Peter Young > writes > >On 20 Jun 2008 David Pilling > >wrote: > >> Doing anything for RISC OS is difficult because I've had > >> 20 years of aversion therapy... > >That's one of the saddest things that I've read for ages. > >I do hope > Yes well maybe that was overdoing it. I certainly had 10 > very happy years working on RISC OS (1988-1998). > As to Microsoft... the thing is that after 10 years of > using Windows (1998-2008) and really trying, I find I > don't like it. > Eventually something will replace Windows. It has already - Linux :-) Im exremely happy with my Ubuntu setup and it wasnt a huge learning curve migrating. However the RISC PC still networks away doing all the graphics and publishing thanks to your superb software. Again many thanks for all the hours spent on it. -- besters.. Ned === skype:nedabell To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Sat Jun 21 12:22:48 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KA13s-3zT000-08-ATD.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 12:22:48 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KA13s-3zT000-08-ATD; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:15:16 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.223] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KA13s-3zT000-08 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:15:16 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KA13r-0000kL-Nx for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:15:16 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 5C0A3862227 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:15:15 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 29489-08 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:15:15 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 30EA086250F for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:15:15 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:14:35 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 2494A862227 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:14:35 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 29426-05 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:14:35 -0400 (EDT) Received: from zen.orpheusnet.co.uk (zen.orpheusnet.co.uk [194.93.128.18]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id E5F3D8621BD for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:14:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave.nom ([88.202.209.138]) by zen.orpheusnet.co.uk (8.14.2/8.14.2) with ESMTP id m5LBEM4Y023264 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 12:14:23 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Dave Symes To: Date: Sat, 21 Jun 2008 08:42:13 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] Unwanted font definitions Message-ID: <4fb2ce7d67dave@triffid.co.uk> References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk> <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/3.04c (RISC-OS/6.10) Content-Type: text/plain X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 789 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: dave@triffid.co.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=owb6_LJ8UAJZEbAx4lEA:9 a=biFgVzVVmNlDaK3DKRoA:7 a=2-cJfmGXAvGMHbZx3EvMt9Hp2FsA:4 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.130 [270.4.1/1511] In article <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk>, Dr Peter Young wrote: > On 20 Jun 2008 David Pilling wrote: > > In message <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk>, "Torrens (lists)" > > writes > >>How easy would it be, when O-Pro complains about a missing font, to > >>allow the user to control the font used as a replacement? > > Essentially the Windows version of OP allows this. > > Doing anything for RISC OS is difficult because I've had 20 years of > > aversion therapy... > That's one of the saddest things that I've read for ages. I do hope > that we ordinary RISC OS users aren't the source of the aversion, as > we have a /very/ great deal to be thankful to David for. > With best wishes, > Peter. Indeedy, I couldn't agree more. The software of Mr P has over the years made my computer use easier, and I guess more efficient. I still use OvPro on both RISC OS and Windows, and to be quite honest about it, I like using it in preference to anything else either side of the OS wall. While I do most of my photo graphics work on the Win PC side using PSP, I still do a bit RO side using DPlngscan. (And obviously do all my Vector graphics work on the RO side with Draw... Not a DP app though). Trusty old SparkFS of course... Been using that for years in Zip mode to transfer stuff all over the place. Plus a number of small bits and bobs from the Dpilling stable. Thank you Mr P for making my computer use easier than it would have been. Cheers Dave S -- To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Sat Jun 21 12:37:48 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KA1Jw-3m7knw-03-AD9.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 12:37:48 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KA1Jw-3m7knw-03-AD9; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:31:52 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.223] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KA1Jw-3m7knw-03 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:31:52 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KA1Jv-00038m-UU for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:31:52 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 88907862799 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:31:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 30405-03 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:31:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 5EC2786274F for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:31:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:31:10 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 4C7EF862799 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:31:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 30284-01 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:31:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: from alpha.arachsys.com (alpha.arachsys.com [91.203.57.7]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 1967C862631 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:31:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: from i-195-137-122-84.freedom2surf.net ([195.137.122.84] helo=Iyo) by alpha.arachsys.com with esmtpa (Exim 4.52) id 1KA1JC-0003e3-AT for davidpilling@freelists.org; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 12:31:06 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: "Torrens (lists)" To: davidpilling@freelists.org Date: Sat, 21 Jun 2008 12:13:22 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions Message-ID: <4fb2e1d238Lists@torrens.org.uk> In-Reply-To: References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk> <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/3.04c (RISC-OS/5.12) POPstar/2.06-ds.5 Content-Type: text/plain X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 790 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: Lists@torrens.org.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=gT3mzVZxLmCiWbzR_YMA:9 a=B5_xOEOxR_H3fJK_dx8A:7 a=pymy7KIoAgFJvRpvcKdgncoDfbkA:4 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.130 [270.4.1/1511] In article , David Pilling wrote: > In message <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk>, Dr Peter Young > writes > >On 20 Jun 2008 David Pilling wrote: > >> Doing anything for RISC OS is difficult because I've had 20 years of > >> aversion therapy... > >That's one of the saddest things that I've read for ages. I do hope > Yes well maybe that was overdoing it. I certainly had 10 very happy > years working on RISC OS (1988-1998). > As to Microsoft... the thing is that after 10 years of using Windows > (1998-2008) and really trying, I find I don't like it. Yes, having to admit that there is no future in a OS you do like, and moving to an OS you do not, simply to make a living, must be a a major de-motivator. But you have always been reluctant to do chargeable upgrades for RISC OS. Are there enough changes you could port back into RO to appease your conscience about making an upgrade charge, and are there enough RO users left and willing to pay a charge to make it worth your while? > Eventually something will replace Windows. To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Sat Jun 21 14:07:52 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KA2gm-18G000-04-8qJ.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:07:52 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KA2gm-18G000-04-8qJ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 12:59:32 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.106] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KA2gm-18G000-04 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 12:59:32 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KA2gm-00021V-19 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 12:59:32 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 8D4798628EE for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 08:59:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 02294-08 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 08:59:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 63A618628E4 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 08:59:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Sat, 21 Jun 2008 08:58:52 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id A7FC48628EE for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 08:58:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 02144-07 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 08:58:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: from anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.87]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 72DD28626C0 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 08:58:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([62.49.20.172]) by anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 4.68) id 1KA2g7-0006nZ-Nn for davidpilling@freelists.org; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 12:58:51 +0000 Message-ID: Date: Sat, 21 Jun 2008 13:57:27 +0100 To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: David Pilling Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk> <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <4fb2e1d238Lists@torrens.org.uk> In-Reply-To: <4fb2e1d238Lists@torrens.org.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-S () X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 791 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: flist@pilling.demon.co.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=dqhQn4rJAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=eKB3vQwSFoFb_-XMkt8A:9 a=xbSgt0MsSXnilA1DB-YA:7 a=99WksRwHQIr-HJH7btHYazYWxnYA:4 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.130 [270.4.1/1512] In message <4fb2e1d238Lists@torrens.org.uk>, "Torrens (lists)" writes >Yes, having to admit that there is no future in a OS you do like, and >moving to an OS you do not, simply to make a living, must be a a major >de-motivator. RISC OS was far ahead of Microsoft in 1988, it is now far behind. There's a lot wrong with RISC OS from a 2008 perspective. I have not made a living from Windows, my Windows experience has been more dispiriting than my RISC OS one. >But you have always been reluctant to do chargeable upgrades for RISC OS. >Are there enough changes you could port back into RO to appease your >conscience about making an upgrade charge, and are there enough RO users >left and willing to pay a charge to make it worth your while? My feeling about charging for RISC OS upgrades post 1998 has been that to do so was misleading (things were not going to go on for ever). Nearly ten years after Acorn. I think I was wrong about a couple of things, RISC OS has gone on longer than I expected and I might as well have put the four years work that went into Ovation Pro for Windows into the RISC OS version. Paid for upgrades would not have saved Ovation Pro, the thing that would have done, was more users. I needed more people to see the copies in use and say "this is fantastic I must have it". All this comes back to finding a way forward... I'm thinking something like putting the source code into the public domain and myself departing to a new venture. However this is easier to say than to do. -- David Pilling email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.davidpilling.net post: David Pilling P.O. Box 22 Thornton Cleveleys Blackpool. FY5 1LR UK fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Sat Jun 21 15:37:54 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KA4Be-1NuVbs-08-Frx.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 15:37:54 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KA4Be-1NuVbs-08-Frx; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:35:30 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.77] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KA4Be-1NuVbs-08 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:35:30 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KA4Bc-000530-Aq for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:35:30 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id B9598862801 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 10:35:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 09653-05 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 10:35:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 91062862BA5 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 10:35:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Sat, 21 Jun 2008 10:34:48 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 1A16C862801 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 10:34:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 09556-03 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 10:34:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mtaout02-winn.ispmail.ntl.com (mtaout02-winn.ispmail.ntl.com [81.103.221.48]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id A5F6486257C for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 10:34:47 -0400 (EDT) Received: from aamtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com ([81.103.221.35]) by mtaout02-winn.ispmail.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20080621143925.KUVX7070.mtaout02-winn.ispmail.ntl.com@aamtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com>; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 15:39:25 +0100 Received: from iyonix.ntlworld.com ([82.1.169.32]) by aamtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20080621144038.JSWH16854.aamtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com@iyonix.ntlworld.com>; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 15:40:38 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions To: davidpilling@freelists.org Cc: Jim Nagel , Iyoniix-support@smartgroup.com, info@virtualacorn.co.uk From: Dr Alan Leighton X-Editor: EmailEdit 1.50 Date: Sat, 21 Jun 2008 15:37:18 +0100 Message-ID: <187ef4b24f.alan@ntlworld.com> References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk> <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <4fb2e1d238Lists@torrens.org.uk> In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/5.12 (MsgServe/3.42) (RISC-OS/5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 792 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: alan.leighton2@ntlworld.com Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=PW5d5tcnGcYvf4x4bEsA:9 a=l4GHnvHZe8bz4UG-QAIA:7 a=MMcu6okxE0rHSwGeWWo0tU_PoS4A:4 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.130 [270.4.1/1512] In message David Pilling wrote: > In message <4fb2e1d238Lists@torrens.org.uk>, "Torrens (lists)" > writes >>Yes, having to admit that there is no future in a OS you do like, and >>moving to an OS you do not, simply to make a living, must be a a major >>de-motivator. > RISC OS was far ahead of Microsoft in 1988, it is now far behind. > There's a lot wrong with RISC OS from a 2008 perspective. > I have not made a living from Windows, my Windows experience has been > more dispiriting than my RISC OS one. >>But you have always been reluctant to do chargeable upgrades for RISC O= S. >>Are there enough changes you could port back into RO to appease your >>conscience about making an upgrade charge, and are there enough RO user= s >>left and willing to pay a charge to make it worth your while? > My feeling about charging for RISC OS upgrades post 1998 has been that > to do so was misleading (things were not going to go on for ever). > Nearly ten years after Acorn. I think I was wrong about a couple of > things, RISC OS has gone on longer than I expected and I might as well > have put the four years work that went into Ovation Pro for Windows int= o > the RISC OS version. > Paid for upgrades would not have saved Ovation Pro, the thing that woul= d > have done, was more users. I needed more people to see the copies in us= e > and say "this is fantastic I must have it". > All this comes back to finding a way forward... > I'm thinking something like putting the source code into the public > domain and myself departing to a new venture. However this is easier to= > say than to do. Do a big update on the Riscos version and charge =A350 or maybe a bit=20 more. I guess many would go for that. After all I pay for Easywriter=20 updates and only use it 5% of the time compared with OPro. If you decide to go ahead I know people like Jim Nagel, VA, etc give=20 backing and free advertising. What do others think, can we have a=20 response? Vote my friends --=20 To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Sat Jun 21 15:52:55 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KA4OS-10OGPo-03-Ff9.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 15:52:55 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KA4OS-10OGPo-03-Ff9; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:48:44 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.210] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KA4OS-10OGPo-03 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:48:44 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KA4OR-0006n3-Uh for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:48:44 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 6841486253C for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 10:48:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 10791-10 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 10:48:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 3D4DE862511 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 10:48:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Sat, 21 Jun 2008 10:48:03 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 42B6F8626B7 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 10:48:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 10670-04 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 10:48:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: from zen.orpheusnet.co.uk (zen.orpheusnet.co.uk [194.93.128.18]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id D344B8622D4 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 10:48:02 -0400 (EDT) Received: from Iyonix.pnyoung.ormail.co.uk ([88.202.192.149]) by zen.orpheusnet.co.uk (8.14.2/8.14.2) with ESMTP id m5LEllwp025567 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 15:47:49 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: Dr Peter Young X-Editor: EmailEdit 1.50 Date: Sat, 21 Jun 2008 15:47:51 +0100 Message-ID: <4b75f5b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk> <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <4fb2e1d238Lists@torrens.org.uk> <187ef4b24f.alan@ntlworld.com> In-Reply-To: <187ef4b24f.alan@ntlworld.com> X-Organization: Home User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/5.12 (MsgServe/3.42) (RISC-OS/5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 793 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: pnyoung@ormail.co.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=CKwIYTfOAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=y9GJjBzOizMxsR--4vkA:9 a=V8nVhOUNhUYX65IXMUsA:7 a=MTGRpzA_9QhN0077Tp7sZfIJhvIA:4 a=_dQi-Dcv4p4A:10 a=LY0hPdMaydYA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.130 [270.4.1/1512] On 21 Jun 2008 Dr Alan Leighton wrote: > In message > David Pilling wrote: [snip] > Do a big update on the Riscos version and charge =A350 or maybe a bit > more. I guess many would go for that. After all I pay for Easywriter > updates and only use it 5% of the time compared with OPro. > If you decide to go ahead I know people like Jim Nagel, VA, etc give > backing and free advertising. What do others think, can we have a > response? I'm definitely with Alan on this; David has consistently undersold=20 himself! And in reply his posting, when he was wondering about what=20 might have been different, perhaps attendance at shows might have made=20 a difference? I'm sure many would have liked to thank him in person,=20 and even buy him a drink :-) With best wishes, Peter. --=20 Peter \ / zfc Er \ Prestbury, Cheltenham, Glos. GL52 Anne \/ __ __ \ England. and / / \ | | |\ | / _ \ http://pnyoung.orpheusweb.co.uk family / \__/ \_/ | \| \__/ \______________ pnyoung@ormail.co.uk. To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Sat Jun 21 16:52:57 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KA5FU-2jIGPo-03-Eo7.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 16:52:57 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KA5FU-2jIGPo-03-Eo7; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 15:43:32 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.223] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KA5FU-2jIGPo-03 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 15:43:32 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KA5FU-0003Vj-I3 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 15:43:33 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 32A32862429 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:43:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 16241-01 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:43:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id F2385862313 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:43:29 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:42:50 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 83EB78622CD for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:42:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 15577-10 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:42:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mtaout02-winn.ispmail.ntl.com (mtaout02-winn.ispmail.ntl.com [81.103.221.48]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 1A4BB8622AF for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:42:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from aamtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com ([81.103.221.35]) by mtaout02-winn.ispmail.