From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 2 22:39:17 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152362 for opro ; Mon, 02 Jul 101 22:39:14 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 993915744:10:03065:65; Sat, 30 Jun 2001 15:42:24 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1002864; 30 Jun 2001 15:42 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5UFfd329860 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 30 Jun 2001 16:41:39 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5UFfav29857 for ; Sat, 30 Jun 2001 16:41:37 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 15GMrw-000KSJ-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 30 Jun 2001 15:41:12 +0000 Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 16:40:04 GMT Message-Id: <152360@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Anyone noticed this? X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >A subtlety that it took me a while to realise (so I'm thick!) is that if >you continually run OP directly from the new CD Although its a commendable feature that you can run OPro from the CD, its surely not time efficient, copying to disc would only take a minute or so. Running from CD must take a lot longer - find the CD, open the archive etc. And you're stuck at 2.60, 3 or 4 versions out of date. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 2 22:39:40 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152368 for opro ; Mon, 02 Jul 101 22:39:37 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 993943103:20:14798:65; Sat, 30 Jun 2001 23:18:23 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2014228; 30 Jun 2001 23:18 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5UNFlL30959 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 1 Jul 2001 00:15:47 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from finch-post-11.mail.demon.net (finch-post-11.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.39]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5UNFjp30956 for ; Sun, 1 Jul 2001 00:15:45 +0100 Received: from omba.demon.co.uk ([158.152.58.5]) by finch-post-11.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15GTxM-000MR6-0B for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 30 Jun 2001 23:15:16 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Jeremy C B Nicoll To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 23:13:53 +0100 Subject: Re: Anyone noticed this? Message-ID: <4a92f05337Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <152360@pilling.demon.co.uk> References: <152360@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.01g (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On 30 Jun, David Pilling wrote: > >A subtlety that it took me a while to realise (so I'm thick!) is that > >if you continually run OP directly from the new CD > Although its a commendable feature that you can run OPro from the CD, > its surely not time efficient, copying to disc would only take a minute > or so. Running from CD must take a lot longer - find the CD, open the > archive etc. > And you're stuck at 2.60, 3 or 4 versions out of date. That's so. But I'm running out of space on my original hard disk, and although I've fitted a new one I have had problems with partitioning it. I decided to use the new one just as 'scratch' storage until I'd finally decided on the partitioning scheme I'm going to use. It's important to leave enough space on the old disk to move any newer files that I've got onto it before I repartition the new one. That all boils down to me not getting around to properly installing OP when I don't absolutely have to. -- Jeremy C B Nicoll - my opinions are my own. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 2 22:41:09 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152385 for opro ; Mon, 02 Jul 101 22:41:08 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 993976976:20:22179:65; Sun, 01 Jul 2001 08:42:56 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2106382; 1 Jul 2001 8:42 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f618gLC31734 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 1 Jul 2001 09:42:21 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f618gJp31730 for ; Sun, 1 Jul 2001 09:42:19 +0100 Received: from [62.188.28.228] (helo=62.188.28.228) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 15Gcj2-0006s3-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sun, 01 Jul 2001 09:37:05 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: David Breakwell To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sun, 01 Jul 2001 09:31:28 +0000 (GMT) Subject: Re: Anyone noticed this? Message-ID: <4a932e5bb1davidb@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a92b6ef3fJeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> References: <13ddd5904a.John@g1rcw.demon.co.uk> <4a92b6ef3fJeremy@omba. User-Agent: Pluto/2.02b (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <4a92b6ef3fJeremy@omba.demon.co.uk>, Jeremy C B Nicoll wrote: > that means that - for the moment - every time I load OP from CD I > have to manually check that that thing is unset before I print anything. Cpuldn't you write a quick script to set all the settings you require? David -- --. --. --. --. : : --- --- .---------------------------------------------. |_| |_| | _ | | | | |_ | |Internet provider for all Acorn RISC machines| | | |\ | | | | |\| | | '---------------------------------------------' | | | \ |_| |_| | | |__ | davidb@argonet.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 2 22:41:21 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152391 for opro ; Mon, 02 Jul 101 22:41:18 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 993990448:20:13695:66; Sun, 01 Jul 2001 12:27:28 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2013453; 1 Jul 2001 12:27 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f61CR9332055 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 1 Jul 2001 13:27:09 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from anchor-post-30.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-30.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.88]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f61CR6p32052 for ; Sun, 1 Jul 2001 13:27:06 +0100 Received: from omba.demon.co.uk ([158.152.58.5]) by anchor-post-30.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15GgL4-000EWJ-0U for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sun, 1 Jul 2001 13:28:34 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Jeremy C B Nicoll To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sun, 01 Jul 2001 11:51:45 +0100 Subject: Re: Anyone noticed this? Message-ID: <4a9335b57fJeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a932e5bb1davidb@argonet.co.uk> References: <13ddd5904a.John@g1rcw.demon.co.uk> <4a92b6ef3fJeremy@omba. User-Agent: Pluto/2.01g (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On 01 Jul, David Breakwell wrote: > Couldn't you write a quick script to set all the settings you require? Yes of course; the problem is that except for using OP to print off its manuals etc I haven't got to the stage in my current programming project where I need OP working easily. Time is *much* better spent on the tech issues of what I want to do... -- Jeremy C B Nicoll - my opinions are my own. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 2 22:41:25 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152393 for opro ; Mon, 02 Jul 101 22:41:22 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994004133:20:05280:65; Sun, 01 Jul 2001 16:15:33 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2005146; 1 Jul 2001 16:15 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f61GEpb32357 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 1 Jul 2001 17:14:51 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from smtp03.wxs.nl (smtp03.wxs.nl [195.121.6.37]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f61GEnp32354 for ; Sun, 1 Jul 2001 17:14:49 +0100 Received: from delink.wxs.nl ([195.121.161.116]) by smtp03.wxs.nl (Netscape Messaging Server 4.05) with SMTP id GFSYFN02.0KS for ; Sun, 1 Jul 2001 18:14:11 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sun, 01 Jul 2001 18:12:53 +0200 Subject: Superscript bug Message-ID: <4a93531c12paul@delink.nl> In-Reply-To: <152074@pilling.demon.co.uk> References: <152074@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/1.14i (RISC-OS/4.02) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Dear all, Geoff Youngs was the first one to announce the superscript bug in 2.64. David Pilling answered: > Now you mention it ISTR this could be a long running saga, of Impression > working one way, and some people thinking different ways are right or > wrong A fair point, perhaps, but in previous versions the superscript option worked perfectly, as far as I remember. In version 2.64 it is absolutely useless, though. Can we expect a patch soon? Kind regards, Paul Sprangers -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 2 22:41:27 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152394 for opro ; Mon, 02 Jul 101 22:41:25 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994008903:10:04383:66; Sun, 01 Jul 2001 17:35:03 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1125918; 1 Jul 2001 17:34 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f61HYfU32526 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 1 Jul 2001 18:34:41 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from mserv1b.vianw.co.uk ([195.102.249.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f61HYcp32523 for ; Sun, 1 Jul 2001 18:34:38 +0100 Received: from [195.102.201.142] (helo=Caslon.english.co.uk) by mserv1b.vianw.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #5) id 15Gl6a-0001Yt-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sun, 01 Jul 2001 18:33:57 +0100 Received: from Gill (10.0.1.1) by Caslon.english.co.uk; Sun, 01 Jul 2001 18:22:35 +0100 Date: Sun, 01 Jul 2001 18:23:00 +0100 From: David Graddol To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Superscript bug Message-ID: <998759934a%Support@Gill.english.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a93531c12paul@delink.nl> X-Organization: The English Company (UK) Ltd X-Mailer: Messenger v1.41d for RISC OS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii User-Agent: POPstar/2.02 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro wrote: > > Dear all, > > Geoff Youngs was the first one to announce the superscript bug in 2.64. > David Pilling answered: > > > Now you mention it ISTR this could be a long running saga, of Impression > > working one way, and some people thinking different ways are right or > > wrong > > A fair point, perhaps, but in previous versions the superscript option > worked perfectly, as far as I remember. In version 2.64 it is absolutely > useless, though. Can we expect a patch soon? > Oh dear. Thanks for alerting me to this problem. A quick retrofit to 2.63 needed quickly methinks. The whole line of text which includes the superscript character seems to get lowered. David -- The English Company (UK) Ltd http://www.english.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 2 22:42:23 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152401 for opro ; Mon, 02 Jul 101 22:42:20 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994018795:20:10677:65; Sun, 01 Jul 2001 20:19:55 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2010548; 1 Jul 2001 20:19 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f61KJWm00326 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 1 Jul 2001 21:19:32 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from monsoon.mail.pipex.net (monsoon.mail.pipex.net [158.43.128.69]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f61KJTp00323 for ; Sun, 1 Jul 2001 21:19:29 +0100 Received: (qmail 13724 invoked from network); 1 Jul 2001 20:18:49 -0000 Received: from userke73.uk.uudial.com (HELO loopback) (62.188.209.47) by smtp-1.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; 1 Jul 2001 20:18:49 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Dave Symes To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sun, 01 Jul 2001 19:09:23 +0100 Subject: Re: Superscript bug Message-ID: <4a935dc66fdfs@ukgateway.net> In-Reply-To: <4a93531c12paul@delink.nl> References: <152074@pilling.demon.co.uk> <4a93531c12paul@delink.nl> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.04-pre1 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R In article <4a93531c12paul@delink.nl>, wrote: > Dear all, > Geoff Youngs was the first one to announce the superscript bug in 2.64. > David Pilling answered: > > Now you mention it ISTR this could be a long running saga, of > > Impression working one way, and some people thinking different ways > > are right or wrong > A fair point, perhaps, but in previous versions the superscript option > worked perfectly, as far as I remember. In version 2.64 it is absolutely > useless, though. Can we expect a patch soon? > Kind regards, > Paul Sprangers Indeedy, I've just tested this with Ov Pro 2.52 then 2.58 and 2.61 where the Super and Subscripts work correctly and don't modify the line space. Cheers Dave S -- _______________________________________________________________________ Dave Symes... dfs@ukgateway.net Also... df@dafs.freeserve.co.uk .. or... dave@triffid.co.uk http://www.dfs.ukgateway.net -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 2 22:42:56 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152410 for opro ; Mon, 02 Jul 101 22:42:53 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994082304:10:29834:278; Mon, 02 Jul 2001 13:58:24 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1117210; 2 Jul 2001 13:55 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f62DuGk01791 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 14:56:16 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from alpha.netvision.net.il (alpha.netvision.net.il [194.90.1.13]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f62Du9p01788 for ; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 14:56:10 +0100 Received: from netvision.net.il (ras4-p31.jlm.netvision.net.il [62.0.147.31]) by alpha.netvision.net.il (8.9.3/8.8.6) with ESMTP id QAA14318 for ; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 16:55:15 +0300 (IDT) Message-ID: <3B407D3C.DF4F5BBC@netvision.net.il> Date: Mon, 02 Jul 2001 16:55:08 +0300 From: Michael Ben-Gershon Organization: My Office X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.19 i686) X-Accept-Language: en-GB, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: DDL question References: <152074@pilling.demon.co.uk> <4a93531c12paul@delink.nl> <4a935dc66fdfs@ukgateway.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Is it possible to specify a document zoom value in a DDL file? Michael Ben-Gershon mybg@netvision.net.il -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 2 22:43:03 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152413 for opro ; Mon, 02 Jul 101 22:43:01 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994077500:20:18012:65; Mon, 02 Jul 2001 12:38:20 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2100939; 2 Jul 2001 12:38 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f62CafX01350 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 13:36:41 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from typhoon.mail.pipex.net (typhoon.mail.pipex.net [158.43.128.27]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f62Cacp01347 for ; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 13:36:38 +0100 Received: (qmail 8753 invoked from network); 2 Jul 2001 12:35:49 -0000 Received: from useral52.uk.uudial.com (HELO RPC) (62.188.134.125) by smtp-2.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; 2 Jul 2001 12:35:49 -0000 Date: Mon, 02 Jul 2001 09:38:41 +0100 From: Elma Alexander To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Can't add picture in 2,64 Message-ID: References: <152314@pilling.