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20080621154728.LQUI7070.mtaout02-winn.ispmail.ntl.com@aamtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 16:47:28 +0100 Received: from [192.168.0.100] (really [82.28.88.234]) by aamtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20080621154841.KLAV16854.aamtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com@[192.168.0.100]> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 16:48:41 +0100 Date: Sat, 21 Jun 2008 16:41:20 +0100 From: Ray Dawson To: davidpilling@freelists.org Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <4b75f5b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk> <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <4fb2e1d238Lists@torrens.org.uk> <187ef4b24f.alan@ntlworld.com> <4b75f5b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> Mail-Followup-To: davidpilling@freelists.org X-Organization: MagRay User-Agent: Gemini/2.29i (Qt/3.3.8) (Windows-Vista) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 794 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: ray@raydawson.com Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=U8HdSdW88m-g7TaAyjQA:9 a=OFHX6FCNAkgzKnQZsA8A:7 a=ChyEYbimFyS98eu21fGYZ5JN4O4A:4 a=_dQi-Dcv4p4A:10 a=nrUGvYwLnKIA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.130 [270.4.1/1512] Dr Peter Young wrote: > On 21 Jun 2008 Dr Alan Leighton wrote: >=20 > > In message > > David Pilling wrote: >=20 > [snip] >=20 > > Do a big update on the Riscos version and charge =A350 or maybe a bit= > > more. I guess many would go for that. After all I pay for Easywriter > > updates and only use it 5% of the time compared with OPro. >=20 > > If you decide to go ahead I know people like Jim Nagel, VA, etc give > > backing and free advertising. What do others think, can we have a > > response? >=20 > I'm definitely with Alan on this; David has consistently undersold=20 > himself! And in reply his posting, when he was wondering about what=20 > might have been different, perhaps attendance at shows might have made = > a difference? I'm sure many would have liked to thank him in person,=20 > and even buy him a drink :-) I get the impression, from what David has said, that a RISC OS update would require a lot more work as he is no longer geared up to RISC OS. Even at =A350 a head the financial return won't be anywhere near the cost= of programming hours. As for the Windows version, perhaps a limited time version on a magazine CD would be worth considering? Presumably not many Windows users visit th= e OP website, as they have no reason to do so, but maybe using meta words such as 'Word problem replacement' 'Serif Pageplus problem replacement' etc might help :-) On the Windows platform there is much too much competition with established DTP applications for a high cost version of OP to exist. It has to have something 'special' to make users want it instead of the myriad of others. File portability is everything these days and, no matte= r how good an app is, if it can't be read in Word or other major software, it won't be used. Cheers, Ray D To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From ecartis@freelists.org Sat Jun 21 16:52:57 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KA5Gn-3azVbs-06-Emo.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 16:52:57 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KA5Gn-3azVbs-06-Emo; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 15:44:53 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.72] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KA5Gn-3azVbs-06 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 15:44:53 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KA5Gn-00059K-2B for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 15:44:53 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 193FC8622C9 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:44:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 16311-10 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:44:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id EB182862451 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:44:45 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling-admins@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling-admins@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id C10748622C9 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:44:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 16303-10 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:44:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id A2F1485F4E7 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:44:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from freelists.org by freelists.org (ECARTIS/1.0.0); Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:44:45 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 21 Jun 2008 11:44:45 -0400 (EDT) From: FreeLists Mailing List Manager To: davidpilling-admins@freelists.org Message-ID: X-ecartis-antiloop: freelists.org Precedence: list Subject: ab_freelists@matwoo.co.uk unsubscribed from davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=loTn7hfFr8gA:10 a=2jB3m0cph5sA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=v_OuJXoMgleipSvKW2YA:9 a=-4J2--F34Foq6dQleHk2FUvcfDAA:4 a=u1RUh8lOPwcA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.130 [270.4.1/1512] ab_freelists@matwoo.co.uk unsubscribed from list davidpilling Command came from: awb@matwoo.co.uk From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Sat Jun 21 17:37:58 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KA5s8-4MRknw-02-EBT.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 17:37:58 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KA5s8-4MRknw-02-EBT; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 16:23:28 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.106] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KA5s8-4MRknw-02 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 16:23:28 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KA5s4-0002yu-Gd for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 16:23:28 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id EF9B0862526; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 12:23:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 18773-10; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 12:23:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 66EED86267C; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 12:23:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Sat, 21 Jun 2008 12:22:45 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 37C4C862526 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 12:22:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 18627-08 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 12:22:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from slave.orpheusnet.co.uk (slave.orpheusnet.co.uk [194.93.128.26]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id E0D45862488 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 12:22:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: from panther (backup.vigay.com [82.163.120.21]) by slave.orpheusnet.co.uk (8.14.1/8.14.1) with ESMTP id m5LGMLKN021576 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 17:22:22 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Paul Vigay To: davidpilling@freelists.org Date: Sat, 21 Jun 2008 17:13:10 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions Message-ID: <4fb2fd44f7lists-nospam@vigay.com> In-Reply-To: References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk> <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <4fb2e1d238Lists@torrens.org.uk> <187ef4b24f.alan@ntlworld.com> <4b75f5b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/3.04c (RISC-OS/5.13) POPstar/2.06-ds.5 X-No-Archive: yes Sensitivity: Private Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 795 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: lists-nospam@vigay.com Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=0xqhCTqKAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=3grUH5V5b9Ypgr9vwh0A:9 a=cdGNMJBSK1mZ3-oltC0A:7 a=4gxgl3qBGV9lCkP5iTR2Kjdq3cMA:4 a=4SztSTlPBk4A:10 a=bzKVVdKtbjEA:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.130 [270.4.1/1512] In a dim and distant universe , Ray Dawson enlightened us thusly: > I get the impression, from what David has said, that a RISC OS update > would require a lot more work as he is no longer geared up to RISC OS. > Even at =A350 a head the financial return won't be anywhere near the cost > of programming hours. Wouldn't a better approach be for David to work out roughly how much it would cost to do a (major?) update to RISC OS OvPro, then we can work out how many people would need to pay X amount? That would then allow us to calculate how much each update would be for the existing userbase vs, how many additional customers we'd need to make it viable. 100 customers each paying =A3100 for an update would bring in =A310,000 which might contribute to a few months programming.... Paul Vigay Editor, www.RISCOS.org -- Using, programming and promoting RISC OS - the most productive computer system in the world. Check it out now, and change your view of computers!! To reply/email, visit http://www.riscos.org/feedback/ The sooner you fall behind, the more time you'll have to catch up. To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Sat Jun 21 18:38:00 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KA6vm-1q1Vbs-02-D7p.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 18:38:00 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KA6vm-1q1Vbs-02-D7p; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 17:31:18 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.210] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KA6vm-1q1Vbs-02 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 17:31:18 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KA6vl-0006xP-Kb for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 17:31:18 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 06576862B56; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 13:31:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 23241-05; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 13:31:16 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 67F46862B4C; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 13:31:16 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Sat, 21 Jun 2008 13:30:38 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id A4342862B56 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 13:30:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 23171-01 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 13:30:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com (mtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com [81.103.221.47]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 3192A86283C for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 13:30:37 -0400 (EDT) Received: from aamtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com ([81.103.221.35]) by mtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20080621173501.LDEV28496.mtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com@aamtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 18:35:01 +0100 Received: from iyonix.ntlworld.com ([82.1.169.32]) by aamtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20080621173629.LNCU16854.aamtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com@iyonix.ntlworld.com> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 18:36:29 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions To: davidpilling@freelists.org Mail-Followup-To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: Dr Alan Leighton X-Editor: EmailEdit 1.50 Date: Sat, 21 Jun 2008 18:33:12 +0100 Message-ID: <799804b34f.alan@ntlworld.com> References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk> <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <4fb2e1d238Lists@torrens.org.uk> <187ef4b24f.alan@ntlworld.com> <4b75f5b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/5.12 (MsgServe/3.42) (RISC-OS/5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 796 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: alan.leighton2@ntlworld.com Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=0NHXYDtJ6arGqWJJMoUA:9 a=WQhEAGiH5TypntFrm7cA:7 a=dQeHsgTwwZU5gGm4MVvkKvSc-SgA:4 a=bzKVVdKtbjEA:10 a=_dQi-Dcv4p4A:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.130 [270.4.1/1512] In message Ray Dawson wrote: > Dr Peter Young wrote: >> On 21 Jun 2008 Dr Alan Leighton wrote: >>=20 >>> In message >>> David Pilling wrote: >>=20 >> [snip] >>=20 >>> Do a big update on the Riscos version and charge =A350 or maybe a bit= >>> more. I guess many would go for that. After all I pay for Easywriter >>> updates and only use it 5% of the time compared with OPro. >>=20 >>> If you decide to go ahead I know people like Jim Nagel, VA, etc give >>> backing and free advertising. What do others think, can we have a >>> response? >>=20 >> I'm definitely with Alan on this; David has consistently undersold >> himself! And in reply his posting, when he was wondering about what >> might have been different, perhaps attendance at shows might have made= >> a difference? I'm sure many would have liked to thank him in person, >> and even buy him a drink :-) > I get the impression, from what David has said, that a RISC OS update > would require a lot more work as he is no longer geared up to RISC OS. > Even at =A350 a head the financial return won't be anywhere near the co= st of > programming hours. > As for the Windows version, perhaps a limited time version on a magazin= e > CD would be worth considering? Presumably not many Windows users visit = the > OP website, as they have no reason to do so, but maybe using meta words= > such as 'Word problem replacement' 'Serif Pageplus problem replacement'= > etc might help :-) > On the Windows platform there is much too much competition with > established DTP applications for a high cost version of OP to exist. It= > has to have something 'special' to make users want it instead of the > myriad of others. File portability is everything these days and, no mat= ter > how good an app is, if it can't be read in Word or other major software= , > it won't be used. Err is that a no? It may cost more than =A350 but first we need to set a = base line for David to respond to. If he sees a lot of interest then=20 we can take it from there. David has done a lot of work in the PC=20 version which he says some of it can be can be ported over to RISC OS=20 version. I have had my money worth out of DP for all those updated he=20 never charged for. Alan --=20 To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Sat Jun 21 18:53:01 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KA73R-24jVbs-02-D0A.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 18:53:01 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KA73R-24jVbs-02-D0A; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 17:39:13 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.211] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KA73R-24jVbs-02 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 17:39:13 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KA73Q-0003vU-Oh for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 17:39:13 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 284E9862909; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 13:39:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 23728-06; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 13:39:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 91E2D862C03; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 13:39:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Sat, 21 Jun 2008 13:38:33 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 438F1862909 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 13:38:33 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 23657-01 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 13:38:33 -0400 (EDT) Received: from smtp805.mail.ird.yahoo.com (smtp805.mail.ird.yahoo.com [217.146.188.65]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with SMTP id C23048627FB for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 13:38:32 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 21264 invoked from network); 21 Jun 2008 17:38:31 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=btinternet.com; h=Received:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:Subject:To:Mail-Followup-To:From:X-Editor:Date:Message-ID:References:In-Reply-To:User-Agent:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=C5rdjNt39WXXFIQnPPJlqZ6Vl1COGZBT/O9tbHbpqn/A9ajRY0fclk4sfzWhGKjUNKPUlv1DB18z0eFePxRH1DaiufmYd/yKMNnkuHxQvnlquL/qkF1fU6GhwFXM5DKERnJGZ1wClgVoU0f8XzJkPUxuDZqfTnZpIqY2/wqwecU= ; Received: from unknown (HELO MyIyonix.btinternet.com) (bryanpage1@btinternet.com@86.153.246.138 with login) by smtp805.mail.ird.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Jun 2008 17:38:31 -0000 X-YMail-OSG: AGjBkFIVM1mhCfbm42gcmeICGB6E8__XyXONs_uQVFM83O09TKVk6HhdxpXoS6uM9H5ZEdFadwerKGHniBYcoFFGhNBoYdCJvx5TJfNGudUu38EbzWCNWPjmFeCXaR.IPPQ- X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions To: davidpilling@freelists.org Mail-Followup-To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: Bryan X-Editor: EmailEdit 1.50 Date: Sat, 21 Jun 2008 18:38:45 +0100 Message-ID: <951a05b34f.Bryan@btinternet.com> References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk> <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <4fb2e1d238Lists@torrens.org.uk> <187ef4b24f.alan@ntlworld.com> <4b75f5b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <799804b34f.alan@ntlworld.com> In-Reply-To: <799804b34f.alan@ntlworld.com> User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/5.12 (MsgServe/3.42) (RISC-OS/5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 797 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: bryanpage1@btinternet.com Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=d4F8Eip14FzbOqLW-XIA:9 a=hbD-2vl732vMgUEe4TEA:7 a=wdw-FdbRHRcqk5Y7gMoro-tU7f0A:4 a=_dQi-Dcv4p4A:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.130 [270.4.1/1512] In message <799804b34f.alan@ntlworld.com> Dr Alan Leighton wrote: [snip] > Err is that a no? It may cost more than =A350 but first we need to set = a > base line for David to respond to. If he sees a lot of interest then > we can take it from there. David has done a lot of work in the PC > version which he says some of it can be can be ported over to RISC OS > version. I have had my money worth out of DP for all those updated he > never charged for. > Alan Why not do it as Martin Wuerthner does with EasiWriter, offer a set of=20 updates and vote on that set - that way the majority of people get=20 what they want and David can price accordingly. Regards, Bryan --=20 Using an Iyonix Aria Cube running Risc OS 5.13 and Virtual RPC=20 AdjustSA running RO 6.10 on a PC. To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Sat Jun 21 18:53:01 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KA77h-2hsGPo-06-Cvu.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 18:53:01 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KA77h-2hsGPo-06-Cvu; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 17:43:37 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.106] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KA77h-2hsGPo-06 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 17:43:37 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KA77h-0004oZ-Ci for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 17:43:37 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 2674A862415; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 13:43:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 24147-03; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 13:43:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 95B4B862420; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 13:43:29 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Sat, 21 Jun 2008 13:42:50 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 6D35A862415 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 13:42:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 24051-07 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 13:42:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pih-relay04.plus.net (pih-relay04.plus.net [212.159.14.131]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 35FEA862411 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 13:42:49 -0400 (EDT) Received: from [84.92.97.176] (helo=greatest) by pih-relay04.plus.net with esmtp (Exim) id 1KA76p-0004xu-LM for davidpilling@freelists.org; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 18:42:49 +0100 Date: Sat, 21 Jun 2008 18:38:34 +0100 From: Tim Powys-Lybbe To: davidpilling@freelists.org Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions Message-ID: <321605b34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk> References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk> <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <4fb2e1d238Lists@torrens.org.uk> <187ef4b24f.alan@ntlworld.com> <4b75f5b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <4fb2fd44f7lists-nospam@vigay.com> In-Reply-To: <4fb2fd44f7lists-nospam@vigay.com> X-Organization: South Farm, Calstone, Calne, Wilts, England (no house here!) User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/5.12 (MsgServe/3.42) (RISC-OS/5.13) POPstar/2.06-ds.5 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 X-Plusnet-Relay: 077d56c46c97b116b7ad9d54fdbddcb4 X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 798 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: tim@powys.org Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=v6Aic-fSAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=PmCXFd0xmCc9LXAhzBoA:9 a=MI5buEPnf2HQkwmUGaIA:7 a=cNpszXWgulBylTsVWbzovYnO6hsA:4 a=MVlnOHnAQ0oA:10 a=wl_QvbsadU8A:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.130 [270.4.1/1512] In message of 21 Jun, Paul Vigay wrote: > 100 customers each paying =A3100 for an update would bring in =A310,000 > which might contribute to a few months programming.... When I retired in 2000 the going rate for a contract programmer was a mere =A3250 a day. Shall we say that it might, just be a bit more now? So =A310K is a 40 days work, not quite two months, and probably less than that at current daily rates. --=20 Tim Powys-Lybbe=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0= =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0tim@pow= ys.org =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0For a miscellany of bygones: http:= //powys.org/ To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpill= ing From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Sat Jun 21 19:08:01 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KA7Rw-4Cs000-03-Cbf.