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <152314@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.10d (MsgServe/1.10) (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <152314@pilling.demon.co.uk> David Pilling wrote: > >Today I tried to add a picture to a text page, originally created in > >v2.64, but it only left it blank with the cross (+) lines on it. > > Main menu, view, options, tick pictures That did it - thanks, David. I'm thick :( Elly. -- Elma Alexander Email: elma.alexander@ukgateway.net - Fax: 0870 138 4996 Praising God & Country Music Elma's Window on the World: http://znap.to/Elly -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 2 22:43:12 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152416 for opro ; Mon, 02 Jul 101 22:43:10 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994097975:10:13967:70; Mon, 02 Jul 2001 18:19:35 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1115067; 2 Jul 2001 18:18 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f62IJbm02334 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 19:19:37 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from mk-smarthost-2.mail.uk.worldonline.com (mk-smarthost-2.mail.uk.worldonline.com [212.74.112.72]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f62IJZp02331 for ; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 19:19:35 +0100 Received: from ppp-2-52.5800-7.access.uk.worldonline.com ([62.64.159.52] helo=ghc) by mk-smarthost-2.mail.uk.worldonline.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #3) id 15H8Ge-000EaC-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Mon, 02 Jul 2001 19:17:53 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Gavin Crawford To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Mon, 02 Jul 2001 19:17:10 +0100 Subject: Re: Pictures in Opro Message-ID: <4a93e25314gav@crawford-print.co.uk> In-Reply-To: References: <21B2A2008F16D2118E7A00805F8BF7ECA99688@w12wnxu01.wn.bbc.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02d (RISC-OS/3.70) POPstar/2.02 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article , Gabriel Swords wrote: > In message > <21B2A2008F16D2118E7A00805F8BF7ECA99688@w12wnxu01.wn.bbc.co.uk> you > wrote: > >Gabriel Swords wrote : > > > > I have 3 pictures in an OPro document... all of them print to > > postscript, but only one of them will print to my LaserDirect (LPB8). > > > > What format are the pictures? > > > > Perhaps the two that don't print are in EPS form and only print to a > > device that understands postscript. > > > There are all Sprites saved from Photodesk 2.04 IIRC the LaserDirect uses the same sprite code as TurboDrivers. If it does then there is a maximum sprite size that it can handle. Are your sprites more than 4094 pixels in height or width as I think that is the limit it will cope with. (or it may be 2047 depending on the sprite mode). ArtWorks suffers from the same limits. Gav. -- Gavin Crawford email: gav@crawford-print.co.uk web: www.crawford-print.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 2 22:43:16 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152417 for opro ; Mon, 02 Jul 101 22:43:12 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994079757:20:15518:65; Mon, 02 Jul 2001 13:15:57 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2102341; 2 Jul 2001 13:15 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f62DG5801504 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 14:16:05 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from purple.paston.co.uk (purple.paston.co.uk [194.202.64.60]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f62DG2p01501 for ; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 14:16:02 +0100 Received: from paston.co.uk (angelwords.netkonect.co.uk [194.164.3.172]) by purple.paston.co.uk (Postfix) with SMTP id 32A3C2BD63 for ; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 14:19:02 +0100 (BST) Date: Mon, 02 Jul 2001 14:16:43 GMT From: Gabriel Swords To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Pictures in Opro Message-ID: <8b4fcc934a.angelwords@paston.co.uk> References: <60f23c924a.Elly@ukgateway.net> In-Reply-To: <60f23c924a.Elly@ukgateway.net> X-Organization: angelwords User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.50a (MsgServe/1.50) (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Hi, I have 3 pictures in an OPro document... all of them print to postscript, but only one of them will print to my LaserDirect (LPB8). I'm using version 2.58 of OP and 1.62 of Printers on a RPC with RO4.02 Any ideas? Please! Gabriel -- Gabriel Swords -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 2 22:43:28 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152419 for opro ; Mon, 02 Jul 101 22:43:21 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994080347:20:00496:70; Mon, 02 Jul 2001 13:25:47 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2000326; 2 Jul 2001 13:25 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f62DPK501572 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 14:25:20 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from gateh.kw.bbc.co.uk (gateh.kw.bbc.co.uk [132.185.132.17]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f62DPIp01569 for ; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 14:25:18 +0100 Received: from w1bhxi02.radio.bbc.co.uk ([10.48.8.92]) by gateh.kw.bbc.co.uk (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id f62DOPX13264 for ; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 14:24:25 +0100 (BST) Received: from w12wcxf01.wc.bbc.co.uk (unverified) by w1bhxi02.radio.bbc.co.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 4.2.1) with ESMTP id for ; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 14:24:24 +0100 Message-ID: <21B2A2008F16D2118E7A00805F8BF7ECA99688@w12wnxu01.wn.bbc.co.uk> From: Michael Hunter To: "'ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk'" Subject: RE: Pictures in Opro Date: Mon, 2 Jul 2001 14:24:23 +0100 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Gabriel Swords wrote : >I have 3 pictures in an OPro document... all of them print to >postscript, but only one of them will print to my LaserDirect (LPB8). What format are the pictures? Perhaps the two that don't print are in EPS form and only print to a device that understands postscript. Michael > Michael Hunter This e-mail, and any attachment, is confidential. If you have received it in error, please delete it from your system, do not use or disclose the information in any way, and notify me immediately. The contents of this message may contain personal views which are not the views of the BBC, unless specifically stated. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 2 22:43:40 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152422 for opro ; Mon, 02 Jul 101 22:43:38 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994096287:20:03793:65; Mon, 02 Jul 2001 17:51:27 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2003660; 2 Jul 2001 17:51 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f62HolS02213 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 18:50:47 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from purple.paston.co.uk (purple.paston.co.uk [194.202.64.60]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f62Hojp02210 for ; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 18:50:45 +0100 Received: from paston.co.uk (angelwords.netkonect.co.uk [194.164.3.172]) by purple.paston.co.uk (Postfix) with SMTP id A448F2BD5B for ; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 18:53:43 +0100 (BST) Date: Mon, 02 Jul 2001 18:53:51 GMT From: Gabriel Swords To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: RE: Pictures in Opro Message-ID: References: <21B2A2008F16D2118E7A00805F8BF7ECA99688@w12wnxu01.wn.bbc.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <21B2A2008F16D2118E7A00805F8BF7ECA99688@w12wnxu01.wn.bbc.co.uk> X-Organization: angelwords User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.50a (MsgServe/1.50) (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In message <21B2A2008F16D2118E7A00805F8BF7ECA99688@w12wnxu01.wn.bbc.co.uk> you wrote: >Gabriel Swords wrote : > > I have 3 pictures in an OPro document... all of them print to > postscript, but only one of them will print to my LaserDirect (LPB8). > > What format are the pictures? > > Perhaps the two that don't print are in EPS form and only print to a device > that understands postscript. > There are all Sprites saved from Photodesk 2.04 -- Gabriel Swords -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 2 22:43:44 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152423 for opro ; Mon, 02 Jul 101 22:43:41 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994098011:20:26664:65; Mon, 02 Jul 2001 18:20:11 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2124445; 2 Jul 2001 18:20 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f62IKnP02354 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 19:20:49 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from sand6.global.net.uk.noc.gxn.net (sand6.global.net.uk [195.147.246.105]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f62IKkp02350 for ; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 19:20:46 +0100 Received: from p33s02a03.client.global.net.uk ([195.147.162.52] helo=loopback) by sand6.global.net.uk.noc.gxn.net with smtp (Exim 3.03 #1) id 15H8IM-0007BL-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Mon, 02 Jul 2001 19:19:39 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Dave Symes To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Mon, 02 Jul 2001 19:00:45 +0100 Subject: Re: Pictures in Opro Message-ID: <4a93e0d237dfs@ukgateway.net> In-Reply-To: References: <21B2A2008F16D2118E7A00805F8BF7ECA99688@w12wnxu01.wn.bbc.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.04-pre1 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article , Gabriel Swords wrote: > In message <21B2A2008F16D2118E7A00805F8BF7ECA99688@w12wnxu01.wn.bbc.co.uk> you wrote: > >Gabriel Swords wrote : > > > > I have 3 pictures in an OPro document... all of them print to > > postscript, but only one of them will print to my LaserDirect (LPB8). > > > > What format are the pictures? > > Perhaps the two that don't print are in EPS form and only print to a > > device that understands postscript. > > > There are all Sprites saved from Photodesk 2.04 Well there's your answer then...Perhaps you should put the sprites back in to !Paint and resave them... Dave S -- _______________________________________________________________________ Dave Symes... dfs@ukgateway.net Also... df@dafs.freeserve.co.uk .. or... dave@triffid.co.uk http://www.dfs.ukgateway.net -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 3 14:44:14 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152460 for opro ; Tue, 03 Jul 101 14:44:13 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994123167:20:26863:66; Tue, 03 Jul 2001 01:19:27 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2110574; 3 Jul 2001 1:19 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f631JQr03122 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 02:19:26 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f631JOp03119 for ; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 02:19:24 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 15HEpg-0006TB-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 01:18:28 +0000 Date: Tue, 03 Jul 2001 02:05:38 GMT Message-Id: <152453@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Superscript bug X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro OK, yes superscripts are clearly wrong, lines move down too much. It is still an interesting question though, should the height of any superscripts count as part of the line height? David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 3 14:44:36 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152463 for opro ; Tue, 03 Jul 101 14:44:24 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994145709:20:24668:67; Tue, 03 Jul 2001 07:35:09 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2127063; 3 Jul 2001 7:34 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f637Z3g03587 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 08:35:03 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from mserv1b.vianw.co.uk ([195.102.249.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f637Z0p03584 for ; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 08:35:00 +0100 Received: from [194.119.179.59] (helo=Caslon.english.co.uk) by mserv1b.vianw.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #5) id 15HKh6-0001Zh-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 03 Jul 2001 08:34:00 +0100 Received: from Gill (10.0.1.1) by Caslon.english.co.uk; Tue, 03 Jul 2001 08:29:38 +0100 Date: Tue, 03 Jul 2001 08:29:59 +0100 From: David Graddol To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Superscript bug Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <152453@pilling.demon.co.uk> X-Organization: The English Company (UK) Ltd X-Mailer: Messenger v1.41d for RISC OS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii User-Agent: POPstar/2.02 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro opro@pilling.demon.co.uk (David Pilling) wrote: > OK, yes superscripts are clearly wrong, lines move down too much. > > It is still an interesting question though, should the height of > any superscripts count as part of the line height? > Well, I would have thought it wasn't really much of a question. Surely, the position of a line of type containing a superscript should be exactly the same as one not containing a superscript. In other words, if a superscript were deleted it should make absolutely no difference to the rest of the line. Traditionally, a superscript is a small character hung from the top line - in other words it is entirely within the line height and does not alter it. If you place, say, a superscript 1 after a letter with an ascender such as 't', then you will see that the two are top aligned. That might be one principled difference between vertical shift and superscript. David -- The English Company (UK) Ltd http://www.english.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 3 14:45:25 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152468 for opro ; Tue, 03 Jul 101 14:45:21 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994154496:10:28682:65; Tue, 03 Jul 2001 10:01:36 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1028486; 3 Jul 2001 10:01 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f63A1PS03946 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 11:01:25 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from cmailg5.svr.pol.co.uk (cmailg5.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.195.175]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f63A1Mp03943 for ; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 11:01:22 +0100 Received: from modem-89.clam.dialup.pol.co.uk ([217.134.24.89] helo=SWebRPC1) by cmailg5.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 15HMyk-0001WM-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 03 Jul 2001 11:00:22 +0100 Date: Tue, 03 Jul 2001 10:51:32 +0100 From: Geoff Youngs To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Superscript bug Message-ID: <5ede37944a.Geoff@solutionsweb.co.uk> References: <152453@pilling.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <152453@pilling.demon.co.uk> X-Organization: solutions.web User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.50a (MsgServe/1.50) (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 X-Question: Do you really find headers very interesting? X-Editor: Zap 1.44 (15 May 2001) [TEST 5], ZapEmail 0.25 (20 Sep 2000) test-5 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In message <152453@pilling.demon.co.uk> opro@pilling.demon.co.uk (David Pilling) wrote: > OK, yes superscripts are clearly wrong, lines move down too much. > > It is still an interesting question though, should the height of > any superscripts count as part of the line height? Not by default. Not unless it affects the line height of the entire section. And even then not by default. The only situation I can think of in which you might want the line height to be altered by superscript text would be where you are editing an equation or trying fancy text effects. In the former case it's probably a bad idea (an equation editor would be more appripriate), but in the case of latter, while it might be useful, it is questionable whether it would be worth crowding interface with the option to use it. Yours, Geoff. -- Geoff Youngs, Technical Director // solutions.web - Internet Consultants \\ Tel. +44 (0) 23 9241 2340 // Web : http://www.solutionsweb.co.uk/ -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 3 14:45:29 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152469 for opro ; Tue, 03 Jul 101 14:45:28 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994154874:10:08888:89; Tue, 03 Jul 2001 10:07:54 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1125775; 3 Jul 2001 10:06 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f63A6QH04009 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 11:06:26 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from smtp01.wxs.nl (smtp01.wxs.nl [195.121.6.61]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f63A6Kp04006 for ; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 11:06:21 +0100 Received: from delink.wxs.nl ([195.121.161.157]) by smtp01.wxs.nl (Netscape Messaging Server 4.05) with SMTP id GFW6OO04.N4R for ; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 12:05:12 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Tue, 03 Jul 2001 12:00:46 +0200 Subject: Superscript bug Message-ID: <4a9438b6b6paul@delink.nl> In-Reply-To: References: <152453@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/1.14i (RISC-OS/4.02) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro David Graddol wrote: > Surely, the position of a line of type containing a superscript > should be exactly the same as one not containing a superscript. I definitively agree. Kind regards, Paul Sprangers -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 3 14:46:17 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152472 for opro ; Tue, 03 Jul 101 14:46:15 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994162170:10:18750:91; Tue, 03 Jul 2001 12:09:30 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1116889; 3 Jul 2001 12:09 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f63C9N904363 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 13:09:23 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from mta01-svc.ntlworld.com (mta01-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.41]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f63C9Lp04359 for ; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 13:09:21 +0100 Received: from RiscPC ([213.104.122.51]) by mta01-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.27 201-229-119-110) with SMTP id <20010703120818.UHBV351.mta01-svc.ntlworld.com@RiscPC> for ; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 13:08:18 +0100 Date: Tue, 03 Jul 2001 13:08:13 +0100 From: Pete Bready To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Superscript bug Message-ID: <9d6144944a.pbready@ntlworld.com> References: <152453@pilling.demon.co.uk> <4a9438b6b6paul@delink.nl> In-Reply-To: <4a9438b6b6paul@delink.nl> X-Organization: Home User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.50a (MsgServe/1.50) (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In message <4a9438b6b6paul@delink.nl> wrote: > > David Graddol wrote: > > Surely, the position of a line of type containing a superscript > > should be exactly the same as one not containing a superscript. > > I definitively agree. > Kind regards, > Paul Sprangers > Sounds sensible - you wouldn't really want to upset the line height for one line of a paragraph just because it contained a sub/superscript - it would look 'odd' and unbalanced! -- Pete Bready pbready@ntlworld.com -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 3 16:13:44 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152476 for opro ; Tue, 03 Jul 101 16:13:35 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994172061:10:28243:75; Tue, 03 Jul 2001 14:54:21 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1125531; 3 Jul 2001 14:51 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f63EnEw04642 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 15:49:14 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net (altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net [193.67.237.6]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f63EnAp04639 for ; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 15:49:11 +0100 Received: from padua by altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net via 1Cust92.tnt37.rtm1.nl.uu.net [213.116.168.92] with SMTP for id QAA08392 (8.8.8/1.3); Tue, 3 Jul 2001 16:48:05 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <002b01c103cf$4424a390$4d01a8c0@padua> From: "Tonnie Demarteau" To: "Ovation Pro" References: Subject: Re: Superscript bug Date: Tue, 3 Jul 2001 16:48:11 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R On Tue 03 Jul, David Graddol wrote: > opro@pilling.demon.co.uk (David Pilling) wrote: > > > OK, yes superscripts are clearly wrong, lines move down too much. > > > > It is still an interesting question though, should the height of > > any superscripts count as part of the line height? > > > > Well, I would have thought it wasn't really much of a question. > Surely, the position of a line of type containing a superscript > should be exactly the same as one not containing a superscript. > In other words, if a superscript were deleted it should make > absolutely no difference to the rest of the line. Traditionally > a superscript is a small character hung from the top line - in > other words it is entirely within the line height and does not > alter it. > If you place, say, a superscript 1 after a letter > with an ascender such as 't', then you will see that the two are > top aligned. I think, this is the 'main' issue: where to put the virtual top (superscript) and where to put the virtual bottom (subscript) ? Within the limits of the pointsize the measurements of the glyphs differ in different fonts. A capital H in Homerton hasn't the same height as a capital H in Trinity.Medium and a capital H in Trinity.Medium hasn't the same height as in Trinity.Bold or in Trinity.Medium.Italic. A capital in a font doesn't need to have the same height as a lower case character with an ascender (l or h). It can have the same heigt, it can be lower, it can be higher. That is part of the design of a specific weight. A composite capital like (capital + accent like ASCII 192) can have its accent above the A, but it can also been designed to have a smaller height. The same 'story' can be told about descenders. A bow of the lower case g doesn't need to be as low as the descender of the p. The only horizontal line *inside* fonts, that fonts share or have in common, is the baseline. Most fonts have already some (kind of) superscript glyphs defined like small 1,2,3 or trademark. Now, as I understand it, the question is, where the virtual top and bottom line should be placed, when superscript and subscript has to be *calculated for all fonts*. Both of course without altering the line height of the current font and fontsize. As an example: on a design size of 1000, heights in Trinity and Homerton are (about): xh lh Hh weight/style 460 670 682 Trinity.Bold 458 682 662 Trinity.Bold.Italic 448 682 662 Trinity.Medium 446 684 660 Trinity.Medium.Italic 542 730 730 Homerton.Bold 543 731 731 Homerton.Bold.Oblique 526 730 730 Homerton.Medium 526 730 730 Homerton.Medium.Oblique xh = x-height lh = lower case l height Hh = capital H height Other fonts have other heights, descenders other lowest values etc. A calculated virtual top and bottom can only be correct for *some* fonts, acceptable or 'wrong' for other fonts. To correct instances, where the result isn't acceptable, vertical shift can be of help ... > That might be one principled difference between > vertical shift and superscript. I think the difference is between what is defined in a font (proportional and different for every font) and what has to be calculated for common use. As Trinity.Medium is already the Basestyle and available for every user, my suggestion would be to use values, which are/seem correct for Trinity.Medium. Trademark (ASCII 141 in Trinity.Medium) seems a good starting point to me. mrs. Tonnie Demarteau - the Netherlands -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 3 22:30:52 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152491 for opro ; Tue, 03 Jul 101 22:30:49 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994193129:20:03845:65; Tue, 03 Jul 2001 20:45:29 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2003376; 3 Jul 2001 20:45 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f63KjC805214 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 21:45:12 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f63Kj9p05211 for ; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 21:45:10 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 15HX1f-0008FG-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 20:44:03 +0000 Date: Tue, 03 Jul 2001 19:43:28 GMT Message-Id: <152479@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Superscript bug X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro OK, OK, I'll put it back. Now where were you all when I was getting emails from someone ranting about what a mess superscripting was... Its a problem, everything is done for a reason, but its not always easy years later to recall what the reason was. Another bug has come to light and been fixed, so its worth doing another version. This one is to do with bad clipping on the join between pages when multiple pages are printed. It goes back a few versions. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 3 22:31:02 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152494 for opro ; Tue, 03 Jul 101 22:30:58 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994194486:20:22302:65; Tue, 03 Jul 2001 21:08:06 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab2110867; 3 Jul 2001 21:07 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f63L7ed05317 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 22:07:40 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from cmailg3.svr.pol.co.uk (cmailg3.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.195.173]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f63L7cp05314 for ; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 22:07:38 +0100 Received: from modem-186.iodine.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.44.186] helo=orchard-way) by cmailg3.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 15HXNN-0001LH-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 03 Jul 2001 22:06:30 +0100 Date: Tue, 03 Jul 2001 22:04:51 +0100 From: Alan Adams To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Superscript bug Message-ID: <318375944a.Alan.Adams@orchard-way.freeserve.co.uk> References: <002b01c103cf$4424a390$4d01a8c0@padua> In-Reply-To: <002b01c103cf$4424a390$4d01a8c0@padua> User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.10 (MsgServe/1.10) (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R In message <002b01c103cf$4424a390$4d01a8c0@padua> you wrote: > On Tue 03 Jul, David Graddol wrote: > > > opro@pilling.demon.co.uk (David Pilling) wrote: > > > > > OK, yes superscripts are clearly wrong, lines move down too much. > > > > > > It is still an interesting question though, should the height of > > > any superscripts count as part of the line height? > > > > > > > I think, this is the 'main' issue: where to put the virtual top (superscript) > and where to put the virtual bottom (subscript) ? > It is an nteresting point to discuss. However, in OPro I would think it had already been decided. Since the line spacing is already being shown, on screen and in print, there must surely have been calculated a top and bottom. (In other words the "bottom" of one line is the "top" of the next.) -- Alan Adams alan.adams@orchard-way.freeserve.co.uk http://www.nckc.org.uk/ -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed Jul 4 01:10:05 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152505 for opro ; Wed, 04 Jul 101 01:10:02 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994198213:20:10603:65; Tue, 03 Jul 2001 22:10:13 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab2129391; 3 Jul 2001 22:10 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f63MAqN05562 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 23:10:52 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f63MAop05559 for ; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 23:10:50 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 15HYMY-000G0u-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 22:09:42 +0000 Date: Tue, 03 Jul 2001 22:34:19 GMT Message-Id: <152495@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Superscript bug X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro I've put super/sub script back to rights. Aside from my intentions the whole lot had a mistake in it. So it was completely wrong. What I think I was going on about is that if you vertial shift some text upwards, it forces the current line of text down. However if you v shift downwards it overlaps the line below. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed Jul 4 01:10:12 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152506 for opro ; Wed, 04 Jul 101 01:10:09 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994200369:20:00267:65; Tue, 03 Jul 2001 22:46:09 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2110683; 3 Jul 2001 22:45 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f63MkhZ05664 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 23:46:43 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f63Mkfp05661 for ; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 23:46:41 +0100 Received: from [62.188.132.245] (helo=62.188.132.245) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 15HYqh-00014q-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 03 Jul 2001 23:40:52 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Phil Coates To: OvPro Date: Tue, 03 Jul 2001 23:43:30 +0100 Subject: Tables Message-ID: <4a947e8b0bphilco.g0coa@argonet.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02d (RISC-OS/4.02) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R Is there any list of hints for creating tables in Ovationpro. It still appears very difficult to create a table consisting of text frames, where the borders overlap. In some instances attempting to enter any text imediatly gives a text overflow in the frame. Any hints please, or is this still a problem.. Thanks in anticipation. Regards Phil -- This email has been sent from a RiscPC which does not run Windows, but it will more than likely read your files. philco.g0coa@argonet.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed Jul 4 13:58:52 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152515 for opro ; Wed, 04 Jul 101 13:58:47 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994224522:20:07539:65; Wed, 04 Jul 2001 05:28:42 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2007434; 4 Jul 2001 5:28 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f645TIe06214 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 4 Jul 2001 06:29:18 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f645TFp06211 for ; Wed, 4 Jul 2001 06:29:15 +0100 Received: from [62.188.156.152] (helo=62.188.156.152) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 15Hf8D-0005pA-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 04 Jul 2001 06:23:22 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Phil Coates To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2001 06:26:32 +0100 Subject: Re: Tables Message-ID: <4a94a37174philco.g0coa@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <152511@pilling.demon.co.uk> References: <152511@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02d (RISC-OS/4.02) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Cor you were up late David. I'll follow those instructions for now I do havea an early copy of tablemate, but was hoping that I could do the same in a basic way with Opro. Thanks again.. Phil -- This email has been sent from a RiscPC which does not run Windows, but it will more than likely read your files. philco.g0coa@argonet.