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 19:08:01 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KA7Rw-4Cs000-03-Cbf; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 18:04:32 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.245] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KA7Rw-4Cs000-03 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 18:04:32 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KA7Rv-0005gH-Ma for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 18:04:32 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 601B986240A; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:04:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 25866-09; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:04:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id C8C10862AAB; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:04:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:03:45 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 3E4F586240A for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:03:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 25736-08 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:03:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com (mtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com [81.103.221.47]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 0DFA48623F4 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:03:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: from aamtaout02-winn.ispmail.ntl.com ([81.103.221.35]) by mtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20080621180802.LLYJ28496.mtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com@aamtaout02-winn.ispmail.ntl.com> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 19:08:02 +0100 Received: from iyonix.ntlworld.com ([82.1.169.32]) by aamtaout02-winn.ispmail.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20080621180650.INSZ29365.aamtaout02-winn.ispmail.ntl.com@iyonix.ntlworld.com> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 19:06:50 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: Dr Alan Leighton X-Editor: EmailEdit 1.50 Date: Sat, 21 Jun 2008 19:05:23 +0100 Message-ID: References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk> <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <4fb2e1d238Lists@torrens.org.uk> <187ef4b24f.alan@ntlworld.com> <4b75f5b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <4fb2fd44f7lists-nospam@vigay.com> <321605b34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <321605b34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/5.12 (MsgServe/3.42) (RISC-OS/5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 799 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: alan.leighton2@ntlworld.com Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=rJgv_MkMEEAElGYRgyUA:9 a=f1j4ZZMiF4mtxz5ZJ5kA:7 a=yi43M9NMmTEZf39zYB45L7BOYEQA:4 a=wl_QvbsadU8A:10 a=MVlnOHnAQ0oA:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.130 [270.4.1/1512] In message <321605b34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk> Tim Powys-Lybbe wrote: > In message of 21 Jun, Paul Vigay wrote: >> 100 customers each paying =A3100 for an update would bring in =A310,00= 0 >> which might contribute to a few months programming.... > When I retired in 2000 the going rate for a contract programmer was a > mere =A3250 a day. Shall we say that it might, just be a bit more now?= > So =A310K is a 40 days work, not quite two months, and probably less th= an > that at current daily rates. I shall put you down as a no then Alan --=20 To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Sat Jun 21 19:08:02 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KA7SF-4DU000-03-CbM.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 19:08:02 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KA7SF-4DU000-03-CbM; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 18:04:51 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.106] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KA7SF-4DU000-03 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 18:04:51 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KA7SF-0000fP-2w for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 18:04:51 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 9D7A6862587; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:04:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 25944-03; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:04:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 1876A862C85; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:04:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:04:12 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 2613D862587 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:04:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 25803-04 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:04:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mtaout03-winn.ispmail.ntl.com (mtaout03-winn.ispmail.ntl.com [81.103.221.49]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id AB4AE862B5C for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:04:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: from aamtaout02-winn.ispmail.ntl.com ([81.103.221.35]) by mtaout03-winn.ispmail.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20080621180930.DAWF16629.mtaout03-winn.ispmail.ntl.com@aamtaout02-winn.ispmail.ntl.com> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 19:09:30 +0100 Received: from iyonix.ntlworld.com ([82.1.169.32]) by aamtaout02-winn.ispmail.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20080621180657.INTW29365.aamtaout02-winn.ispmail.ntl.com@iyonix.ntlworld.com> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 19:06:57 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions To: davidpilling@freelists.org Mail-Followup-To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: Dr Alan Leighton X-Editor: EmailEdit 1.50 Date: Sat, 21 Jun 2008 19:06:19 +0100 Message-ID: References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk> <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <4fb2e1d238Lists@torrens.org.uk> <187ef4b24f.alan@ntlworld.com> <4b75f5b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <799804b34f.alan@ntlworld.com> <951a05b34f.Bryan@btinternet.com> In-Reply-To: <951a05b34f.Bryan@btinternet.com> User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/5.12 (MsgServe/3.42) (RISC-OS/5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 800 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: alan.leighton2@ntlworld.com Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=6fKVpRdU75Q1i6g1dFcA:9 a=yYg0yOdwsFRG_HycEHkA:7 a=UcGtCu4nVGm1jBcFZijXcYjgv6gA:4 a=Nr7Pmq0tdocA:10 a=_dQi-Dcv4p4A:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.130 [270.4.1/1512] In message <951a05b34f.Bryan@btinternet.com> Bryan wrote: > In message <799804b34f.alan@ntlworld.com> > Dr Alan Leighton wrote: > [snip] >> Err is that a no? It may cost more than =A350 but first we need to set= a >> base line for David to respond to. If he sees a lot of interest then >> we can take it from there. David has done a lot of work in the PC >> version which he says some of it can be can be ported over to RISC OS >> version. I have had my money worth out of DP for all those updated he >> never charged for. >> Alan > Why not do it as Martin Wuerthner does with EasiWriter, offer a set of > updates and vote on that set - that way the majority of people get > what they want and David can price accordingly. Another no. I wish David would do the same. Alan --=20 To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Sat Jun 21 19:23:02 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KA7ae-1wfVbs-04-CSx.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 19:23:02 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KA7ae-1wfVbs-04-CSx; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 18:13:32 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.245] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KA7ae-1wfVbs-04 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 18:13:32 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KA7ad-0004N4-MJ for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 18:13:32 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 15CE4862431; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:13:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 26757-10; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:13:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 826EE862613; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:13:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:12:52 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 0EC5D862431 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:12:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 26667-07 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:12:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from smtp807.mail.ird.yahoo.com (smtp807.mail.ird.yahoo.com [217.146.188.67]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with SMTP id 8E2C1862077 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:12:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 83564 invoked from network); 21 Jun 2008 18:12:50 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=btinternet.com; h=Received:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:Subject:To:Mail-Followup-To:From:X-Editor:Date:Message-ID:References:In-Reply-To:User-Agent:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=RcD4pJry51j7ptn95RjUyTEmorn+vfUY+5bA/moSFM+ZA1Llmqx4RtSV3bmO3j3LQCo3fqOOwwmBc2VjMhNwIQJ2xTIGqA7inYMw0MhyxGgSmt0Poxvu8whcxd0OcryzjGZB1MyOb15nsPazc9HM2H7Y4v6ziIGxvEtAwNDhEDU= ; Received: from unknown (HELO MyIyonix.btinternet.com) (bryanpage1@btinternet.com@86.153.246.138 with login) by smtp807.mail.ird.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Jun 2008 18:12:50 -0000 X-YMail-OSG: W2VVKnIVM1mYhF.Z_SOdgnvk7SAJo96IQs6GLBhM2m2lIdyqL3dQV8yFnstzqrfcbTF2rwFFVkal_RGgqc0znfo3534D73cRaw50MNh_BBmLkpSt1byl82r1yE5EbpOPloE- X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions To: davidpilling@freelists.org Mail-Followup-To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: Bryan X-Editor: EmailEdit 1.50 Date: Sat, 21 Jun 2008 19:12:21 +0100 Message-ID: <2d2e08b34f.Bryan@btinternet.com> References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk> <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <4fb2e1d238Lists@torrens.org.uk> <187ef4b24f.alan@ntlworld.com> <4b75f5b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <799804b34f.alan@ntlworld.com> <951a05b34f.Bryan@btinternet.com> In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/5.12 (MsgServe/3.42) (RISC-OS/5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 801 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: bryanpage1@btinternet.com Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=isBDDDMBoYyxQ2vYjFMA:9 a=X8VqOgIlPEFvfnchjTMA:7 a=yphI5JXrURjkxb3C34rSTFhLoEkA:4 a=_dQi-Dcv4p4A:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.130 [270.4.1/1512] In message Dr Alan Leighton wrote: [snip] > Another no. I wish David would do the same. > Alan I find your answer a little short to say the least, please explain. Bryan -- Using an Iyonix Aria Cube running Risc OS 5.13 and Virtual RPC AdjustSA running RO 6.10 on a PC. To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Sat Jun 21 19:53:03 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KA84F-1c6000-08-BzM.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 19:53:03 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KA84F-1c6000-08-BzM; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 18:44:07 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.245] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KA84F-1c6000-08 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 18:44:07 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KA84E-0003mZ-Qz for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 18:44:07 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id C6026861DDD; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:44:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 29749-04; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:44:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 3D4A28623FE; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:44:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:43:27 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 6AEB6861DDD for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:43:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 29618-08 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:43:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com (mtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com [81.103.221.47]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 04D1D85E83D for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:43:26 -0400 (EDT) Received: from aamtaout04-winn.ispmail.ntl.com ([81.103.221.35]) by mtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20080621184750.LWKV28496.mtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com@aamtaout04-winn.ispmail.ntl.com> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 19:47:50 +0100 Received: from iyonix.ntlworld.com ([82.1.169.32]) by aamtaout04-winn.ispmail.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20080621184332.FWYL18637.aamtaout04-winn.ispmail.ntl.com@iyonix.ntlworld.com> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 19:43:32 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions To: davidpilling@freelists.org Mail-Followup-To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: Dr Alan Leighton X-Editor: EmailEdit 1.50 Date: Sat, 21 Jun 2008 19:46:08 +0100 Message-ID: <07460bb34f.alan@ntlworld.com> References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk> <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <4fb2e1d238Lists@torrens.org.uk> <187ef4b24f.alan@ntlworld.com> <4b75f5b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <799804b34f.alan@ntlworld.com> <951a05b34f.Bryan@btinternet.com> <2d2e08b34f.Bryan@btinternet.com> In-Reply-To: <2d2e08b34f.Bryan@btinternet.com> User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/5.12 (MsgServe/3.42) (RISC-OS/5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 802 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: alan.leighton2@ntlworld.com Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=nburpIHWRxfjngaNc74A:9 a=minHsLwxoXhPxYZ8lwgA:7 a=RDxCrCMaBf1H3qSGEVotSV281eUA:4 a=Nr7Pmq0tdocA:10 a=_dQi-Dcv4p4A:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.130 [270.4.1/1512] In message <2d2e08b34f.Bryan@btinternet.com> Bryan wrote: > In message > Dr Alan Leighton wrote: > [snip] >> Another no. I wish David would do the same. >> Alan > I find your answer a little short to say the least, please explain. Sorry Bryan I thought you had read the original posting. Which said in essence who would support a paid update. I am listing the replies. Blessings Alan -- To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Sat Jun 21 20:08:03 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KA8IB-4VjVbs-02-BlQ.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 20:08:03 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KA8IB-4VjVbs-02-BlQ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 18:58:31 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.77] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KA8IB-4VjVbs-02 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 18:58:31 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KA8IA-0005Xk-Jg for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 18:58:31 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 0F7A5862238; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:58:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 30892-05; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:58:29 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 761E08621F2; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:58:29 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:57:51 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id CCE4F862745 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:57:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 30765-09 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:57:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from smtp810.mail.ird.yahoo.com (smtp810.mail.ird.yahoo.com [217.146.188.70]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with SMTP id 60517862072 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 14:57:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 77380 invoked from network); 21 Jun 2008 18:57:50 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=btinternet.com; h=Received:X-YMail-OSG:X-Yahoo-Newman-Property:Subject:To:Mail-Followup-To:From:X-Editor:Date:Message-ID:References:In-Reply-To:User-Agent:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=UvWqgwTbdLZ6cH+t0p1Sp4X5QV92ntT/IhCzTqrHV4RtKtl1jsRNayb7Ukkrr7LN4xqIzw91dEvmEN5RQFOGx6vy1x/HKr8kk4TeJsSd/pJZdQ7DLSdiT0OkZf3YGlVnN55cgerOt0FMJCe0co4w69FcD2XdPR8cZkZR5HuA+dk= ; Received: from unknown (HELO MyIyonix.btinternet.com) (bryanpage1@btinternet.com@86.153.246.138 with login) by smtp810.mail.ird.yahoo.com with SMTP; 21 Jun 2008 18:57:50 -0000 X-YMail-OSG: l9YpwDcVM1lXxf2jLZv_S4TVzIrVq.K.RFrBzwRrMC0CtwU1aEITJemxeIVzCbgMLl5d3EiS3e9cHLWF89JtB1k39cAZkmS.sF_fcD0_OM2P4MCYU4MzFcxLMgFFGCYe8Iw- X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions To: davidpilling@freelists.org Mail-Followup-To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: Bryan X-Editor: EmailEdit 1.50 Date: Sat, 21 Jun 2008 19:58:02 +0100 Message-ID: References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk> <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <4fb2e1d238Lists@torrens.org.uk> <187ef4b24f.alan@ntlworld.com> <4b75f5b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <799804b34f.alan@ntlworld.com> <951a05b34f.Bryan@btinternet.com> <2d2e08b34f.Bryan@btinternet.com> <07460bb34f.alan@ntlworld.com> In-Reply-To: <07460bb34f.alan@ntlworld.com> User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/5.12 (MsgServe/3.42) (RISC-OS/5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 803 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: bryanpage1@btinternet.com Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=M-hMJqDIBfybM1Hg-X4A:9 a=887Z8t0CPCCrRwZMTFoA:7 a=SxxBZgc1M-mFSvw07U56h5NAAk4A:4 a=_dQi-Dcv4p4A:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.130 [270.4.1/1512] In message <07460bb34f.alan@ntlworld.com> Dr Alan Leighton wrote: [snip] > Sorry Bryan I thought you had read the original posting. Which said in > essence who would support a paid update. > I am listing the replies. > Blessings > Alan The answer to that would be a resounding "Yes" and my apologies for not having read the previous postings. Bryan -- Using an Iyonix Aria Cube running Risc OS 5.13 and Virtual RPC AdjustSA running RO 6.10 on a PC. To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Sat Jun 21 20:38:04 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KA8jA-49qVbs-04-BKR.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 20:38:04 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KA8jA-49qVbs-04-BKR; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 19:26:24 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.245] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KA8jA-49qVbs-04 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 19:26:24 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KA8jA-0006XV-Ex for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 19:26:24 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id F24BC862596; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 15:26:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 00367-07; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 15:26:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 6CADA8626F7; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 15:26:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Sat, 21 Jun 2008 15:25:45 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id E798E862596 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 15:25:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 32691-10 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 15:25:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: from smtp.talktalk.net (smtp-out-1.talktalk.net [62.24.128.231]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 9913C86258F for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 15:25:44 -0400 (EDT) X-Path: TTSMTP X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AoIyAKjyXEhOlPCVPGdsb2JhbACBP5EfAQEBAS2bKA Received: from unknown (HELO Kinetic.) ([78.148.240.149]) by smtp.talktalk.net with ESMTP; 21 Jun 2008 20:25:43 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Steve Yandell To: davidpilling@freelists.org Date: Sat, 21 Jun 2008 20:25:36 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions Message-ID: <4fb30ee305steyan@talktalk.net> In-Reply-To: <07460bb34f.alan@ntlworld.com> References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk> <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <4fb2e1d238Lists@torrens.org.uk> <187ef4b24f.alan@ntlworld.com> <4b75f5b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <799804b34f.alan@ntlworld.com> <951a05b34f.Bryan@btinternet.com> <2d2e08b34f.Bryan@btinternet.com> <07460bb34f.alan@ntlworld.com> User-Agent: Pluto/3.04c (RISC-OS/6.10) Content-Type: text/plain X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 804 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: steyan@talktalk.net Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=wsfpr4vr21Eb5lfQGFcA:9 a=HrE5GUHMff5SyUB4JDYA:7 a=OOF5lmMVC5ZW_sghAvdmH8-TJ6UA:4 a=_dQi-Dcv4p4A:10 a=muIvw5a9-cgA:10 a=LY0hPdMaydYA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.130 [270.4.1/1512] On 21 Jun, Dr Alan Leighton wrote: > I am listing the replies. > Blessings > Alan In the hope that such a list might persuade David, I would say yay. I have been lost in wonderment at both David and Martin's capacity not just to write programs but to understand the needs of professional users of DTP, graphics packages and how printing processes work. -- steyan@talktalk.net To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Sun Jun 22 11:58:18 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KAAh9-3JR000-01-9MS.