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed Jul 4 13:59:05 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152516 for opro ; Wed, 04 Jul 101 13:58:47 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994210671:10:03649:71; Wed, 04 Jul 2001 01:37:51 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1104675; 4 Jul 2001 1:37 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f641bpm05932 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 4 Jul 2001 02:37:51 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f641bnp05929 for ; Wed, 4 Jul 2001 02:37:49 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 15Hbaq-0004ua-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 4 Jul 2001 01:36:40 +0000 Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2001 02:29:15 GMT Message-Id: <152511@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Tables X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >Is there any list of hints for creating tables in Ovationpro. Probably get a copy of tablemate. >It still appears very difficult to create a table consisting of text >frames, where the borders overlap. In some instances attempting to enter any >text imediatly gives a text overflow in the frame. A good idea would be to sort out the text flow setting on the frames you are using for cells. e.g. set it to none. I suppose you're hinting at the sort of bug where OPro gets its text flow wrong when frames overlie one another just right. That sort of thing is still! present. By setting the flow to none, or perhaps changing the stand off setting to zero you may get around that. Although in any case thats a good idea for a table. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed Jul 4 13:59:17 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152517 for opro ; Wed, 04 Jul 101 13:59:12 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994228429:10:02530:67; Wed, 04 Jul 2001 06:33:49 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1106861; 4 Jul 2001 6:33 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f646YZe06373 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 4 Jul 2001 07:34:35 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f646YXp06370 for ; Wed, 4 Jul 2001 07:34:33 +0100 Received: from [62.188.135.80] (helo=62.188.135.80) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 15Hg9O-0006Zj-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 04 Jul 2001 07:28:39 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Phil Coates To: OvPro Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2001 07:31:23 +0100 Subject: Table Message-ID: <4a94a96126philco.g0coa@argonet.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02d (RISC-OS/4.02) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Thanks for the posting David. Your suggestions have worked wonderfully. I have not encountered any serious difficulty with overlaying of the frame edges, except I usually counter it by the front or back position on the page, if that is the bug you are referring to. Thanks again. Regards Phil -- This email has been sent from a RiscPC which does not run Windows, but it will more than likely read your files. philco.g0coa@argonet.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed Jul 4 13:59:24 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152519 for opro ; Wed, 04 Jul 101 13:59:20 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994239724:10:06388:75; Wed, 04 Jul 2001 09:42:04 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1116601; 4 Jul 2001 9:41 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f649cPk06636 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 4 Jul 2001 10:38:25 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from mk-smarthost-2.mail.uk.worldonline.com (mk-smarthost-2.mail.uk.worldonline.com [212.74.112.72]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f649cMp06633 for ; Wed, 4 Jul 2001 10:38:22 +0100 Received: from ppp-5-171.5800-6.access.uk.worldonline.com ([62.64.157.171] helo=thosechurchills.screaming.net) by mk-smarthost-2.mail.uk.worldonline.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #3) id 15Hj50-00040j-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 04 Jul 2001 10:36:18 +0100 Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2001 09:06:26 +0100 From: M P Churchill To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Superscript bug Message-ID: References: <152495@pilling.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <152495@pilling.demon.co.uk> X-Organization: Home User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.50a (MsgServe/1.50) (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In message <152495@pilling.demon.co.uk> you wrote: > > I've put super/sub script back to rights. Aside from my intentions > the whole lot had a mistake in it. So it was completely wrong. > Ah! Good! I've just tried using v2.64 for a Chemistry text with lots of charges on ions as superscripts. It looked like the results I got from a Mac we used about 10 years ago which had the same error for superscripts! Is the corrected version available yet, please? -- Malcolm -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu Jul 5 01:32:48 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152547 for opro ; Thu, 05 Jul 101 01:32:46 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994286210:10:07282:65; Wed, 04 Jul 2001 22:36:50 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1007077; 4 Jul 2001 22:36 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f64MaBB07686 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 4 Jul 2001 23:36:11 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from anchor-post-31.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-31.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.89]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f64Ma9p07683 for ; Wed, 4 Jul 2001 23:36:09 +0100 Received: from cartmell.demon.co.uk ([158.152.204.98]) by anchor-post-31.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15HvFF-000H44-0V for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 4 Jul 2001 23:35:41 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: John Cartmell To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2001 23:28:31 +0100 Subject: Re: Tables Message-ID: <4a95010226john@cartmell.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <152511@pilling.demon.co.uk> References: <152511@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02d (RISC-OS/4.02) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R In article <152511@pilling.demon.co.uk>, David Pilling wrote: > >Is there any list of hints for creating tables in Ovationpro. > Probably get a copy of tablemate. This makes sense as Tablemate can be used to produce a table for anywhere a Draw file could be inserted. -- John Cartmell - Manchester, UK Fleur Designs -- compact designer board games -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu Jul 5 13:23:48 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152553 for opro ; Thu, 05 Jul 101 13:23:43 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994293220:20:05623:65; Thu, 05 Jul 2001 00:33:40 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2112230; 5 Jul 2001 0:33 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f650Xch07973 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 5 Jul 2001 01:33:38 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from mail6.svr.pol.co.uk (mail6.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.212]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f64MdRp07737 for ; Wed, 4 Jul 2001 23:39:27 +0100 Received: from modem-41.holmium.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.53.41] helo=localhost.com) by mail6.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 15HvHa-0002NO-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 04 Jul 2001 23:38:07 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Colin Wood To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2001 23:31:54 +0100 Subject: Re: Superscript bug Message-ID: <4a95015124Colin@meldr.co.uk> In-Reply-To: References: <152495@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02c (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article , M P Churchill wrote: > In message <152495@pilling.demon.co.uk> you wrote: > > > > I've put super/sub script back to rights. Aside from my intentions > > the whole lot had a mistake in it. So it was completely wrong. > > > Ah! Good! I've just tried using v2.64 for a Chemistry text with lots of > charges on ions as superscripts. It looked like the results I got from > a Mac we used about 10 years ago which had the same error for > superscripts! Same thing occurred in an official publication on Chemistry for schools. The camera ready pages were produced on an Apple Mac just last year. Iirc, problems with line spacing whenever superscrip or subscript used - looks so untidy on a page of mainly text! -- ______________________________ __ / / _ |. _ \ /_ _ _| / Acorn SA RiscPC with RiscOS4 \__(_)||| ) \/\/(_)(_)(_| / and Dynalink 56k __________________________/ colin@meldr.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu Jul 5 13:24:25 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152562 for opro ; Thu, 05 Jul 101 13:24:23 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994330781:20:05184:97; Thu, 05 Jul 2001 10:59:41 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2115984; 5 Jul 2001 10:58 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f65AiWA08815 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 5 Jul 2001 11:44:32 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from cmailg2.svr.pol.co.uk (cmailg2.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.195.172]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f65AiTp08812 for ; Thu, 5 Jul 2001 11:44:29 +0100 Received: from modem-739.aerodactyl.dialup.pol.co.uk ([217.135.6.227] helo=magray.freeserve.co.uk) by cmailg2.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 15I6b7-0001Cb-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 05 Jul 2001 11:43:02 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Ray Dawson To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Thu, 05 Jul 2001 10:03:07 +0100 Subject: Re: Tables Message-ID: <4a953b1ba7rayd@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a95010226john@cartmell.demon.co.uk> References: <152511@pilling.demon.co.uk> <4a95010226john@cartmell.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 Organization: MagRay Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <4a95010226john@cartmell.demon.co.uk>, John Cartmell wrote: > In article <152511@pilling.demon.co.uk>, David Pilling > wrote: > > >Is there any list of hints for creating tables in Ovationpro. > > Probably get a copy of tablemate. > This makes sense as Tablemate can be used to produce a table for > anywhere a Draw file could be inserted. Tablemate supports OLE. If you insert a Tablemate table as a native file, Ctrl clicking on the table opens it up into Tablemate again for editing. Cheers, Ray D -- ..===================================. | M a g R a y Document Services | Ray Dawson Tel: 020 8864 7208 | the audio and braille specialists | rayd@argonet.co.uk '===================================' http://www.magray.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu Jul 5 22:27:16 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152592 for opro ; Thu, 05 Jul 101 22:27:14 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994362416:10:11276:67; Thu, 05 Jul 2001 19:46:56 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1011176; 5 Jul 2001 19:46 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f65JlNR10011 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 5 Jul 2001 20:47:23 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from warrior-outbound.servers.plus.net ([212.159.14.227]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f65JlLp10008 for ; Thu, 5 Jul 2001 20:47:21 +0100 Received: (qmail 3697 invoked from network); 5 Jul 2001 19:45:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO tinshill.force9.net) (212.159.17.126) by warrior with SMTP; 5 Jul 2001 19:45:41 -0000 Date: Thu, 5 Jul 2001 00:55:57 +0100 (BST) From: Anthony Hilton Subject: Re: Superscript bug To: Ovation Pro List In-Reply-To: <152495@pilling.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R In on Tue 03 Jul, David Pilling wrote: > > > What I think I was going on about is that if you vertial shift some text > upwards, it forces the current line of text down. However if you v shift > downwards it overlaps the line below. > Can you describe what vertical shift does in terms of the leading? I think I expect it to move the baseline within the overall leading set for the line, but I don't think that's how it works in Opro. Anthony Hilton -- ajh@tinshill.f9.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri Jul 6 17:54:20 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152636 for opro ; Fri, 06 Jul 101 17:54:18 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994424427:20:03851:73; Fri, 06 Jul 2001 13:00:27 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2118822; 6 Jul 2001 12:59 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f66CxWi11716 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 6 Jul 2001 13:59:32 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f66CxTp11712 for ; Fri, 6 Jul 2001 13:59:29 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 15IVB5-000GnX-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Fri, 6 Jul 2001 12:57:47 +0000 Date: Fri, 06 Jul 2001 03:04:12 GMT Message-Id: <152610@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Superscript bug X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R >Can you describe what vertical shift does in terms of the leading? I think I >expect it to move the baseline within the overall leading set for the line, >but I don't think that's how it works in Opro. I don't think it does. It lets you move the baseline of text up or down, as much as you like. As with sub/super scripts if you move the baseline up the effective height of the line (for leading purposes) is increased whilst if you move it down there is no change. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri Jul 6 21:42:51 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152647 for opro ; Fri, 06 Jul 101 21:42:40 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994442418:10:10221:66; Fri, 06 Jul 2001 18:00:18 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1118862; 6 Jul 2001 18:00 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f66I11Q12525 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 6 Jul 2001 19:01:01 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.91]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f66I0wp12522 for ; Fri, 6 Jul 2001 19:00:58 +0100 Received: from tarazen.demon.co.uk ([193.237.156.226] helo=tarazen) by anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15IZtR-000Mt4-0X for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Fri, 6 Jul 2001 18:59:54 +0100 Date: Fri, 06 Jul 2001 16:46:13 +0100 From: Jon Keates To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Superscript bug Message-ID: References: <152610@pilling.