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Sun, 22 Jun 2008 11:58:18 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KAAh9-3JR000-01-9MS; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 21:32:27 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.77] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KAAh9-3JR000-01 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 21:32:27 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KAAh9-0003CT-37 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 21:32:27 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id B66288630D4; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 17:32:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 10979-03; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 17:32:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 2DCE486314A; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 17:32:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Sat, 21 Jun 2008 17:31:41 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 883148630D4 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 17:31:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 10876-07 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 17:31:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from slave.orpheusnet.co.uk (slave.orpheusnet.co.uk [194.93.128.26]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 3EC3E862D14 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 17:31:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: from panther (backup.vigay.com [82.163.120.21]) by slave.orpheusnet.co.uk (8.14.1/8.14.1) with ESMTP id m5LLVBZS024380 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 22:31:12 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Paul Vigay To: davidpilling@freelists.org Date: Sat, 21 Jun 2008 22:29:44 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions Message-ID: <4fb31a4054lists-nospam@vigay.com> In-Reply-To: <321605b34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk> References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk> <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <4fb2e1d238Lists@torrens.org.uk> <187ef4b24f.alan@ntlworld.com> <4b75f5b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <4fb2fd44f7lists-nospam@vigay.com> <321605b34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/3.04c (RISC-OS/5.13) POPstar/2.06-ds.5 X-No-Archive: yes Sensitivity: Private Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 805 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: lists-nospam@vigay.com Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=0xqhCTqKAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=7gFVYm8u6EUd3Ez4YhQA:9 a=Aa836SZUlFECpm1DQuMA:7 a=BUrOm9h46_7T-EfOS-5qQHEOJl4A:4 a=4SztSTlPBk4A:10 a=wl_QvbsadU8A:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.130 [270.4.1/1513] In a dim and distant universe <321605b34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk>, Tim Powys-Lybbe enlightened us thusly: > When I retired in 2000 the going rate for a contract programmer was a > mere =A3250 a day. I'm in the wrong job. :-( I get less than that a week! Paul Vigay Editor, www.RISCOS.org -- Using, programming and promoting RISC OS - the most productive computer system in the world. Check it out now, and change your view of computers!! To reply/email, visit http://www.riscos.org/feedback/ 21 of Life's Unanswered Questions... 10. Why is it that rain drops but snow falls? To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Sun Jun 22 11:58:20 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KAB6b-4IaVbs-07-8x0.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Sun, 22 Jun 2008 11:58:20 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KAB6b-4IaVbs-07-8x0; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 21:58:45 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.223] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KAB6b-4IaVbs-07 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 21:58:45 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KAB6V-0006dc-GM for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 21:58:45 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id E927E862CEB; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 17:58:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 12810-07; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 17:58:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 66377862D09; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 17:58:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Sat, 21 Jun 2008 17:57:51 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id D17EE862CEB for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 17:57:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 12578-06 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 17:57:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from ptb-relay02.plus.net (ptb-relay02.plus.net [212.159.14.213]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 9B5FC862CE8 for ; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 17:57:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from [84.92.97.176] (helo=greatest) by ptb-relay02.plus.net with esmtp (Exim) id 1KAB5d-0004vN-Cl for davidpilling@freelists.org; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 22:57:50 +0100 Date: Sat, 21 Jun 2008 22:52:48 +0100 From: Tim Powys-Lybbe To: davidpilling@freelists.org Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions Message-ID: References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk> <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <4fb2e1d238Lists@torrens.org.uk> <187ef4b24f.alan@ntlworld.com> <4b75f5b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <4fb2fd44f7lists-nospam@vigay.com> <321605b34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: X-Organization: South Farm, Calstone, Calne, Wilts, England (no house here!) User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/5.12 (MsgServe/3.42) (RISC-OS/5.13) POPstar/2.06-ds.5 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 X-Plusnet-Relay: 4b63cea99510ffdcb9fca9a601b4b66b X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 806 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: tim@powys.org Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=v6Aic-fSAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=kNYRTAWQZG6ilC2-X4gA:9 a=WdMXJFq0YJhBilwLWNMA:7 a=9NuQtncdoBE1Blu4eiLLgG4TD7QA:4 a=_dQi-Dcv4p4A:10 a=wl_QvbsadU8A:10 a=MVlnOHnAQ0oA:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.130 [270.4.1/1513] In message of 21 Jun, Dr Alan Leighton wrote: > In message <321605b34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk> > Tim Powys-Lybbe wrote: >=20 > > In message of 21 Jun, Paul Vigay wrote: >=20 > >> 100 customers each paying =A3100 for an update would bring rin > >> =A310,000 which might contribute to a few months programming.... >=20 > > When I retired in 2000 the going rate for a contrarct programmer was > > a mere =A3250 a day. Shall we say that it might, just be a bit more > > now? So =A310K is a 40 days work, not quite two months, and probably > > less than that at current daily rates. >=20 > I shall put you down as a no then Can't see why. --=20 Tim Powys-Lybbe=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0= =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0tim@pow= ys.org =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0For a miscellany of bygones: http:= //powys.org/ To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpill= ing From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Sun Jun 22 11:58:21 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KAClA-46Fknw-06-Fox.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Sun, 22 Jun 2008 11:58:21 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KAClA-46Fknw-06-Fox; Sat, 21 Jun 2008 23:44:44 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.210] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KAClA-46Fknw-06 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; 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Sun, 22 Jun 2008 11:44:02 +1200 (NZST) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Keith Hopper To: davidpilling@freelists.org Date: Sun, 22 Jun 2008 11:45:11 +1200 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions Message-ID: <4fb326a6bdasgard@inspire.net.nz> In-Reply-To: <321605b34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk> References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk> <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <4fb2e1d238Lists@torrens.org.uk> <187ef4b24f.alan@ntlworld.com> <4b75f5b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <4fb2fd44f7lists-nospam@vigay.com> <321605b34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/3.04c (RISC-OS/5.11) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 807 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: asgard@inspire.net.nz Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=boZg6xF9ssJEtFJJPw4A:9 a=pU_Z3NvgL9Vz0d9YpIAA:7 a=dvD6tXoGLFHGc1PQoiWQvkcmzUwA:4 a=wl_QvbsadU8A:10 a=MVlnOHnAQ0oA:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.130 [270.4.1/1513] In article <321605b34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk>, Tim Powys-Lybbe wrote: > In message of 21 Jun, Paul Vigay wrote: > > 100 customers each paying =A3100 for an update would bring in =A310,000 > > which might contribute to a few months programming.... > When I retired in 2000 the going rate for a contract programmer was a > mere =A3250 a day. Shall we say that it might, just be a bit more now? > So =A310K is a 40 days work, not quite two months, and probably less than > that at current daily rates. As I commented in a news group earlier today I am happy to pay GBP50 or over if necessary - even though I don't use OvnPro as much as I used to - my wife does. If you are thinking of a wish list then, before we 'vote' I would suggest that David's advice on likely cost (in time or money terms) of each item on the list could be helpful. I know that my 'most wanted' feature is likely to be fearfully expensive so I will just keep my mush shut!! Keith --=20 Inspired! To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 24 11:23:46 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KAgAt-4NXknw-06-Bym.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:23:46 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KAgAt-4NXknw-06-Bym; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 07:09:15 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.210] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KAgAt-4NXknw-06 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 07:09:15 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KAgAs-0007nd-Ri for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 07:09:15 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 4D8EE863438; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 03:09:14 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 04275-09; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 03:09:14 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id C48CA863345; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 03:09:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Mon, 23 Jun 2008 03:08:35 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 49E6F86345D for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 03:08:35 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 04199-02 for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 03:08:35 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mk-outboundfilter-3.mail.uk.tiscali.com (mk-outboundfilter-3.mail.uk.tiscali.com [212.74.114.23]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id E03E9863437 for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 03:08:34 -0400 (EDT) X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: ApoEAEBvV0jDiXpU/2dsb2JhbACvBAM X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.27,688,1204502400"; d="scan'208";a="135127887" X-IP-Direction: IN Received: from i-195-137-122-84.freedom2surf.net (HELO lab) ([195.137.122.84]) by smtp.f2s.tiscali.co.uk with ESMTP; 23 Jun 2008 08:08:33 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: "Torrens (lists)" To: davidpilling@freelists.org Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2008 08:08:23 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] O-Pro's future Message-ID: <4fb3d31088Lists@torrens.org.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/3.04c (RISC-OS/4.39) POPstar/2.06-ds.5 Content-Type: text/plain X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 808 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: Lists@torrens.org.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=ey2iPqIFAAAA:8 a=Q2MTwp5kAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=W__X8tBUNg2G3W812iEA:9 a=0ypvwC4qQFkLa3EjDToA:7 a=7TcDiP6TvOOwZpy2znJyuNjLk6wA:4 a=hpF-ijbX5cwA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.130 [270.4.1/1513] What Dave needs is only in part money. He needs to be able to see, or even imagine, a light at the end of the tunnel. Hindsight is wonderful stuff. We can all think of things that should have been done years ago. Yes, doing a chargeable upgrade now will give him a little cash. But O-Pro's too good to upgrade much. Any upgrades can only get thinner on the ground. So can we all get together and do something that will get O-Pro noticed? What? So we can all busily transcribe books. And form a O-Pro web ring showing examples. For a long time I have put 4QD's technical manuals on the ww. I do not know is anyone uses them in that form. I have to also have present a pdf file! To anyone already interested in O-Pro, yes some of them are pretty examples of what O-Pro and Vector can do, e.g. http://www.4qd.co.uk/instrs/OPro/Pro_150Ser.dpd but it's hardly going to attract new users. Has anyone else any similar resources? Could we form a web ring? I have recently added a section of Opera libretti. http://www.Torrens.org.uk/Opera/index.html If that was a _lot_ bigger - yes something like that could attract interest. but some such resource needs to be huge, either as a single resource or as a linked set. If it's bit enough, it could get (paper) press attention, world-wide. But only in the musical press. O-Pro needs some such resource big enough and general enough to get proper press attention. Can we think of a project, and enough of us combine to do it? To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 24 11:23:46 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KAhTw-2bbknw-04-Afj.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:23:46 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KAhTw-2bbknw-04-Afj; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 08:33:00 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.72] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KAhTw-2bbknw-04 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 08:33:00 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KAhTw-0007Gy-Cq for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 08:33:00 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id B5EE3863066; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 04:32:59 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 10934-02; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 04:32:59 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 3C79B8633BB; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 04:32:59 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Mon, 23 Jun 2008 04:32:21 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 47757863066 for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 04:32:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 10687-07 for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 04:32:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pih-relay06.plus.net (pih-relay06.plus.net [212.159.14.133]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id E1B3C862C9F for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 04:32:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: from [84.92.97.176] (helo=greatest) by pih-relay06.plus.net with esmtp (Exim) id 1KAhTB-0002T6-Dt for davidpilling@freelists.org; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 09:32:18 +0100 Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2008 09:26:59 +0100 From: Tim Powys-Lybbe To: davidpilling@freelists.org Message-ID: <9242dab34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk> X-Organization: South Farm, Calstone, Calne, Wilts, England (no house here!) User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/5.12 (MsgServe/3.42) (RISC-OS/5.13) POPstar/2.06-ds.5 Subject: [softwarelist] Loading pictures into OPro MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 X-Plusnet-Relay: c49aabe7e409d5a1ea633fc46411c125 X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 809 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: tim@powys.org Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=CVu5_CJqJk4A:10 a=hoVx7TwzztgA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=v6Aic-fSAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=P2yDYHpMVb4t3Hz_L9wA:9 a=rici1hAdV7xclZMc6u4A:7 a=gx4rwy_60AzcPsQMLmoFSIu3sAoA:4 a=wl_QvbsadU8A:10 a=-ZQhYGXY2L8A:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.130 [270.4.1/1513] For some years now I have been using OPro to construct PDF files that consist of a series of pictures (scans) of old documents. By and large I find that this can only be done successfully by converting the pictures to (large) sprites. Using alternative strategies has one or two problems: First: Set OPro to load by Reference for files above 210 Kbytes. -------------------------------------------------------- To demonstrate this problem, I made a one-page document into which I loaded a 3.5M Tiff file, with 16-bit colour. It loaded OK. Then: Saved it, Closed the file Reloaded the file and got the error "Bad Page Number" The file was in fact corrupt and had to be deleted. Sometimes I have had to kill OPro to clear this. =20 Second: Load in 1-bit Tiff files ------------------------ Again I started with a one-page document. The one-bit Tiff files are black and white, made by scanning with DPlngScan and thus of very low size. Trying to load these produces the error: "Unknown or missing variable (internal number 6282)" The file is not corrupted by this and loading a usable graphics file over the same page gives a usable result. Third: Load in 1-bit Gif files ----------------------- Using the same file as in the previous example I converted them to Gif; this increased the size from, say, 40 Kbytes or so to 60 Kbytes or so. The Gif files would load into OPro with no trouble; but saving the OPro file resulted in a file of 6 Mbytes (yes, Mega). Fourth: Load in 1-bit Sprite files -------------------------- Using the same file as in the previous two examples, but converted to sprite of, say, 256 Kbytes, the resulting OPro file was totally OK and was a mere 263 Kbytes. All these images have been scanned in by DPlngScan, which is perhaps my most frequently used of all RISC OS applications, e-mailing apart. A totally alternative strategy might be to use another program to assemble all the images to join them together into one PDF file. But I have yet to find a program that does this as easily as OPro - and I have tried Easiwriter. Any suggestions, anyone? --=20 Tim Powys-Lybbe=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0= =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0tim@pow= ys.org =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0For a miscellany of bygones: http:= //powys.org/ To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpill= ing From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 24 11:23:48 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KAiI4-0Lr000-06-9rb.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:23:48 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KAiI4-0Lr000-06-9rb; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 09:24:48 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.210] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KAiI4-0Lr000-06 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 09:24:48 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KAiI3-0004l7-Hy for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 09:24:47 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 49AE1863084; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 05:24:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 15940-01; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 05:24:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id CBE83862EB9; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 05:24:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Mon, 23 Jun 2008 05:24:01 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id D6E5A862B9D for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 05:24:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 15766-06 for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 05:24:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hpsmtp-eml15.kpnxchange.com (hpsmtp-eml15.kpnxchange.com [213.75.38.115]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 85E818628F2 for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 05:24:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cpsmtp-eml113.kpnxchange.com ([213.75.84.113]) by hpsmtp-eml15.kpnxchange.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 23 Jun 2008 11:23:58 +0200 Received: from iyonix.delink.speed.planet.nl ([81.204.75.73]) by cpsmtp-eml113.kpnxchange.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 23 Jun 2008 11:23:58 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Paul Sprangers To: davidpilling@freelists.org Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2008 11:24:55 +0200 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: O-Pro's future Message-ID: <4fb3df9051Paul@sprie.nl> In-Reply-To: <4fb3d31088Lists@torrens.org.uk> References: <4fb3d31088Lists@torrens.org.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/3.04c (RISC-OS/5.13) Content-Type: text/plain X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 Jun 2008 09:23:58.0887 (UTC) FILETIME=[DDE3A370:01C8D512] X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 810 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: Paul@sprie.nl Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=ey2iPqIFAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=zd3IxBPUy_UJBCl1o-0A:9 a=NSpLkD1xYG0kEBZ97ZMA:7 a=EXfqlPNC7paq9oLzFtXPJX2q3dEA:4 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.130 [270.4.1/1513] In article <4fb3d31088Lists@torrens.org.uk>, Torrens (lists) wrote: > To anyone already interested in O-Pro, yes some of them are pretty > examples of what O-Pro and Vector can do, e.g. > http://www.4qd.co.uk/instrs/OPro/Pro_150Ser.dpd but it's hardly going to > attract new users. I think that pretty examples might help to attract attention indeed, but it would be much better if we could somehow make clear how EASY it is to create such examples - often even much easier than in Impression, that many people still appear to consider superior. However, I've no idea how this should be made clear in examples. Kind regards, Paul Sprangers To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 24 11:23:48 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KAijE-1nbknw-03-9QR.