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <152610@pilling.demon.co.uk> X-Organization: Just as it comes User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.50a (MsgServe/1.50) (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 X-Editor: StrongEd 4.63 X-wotsthese: let me know Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R In message <152610@pilling.demon.co.uk> opro@pilling.demon.co.uk (David Pilling) once upon a time wrote : MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > >Can you describe what vertical shift does in terms of the leading? I think I > >expect it to move the baseline within the overall leading set for the line, > >but I don't think that's how it works in Opro. > > I don't think it does. It lets you move the baseline of text up or down, > as much as you like. As with sub/super scripts if you move the baseline > up the effective height of the line (for leading purposes) is increased > whilst if you move it down there is no change. > I know very little about such things, but I would have thought that if Lock to Grid was set then it should override all other minor alterations that affect baseline or leading, but it doesn't appear to as regards super/sub and V shift. -- Jon -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Sat Jul 7 01:50:33 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152664 for opro ; Sat, 07 Jul 101 01:50:29 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994459027:20:28391:67; Fri, 06 Jul 2001 22:37:07 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2118870; 6 Jul 2001 22:36 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f66Mbbg13017 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 6 Jul 2001 23:37:37 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from finch-post-11.mail.demon.net (finch-post-11.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.39]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f66MbZp13014 for ; Fri, 6 Jul 2001 23:37:35 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by finch-post-11.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15IeCP-000EVU-0B for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Fri, 6 Jul 2001 22:35:45 +0000 Date: Fri, 06 Jul 2001 21:52:12 GMT Message-Id: <152650@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Superscript bug X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >I would have thought that if Lock to Grid was set then it should override >all other minor alterations that affect baseline or leading, but it doesn't >appear to as regards super/sub and V shift. I believe lock to grid does work correctly, it locks the baseline of the line containing shifted text to the grid. It doesn't lock the baseline of the shifted text of course, how could it, since there may be many different shifts in one line. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Sat Jul 7 03:26:19 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152670 for opro ; Sat, 07 Jul 101 03:26:18 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994466901:20:27172:65; Sat, 07 Jul 2001 00:48:21 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2119916; 7 Jul 2001 0:48 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f670nds13253 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 7 Jul 2001 01:49:39 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from finch-post-12.mail.demon.net (finch-post-12.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.41]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f670nbp13249 for ; Sat, 7 Jul 2001 01:49:37 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by finch-post-12.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15IgGB-000JQs-0C for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 7 Jul 2001 00:47:47 +0000 Date: Fri, 06 Jul 2001 23:41:47 GMT Message-Id: <152661@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Ovation Pro 2.65 X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro OvationPro 2.65 is now available for testing, from http://www.davidpilling.net/ovationpro/upgrade/op265.zip I can but repeat my warning with 2.64... "I say for 'testing' because this version has some new features which may well have problems. One of the main new things is support for variable sized spaces in text, as a result documents saved from 2.64 or later won't load into earlier versions. So don't use this version to edit your lifes work just yet." 2.65 should fix the sub/superscript problems introduced in 2.64 and it also fixes a bad clipping problem with printing more than one page on a sheet of paper. You'll need a copy of Ovation Pro 2.60 or later to upgrade from. Don't all rush because this is a bit fiddly and I may have got it wrong. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Sat Jul 7 14:11:47 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152673 for opro ; Sat, 07 Jul 101 14:11:43 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994487708:20:11605:65; Sat, 07 Jul 2001 06:35:08 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2106848; 7 Jul 2001 6:35 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f676aAJ13755 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 7 Jul 2001 07:36:10 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net (altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net [193.67.237.6]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f676a7p13752 for ; Sat, 7 Jul 2001 07:36:07 +0100 Received: from padua by altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net via 1Cust51.tnt50.rtm1.nl.uu.net [213.117.18.51] with SMTP for id IAA15266 (8.8.8/1.3); Sat, 7 Jul 2001 08:34:16 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <001d01c106ae$f16419f0$4d01a8c0@padua> From: "Tonnie Demarteau" To: References: <152610@pilling.demon.co.uk> Subject: Re: Superscript bug Date: Sat, 7 Jul 2001 08:33:05 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Fri 06 Jul, Jon Keates wrote: > In message <152610@pilling.demon.co.uk> > opro@pilling.demon.co.uk (David Pilling) once upon a time wrote : > > >Can you describe what vertical shift does in terms of the leading? I think > > >I expect it to move the baseline within the overall leading set for the > > >line, but I don't think that's how it works in Opro. > > > > I don't think it does. It lets you move the baseline of text up or down, > > as much as you like. As with sub/super scripts if you move the baseline > > up the effective height of the line (for leading purposes) is increased > > whilst if you move it down there is no change. > > > > I know very little about such things, but I would have > thought that if Lock to Grid was set then it should override > all other minor alterations that affect baseline or leading, > but it doesn't appear to as regards super/sub and V shift. > As far as I know, there are *two* base lines: One in the font definition of the currently selected font (a guideline for all the characters in the font) and one in the document (the nearest horizontal line in the grid). When you set 'Lock to Grid' the baseline of the currently selected font is locked to the nearest horizontal line in the grid. As far as I understand it: Regardless, whether or not you have set 'Lock to grid' 1) the shape of the characters, 2) the angle of the verticals in the shape with the font base line 3) the angle of the whole shape with the font base line 4) the colour of the shape and the background of the character box 5) the width of each character (that is shape + 'white' space) and 6) their position in the fontbox (minimal height, needed for the largest shapes) can be manipulated without changing the choosen fontsize and leading. Maybe also other 'things'. Examples: 1) small caps and the (resized) small shapes, needed for subscript and superscript, changed aspect ratio (Condensed and Extended) 2) skewing (making Obliques or Slanted) 3) rotating 4) inverse or colour change (and font background blending) 5) auto kerning (making use of kerndata in the font) and tracking (adding 'white' space) 6) V-shift (moving the shape up or down) Notes: You also can apply a combination of 1 to 6. When you apply a large V-shift (up or down) to a selection, this selection can cross or even pass the line of text above or beneath this V-shifted selection Auto kerning can only be applied to paragraphs. mrs. Tonnie Demarteau - the Netherlands -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Sat Jul 7 16:20:01 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152684 for opro ; Sat, 07 Jul 101 16:20:00 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994514161:20:20662:67; Sat, 07 Jul 2001 13:56:01 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2126867; 7 Jul 2001 13:55 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f67DtS914386 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 7 Jul 2001 14:55:28 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f67DtQp14383 for ; Sat, 7 Jul 2001 14:55:26 +0100 Received: from userbk65.uk.uudial.com ([62.188.144.73] helo=argonet.co.uk) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 15IsRr-00025l-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 07 Jul 2001 14:48:40 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Tanner Family To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sat, 07 Jul 2001 14:48:43 +0100 Subject: Re: Superscript bug Message-ID: <4a965ced4attehtann@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <152610@pilling.demon.co.uk> References: <152610@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02d (RISC-OS/3.70) POPstar/2.01b12 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <152610@pilling.demon.co.uk>, David Pilling wrote: > >Can you describe what vertical shift does in terms of the leading? I > >think I expect it to move the baseline within the overall leading set > >for the line, but I don't think that's how it works in Opro. > I don't think it does. It lets you move the baseline of text up or down, > as much as you like. As with sub/super scripts if you move the baseline > up the effective height of the line (for leading purposes) is increased > whilst if you move it down there is no change. Hmm, When I worked on a professional typesetting system in the early 80s, superscript and subscript had no effect on the line leading. Where a typeface didn't have superscripts / subscripts, they were simulated by a reduced size and shoving the effective baseline up for the superscript and back down, or down for the subscript and back up. I don't think superscripts necessarily aligned with the cap height though. Or, indeed, subscripts with the descender. Cheers Tom Regards (PC) / Love from (non PC but nicer) [delete as applicable] Thos -- T. R. Tanner email: ttehtann@argonet.co.uk web page: http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/ttehtann Warning: Here be random taglines! .... If you know, you're a genius. If you answer, you're awesome. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 9 22:13:51 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152687 for opro ; Mon, 09 Jul 101 22:13:47 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994531318:10:15332:65; Sat, 07 Jul 2001 18:41:58 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1015026; 7 Jul 2001 18:41 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f67IgtJ14829 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 7 Jul 2001 19:42:55 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from alpha.netvision.net.il (alpha.netvision.net.il [194.90.1.13]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f67Ignp14826 for ; Sat, 7 Jul 2001 19:42:50 +0100 Received: from netvision.net.il (ras6-p5.jlm.netvision.net.il [62.0.150.5]) by alpha.netvision.net.il (8.9.3/8.8.6) with ESMTP id VAA01997 for ; Sat, 7 Jul 2001 21:40:53 +0300 (IDT) Message-ID: <3B4757AB.F593C647@netvision.net.il> Date: Sat, 07 Jul 2001 21:40:43 +0300 From: Michael Ben-Gershon Organization: My Office X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.19 i686) X-Accept-Language: en-GB, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: DDL question References: <152074@pilling.demon.co.uk> <4a93531c12paul@delink.nl> <4a935dc66fdfs@ukgateway.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R This message may have been missed in all the excitement about the super/subscripts, so I am repeating it! ------------------------------------------------------------------- Is it possible to specify a document zoom value in a DDL file? Michael Ben-Gershon mybg@netvision.net.il -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 9 22:14:05 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152693 for opro ; Mon, 09 Jul 101 22:14:03 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994534421:20:29199:65; Sat, 07 Jul 2001 19:33:41 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2103568; 7 Jul 2001 19:33 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f67JZFt14997 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 7 Jul 2001 20:35:15 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from mail11.svr.pol.co.uk (mail11.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.23]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f67JZDp14994 for ; Sat, 7 Jul 2001 20:35:13 +0100 Received: from modem-29.anfauglith.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.110.29] helo=worthy) by mail11.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 15IxpL-0001O0-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 07 Jul 2001 20:33:15 +0100 Date: Sat, 07 Jul 2001 20:33:10 +0100 From: Tim Howarth To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Screen update on Viewfinder Message-ID: <46767c964a%tim@worthy.demon.co.uk> X-Organization: Home X-Mailer: Messenger v1.41c for RISC OS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.67 User-Agent: POPstar/2.02 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R Whilst trying to covert some old Impression Publisher files to Ovation Pro on a RiscPC fitted with a Viewfinder graphics card the screen update seems very slow. Impression updates quickly even in 16m colour modes whereas OP seems very "floppy", pages seem to slowly appear rather than just appearing. Hmmmm, the easiest demonstration is when clicking a minimized doc to full screen height - with Impression, the window furniture hits the bottom of the screen then the contents appear, with OP the furniture appears then the window very slowly clears to backround (down the page) and text quickly appears in a single action. It looks as if OP clears the document area one line of text at a time (even with a blank page) does OP do its own screen clearing which is slow because of transfer across podule bus ? or is it simply that it clears a line at a time rather than a single rectangle ? Can OP be speeded up (apart from switching down colour depth) ? -- ___ |im ---- ARM Powered ---- -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 9 22:14:11 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152695 for opro ; Mon, 09 Jul 101 22:14:07 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994544568:20:24169:65; Sat, 07 Jul 2001 22:22:48 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2111212; 7 Jul 2001 22:22 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f67MO1V15253 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 7 Jul 2001 23:24:01 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from warrior-outbound.servers.plus.net ([212.159.14.227]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f67MNxp15250 for ; Sat, 7 Jul 2001 23:23:59 +0100 Received: (qmail 4662 invoked from network); 7 Jul 2001 22:21:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO tinshill.force9.net) (212.159.17.44) by warrior with SMTP; 7 Jul 2001 22:21:50 -0000 Date: Sat, 7 Jul 2001 23:13:52 +0100 (BST) From: Anthony Hilton Subject: Vertical shift (was Re: Superscript bug) To: Ovation Pro List In-Reply-To: <4a965ced4attehtann@argonet.