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:23:48 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KAijE-1nbknw-03-9QR; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 09:52:52 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.77] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KAijE-1nbknw-03 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 09:52:52 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KAijD-0005T1-IZ for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 09:52:52 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id E5B5786326E; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 05:52:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 18409-08; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 05:52:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 64C6286329D; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 05:52:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Mon, 23 Jun 2008 05:52:12 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id D23AE862CE6 for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 05:52:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 18230-05 for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 05:52:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mk-outboundfilter-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com (mk-outboundfilter-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com [212.74.114.32]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 6B291862FDC for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 05:52:11 -0400 (EDT) X-Trace: 101532510/mk-outboundfilter-2.mail.uk.tiscali.com/F2S/$ACCEPTED/freedom2Surf-customers/195.137.122.84 X-SBRS: None X-RemoteIP: 195.137.122.84 X-IP-MAIL-FROM: Lists@torrens.org.uk X-IP-BHB: Once X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: ApoEAOMOX0jDiXpU/2dsb2JhbACwYQM X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.27,689,1204502400"; d="scan'208";a="101532510" X-IP-Direction: IN Received: from i-195-137-122-84.freedom2surf.net (HELO lab) ([195.137.122.84]) by smtp.f2s.tiscali.co.uk with ESMTP; 23 Jun 2008 10:52:10 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: "Torrens (lists)" To: davidpilling@freelists.org Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2008 10:37:01 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: O-Pro's future Message-ID: <4fb3e0abd0Lists@torrens.org.uk> In-Reply-To: <4fb3df9051Paul@sprie.nl> References: <4fb3d31088Lists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb3df9051Paul@sprie.nl> User-Agent: Pluto/3.04c (RISC-OS/4.39) POPstar/2.06-ds.5 Content-Type: text/plain X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 811 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: Lists@torrens.org.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=ey2iPqIFAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=2D6be9FfCJ7umcZyd60A:9 a=cgC1p4_Z1H4f-iGSNQQA:7 a=LkIYCPIIki5ozYhKaRrisxq5q90A:4 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.130 [270.4.1/1513] In article <4fb3df9051Paul@sprie.nl>, Paul Sprangers wrote: > In article <4fb3d31088Lists@torrens.org.uk>, > Torrens (lists) wrote: > > To anyone already interested in O-Pro, yes some of them are pretty > > examples of what O-Pro and Vector can do, e.g. > > http://www.4qd.co.uk/instrs/OPro/Pro_150Ser.dpd but it's hardly going to > > attract new users. > I think that pretty examples might help to attract attention indeed, but > it would be much better if we could somehow make clear how EASY it is to > create such examples - often even much easier than in Impression, that > many people still appear to consider superior. However, I've no idea how > this should be made clear in examples. Indeed. But until people have noticed O-Pro, they aren't going to be interested in using it! But you raise another point. If we can find the right project it's going to be enjoyable using O-Pro to do it! The only reason that I bothered to do the Libretti is that O-Pro is enjoyable and relaxing to use. No amount of telling potential new users how much fun it is and how easy it is will ever convince them (unless someone wants to fork out for hugely expensive advertising) as this will simply be dismissed as sales hype. Remember that for most peple using anything under windoze is not fun. They simply know no better! To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 24 11:23:49 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KAijK-2l8GPo-01-9QL.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:23:49 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KAijK-2l8GPo-01-9QL; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 09:52:58 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.245] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KAijK-2l8GPo-01 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 09:52:58 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KAijK-00008S-JS for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 09:52:58 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 49E0E863030; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 05:52:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 18427-05; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 05:52:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id CC205862CE6; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 05:52:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Mon, 23 Jun 2008 05:52:13 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 49720863030 for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 05:52:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 18146-09 for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 05:52:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mk-outboundfilter-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com (mk-outboundfilter-4.mail.uk.tiscali.com [212.74.114.32]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 00DC8862FDC for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 05:52:12 -0400 (EDT) X-Trace: 101532514/mk-outboundfilter-2.mail.uk.tiscali.com/F2S/$ACCEPTED/freedom2Surf-customers/195.137.122.84 X-SBRS: None X-RemoteIP: 195.137.122.84 X-IP-MAIL-FROM: Lists@torrens.org.uk X-IP-BHB: Once X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: ApoEAOMOX0jDiXpU/2dsb2JhbACwYQM X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.27,689,1204502400"; d="scan'208";a="101532514" X-IP-Direction: IN Received: from i-195-137-122-84.freedom2surf.net (HELO lab) ([195.137.122.84]) by smtp.f2s.tiscali.co.uk with ESMTP; 23 Jun 2008 10:52:10 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: "Torrens (lists)" To: davidpilling@freelists.org Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2008 10:52:07 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] O-Pro's future Message-ID: <4fb3e20dc3Lists@torrens.org.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/3.04c (RISC-OS/4.39) POPstar/2.06-ds.5 Content-Type: text/plain X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 812 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: Lists@torrens.org.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=bX5TI-8lpBuhUdWKPWUA:9 a=yAom455dD1jO3xcV9J0A:7 a=oIq28gn48V-DH6iW2_Ho_PWJ7v4A:4 a=3I_whO4B8K8A:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.130 [270.4.1/1513] Just in case any of you are interested in seeing if anything happens, I have just posted to rec.music.opera informing them of my libretto transcriptions. I'm interested myself to see what the reaction will be! To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 24 11:23:49 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KAj7S-2N3Vbs-07-92D.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:23:49 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KAj7S-2N3Vbs-07-92D; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 10:17:54 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.245] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KAj7S-2N3Vbs-07 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 10:17:54 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KAj7R-0002nI-Lo for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 10:17:53 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 27C5786278C; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 06:17:53 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 20439-08; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 06:17:53 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id AAA68862B69; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 06:17:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Mon, 23 Jun 2008 06:17:14 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 96A1686278C for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 06:17:14 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 20325-10 for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 06:17:14 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mk-outboundfilter-5.mail.uk.tiscali.com (mk-outboundfilter-5.mail.uk.tiscali.com [212.74.114.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 48AE286273D for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 06:17:14 -0400 (EDT) X-Trace: 47947024/mk-outboundfilter-5.mail.uk.tiscali.com/F2S/$ACCEPTED/freedom2Surf-customers/195.137.122.84 X-SBRS: None X-RemoteIP: 195.137.122.84 X-IP-MAIL-FROM: Lists@torrens.org.uk X-IP-BHB: Once X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: ApoEAHMVX0jDiXpU/2dsb2JhbACwSgM X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.27,689,1204502400"; d="scan'208";a="47947024" X-IP-Direction: IN Received: from i-195-137-122-84.freedom2surf.net (HELO lab) ([195.137.122.84]) by smtp.f2s.tiscali.co.uk with ESMTP; 23 Jun 2008 11:17:13 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: "Torrens (lists)" To: davidpilling@freelists.org Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2008 10:56:25 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Loading pictures into OPro Message-ID: <4fb3e272e3Lists@torrens.org.uk> In-Reply-To: <9242dab34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk> References: <9242dab34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/3.04c (RISC-OS/4.39) POPstar/2.06-ds.5 Content-Type: text/plain X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 813 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: Lists@torrens.org.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=05BhGNz0vVAA:10 a=ndaL82KW2GUA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=vcSg4NEPhmhjVkX5vUAA:9 a=XfAGUtSnlgrT-4zTlHYA:7 a=qolCCGQDUkEjYnT0CZnGYPREf5AA:4 a=wl_QvbsadU8A:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.130 [270.4.1/1513] In article <9242dab34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk>, Tim Powys-Lybbe wrote: > For some years now I have been using OPro to construct PDF files that > consist of a series of pictures (scans) of old documents. By and large > I find that this can only be done successfully by converting the > pictures to (large) sprites. I would have thought jpeg files were ideal. I find O-Pro's handling of jpegs exemplary and scans of old documents are suficiently granular that gifs are large, as are tiffs. To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 24 11:24:05 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KAsb8-00p005-08-xE9.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:24:05 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KAsb8-00p005-08-xE9; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 20:25:11 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.211] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KAsb8-00p005-08 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 20:25:11 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KAsSl-0005TQ-4c for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 20:16:33 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 1A0198634F4; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 16:16:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 21288-05; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 16:16:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 9F22786355F; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 16:16:29 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Mon, 23 Jun 2008 16:15:51 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id E38778634F4 for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 16:15:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 21177-03 for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 16:15:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pih-relay04.plus.net (pih-relay04.plus.net [212.159.14.131]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 8B83D8631BC for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 16:15:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from [84.92.97.176] (helo=greatest) by pih-relay04.plus.net with esmtp (Exim) id 1KAsS4-0002z3-3q for davidpilling@freelists.org; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 21:15:48 +0100 Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2008 21:11:51 +0100 From: Tim Powys-Lybbe To: davidpilling@freelists.org Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Loading pictures into OPro Message-ID: <0fcb1ab44f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk> References: <9242dab34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk> <0a4be2b34f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <0a4be2b34f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> X-Organization: South Farm, Calstone, Calne, Wilts, England (no house here!) User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/5.12 (MsgServe/3.42) (RISC-OS/5.13) POPstar/2.06-ds.5 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 X-Plusnet-Relay: 3f407cfab402e642ad8ee006b82c180f X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 818 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: tim@powys.org Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=05BhGNz0vVAA:10 a=ndaL82KW2GUA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=v6Aic-fSAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=V-pFFdul9-VT_EtP0WgA:9 a=waWYZV2bizYhqfHIO10A:7 a=ve111bPbk3m8S2e4eyASD1ScvTUA:4 a=wl_QvbsadU8A:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.130 [270.4.1/1513] In message of 23 Jun, Dr Peter Young wrote: > On 23 Jun 2008 Tim Powys-Lybbe wrote: >=20 > [snip] >=20 > > A totally alternative strategy might be to use another program to > > assemble all the images to join them together into one PDF file. But= I > > have yet to find a program that does this as easily as OPro - and I h= ave > > tried Easiwriter. Any suggestions, anyone? >=20 >=20 > No idea if this would work, but perhaps worth a try? Use a program=20 > like WebGallery to make a web-page of the images, and "print" this=20 > using PrintPDF? Yes, I was wondering earlier today if some other iterative program would do the business. I had a good look at Labella and WebGallery. Labella will only accept Draw types of files, which is a bit laborious, and WebGallery did not seem to have a facility to pump out A4 size images, whatever the size of the incoming picture. WebGallery only accepts JPEGs and GIFs for input at the moment and I'm not sure this will do what I want. I even gave it a few moments thought that I could write a program to load images and output a series of pages in some sort of file. It did not take long to realise that this would be complicated. But I wonder if screen background display programs, such as BDRand by Nick Roberts, might have some of the core technology? In fact I have now completed the latest assembly via OPro. The laborious step was converting all the input to Sprites. Then I loaded each sprite in turn into OPro which auto-enlarges or constricts the images to nicely fit inside the chosen frame. Nearly all the images were loaded by Reference leading to an OPro file size of 668K, even though the 70 images totalled some 34.6M. The resulting PDF file was a mere 6.7M; this compares will with the total of 7.7M of the source Tiff files. Using sprites, the OPro file is completely stable and shows none of the problems I found when using Tiffs or Gifs - and reported earlier today. --=20 Tim Powys-Lybbe=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0= =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0tim@pow= ys.org =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0For a miscellany of bygones: http:= //powys.org/ To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpill= ing From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 24 11:24:05 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KAscN-01n002-06-ogO.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:24:05 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KAscN-01n002-06-ogO; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 20:26:43 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.95] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KAscN-01n002-06 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 20:26:43 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KAs5t-0002c7-8z for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 19:52:54 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id A7D428636EC; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 15:52:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 18546-04; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 15:52:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 269578635A4; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 15:52:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Mon, 23 Jun 2008 15:52:07 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 1011C8636EC for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 15:52:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 18347-08 for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 15:52:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mk-outboundfilter-1.mail.uk.tiscali.com (mk-outboundfilter-1.mail.uk.tiscali.com [212.74.114.37]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 06E188636EB for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 15:52:05 -0400 (EDT) X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AhEBAEBvV0hYaXlc/2dsb2JhbAAIrnw X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.27,692,1204502400"; d="scan'208";a="135537083" X-IP-Direction: IN Received: from 88-105-121-92.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com (HELO [10.0.0.6]) ([88.105.121.92]) by smtp.pipex.tiscali.co.uk with ESMTP; 23 Jun 2008 20:52:03 +0100 Message-ID: <485FFEE3.9020808@zionundy.me.uk> Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2008 20:52:03 +0100 From: Bernard G Hill User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 (X11/20080505) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: davidpilling@freelists.org Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Unwanted font definitions References: <4faf0642b8asgard@inspire.net.nz> <4fb1ed494bLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb24ffeeeLists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb28a4e50Lists@torrens.org.uk> <94a696b24f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <4fb2e1d238Lists@torrens.org.uk> <187ef4b24f.alan@ntlworld.com> In-Reply-To: <187ef4b24f.alan@ntlworld.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 817 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: berni@zionundy.me.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=jleGHzKj7hYA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=j1SxvI4MULkHjDV3nbQA:9 a=74BnodAUJkapciaYnFoA:7 a=nIosbXTac7Z4LSXmVlg8kbB4peEA:4 a=nrUGvYwLnKIA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.130 [270.4.1/1513] Dr Alan Leighton wrote: > In message > David Pilling wrote: >=20 >> In message <4fb2e1d238Lists@torrens.org.uk>, "Torrens (lists)" >> writes >>> Yes, having to admit that there is no future in a OS you do like, and >>> moving to an OS you do not, simply to make a living, must be a a majo= r >>> de-motivator. >=20 >> RISC OS was far ahead of Microsoft in 1988, it is now far behind. >> There's a lot wrong with RISC OS from a 2008 perspective. >=20 >> I have not made a living from Windows, my Windows experience has been >> more dispiriting than my RISC OS one. >=20 >>> But you have always been reluctant to do chargeable upgrades for RISC= OS. >>> Are there enough changes you could port back into RO to appease your >>> conscience about making an upgrade charge, and are there enough RO us= ers >>> left and willing to pay a charge to make it worth your while? >=20 >> My feeling about charging for RISC OS upgrades post 1998 has been that >> to do so was misleading (things were not going to go on for ever). >=20 >> Nearly ten years after Acorn. I think I was wrong about a couple of >> things, RISC OS has gone on longer than I expected and I might as well >> have put the four years work that went into Ovation Pro for Windows in= to >> the RISC OS version. >=20 >> Paid for upgrades would not have saved Ovation Pro, the thing that wou= ld >> have done, was more users. I needed more people to see the copies in u= se >> and say "this is fantastic I must have it". >=20 >> All this comes back to finding a way forward... >=20 >> I'm thinking something like putting the source code into the public >> domain and myself departing to a new venture. However this is easier t= o >> say than to do. >=20 > Do a big update on the Riscos version and charge =A350 or maybe a bit=20 > more. I guess many would go for that. After all I pay for Easywriter=20 > updates and only use it 5% of the time compared with OPro. >=20 > If you decide to go ahead I know people like Jim Nagel, VA, etc give=20 > backing and free advertising. What do others think, can we have a=20 > response? >=20 > Vote my friends >=20 >=20 >=20 Count me in! Berni. To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpill= ing From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 24 11:24:25 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KAtJW-0ne000-04-FtB.