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R In on Sat 07 Jul, Tanner Family wrote: > In article <152610@pilling.demon.co.uk>, > David Pilling wrote: > > > >Can you describe what vertical shift does in terms of the leading? I > > >think I expect it to move the baseline within the overall leading set > > >for the line, but I don't think that's how it works in Opro. > > > I don't think it does. It lets you move the baseline of text up or down, > > as much as you like. As with sub/super scripts if you move the baseline > > up the effective height of the line (for leading purposes) is increased > > whilst if you move it down there is no change. > > Hmm, When I worked on a professional typesetting system in the early 80s, > superscript and subscript had no effect on the line leading. Where a > typeface didn't have superscripts / subscripts, they were simulated by a > reduced size and shoving the effective baseline up for the superscript and > back down, or down for the subscript and back up. I don't think > superscripts necessarily aligned with the cap height though. Or, indeed, > subscripts with the descender. Sorry to confuse. I think I should have changed the subject with my first posting (above). I expect the sub/super script to work as Tom described. My enquiry was because vertical shift seems to increase the effective leading if taken beyond a particular point, for example a vertical shift of 50% for part of a line produces the effect that the rest of the line has been shifted down instead of pushing the vertically shifted bit into the line above, unless the text has been Locked to grid. I think it should behave the same regardless of whether lock to grid is ticked or not, to move the text relative to the normal baseline, and not move the baseline of any unshifted text in the line. Further playing reveals that once text has been locked to the grid, even if that option has been unticked again, the vertical shift does not affect the position of the rest of the line. OPro 2.62 - have I skimmed the announcements of changes in later versions and missed something which has affected this behaviour? I think that if I was wanting interesting, varied position within the line I would probably not expect to lock baselines to grid. (David, if I've previously asked about this and you've said it is not possible to change this behaviour I apologise, but the discussion on superscripts raised it in my mind again.) Anthony Hilton -- ajh@tinshill.f9.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 9 22:14:12 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152696 for opro ; Mon, 09 Jul 101 22:14:10 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994547125:10:24916:66; Sat, 07 Jul 2001 23:05:25 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1104611; 7 Jul 2001 23:05 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f67N6Dl15369 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 8 Jul 2001 00:06:13 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f67N6Ap15366 for ; Sun, 8 Jul 2001 00:06:10 +0100 Received: from omba.demon.co.uk ([158.152.58.5]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 15J17T-0002Jd-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 7 Jul 2001 23:04:11 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Jeremy C B Nicoll To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sun, 08 Jul 2001 00:00:54 +0100 Subject: Re: DDL question Message-ID: <4a968f7b1dJeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <3B4757AB.F593C647@netvision.net.il> References: <152074@pilling.demon.co.uk> <4a93531c12paul@delink.nl> <4a935dc66fdfs@ukgateway.net> <3B4757AB.F593C647@netvision. User-Agent: Pluto/2.01g (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On 07 Jul, Michael Ben-Gershon wrote: > This message may have been missed in all the excitement about the > super/subscripts, so I am repeating it! > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > Is it possible to specify a document zoom value in a DDL > file? Don't know. Why are you asking this in the middle of a thread about something else? Why not creat a new discussion thread? -- Jeremy C B Nicoll - my opinions are my own. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 9 22:14:26 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152701 for opro ; Mon, 09 Jul 101 22:14:24 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994584912:20:01174:65; Sun, 08 Jul 2001 09:35:12 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2129602; 8 Jul 2001 9:35 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f689aBx16063 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 8 Jul 2001 10:36:11 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from alpha.netvision.net.il (alpha.netvision.net.il [194.90.1.13]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f689a6p16060 for ; Sun, 8 Jul 2001 10:36:06 +0100 Received: from netvision.net.il (ras4-p129.jlm.netvision.net.il [62.0.147.129]) by alpha.netvision.net.il (8.9.3/8.8.6) with ESMTP id MAA11092; Sun, 8 Jul 2001 12:34:02 +0300 (IDT) Message-ID: <3B482900.C81FA63E@netvision.net.il> Date: Sun, 08 Jul 2001 12:33:52 +0300 From: Michael Ben-Gershon Organization: My Office X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.19 i686) X-Accept-Language: en-GB, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk, Jeremy C B Nicoll Subject: Re: DDL question References: <152074@pilling.demon.co.uk> <4a93531c12paul@delink.nl> <4a935dc66fdfs@ukgateway.net> <3B4757AB.F593C647@netvision. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Jeremy C B Nicoll wrote: > > On 07 Jul, Michael Ben-Gershon wrote: > > This message may have been missed in all the excitement about the > > super/subscripts, so I am repeating it! > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > Is it possible to specify a document zoom value in a DDL > > file? > > Don't know. Why are you asking this in the middle of a thread about > something else? Why not creat a new discussion thread? Why do you think this is in the middle of another thread? Did you care to look at the subject? All it has is 'DDL question'. Nothing else. All I was saying was that there had been an animated discussion of super/subscripts and that this other thread may have been overlooked in all the excitement. Before criticising so sharply, please pause for a moment and think. Michael Ben-Gershon mybg@netvision.net.il -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 9 22:14:36 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152706 for opro ; Mon, 09 Jul 101 22:14:33 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994590473:10:09142:67; Sun, 08 Jul 2001 11:07:53 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1008953; 8 Jul 2001 11:07 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f68B9HR16239 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 8 Jul 2001 12:09:17 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.91]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f68B9Ep16236 for ; Sun, 8 Jul 2001 12:09:14 +0100 Received: from omba.demon.co.uk ([158.152.58.5]) by anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15JCPg-000JBN-0X; Sun, 8 Jul 2001 12:07:45 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Jeremy C B Nicoll To: Michael Ben-Gershon Cc: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sun, 08 Jul 2001 11:57:43 +0100 Subject: Re: DDL question Message-ID: <4a96d11adaJeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <3B482900.C81FA63E@netvision.net.il> References: <152074@pilling.demon.co.uk> <4a93531c12paul@delink.nl> <4a935dc66fdfs@ukgateway.net> <3B4757AB.F593C647@netvision. User-Agent: Pluto/2.01g (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On 08 Jul, Michael Ben-Gershon wrote: > Jeremy C B Nicoll wrote: > > > > On 07 Jul, Michael Ben-Gershon wrote: > > > This message may have been missed in all the excitement about the > > > super/subscripts, so I am repeating it! > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > Is it possible to specify a document zoom value in a DDL > > > file? > > > > Don't know. Why are you asking this in the middle of a thread about > > something else? Why not creat a new discussion thread? > Why do you think this is in the middle of another thread? Did > you care to look at the subject? All it has is 'DDL question'. > Nothing else. Because a "thread" isn't just determined by subject. Each message that is written has a unique message-id, and when someone replies to an existing message the reply's header contains the information of what message it is being replied to. Your message was in reply to one on another thread. This would have happened because when you chose to write your post you had a current message in this other thread selected, so your news reader supposed you were writing a reply. The fact that you altered the subject has nothing to do with it. To post something that isn't a reply to an article already in a thread you need not to have an existing message selected. In *my* newsreader software I generally highlight the newsgroup name rather than a message within it to achieve this. The significance of this who-replied-to-what structure is that suitable software (eg !Pluto which I use) can then display the structure of the thread; in general this helps to show sub-threads and who replied to the sub-threads rather than the main thread. It also shows the structure regardless of the order in which replies arrive at the reader. > All I was saying was that there had been an animated discussion of > super/subscripts and that this other thread may have been overlooked > in all the excitement. > Before criticising so sharply, please pause for a moment and think. > Michael Ben-Gershon > mybg@netvision.net.il -- Jeremy C B Nicoll - my opinions are my own. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 9 22:14:39 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152707 for opro ; Mon, 09 Jul 101 22:14:37 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994597820:20:28905:65; Sun, 08 Jul 2001 13:10:20 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2028860; 8 Jul 2001 13:10 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f68DBB416420 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 8 Jul 2001 14:11:11 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from alpha.netvision.net.il (alpha.netvision.net.il [194.90.1.13]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f68DB5p16417 for ; Sun, 8 Jul 2001 14:11:06 +0100 Received: from netvision.net.il (ras6-p20.jlm.netvision.net.il [62.0.150.20]) by alpha.netvision.net.il (8.9.3/8.8.6) with ESMTP id QAA14319 for ; Sun, 8 Jul 2001 16:08:59 +0300 (IDT) Message-ID: <3B485B61.64DC18DD@netvision.net.il> Date: Sun, 08 Jul 2001 16:08:49 +0300 From: Michael Ben-Gershon Organization: My Office X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.19 i686) X-Accept-Language: en-GB, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: DDL question Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro This message may have been missed in all the excitement about the super/subscripts, so I am repeating it! It would seem that it somehow got mixed up in another thread which may have confused some of you! ------------------------------------------------------------------- Is it possible to specify a document zoom value in a DDL file? Michael Ben-Gershon mybg@netvision.net.il -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 9 22:15:04 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152713 for opro ; Mon, 09 Jul 101 22:15:03 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994664752:10:14969:67; Mon, 09 Jul 2001 07:45:52 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1127800; 9 Jul 2001 7:45 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f697ll917669 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 9 Jul 2001 08:47:47 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from stolly.southnet.co.nz (stolly.southnet.co.nz [202.49.115.1]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f697lhp17666 for ; Mon, 9 Jul 2001 08:47:43 +0100 Received: from danmccat.southnet.co.nz (p19.netserver1-dn.southnet.co.nz [202.36.220.149]) by stolly.southnet.co.nz (8.11.1/8.11.1) with SMTP id f697Nrq28347 for ; Mon, 9 Jul 2001 19:23:54 +1200 Date: Mon, 9 Jul 2001 20:22:58 +1300 (BST) From: Dan McCarthy Subject: Re: DDL question To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk In-Reply-To: <4a96d11adaJeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Organisation name, location. Telephone/Fax? X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.46] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Sun 08 Jul, Jeremy C B Nicoll wrote: > On 08 Jul, Michael Ben-Gershon wrote: > > Jeremy C B Nicoll wrote: > > The significance of this who-replied-to-what structure is that suitable > software (eg !Pluto which I use) can then display the structure of the > thread; in general this helps to show sub-threads and who replied to the > sub-threads rather than the main thread. It also shows the structure > regardless of the order in which replies arrive at the reader. > In my view a case of software being too damn clever for its own good. > Actually I wasn't aware of any of this - I thought to suject line was it. Who knows how much of my wisdom as been wound in on the wrong thread? ------- Dan McCarthy, 8 Kings Avenue, Dunedin, New Zealand. danmccat@deepsouth.co.nz THE STEEP BIRANCAS OPERATION - HEAT TREATED ICE -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 9 22:15:06 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152714 for opro ; Mon, 09 Jul 101 22:15:04 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994660936:20:24352:65; Mon, 09 Jul 2001 06:42:16 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2023813; 9 Jul 2001 6:41 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f696fBv17505 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 9 Jul 2001 07:41:11 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from cmailg1.svr.pol.co.uk (cmailg1.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.195.171]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f696f3p17502 for ; Mon, 9 Jul 2001 07:41:08 +0100 Received: from modem-121.south-dakota.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.92.121] helo=freeserve.co.uk) by cmailg1.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 15JUgv-0004js-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Mon, 09 Jul 2001 07:38:46 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: "Robin A. Hampshire" To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sun, 08 Jul 2001 19:13:51 +0100 Subject: Re: DDL question Message-ID: <4a96f9091brah@brushford.fsnet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <3B407D3C.DF4F5BBC@netvision.net.il> References: <152074@pilling.demon.co.uk> <4a93531c12paul@delink.nl> <4a935dc66fdfs@ukgateway.net> <3B407D3C.DF4F5BBC@netvision. User-Agent: Pluto/2.02d (RISC-OS/4.02) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <3B407D3C.DF4F5BBC@netvision.net.il>, Michael Ben-Gershon wrote: > Is it possible to specify a document zoom value in a DDL file? > Michael Ben-Gershon mybg@netvision.net.il The way I test for various features of DDL is to create a small OPro file containing just the feature to be tested, then save out as DDL. You can then inspect the DDL file in a text editor to see what's been created. Using that system, zoom factors do not seem to be saved out with DDL created by OPro. -- Robin Hampshire rah@brushford.fsnet.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 10 03:01:23 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152747 for opro ; Tue, 10 Jul 101 03:01:20 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994727505:10:09980:68; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 01:11:45 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1009937; 10 Jul 2001 1:11 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6A1Dk819407 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 02:13:46 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from finch-post-10.mail.demon.net (finch-post-10.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.38]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6A1Dcp19399 for ; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 02:13:38 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by finch-post-10.