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:24:25 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KAtJW-0ne000-04-FtB; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 21:11:02 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.245] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KAtJW-0ne000-04 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 21:11:02 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KAkE2-0002ks-Df for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 11:28:46 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 02E728634D1; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 07:28:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 26076-04; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 07:28:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 7B7D18634D9; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 07:28:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Mon, 23 Jun 2008 07:28:07 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 746C48634D1 for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 07:28:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 26012-01 for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 07:28:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: from fhw-relay07.plus.net (fhw-relay07.plus.net [212.159.14.215]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 3DC1186348D for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 07:28:06 -0400 (EDT) Received: from [84.92.97.176] (helo=greatest) by fhw-relay07.plus.net with esmtp (Exim) id 1KAkDN-00029v-JP for davidpilling@freelists.org; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 12:28:05 +0100 Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2008 12:25:47 +0100 From: Tim Powys-Lybbe To: davidpilling@freelists.org Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Loading pictures into OPro Message-ID: <23a1eab34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk> References: <9242dab34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk> <4fb3e272e3Lists@torrens.org.uk> In-Reply-To: <4fb3e272e3Lists@torrens.org.uk> X-Organization: South Farm, Calstone, Calne, Wilts, England (no house here!) User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/5.12 (MsgServe/3.42) (RISC-OS/5.13) POPstar/2.06-ds.5 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 X-Plusnet-Relay: 11c22493df871cd9c179e989757e544f X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 814 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: tim@powys.org Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=05BhGNz0vVAA:10 a=ndaL82KW2GUA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=v6Aic-fSAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=Fw5JXG5WNr_2XOu-CGIA:9 a=nPje47seUQwbqJ9YfnEA:7 a=ot3qh5Y0ehILxID-Tb4f3rjg9HIA:4 a=wl_QvbsadU8A:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.131 [270.4.1/1516] In message of 23 Jun, "Torrens (lists)" wrote: > In article <9242dab34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk>, > Tim Powys-Lybbe wrote: > > For some years now I have been using OPro to construct PDF files that > > consist of a series of pictures (scans) of old documents. By and lar= ge > > I find that this can only be done successfully by converting the > > pictures to (large) sprites. >=20 > I would have thought jpeg files were ideal. I find O-Pro's handling of > jpegs exemplary and scans of old documents are suficiently granular tha= t > gifs are large, as are tiffs. I did say that I was scanning to around 40K for a TIFF file - and that a GIF of the same was about 60K. Well I have taken one of these TIFF and, using the old faithful, DplngScan, converted it to JPEG. The file size shot up to 566K and the bits per pixel from 1 to 8. And never mind the slight deterioration one always gets when converting to JPEG (and noting that GIF also is lossy). Curiously for the same image, the Sprite file was a mere 334K. But this retained the 1 bpp. These respective file sizes are consistent across a wide range of documents. These 1 bpp files are scanned at 200 dpi. While this does not give the best result on screen which has around 80 dpi, it does give a very legible output on printer which will all handle 300 dpi these days and most a lot more than that. But this is not what I was reporting. I was reporting a few problems with OPro that led to error messages and difficulties. --=20 Tim Powys-Lybbe=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0= =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0tim@pow= ys.org =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0For a miscellany of bygones: http:= //powys.org/ To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpill= ing From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 24 11:24:25 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KAtNG-0ec00G-03-2SDh.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:24:25 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KAtNG-0ec00G-03-2SDh; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 21:15:51 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.95] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KAtNG-0ec00G-03 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 21:15:51 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KAnSU-0005sx-Od for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 14:56:00 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 858C4863174; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 10:55:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 13696-02; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 10:55:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 0AF10863489; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 10:55:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Mon, 23 Jun 2008 10:55:14 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 34DB4863174 for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 10:55:14 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 13558-03 for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 10:55:14 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pih-relay05.plus.net (pih-relay05.plus.net [212.159.14.132]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id F2701863057 for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 10:55:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: from [80.229.143.2] (helo=radstock.localdomain) by pih-relay05.plus.net with esmtp (Exim) id 1KAnRn-0005os-Qk for davidpilling@freelists.org; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 15:55:12 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Chris Johnson To: davidpilling@freelists.org Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2008 15:54:45 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Loading pictures into OPro Message-ID: <4fb3fdc2e8chris@chrisjohnson.plus.com> In-Reply-To: <23a1eab34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk> References: <9242dab34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk> <4fb3e272e3Lists@torrens.org.uk> <23a1eab34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/3.04c (RISC-OS/5.13) Content-Type: text/plain X-Plusnet-Relay: 67c30f95faed23953ef852a598b61fb9 X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 816 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: chris@chrisjohnson.plus.com Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=05BhGNz0vVAA:10 a=ndaL82KW2GUA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=it5Zdl8IbuJuo2YidzcA:9 a=AUsreQ5BQJLPZzk5Wp0A:7 a=xTOn2AZnOyHROwAw0zJHzEueB50A:4 a=wl_QvbsadU8A:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.131 [270.4.1/1516] In article <23a1eab34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk>, Tim Powys-Lybbe wrote: > GIF also is lossy Not strictly true that GIF is lossy - like sprites, BMPs etc, all the original information is retained. However, GIF is only 256 colours, so in that sense some colour information may be lost if a 24-bit colour image is converted to the 8 bit GIF format. For 1 - 8 bit images, no information is lost. JPEGS (and e.g. MP3s) are lossy because various techniques are used to discard what is 'considered' to be non-essential information to allow the high compression ratios. The information discarded can never be recovered. JPEGS are not recommended for colour images (or B&W) that have areas of constant, or near constant, colour, since the algorithm used to produce a jpeg will introduce artifacts, often seen as patches of slightly differing colour across a constant colour. Hence jpegs are ideal for real photos, since any artifacts are hidden by the constantly changing colours across the image, whereas for a e.g. Draw image, with large areas of constant colour, jpgs would not be a first choice. Sprite, TIFF, GIF would be better. PNG also, which is a lossless compression method, and also 24-bit with masks. If you go through a long sequence of only load/save/load/save with a jpeg, the quality slowly deteriorates, whereas with GIF, the final image will be identical to the original GIF. Sorry for rambling on - I've obviously got nothing better to do! Chris... -- Chris Johnson To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 24 11:24:28 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KAtXh-0x0002-07-nl4.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:24:28 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KAtXh-0x0002-07-nl4; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 21:26:41 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.95] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KAtXh-0x0002-07 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 21:26:41 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KAmew-0004vT-M4 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 14:04:43 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 4ADAD863695; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 10:04:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 08619-04; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 10:04:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id A9BA086369F; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 10:04:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Mon, 23 Jun 2008 10:04:02 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 3C381863695 for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 10:04:02 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 08454-08 for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 10:04:02 -0400 (EDT) Received: from zen.orpheusnet.co.uk (zen.orpheusnet.co.uk [194.93.128.18]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id D866686369A for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 10:04:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from Iyonix.pnyoung.ormail.co.uk ([88.202.196.4]) by zen.orpheusnet.co.uk (8.14.2/8.14.2) with ESMTP id m5NE3lHE014769 for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 15:03:47 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Loading pictures into OPro To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: Dr Peter Young X-Editor: EmailEdit 1.50 Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2008 10:54:43 +0100 Message-ID: <0a4be2b34f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> References: <9242dab34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <9242dab34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk> X-Organization: Home User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/5.12 (MsgServe/3.42) (RISC-OS/5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 815 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: pnyoung@ormail.co.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=05BhGNz0vVAA:10 a=ndaL82KW2GUA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=CKwIYTfOAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=5pbKY86TVWjPiOFcoIsA:9 a=IFs0TbnWN2zn2EyLcIQA:7 a=9uqsTWblLPk9hdIw4jWlDw-FYbAA:4 a=wl_QvbsadU8A:10 a=LY0hPdMaydYA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.131 [270.4.1/1516] On 23 Jun 2008 Tim Powys-Lybbe wrote: [snip] > A totally alternative strategy might be to use another program to > assemble all the images to join them together into one PDF file. But I > have yet to find a program that does this as easily as OPro - and I have > tried Easiwriter. Any suggestions, anyone? No idea if this would work, but perhaps worth a try? Use a program like WebGallery to make a web-page of the images, and "print" this using PrintPDF? With best wishes, Peter. -- Peter \ / zfc Er \ Prestbury, Cheltenham, Glos. GL52 Anne \/ __ __ \ England. and / / \ | | |\ | / _ \ http://pnyoung.orpheusweb.co.uk family / \__/ \_/ | \| \__/ \______________ pnyoung@ormail.co.uk. To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 24 11:24:39 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KAuip-0VQknw-07-ETs.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:24:39 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KAuip-0VQknw-07-ETs; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 22:41:15 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.106] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KAuip-0VQknw-07 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 22:41:15 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KAuio-0000I7-Jz for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 22:41:15 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id E31A986483B; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 18:41:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 03525-06-3; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 18:41:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 6074D86485B; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 18:41:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Mon, 23 Jun 2008 18:40:30 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 57EBA86477B for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 18:40:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 03365-07 for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 18:40:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com (mtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com [81.103.221.47]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 31665864771 for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 18:40:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: from aamtaout04-winn.ispmail.ntl.com ([81.103.221.35]) by mtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20080623224449.VKPA28496.mtaout01-winn.ispmail.ntl.com@aamtaout04-winn.ispmail.ntl.com> for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 23:44:49 +0100 Received: from Snowwhite ([86.29.51.126]) by aamtaout04-winn.ispmail.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20080623224030.CZBG18637.aamtaout04-winn.ispmail.ntl.com@Snowwhite> for ; Mon, 23 Jun 2008 23:40:30 +0100 From: "Ian Barr" To: References: <9242dab34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk> <0a4be2b34f.pnyoung@pnyoung.ormail.co.uk> <0fcb1ab44f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <0fcb1ab44f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk> Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Loading pictures into OPro Date: Mon, 23 Jun 2008 23:39:55 +0100 Message-ID: <000601c8d582$125b7eb0$37127c10$@com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 12.0 Thread-Index: AcjVbf/PxbWWponXQz6zh7br7UA3QAAE80Dg Content-Language: en-gb X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 819 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: ianbarr@supanet.com Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=05BhGNz0vVAA:10 a=ndaL82KW2GUA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=5nPkVO1zAAAA:8 a=v6Aic-fSAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=EvsXyRc7jfKTDHoocRMA:9 a=GErzZ3u_B7r1_s4UDj0A:7 a=4QXVOGSZ43dzKuILCejkE5Y27gUA:4 a=btyeseNR-KIA:10 a=wl_QvbsadU8A:10 a=2uiCRmbCp6AA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.131 [270.4.1/1516] Have you tried JAlbum for creating web pages of images? http://jalbum.net/ -----Original Message----- From: [mailto:davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org] On Behalf Of Tim Powys-Lybbe Sent: 23 June 2008 21:12 To: davidpilling@freelists.org Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Loading pictures into OPro In message of 23 Jun, Dr Peter Young wrote: > On 23 Jun 2008 Tim Powys-Lybbe wrote: >=20 > [snip] >=20 > > A totally alternative strategy might be to use another program to > > assemble all the images to join them together into one PDF file. = But I > > have yet to find a program that does this as easily as OPro - and I = have > > tried Easiwriter. Any suggestions, anyone? >=20 >=20 > No idea if this would work, but perhaps worth a try? Use a program=20 > like WebGallery to make a web-page of the images, and "print" this=20 > using PrintPDF? Yes, I was wondering earlier today if some other iterative program would do the business. I had a good look at Labella and WebGallery. Labella will only accept Draw types of files, which is a bit laborious, and WebGallery did not seem to have a facility to pump out A4 size images, whatever the size of the incoming picture. WebGallery only accepts JPEGs and GIFs for input at the moment and I'm not sure this will do what I want. I even gave it a few moments thought that I could write a program to load images and output a series of pages in some sort of file. It did not take long to realise that this would be complicated. But I wonder if screen background display programs, such as BDRand by Nick Roberts, might have some of the core technology? In fact I have now completed the latest assembly via OPro. The laborious step was converting all the input to Sprites. Then I loaded each sprite in turn into OPro which auto-enlarges or constricts the images to nicely fit inside the chosen frame. Nearly all the images were loaded by Reference leading to an OPro file size of 668K, even though the 70 images totalled some 34.6M. The resulting PDF file was a mere 6.7M; this compares will with the total of 7.7M of the source Tiff files. Using sprites, the OPro file is completely stable and shows none of the problems I found when using Tiffs or Gifs - and reported earlier today. --=20 Tim = Powys-Lybbe=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0= =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0tim@powys.= org =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0For a miscellany of bygones: = http://powys.org/ To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: = http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 24 11:24:55 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KB0kT-2a4GPo-01-Gyk.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:24:55 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KB0kT-2a4GPo-01-Gyk; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 05:07:21 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.223] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KB0kT-2a4GPo-01 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 05:07:21 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KB0kS-0005Cm-Sf for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 05:07:21 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id D69F38643C4; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 01:07:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 01120-08; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 01:07:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 5DAE78643D5; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 01:07:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Tue, 24 Jun 2008 01:06:41 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 813C18643C4 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 01:06:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 00989-08 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 01:06:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from zen.orpheusnet.co.uk (zen.orpheusnet.co.uk [194.93.128.18]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 33B878643C0 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 01:06:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave.nom ([88.202.207.43]) by zen.orpheusnet.co.uk (8.14.2/8.14.2) with ESMTP id m5O56WMl027534 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 06:06:34 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Dave Symes To: Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 06:06:11 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] Loading pictures into OPro Message-ID: <4fb44bb643dave@triffid.co.uk> References: <9242dab34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <9242dab34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/3.04c (RISC-OS/6.10) Content-Type: text/plain X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 820 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: dave@triffid.co.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=CVu5_CJqJk4A:10 a=hoVx7TwzztgA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=hMkESyGUdb6KIxaQK34A:9 a=_WrgFFfPSswDtRt9SiUA:7 a=aPzI2ooaI1bEZBin2IJnTalzxQ0A:4 a=wl_QvbsadU8A:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.131 [270.4.1/1516] In article <9242dab34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk>, Tim Powys-Lybbe wrote: > For some years now I have been using OPro to construct PDF files that > consist of a series of pictures (scans) of old documents. By and large > I find that this can only be done successfully by converting the > pictures to (large) sprites. > Using alternative strategies has one or two problems: [Snip] > A totally alternative strategy might be to use another program to > assemble all the images to join them together into one PDF file. But I > have yet to find a program that does this as easily as OPro - and I have > tried Easiwriter. Any suggestions, anyone? Have you tried using PNG files. I also use OvPro to construct PDF files, though on a smaller scale than you are doing,I can't say I've noticed any problems. Picture/Png 75,910 bytes. OvPro document just containing picture 319,068 bytes. PDF file (PrintPDF) 7,043 bytes. Dave S -- To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 24 11:24:55 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KB0sy-2n5GPo-03-GqF.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:24:55 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KB0sy-2n5GPo-03-GqF; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 05:16:08 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.72] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KB0sy-2n5GPo-03 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 05:16:08 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KB0sy-0001EW-36 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 05:16:08 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 9740886440B; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 01:16:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 01795-03; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 01:16:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 2E5E3864421; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 01:16:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Tue, 24 Jun 2008 01:15:28 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 40D3286440B for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 01:15:28 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 01699-03 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 01:15:28 -0400 (EDT) Received: from smtp5.clear.net.nz (smtp5.clear.net.nz [203.97.33.68]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id E5C82864400 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 01:15:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: from Iyonix (121-72-171-29.dsl.telstraclear.net [121.72.171.29]) by smtp5.clear.net.nz (CLEAR Net Mail) with ESMTP id <0K2Y00JH5BXKZS00@smtp5.clear.net.nz> for davidpilling@freelists.org; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 17:15:26 +1200 (NZST) Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 17:14:24 +1200 From: "lists (ww)" Subject: [softwarelist] DDL too big for text editors To: davidpilling@freelists.org Message-id: <4fb44c76eflists@ww.co.nz> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain X-Editor: Zap 1.47 (20 Aug 2005) [TEST], ZapEmail 0.28.3 (25 Mar 2005) (32) User-Agent: Pluto/3.04c (RISC-OS/5.13) POPstar/2.06-ds.4 X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 821 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: lists@ww.co.nz Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=bDIS7kRBWWcA:10 a=Tfk4C-BSRwQA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=sALDCjl9ryZo2QZKfYQA:9 a=LybcgFhddV7fhDKw_H0A:7 a=zdipn0DgUMQ9nZgOt5mFknqevhgA:4 a=gi0PWCVxevcA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.131 [270.4.1/1516] I have a 60KB OPro document of 7xA5 pages. Saved as OPro = 59MB Misc,min memory = 54MB DDL = 75MB but I can't open the DDL in Zap, Edit or StrongArm (sp) to check it. What do you recommend? Make two identical files and delete half the pages? Brian -- Auckland NEW ZEALAND To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 24 11:25:04 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KB33p-0Rzknw-02-EfO.