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15Jm3T-000LBK-0A for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 01:11:11 +0000 Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2001 02:04:23 GMT Message-Id: <152742@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Vertical shift (was Re: Superscript bug) X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >I think it should behave the same regardless of whether lock to grid is >ticked or not, to move the text relative to the normal baseline, and not >move the baseline of any unshifted text in the line. Ignore the bit about baseline grids. I believe the decision was made to make it work exactly the opposite way to what you suggest at some stage in the development - wish I could remember the logic, because interestingly Impression works the other way. You can of course change the leading if you want the text in one line to lie on top of another. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 10 03:01:23 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152748 for opro ; Tue, 10 Jul 101 03:01:20 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994727508:20:27112:65; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 01:11:48 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2127197; 10 Jul 2001 1:11 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6A1Cxg19382 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 02:12:59 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from finch-post-10.mail.demon.net (finch-post-10.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.38]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6A1Cvp19379 for ; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 02:12:57 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by finch-post-10.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15Jm2n-000LBK-0A for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 01:10:30 +0000 Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 22:21:45 GMT Message-Id: <152720@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: DDL question X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Sorry for missing the question, no DDL can't save doc zoom values. The idea was that DDL only saves document structure and nothing concerned with the appearance of the document. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 10 03:01:27 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152749 for opro ; Tue, 10 Jul 101 03:01:24 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994727505:10:10058:67; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 01:11:45 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1128456; 10 Jul 2001 1:11 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6A1Djf19404 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 02:13:45 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from finch-post-10.mail.demon.net (finch-post-10.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.38]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6A1Dbp19395 for ; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 02:13:37 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by finch-post-10.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15Jm3R-000LBK-0A for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 01:11:09 +0000 Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2001 01:58:02 GMT Message-Id: <152740@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Screen update on Viewfinder X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >Impression updates quickly even in 16m colour modes whereas OP seems >very "floppy", pages seem to slowly appear rather than just appearing. I'm going to deny that OPro is slower than Impression. You need to tie down the problem area to something specific. For example if you've got OPro set up to render CMYK inks realistically then CMYK sprites will be much slower than Impression which is just blasting them onto screen without bothering about the colours. You can turn off this feature in OPro. But main the point is that this is something specific. >It looks as if OP clears the document area one line of text at a time >(even with a blank page) does OP do its own screen clearing which is >slow because of transfer across podule bus ? or is it simply that it >clears a line at a time rather than a single rectangle ? But why in the situation you describe, would *OPro* be clearing the screen? There are situations where OPro will rub out text areas a line at a time, but these are when editing text or moving frames around, not on any old screen refresh. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 10 03:01:28 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152750 for opro ; Tue, 10 Jul 101 03:01:24 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994727508:20:27152:65; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 01:11:48 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2026901; 10 Jul 2001 1:11 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6A1DfN19402 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 02:13:41 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from finch-post-10.mail.demon.net (finch-post-10.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.38]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6A1DZp19390 for ; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 02:13:35 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by finch-post-10.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15Jm3Q-000LBK-0A for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 01:11:08 +0000 Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 22:53:28 GMT Message-Id: <152738@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Paper jams with Laser Direct Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >I acknowledge that this may not be an Ov Pro problem. But has anyone had a >similar experience and, more importantly, found a solution? Been there done that. In fact the jams with my Canon LD were the motivation for the OPro print feature that lets you print just one side of a sheet in a pamphlet. Yes the LD software goes haywire and shows numbers too large. However it rarely actually prints the wrong number. Of course what does happen is that after a jam it sets off counting at 1 again. I usually ended up shaking my fist in the general direction of Gaddesden Palace and enquiring aloud why they never finished the software properly. LD was a brilliant idea, they even did the difficult bits of the software well, yet apparently they couldn't be bothered to finish it. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 10 03:01:32 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152752 for opro ; Tue, 10 Jul 101 03:01:30 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994727509:20:27141:66; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 01:11:49 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2127207; 10 Jul 2001 1:11 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6A1DZY19392 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 02:13:35 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from finch-post-10.mail.demon.net (finch-post-10.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.38]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6A1DXp19386 for ; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 02:13:33 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by finch-post-10.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15Jm3P-000LBK-0A for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 01:11:07 +0000 Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 22:53:25 GMT Message-Id: <152736@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Screen update on Viewfinder X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 10 14:50:31 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152756 for opro ; Tue, 10 Jul 101 14:50:20 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994748003:20:18176:66; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 06:53:23 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2110937; 10 Jul 2001 6:53 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6A6rN420244 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 07:53:23 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from mail1.svr.pol.co.uk (mail1.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.18]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6A6rKp20241 for ; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 07:53:20 +0100 Received: from modem-88.argonath.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.124.88] helo=worthy) by mail1.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 15JrMA-0004EA-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 07:50:51 +0100 Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2001 07:50:02 +0100 From: Tim Howarth To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Screen update on Viewfinder Message-ID: <391ac2974a%tim@worthy.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <152740@pilling.demon.co.uk> X-Organization: Home X-Mailer: Messenger v1.41c for RISC OS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.67 User-Agent: POPstar/2.02 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R In message <152740@pilling.demon.co.uk> opro@pilling.demon.co.uk (David Pilling) wrote: > >Impression updates quickly even in 16m colour modes whereas OP seems > >very "floppy", pages seem to slowly appear rather than just appearing. > > I'm going to deny that OPro is slower than Impression. You need to > tie down the problem area to something specific. I knew it was going to be hard to describe (anyone know of a frame by frame screen grabber?) but I can add more... Taking a default A4 document at 100% in a 1488x1116x16Mx85Hz mode, put page at top of screen and push bottom up to top, hitting toggle to full size and it takes about 0.8 seconds to draw the screen. This is a blank document and I can clearly see the background clearing down the page. Doing the same with some text you can see the same slow clearing then the text appears relatively quickly. However I've now noticed that the area outside the default frame appears almost instantly..... Making the default frame tiny makes the page appear/clear much quicker and a further play shows that setting background colour to transparent has the same effect. (Even then Impression draws the text noticeably faster but the difference is much less obvious/annoying.) > For example if you've got OPro set up to render CMYK inks realistically > then CMYK sprites will be much slower than Impression which is just blasting > them onto screen without bothering about the colours. You can turn off > this feature in OPro. But main the point is that this is something specific. No graphics, just empty frame and/or text. > >It looks as if OP clears the document area one line of text at a time > >(even with a blank page) does OP do its own screen clearing which is > >slow because of transfer across podule bus ? or is it simply that it > >clears a line at a time rather than a single rectangle ? > > But why in the situation you describe, would *OPro* be clearing the screen? One of the problems with Viewfinder is apps which do their own screen clearing/drawing to speed up the redraw on a standard machine. However with a Viewfinder standard OS_Plot calls are much faster than sending your own screen data across the podule bus. > There are situations where OPro will rub out text areas a line at a time, > but these are when editing text or moving frames around, not on any > old screen refresh. Something appears (to me) to be happening on a line by line basis when drawing a coloured frame background, even if OP doesn't draw it itself it looks like it's sending lots of horizontal line fills rather than a single rectangle fill - which is very fast with Viewfinder as it uses hardware acceleration, unless some obscure version of OS_Plot is used which the Viewfinder doesn't accelerate. -- ___ |im ---- ARM Powered ---- -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 10 14:50:35 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152757 for opro ; Tue, 10 Jul 101 14:50:31 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994753658:10:03549:88; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 08:27:38 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1105162; 10 Jul 2001 8:27 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6A8Sm220542 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 09:28:48 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from cmailg2.svr.pol.co.uk (cmailg2.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.195.172]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6A8Skp20539 for ; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 09:28:46 +0100 Received: from modem-197.blastoise.dialup.pol.co.uk ([217.135.32.197] helo=modem-197) by cmailg2.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 15JsqR-0003nU-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 09:26:12 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Ray Dawson To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2001 09:25:20 +0100 Subject: Re: Screen update on Viewfinder Message-ID: <4a97cad3ffrayd@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <391ac2974a%tim@worthy.demon.co.uk> References: <152740@pilling.demon.co.uk> <391ac2974a%tim@worthy.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 Organization: MagRay Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <391ac2974a%tim@worthy.demon.co.uk>, Tim Howarth wrote: > In message <152740@pilling.demon.co.uk> opro@pilling.demon.co.uk (David > Pilling) wrote: > > >Impression updates quickly even in 16m colour modes whereas OP seems > > >very "floppy", pages seem to slowly appear rather than just > > >appearing. > > > > I'm going to deny that OPro is slower than Impression. You need to > > tie down the problem area to something specific. > I knew it was going to be haif |Ird to describe (anyone know of a frame > by frame screen grabber?) but I can add more... > Taking a default A4 document at 100% in a 1488x1116x16Mx85Hz mode, put > page at top of screen and push bottom up to top, hitting toggle to full > size and it takes about 0.8 seconds to draw the screen. > This is a blank document and I can clearly see the background clearing > down the page. I've just tried it with OP, IP and Viewfinder here and the result is similar. Using 1280 x 1024 x 16M colours, if I fill a standard A4 frame with text and collapse the window vertically as above, clicking on the full size toggle opens the OP window to full size immediately - but blank. After a short delay the text appears, but it does so all at once and not line by line as Tim suggested. It does the same thing in my normal mode of 1152 x 864 x 32k, but a lot quicker so you don't notice it so much. Impression provides a full text frame immediately at any resolution. As does Zap now :-) Using VF 1.31 Cheers, Ray D -- ..===================================. | M a g R a y Document Services | Ray Dawson Tel: 020 8864 7208 | the audio and braille specialists | rayd@argonet.co.uk '===================================' http://www.magray.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 10 21:34:36 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152775 for opro ; Tue, 10 Jul 101 21:34:32 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994787080:10:20041:65; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 17:44:40 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1116125; 10 Jul 2001 17:44 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6AHiWm22739 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 18:44:32 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.90]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6AHiTp22736 for ; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 18:44:29 +0100 Received: from omba.demon.co.uk ([158.152.58.5]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15K1WE-000Gr4-0W for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 18:41:54 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Jeremy C B Nicoll To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2001 18:24:42 +0100 Subject: Re: Screen update on Viewfinder Message-ID: <4a97fc3534Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <46767c964a%tim@worthy.demon.co.uk> References: <46767c964a%tim@worthy.