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:25:04 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KB33p-0Rzknw-02-EfO; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:35:29 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.210] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KB33p-0Rzknw-02 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:35:29 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KB33p-0002mc-GL for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:35:29 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id D9A4086446B; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 03:35:28 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 11111-07; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 03:35:28 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 6886986460F; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 03:35:28 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Tue, 24 Jun 2008 03:34:49 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id CA7BE86446B for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 03:34:49 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 10971-09 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 03:34:49 -0400 (EDT) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.186]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 74F23864450 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 03:34:49 -0400 (EDT) Received: from bach (88-134-110-250-dynip.superkabel.de [88.134.110.250]) by mrelayeu.kundenserver.de (node=mrelayeu4) with ESMTP (Nemesis) id 0ML21M-1KB33A03iY-0000NW; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 09:34:48 +0200 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: DDL too big for text editors To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: Martin Wuerthner X-Editor: EmailEdit 1.50 Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 09:35:18 +0200 Message-ID: <545d59b44f.martin@bach.planiverse.com> References: <4fb44c76eflists@ww.co.nz> In-Reply-To: <4fb44c76eflists@ww.co.nz> X-Organization: MW Software User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/5.12 (MsgServe/3.42) (RISC-OS/5.11) POPstar/2.05 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX1/kXpIGgsoiQtwv5l3XKbx93idEDz+ClUsUwar 89xq4YA+zINrZNRVyp4Oyw6dDzdbXEYxK6mU4DS5lWxVis7cpS H8XOB1ciAcwTCpLcbE0uFV14eUYEn1F X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 822 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: public@mw-software.com Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=lIBZ1r-sEucA:10 a=7wu1HnDvHdIA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=C4QmYdQpoc4xkmnnbgUA:9 a=6tIAiZ-aGuC6j7TMrm4A:7 a=6wZe8eSgta2DzLs34PNgrZ-6enYA:4 a=fl4ZfBcLCrEA:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.131 [270.4.1/1516] In message <4fb44c76eflists@ww.co.nz> "lists (ww)" wrote: > I have a 60KB OPro document of 7xA5 pages. > Saved as OPro = 59MB > Misc,min memory = 54MB > DDL = 75MB > but I can't open the DDL in Zap, Edit or StrongArm (sp) to check it. ^^^^^^^^^ StrongEd > What do you recommend? Presuming you have more than 75MB of memory free, you should be able to edit this file in any of the above editors. If you cannot, then at a guess, you are running Aemulor, which limits the amount of memory each application. Without Aemulor running it should work. Martin -- --------------------------------------------------------------------- Martin Wuerthner MW Software martin@mw-software.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From louie@orpheusmail.co.uk Tue Jun 24 11:25:05 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KB3Ed-0yxknw-08-EUa.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:25:05 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KB3Ed-0yxknw-08-EUa; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:46:39 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.77] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KB3Ed-0yxknw-08 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:46:39 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.90] (helo=anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KB3Ed-00029f-Hr for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:46:39 +0000 Received: from vigay.demon.co.uk ([80.177.103.19] helo=AriaCube) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 4.67) id 1KB3Ed-000GlN-7M for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:46:39 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Louie To: David Pilling Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 08:43:12 +0100 Subject: OvationPro Update Message-ID: <4fb45a1650louie@orpheusmail.co.uk> In-Reply-To: References: User-Agent: Pluto/3.04c (RISC-OS/5.13) POPstar/2.06-ds.5 Content-Type: text/plain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=2Zfq3aqyAREce8pte2sQew==:17 a=0AD0Xp_8hY51LMhl6EYA:9 a=WtYpLDrwq9SveuSeA3ONnGlG8OoA:4 a=50e4U0PicR4A:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.131 [270.4.1/1516] Hi David, Just thought I'd drop you a personal line to give my support and that of RISC OS Now should you decide to write a paid-for update (or free for that matter!) of OvationPro. You know obviously I use it for producing RISC OS Now, which is credited in the inside cover of the magazine. I would love to be able to support you in producing an update, whether it be by advertising (I already offered on the newsgroups free space to help promote it), and if you needed any help with printing of manuals/ accompanying merchandise I'd be more that willing to assist should you need it, and of course you can count myself and Paul in on the update! I truly believe that OvationPro is an excellent package and well worth the attention! Please let me know if there is anything I can help with! Kindest regards, Louie From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 24 11:25:05 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KB3c3-2DBknw-08-E7A.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:25:05 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KB3c3-2DBknw-08-E7A; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 08:10:51 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.210] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KB3c3-2DBknw-08 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 08:10:51 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KB3c1-00058r-7S for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 08:10:51 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 2FC078646C3; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 04:10:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 14037-02; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 04:10:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id B8CB98646F7; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 04:10:47 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Tue, 24 Jun 2008 04:10:09 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 488B78646C3 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 04:10:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 13941-01 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 04:10:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pih-relay05.plus.net (pih-relay05.plus.net [212.159.14.132]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 0CCEF864594 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 04:10:08 -0400 (EDT) Received: from [80.229.238.131] (helo=ASCENSION) by pih-relay05.plus.net with esmtpa (Exim) id 1KB3bL-0004Vo-06 for davidpilling@freelists.org; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 09:10:07 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Ned Abell To: davidpilling@freelists.org Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 09:06:31 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] OP on Linux (revisited) Message-ID: <4fb45c38bbnedabell@weatherpost.org.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/3.04c (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.06-ds.5 Content-Type: text/plain X-Plusnet-Relay: 7314842355b795253741a0c2e9fc4787 X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 823 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: nedabell@weatherpost.org.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=QTaWKZTdanMA:10 a=io59jHz2K4YA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=Gq4BRO86aGY1aS0oAYEA:9 a=EDrKC8jLJNJLd0QRSCoA:7 a=87E7ux5LE6RLmsNbGs5FirtuGTIA:4 a=csDljm-qqwUA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.131 [270.4.1/1516] Ive just been looking through the 2006 Freelists archive discussion on this subject and wondered if you had any newer thoughts on this David ? -- besters.. Ned === skype:nedabell To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 24 11:25:08 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KB4re-30PVbs-03-CrZ.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:25:08 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KB4re-30PVbs-03-CrZ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 09:31:02 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.223] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KB4re-30PVbs-03 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 09:31:02 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KB4re-00041O-0J for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 09:31:02 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 721A78644A7; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 05:31:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 20714-08; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 05:31:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 0A1838643D5; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 05:31:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Tue, 24 Jun 2008 05:30:22 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id ABD288644A7 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 05:30:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 20662-01 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 05:30:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: from smtp5.freeserve.com (smtp5.freeserve.com [193.252.22.152]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 73C388643B2 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 05:30:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: from me-wanadoo.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mwinf3427.me.freeserve.com (SMTP Server) with ESMTP id 239951C00086 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:30:21 +0200 (CEST) Received: from rachael.local (unknown [91.111.45.26]) by mwinf3427.me.freeserve.com (SMTP Server) with ESMTP id 25A0F1C0008A for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:30:19 +0200 (CEST) X-ME-UUID: 20080624093019154.25A0F1C0008A@mwinf3427.me.freeserve.com From: Mark Fraser To: davidpilling@freelists.org Subject: [softwarelist] Re: OP on Linux (revisited) Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 10:30:16 +0100 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.9 References: <4fb45c38bbnedabell@weatherpost.org.uk> In-Reply-To: <4fb45c38bbnedabell@weatherpost.org.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200806241030.16941.freelists@mfraz74.orangehome.co.uk> X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 824 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: freelists@mfraz74.orangehome.co.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=cLfaQ7CIZxwA:10 a=bjfFOPuKD5UA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=FZ4pHXNLHP2jhhlmWAgA:9 a=ImnP7sLCmzlrZzn4LLcA:7 a=XiW-FSQ52ixVMGVBMTg6sKzzVjAA:4 a=LY0hPdMaydYA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.131 [270.4.1/1516] On Tuesday 24 June 2008 09:06:31 Ned Abell wrote: > Ive just been looking through the 2006 Freelists archive > discussion on this subject and wondered if you had any newer > thoughts on this David ? Well, I've tried again with WINE 1.0 and still get the same errors as before. So, I'm not ready to pay for the full version yet. To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 24 12:08:24 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KB6GF-1ch000-03-BSy.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 12:08:24 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KB6GF-1ch000-03-BSy; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:00:31 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.210] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KB6GF-1ch000-03 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:00:31 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KB6GF-0004Za-5p for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:00:31 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 84B31863FFC; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:00:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 27401-10; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:00:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 1357486407A; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:00:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Tue, 24 Jun 2008 06:59:51 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 999B0863FFC for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 06:59:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 27339-02 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 06:59:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from anchor-post-36.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-36.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.86]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 5A3D4863FD0 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 06:59:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([62.49.20.172]) by anchor-post-36.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 4.67) id 1KB6Fa-0000Y8-KG for davidpilling@freelists.org; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 10:59:50 +0000 Message-ID: <1sz3SKEZNNYIFwv$@pilling.demon.co.uk> Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:58:33 +0100 To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: David Pilling Subject: [softwarelist] Re: Loading pictures into OPro References: <9242dab34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <9242dab34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-S () X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 825 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: flist@pilling.demon.co.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=05BhGNz0vVAA:10 a=ndaL82KW2GUA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=d9frsj0YAAAA:8 a=dqhQn4rJAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=74UF0VHDw8-YPe5bxCUA:9 a=8rFwcGn6XHwYbifNFLgA:7 a=JB_gYLUPCh8CMUFOVEWRnoqbkfUA:4 a=wl_QvbsadU8A:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.131 [270.4.1/1516] In message <9242dab34f.tim@south-frm.demon.co.uk>, Tim Powys-Lybbe writes >For some years now I have been using OPro to construct PDF files that >consist of a series of pictures (scans) of old documents. By and large >I find that this can only be done successfully by converting the >pictures to (large) sprites. One thing you need to understand is that Ovation Pro can only render and contain in documents certain types of image. For RISC OS they are: Sprite, Draw, JPEG, ArtWorks and EPS. For Windows they are: Sprite, Draw, JPEG, BMP, WMF and EPS. Any other types you have like GIF or TIFF will be converted when they are loaded into the document, using the filter system. The RISC OS version is limited in that it cannot reference image types not on the above list. This limit does not apply to OP on Windows. So if you're on RISC OS don't bother trying to load a TIFF by reference. TIFF is a good format for black and white (1 bit per pixel) images, because it has special compression techniques for that sort of image. JPEG is bad format, because it can't do less than eight bits per pixel and black and white are just the sort of documents where you notice the effects of "lossy" compression. >Second: Load in 1-bit Tiff files > "Unknown or missing variable (internal number 6282)" My TranTIFF+ would be a better choice for loading TIFF files than TransFSI (from which I assume the above error comes). http://www.davidpilling.com/ovationpro/filelib/files/trantiff.zip (and note that not only must this be installed but TransFSI must be told not to load TIFFs). Bottom line, (on RISC OS) you can't load anything not on the above list of file types by reference. >Using the same file as in the previous example I converted them to Gif; >this increased the size from, say, 40 Kbytes or so to 60 Kbytes or so. >The Gif files would load into OPro with no trouble; but saving the OPro >file resulted in a file of 6 Mbytes (yes, Mega). Bottom line, GIF files are translated when loaded (into Sprites). >A totally alternative strategy might be to use another program to >assemble all the images to join them together into one PDF file. But I >have yet to find a program that does this as easily as OPro - and I have >tried Easiwriter. Any suggestions, anyone? I'm not sure what the problem is with using 1bpp sprites. If the files come out of your scanning software as TIFF (say) then when you construct the OP document they will be converted to sprites automatically when loaded. The downside of course is that documents will be large. If you can use OP on Windows then there is another strategy - use TIFF, but by reference. If you're producing the same thing over and over, then you might like to investigate using pictures in mail merge (see the OP manual). I suspect the same limits on referenced images will apply though. -- David Pilling email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.davidpilling.net post: David Pilling P.O. Box 22 Thornton Cleveleys Blackpool. FY5 1LR UK fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 24 12:23:26 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KB6Wb-31R000-07-BCc.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 12:23:26 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KB6Wb-31R000-07-BCc; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:17:25 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.211] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KB6Wb-31R000-07 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:17:25 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KB6Wa-00029g-97 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:17:24 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id BCF678635A8; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:17:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 28930-05; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:17:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 4F965863E6F; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:17:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:16:45 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 60CB786440A for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 04:18:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 14593-03 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 04:18:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mx6.orcon.net.nz (mx6.orcon.net.nz [219.88.242.56]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id CAB5D864403 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 04:18:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: from Debian-exim by mx6.orcon.net.nz with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1KB3jD-0002zt-Jz for davidpilling@freelists.org; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 20:18:15 +1200 Received: from [60.234.184.59] (helo=mysteriousmrf.my.home) by mx6.orcon.net.nz with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1KB3jC-0002zc-VY for davidpilling@freelists.org; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 20:18:15 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Robert Greenfield To: Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 20:19:58 +1200 Subject: [softwarelist] O-Pro's future Message-ID: <4fb45d73famonster@caverock.net.nz> References: <4fb3d31088Lists@torrens.org.uk> In-Reply-To: <4fb3d31088Lists@torrens.org.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/3.04c (RISC-OS/4.39) Content-Type: text/plain X-DSPAM-Check: by mx6.orcon.net.nz on Tue, 24 Jun 2008 20:18:15 +1200 X-DSPAM-Result: Innocent X-DSPAM-Processed: Tue Jun 24 20:18:15 2008 X-DSPAM-Confidence: 0.9903 X-DSPAM-Probability: 0.0000 X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 826 X-Approved-By: flist@pilling.demon.co.uk X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: monster@caverock.net.nz Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=ey2iPqIFAAAA:8 a=w-HLxcFvAAAA:8 a=an63MGxJAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=JkUAS0Q2eOgTg_QPVqYA:9 a=by8oFnoDfqUvBrQRU1YA:7 a=SEm103oaH7fMhWSiBJyQV1LA-OgA:4 a=FoIJIXdLxNwA:10 a=hP9Uo5zeJykA:10 a=LY0hPdMaydYA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.131 [270.4.1/1516] On 23 Jun, Torrens (lists) wrote: > Yes, doing a chargeable upgrade now will give him a little cash. But > O-Pro's too good to upgrade much. Any upgrades can only get thinner on > the ground. How would we (and David) like it to be enhanced? What is 'missing' in our opinions? What especially would make the software and our OvPro docs more easily maintainable and usable? At this point I must say that I really enjoy the combination of OvPro/Artworks/TableMate/Draw/Sibelius (and the filer+desktop etc). Creating, designing and composing under RISC OS *is* a joy. Without being any sort of expert, OvPro DDL seems like an excellent thing and I am sure that David P said he would have preferred that OvPro saved in DDL format rather than a binary format. Why not make DDL standard OvPro format and leave the binary one for loading legacy documents? Pros/Cons? DDL looks like an 'open' format. Thinking longer term, can we encourage its use further afield? Could a developer conceivably make a DDL 'transloader/saver' for the oft-mentioned Quark? Any other possible features or improvements? - I'd like a 'screen redraw' button to clear the occasional detritus left by processes. - A biggie this one - I'd like closer interaction between Artworks & OvPro. Sometimes you are in Artworks and you would like (say) the fancier text frames offered by OvPro. Or perhaps you have drawn a line or shape in OvPro and want the fancier line/shape editing offered by Artworks. Imagine if it could be like OLE 'in-situ' in the document. Also, ability to load OvPro documents into Artworks for PDF generation, bitmap export etc. would be great. Could DDL potentially be used for this? > So can we all get together and do something that will get O-Pro noticed? Let schools/teachers know that they can still use their old Impression files even though they now use Windows. Can OvPro be noticed on what-it-does-for-the-price? I have no idea how it compares for features or price with anything on any other platform. Can we make a bit of a list here? Can David and some select developers see if it can be made cross-platform, somewhat like Netsurf (I am not suggesting that getting it to this stage would be quickly done). Cross platform with an open file format seems potentially attractive to me. > And form a O-Pro web ring showing > examples. Why not a central website in the same way that you go to netsurf-browser.org first for netsurf resources/updates, or apple.com for apple stuff? A central repository for OvPro Stationery/Label templates, updates, chat, screenshots seems easier in my mind instead of going around lots of different sites. I guess that even this mailing list is a bit old-hat these days. Funky design folk probably like funkily designed websites... > To anyone already interested in O-Pro, yes some of them are pretty > examples of what O-Pro and Vector can do, e.g. > http://www.4qd.co.uk/instrs/OPro/Pro_150Ser.dpd but it's hardly going to > attract new users. It is one example of what you *can* do though. Imagine this (suitably copyrighted or watermarked) along with other examples on a central website for people to peruse. > Has anyone else any similar resources? I do, but I would have to think carefully about what I wanted to submit for public viewing; some files I will be a bit precious about eg I am currently working on a workbook for my students for www.musictheory.net I think it looks great, has taken a fair bit of thought and work and is currently up to page 26 and counting. Of course quite a bit of what I do is made up in Artworks, so the website would have to mention just how fabulously good Artworks and OvPro are together ;-) regards, -- Robert Greenfield via RISC OS - http://www.webmonster.co.nz/ To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 24 12:38:27 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KB6dk-3W4000-02-B5T.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 12:38:27 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KB6dk-3W4000-02-B5T; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:24:48 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.245] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KB6dk-3W4000-02 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:24:48 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KB6dk-0001m2-Du for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:24:48 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id D3A77863ADD; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:24:47 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 29343-06; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:24:47 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 63B1A863AF7; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:24:47 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:24:09 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 85C3A863ADD for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:24:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 29273-02 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:24:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: from anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.92]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 52A03863781 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:24:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([62.49.20.172]) by anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 4.67) id 1KB6d6-000Pwg-DV for davidpilling@freelists.org; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:24:08 +0000 Message-ID: <0Mv3a1GrjNYIFwti@pilling.demon.co.uk> Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 12:22:19 +0100 To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: David Pilling Subject: [softwarelist] Re: OP on Linux (revisited) References: <4fb45c38bbnedabell@weatherpost.org.uk> In-Reply-To: <4fb45c38bbnedabell@weatherpost.org.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-S () X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 827 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: flist@pilling.demon.co.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=cLfaQ7CIZxwA:10 a=bjfFOPuKD5UA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=dqhQn4rJAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=7hBMre_ymI4G4h_Kqw8A:9 a=ks1CTGPdg2cUAyx8IVAA:7 a=g14sct81SxRK8mj16GWyAN4alEQA:4 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.131 [270.4.1/1516] In message <4fb45c38bbnedabell@weatherpost.org.uk>, Ned Abell writes >Ive just been looking through the 2006 Freelists archive >discussion on this subject and wondered if you had any newer >thoughts on this David ? You can tell what I'm up against, I installed Linux on an old machine in May 2006 to investigate, I don't think I've turned it on since. Given my dislike for Windows, a move to Linux is possible. Oddly enough one reason why I don't move today, is that I use Ovation Pro and it is not available for Linux. Would I do a Linux version (or a Mac version)... the problem is the amount of time involved. Without trying I don't know for sure, but if like Windows it involves several years full time work then I think it is unlikely. -- David Pilling email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.davidpilling.net post: David Pilling P.O. Box 22 Thornton Cleveleys Blackpool. FY5 1LR UK fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 24 12:38:32 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KB6fh-3ey000-07-B3W.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 12:38:32 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KB6fh-3ey000-07-B3W; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:26:49 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.95] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KB6fh-3ey000-07 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:26:49 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KB6fh-0003qL-Ct for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:26:49 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id E7AA5864091; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:26:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 29600-01; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:26:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 7D9E4863EBA; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:26:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:26:10 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id B7395863CDF for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:26:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 29449-05 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:26:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: from anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.87]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 8519F863AF7 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:26:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([62.49.20.172]) by anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 4.68) id 1KB6f3-00005U-PC for davidpilling@freelists.org; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:26:10 +0000 Message-ID: Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 12:24:48 +0100 To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: David Pilling Subject: [softwarelist] Re: DDL too big for text editors References: <4fb44c76eflists@ww.co.nz> In-Reply-To: <4fb44c76eflists@ww.co.nz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-S () X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 828 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: flist@pilling.demon.co.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=lIBZ1r-sEucA:10 a=7wu1HnDvHdIA:10 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=dqhQn4rJAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=qInVw--bF8Mu4uUVu3oA:9 a=L3N-SnLCT01bB7yZ55gA:7 a=sXHws-Go6aW5QOX6Zlwank2HFpEA:4 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.131 [270.4.1/1516] In message <4fb44c76eflists@ww.co.nz>, "lists (ww)" writes >I have a 60KB OPro document of 7xA5 pages. > >Saved as OPro = 59MB >Misc,min memory = 54MB >DDL = 75MB > >but I can't open the DDL in Zap, Edit or StrongArm (sp) to check it. > >What do you recommend? >Make two identical files and delete half the pages? Depends how much RAM your machine has, if it is more than 75MB, then free it up by quitting applications etc. If you don't have 75MB, and perhaps it would make sense to do this anyway because 75MB is an awful lot of stuff to look at, I'd reference any images. Presumably the bulk comes from bitmap images. -- David Pilling email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.davidpilling.net post: David Pilling P.O. Box 22 Thornton Cleveleys Blackpool. FY5 1LR UK fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 24 12:38:32 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KB6pv-4LU000-08-AtI.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 12:38:32 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KB6pv-4LU000-08-AtI; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:37:23 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.245] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KB6pv-4LU000-08 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:37:23 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KB6pp-0002f4-Ms for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:37:23 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 7D0F6863E66; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:36:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 30830-07; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:36:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 038CC8645AA; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:36:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:35:42 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id AA456863E66 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:35:42 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 30341-09 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:35:42 -0400 (EDT) Received: from anchor-post-36.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-36.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.86]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 74AF1864247 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:35:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([62.49.20.172]) by anchor-post-36.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 4.67) id 1KB6oG-000ATd-Js for davidpilling@freelists.org; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:35:40 +0000 Message-ID: Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 12:34:20 +0100 To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: David Pilling Subject: [softwarelist] Re: O-Pro's future References: <4fb3d31088Lists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb45d73famonster@caverock.net.nz> In-Reply-To: <4fb45d73famonster@caverock.net.nz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=us-ascii;format=flowed User-Agent: Turnpike/6.02-S () X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 829 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: flist@pilling.demon.co.uk Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=dqhQn4rJAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=4kKp12NNWYV4bY1ohMUA:9 a=2ta4XJAf-4jWmVdsZ6YA:7 a=jtzaWKTH9J-xL4jnk_Yxb1W0NE4A:4 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.131 [270.4.1/1516] In message <4fb45d73famonster@caverock.net.nz>, Robert Greenfield writes >How would we (and David) like it to be enhanced? >What is 'missing' in our opinions? One problem is that there is an awful lot that could be added. Ask 20 different people and you'll get 20 different suggestions, all of them reasonable. The problem is that there is no single improvement which would make the program instantly viable. My current disillusion with Windows is due to the realisation that years of work are now needed just to add the basic requirements. Often in the past people have said "add feature A and I will buy it", having added A they then turn around and say "do you seriously expect me to use a program that lacks feature B". >Why not make DDL standard OvPro format and leave the binary one for >loading legacy documents? Because for most users this would make no difference. >- I'd like a 'screen redraw' button to clear the occasional detritus left >by processes. I'd like to see the bugs that cause this fixed. >Let schools/teachers know that they can still use their old Impression >files even though they now use Windows. One interesting aspect of the demise of Acorn was how many documents must have been dumped along with all the computers in schools. This discussion began with me talking about getting someone's book from Impression to Word format. It is hard to believe that no one wrote a Word translator in about 1995. It is perhaps a bit late now. -- David Pilling email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.davidpilling.net post: David Pilling P.O. Box 22 Thornton Cleveleys Blackpool. FY5 1LR UK fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpilling From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 24 13:08:27 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KB78R-0lyknw-02-Aam.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 13:08:27 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KB78R-0lyknw-02-Aam; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:56:31 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.245] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KB78R-0lyknw-02 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:56:31 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KB78Q-0007aP-7D for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:56:30 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id BA4078645E6; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:56:29 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 02788-07; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:56:29 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 52081864779; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:56:29 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:55:51 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 3A3678646E0 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:55:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 02573-09 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:55:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.87]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 0454C864709 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:55:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from newble.demon.co.uk ([80.176.249.168] helo=iyonix.iyonix) by anchor-post-37.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 4.68) id 1KB77m-00032X-NR for davidpilling@freelists.org; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 11:55:50 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: P C Newble To: Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 12:55:41 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: O-Pro's future Message-ID: <4fb47133f1peter@newble.com> In-Reply-To: <4fb45d73famonster@caverock.net.nz> References: <4fb3d31088Lists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb45d73famonster@caverock.net.nz> User-Agent: Pluto/3.04e (RISC-OS/5.11) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 830 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: peter@newble.com Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=QnMsQNrnAAAA:8 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=CQDi67XrNAPL3ks1XF0A:9 a=tyEMsiUqR7zcKnnE6t0A:7 a=vR4dupeWc7Ws0ZI77UOgdRnYQH0A:4 a=a6GPAEu2-fsA:10 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.131 [270.4.1/1516] In article <4fb45d73famonster@caverock.net.nz>, Robert Greenfield wrote: > I'd like a 'screen redraw' button to clear the occasional > detritus left by processes. Define a key macro containing: {viewrepaint(0,0)} I use F2 for this, because it the otherwise-unused "load" key, which seems appropriate for refreshing the display. --=20 P. C. Newble 10 Heath Close, Polstead Heath, Colchester CO6 5BE, UK Tel. +44(0)1787 210107; Mob. +44(0)7944 816266 http://www.newble.com/ =B7 peter@newble.com =B7 Skype: peter_newble To unsubscribe or subscribe goto: http://www.freelists.org/list/davidpill= ing From davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Tue Jun 24 13:23:32 2008 Received: from pop3.demon.co.uk by pilling.demon.co.uk with POP3 id <1KB7St-20Xknw-07-AGK.pilling@pop3.demon.co.uk> for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 13:23:32 +0100 Return-Path: Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk id 1KB7St-20Xknw-07-AGK; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 12:17:39 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.77] (lhlo=anchor-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1KB7St-20Xknw-07 for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 12:17:39 +0000 Received: from [206.53.239.180] (helo=turing.freelists.org) by anchor-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1KB7St-0001az-AU for flist@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 12:17:39 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id A5F1D864464; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 08:17:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 08093-07; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 08:17:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 3625F864222; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 08:17:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list davidpilling); Tue, 24 Jun 2008 08:16:53 -0400 (EDT) X-Original-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Delivered-To: davidpilling@freelists.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 4D24F864307 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 08:16:53 -0400 (EDT) Received: from turing.freelists.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (turing.freelists.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 07995-06 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 08:16:53 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mtaout03-winn.ispmail.ntl.com (mtaout03-winn.ispmail.ntl.com [81.103.221.49]) by turing.freelists.org (Avenir Technologies Mail Multiplex) with ESMTP id 2EC5E864375 for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 08:16:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from aamtaout03-winn.ispmail.ntl.com ([81.103.221.35]) by mtaout03-winn.ispmail.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20080624122207.PSKS16629.mtaout03-winn.ispmail.ntl.com@aamtaout03-winn.ispmail.ntl.com> for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 13:22:07 +0100 Received: from iyonix.ntlworld.com ([82.1.169.32]) by aamtaout03-winn.ispmail.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20080624122606.BPMJ8797.aamtaout03-winn.ispmail.ntl.com@iyonix.ntlworld.com> for ; Tue, 24 Jun 2008 13:26:06 +0100 Subject: [softwarelist] Re: O-Pro's future To: davidpilling@freelists.org From: Dr Alan Leighton X-Editor: EmailEdit 1.50 Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 13:19:03 +0100 Message-ID: References: <4fb3d31088Lists@torrens.org.uk> <4fb45d73famonster@caverock.net.nz> In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/5.12 (MsgServe/3.42) (RISC-OS/5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-archive-position: 831 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org Errors-to: davidpilling-bounce@freelists.org X-original-sender: alan.leighton2@ntlworld.com Precedence: normal Reply-to: davidpilling@freelists.org List-help: List-unsubscribe: List-software: Ecartis version 1.0.0 List-Id: davidpilling X-List-ID: davidpilling List-subscribe: List-owner: List-post: List-archive: X-list: davidpilling X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at localhost.localdomain X-CNFS-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=cwSeiBLpj2MA:10 a=pMdtZHg6hnHVLmAUEJaFkA==:17 a=D_VmOLqjAAAA:8 a=HT2m-uHvRVsYfd5ptIwA:9 a=5cmBy0aq-Xx4pVl_QLcA:7 a=-yyclV0L9XTbqhdxhsC80u85yucA:4 a=5WZzfXpOq_gA:10 X-Antivirus: AVG for E-mail 8.0.131 [270.4.1/1516] In message David Pilling wrote: > In message <4fb45d73famonster@caverock.net.nz>, Robert Greenfield > writes >>How would we (and David) like it to be enhanced? >>What is 'missing' in our opinions? > One problem is that there is an awful lot that could be added. Ask 20 > different people and you'll get 20 different suggestions, all of them > reasonable. > The problem is that there is no single improvement which would make the= > program instantly viable. > My current disillusion with Windows is due to the realisation that year= s > of work are now needed just to add the basic requirements. > Often in the past people have said "add feature A and I will buy it", > having added A they then turn around and say "do you seriously expect m= e > to use a program that lacks feature B". >>Why not make DDL standard OvPro format and leave the binary one for >>loading legacy documents? > Because for most users this would make no difference. >>- I'd like a 'screen redraw' button to clear the occasional detritus le= ft >>by processes. > I'd like to see the bugs that cause this fixed. >>Let schools/teachers know that they can still use their old Impression >>files even though they now use Windows. > One interesting aspect of the demise of Acorn was how many documents > must have been dumped along with all the computers in schools. This > discussion began with me talking about getting someone's book from > Impression to Word format. It is hard to believe that no one wrote a > Word translator in about 1995. It is perhaps a bit late now. Why don't you produce a list like Martin did for EasiWriter and we=20 could suggest our 2-4 favourites? In my survey 49 licence holders have voted for an =A350 + upgrade so=20 far, Thanks D