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.01g (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On 07 Jul, Tim Howarth wrote: > Whilst trying to covert some old Impression Publisher files to Ovation > Pro on a RiscPC fitted with a Viewfinder graphics card the screen update > seems very slow. Can I suggest that you make sure that *all* applets are turned off? It sounds to me as if some external process is considering the text on each line before redrawing it. -- Jeremy C B Nicoll - my opinions are my own. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 10 21:34:38 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152776 for opro ; Tue, 10 Jul 101 21:34:32 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994788327:20:26549:65; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 18:05:27 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2026115; 10 Jul 2001 18:05 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6AI7FE22811 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 19:07:15 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from mail3.svr.pol.co.uk (mail3.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.19]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6AI7Cp22808 for ; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 19:07:12 +0100 Received: from modem-125.arossiach.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.126.253] helo=worthy) by mail3.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 15K1sC-0000jg-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 19:04:37 +0100 Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2001 19:04:10 +0100 From: Tim Howarth To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Screen update on Viewfinder Message-ID: <84d2ff974a%tim@worthy.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a97fc3534Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> X-Organization: Home X-Mailer: Messenger v1.41c for RISC OS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.67 User-Agent: POPstar/2.02 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In message <4a97fc3534Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> Jeremy C B Nicoll wrote: > On 07 Jul, Tim Howarth wrote: > > Whilst trying to covert some old Impression Publisher files to Ovation > > Pro on a RiscPC fitted with a Viewfinder graphics card the screen update > > seems very slow. > > Can I suggest that you make sure that *all* applets are turned off? It > sounds to me as if some external process is considering the text on each > line before redrawing it. Unfortunately update is slow even with no text! -- ___ |im ---- ARM Powered ---- -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed Jul 11 01:14:38 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152785 for opro ; Wed, 11 Jul 101 01:14:34 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994797163:20:21427:66; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 20:32:43 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2021202; 10 Jul 2001 20:32 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6AKYQ623169 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 21:34:26 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from finch-post-11.mail.demon.net (finch-post-11.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.39]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6AKYOp23165 for ; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 21:34:24 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by finch-post-11.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15K4AR-00065q-0B for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 20:31:35 +0000 Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2001 18:08:59 GMT Message-Id: <152771@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Screen update on Viewfinder X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >This is a blank document and I can clearly see the background clearing >down the page. >However I've now noticed that the area outside the default frame appears >almost instantly..... Unless there are lines of text, then there is no way OPro will do anything other than use a RISC OS block fill to fill in an area. Although OPro does sometimes attempt direct screen memory access, this is only when rendering graphics in irregular frames. I said yesterday that OPro might do some intensive drawing to blank out lines (when editing text or flowing), perhaps an easier way to see it would be to mark some text, and either see how fast that redraws when you toggle the window or when you actually do the marking. In days gone by I put a lot of effort into ensuring that OPro screen updates where as fast as those in Impression. >Impression provides a full text frame immediately at any resolution. >As does Zap now :-) Now? I wonder if John Kortinck could be pursuaded to comment? For example maybe he has tuned Viewfinder to work with Impression in some way. I imagine JK has debugging tools which tell him exactly what is going on at any given time with drawing commands. One idea if Viewfinder passes on a lot of small redraw areas instead of the normal as large as possible one, then OPro might be a lot slower than Impression - a large set up time. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed Jul 11 01:14:38 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152784 for opro ; Wed, 11 Jul 101 01:14:34 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994799967:10:24005:65; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 21:19:27 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1023898; 10 Jul 2001 21:19 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6ALLo223335 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 22:21:50 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from scrabble.freeuk.net (scrabble.freeuk.net [212.126.144.6]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6ALLlp23332 for ; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 22:21:47 +0100 Received: from du-006-0112.freeuk.com ([212.126.147.112] helo=freeuk.com) by scrabble.freeuk.net with smtp (Exim 3.12 #2) id 15K4uT-00019p-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 22:19:09 +0100 Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2001 22:10:25 +0100 From: Steve Fryatt To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Screen update on Viewfinder Message-ID: <82df10984a.steve@steve.stevefryatt.org.uk> References: <152740@pilling.demon.co.uk> <391ac2974a%tim@worthy.demon.co.uk> <4a97cad3ffrayd@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a97cad3ffrayd@argonet.co.uk> X-Organization: Home User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.50a (MsgServe/1.50) (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 X-Editor: Zap 1.44 (14 Jan 2001) [TEST 4], ZapEmail 0.25 (20 Sep 2000) test-5 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In message <4a97cad3ffrayd@argonet.co.uk> Ray Dawson wrote: > In article <391ac2974a%tim@worthy.demon.co.uk>, Tim Howarth > wrote: > > > Taking a default A4 document at 100% in a 1488x1116x16Mx85Hz mode, put > > page at top of screen and push bottom up to top, hitting toggle to > > full size and it takes about 0.8 seconds to draw the screen. > > > This is a blank document and I can clearly see the background clearing > > down the page. > > I've just tried it with OP, IP and Viewfinder here and the result is > similar. > > Using 1280 x 1024 x 16M colours, if I fill a standard A4 frame with text > and collapse the window vertically as above, clicking on the full size > toggle opens the OP window to full size immediately - but blank. After a > short delay the text appears, but it does so all at once and not line by > line as Tim suggested. I can get the same, with the default blank document and file of Lorem Ipsum. The window clears immediately, with a white background and a grey rectangle where the frame is. Then the white frame background fills in, one pixel line at a time from the top of the frame. When this is complete, the text is plotted almost instantly on top. Version 2.63 of Ovation Pro. > Using VF 1.31 Same here, 16M colours @ 1280 x 1024. -- Steve Fryatt - Glasgow, Scotland http://www.stevefryatt.org.uk/ or http://www.tardis.ed.ac.uk/~stevef/ http://www.sfryatt.freeuk.com/ -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed Jul 11 01:14:42 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152786 for opro ; Wed, 11 Jul 101 01:14:40 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994799710:20:07068:66; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 21:15:10 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2006824; 10 Jul 2001 21:14 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6ALHJY23296 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 22:17:19 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from warrior-outbound.servers.plus.net ([212.159.14.227]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f6ALHHp23293 for ; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 22:17:17 +0100 Received: (qmail 21146 invoked from network); 10 Jul 2001 21:14:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO tinshill.force9.net) (212.159.21.56) by warrior with SMTP; 10 Jul 2001 21:14:25 -0000 Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2001 22:05:23 +0100 (BST) From: Anthony Hilton Subject: Re: Vertical shift (was Re: Superscript bug) To: Ovation Pro List In-Reply-To: <152742@pilling.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In on Tue 10 Jul, David Pilling wrote: > > >I think it should behave the same regardless of whether lock to grid is > >ticked or not, to move the text relative to the normal baseline, and not > >move the baseline of any unshifted text in the line. > > Ignore the bit about baseline grids. I believe the decision was made to > make it work exactly the opposite way to what you suggest at some stage in > the development - wish I could remember the logic, because interestingly > Impression works the other way. > When trying it I found the result in OPro looks 'wrong' (to my mind) where a paragraph gets, in effect, different leading for lines with vertical shifted text from lines without. Even worse if there are lines with differing values of vertical shift within a paragraph - can't think I'd ever actually use that! > You can of course change the leading if you want the text in one line > to lie on top of another. Yes, my playing with leading showed me that. Until I'd proved it I wondered if there was something in OPro to prevent text overlapping vertically. Anthony Hilton -- ajh@tinshill.f9.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed Jul 11 13:49:13 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152801 for opro ; Wed, 11 Jul 101 13:49:10 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994844137:10:10062:65; Wed, 11 Jul 2001 09:35:37 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1009832; 11 Jul 2001 9:35 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6B9bSX24558 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 11 Jul 2001 10:37:28 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6B9bPp24555 for ; Wed, 11 Jul 2001 10:37:25 +0100 Received: from ypical.demon.co.uk ([158.152.78.65]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 15KGOH-000CLg-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 11 Jul 2001 09:34:41 +0000 Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2001 23:42:54 +0100 From: Fred Bambrough To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Screen update on Viewfinder Message-ID: <575719984a.fred@ypical.demon.co.uk> References: <152771@pilling.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <152771@pilling.demon.co.uk> X-Organization: @ypical User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.50a (MsgServe/1.50) (RISC-OS/4.02) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In message <152771@pilling.demon.co.uk> opro@pilling.demon.co.uk (David Pilling) wrote: [snip] >Impression provides a full text frame immediately at any resolution. >As does Zap now :-) > > Now? > > I wonder if John Kortinck could be pursuaded to comment? For example maybe > he has tuned Viewfinder to work with Impression in some way. [snip] There's a new version of ZapRedraw to improve screen updates with Zap and Viewfinder. JK supplied one of the Zap authors with a Viewfinder to this end, I believe. -- Fred -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed Jul 11 13:49:17 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152803 for opro ; Wed, 11 Jul 101 13:49:14 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994840048:20:29982:70; Wed, 11 Jul 2001 08:27:28 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2029043; 11 Jul 2001 8:26 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6B8QsO24375 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 11 Jul 2001 09:26:54 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.92]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6B8Qpp24372 for ; Wed, 11 Jul 2001 09:26:51 +0100 Received: from mk-net.demon.co.uk ([194.222.12.18] helo=Tonys) by anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15KFHz-0000ua-0Y for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 11 Jul 2001 09:24:07 +0100 Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2001 08:56:23 +0100 From: Tony van der Hoff To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Screen update on Viewfinder Message-ID: <74034c984a.Tony@mk-net.demon.co.uk> References: <152771@pilling.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <152771@pilling.demon.co.uk> X-Organization: CCC User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.10d (MsgServe/1.10) (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On 10 Jul 2001, opro@pilling.demon.co.uk (David Pilling) wrote: > > In days gone by I put a lot of effort into ensuring that OPro screen > updates where as fast as those in Impression. > > >Impression provides a full text frame immediately at any resolution. > >As does Zap now :-) > > Now? > > I wonder if John Kortinck could be pursuaded to comment? For example maybe > he has tuned Viewfinder to work with Impression in some way. > > I imagine JK has debugging tools which tell him exactly what is going on > at any given time with drawing commands. > > One idea if Viewfinder passes on a lot of small redraw areas instead of the > normal as large as possible one, then OPro might be a lot slower than > Impression - a large set up time. > John recently posted on csaa on this subject: ------------------------------------------- Due to a short and fruitful collaboration between Zap maintainer Darren Salt and Windfall Engineering, new versions of Zap's text rendering engine ZapRedraw make use of new hardware accelerated text drawing functions recently added to the ViewFinder software. Making Zap's on screen performance the highest ever seen. Writers and maintainers of text editors, if interested in making their text editor fly, are kindly invited to contact me for details of the relevant API calls. John Kortink Windfall Engineering http://www.windfall.nl ------------------------------------------ May be worth an email or two... -- Tony van der Hoff | MailTo:tony@mk-net.demon.co.uk | MailTo:avanderhoff@iee.org Buckinghamshire, England | http:www.mk-net.demon.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed Jul 11 13:49:25 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152807 for opro ; Wed, 11 Jul 101 13:49:22 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994855438:20:23924:69; Wed, 11 Jul 2001 12:43:58 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2023852; 11 Jul 2001 12:43 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6BCjVq24996 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 11 Jul 2001 13:45:31 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from cmailg2.svr.pol.co.uk (cmailg2.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.195.172]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6BCjSp24993 for ; Wed, 11 Jul 2001 13:45:28 +0100 Received: from modem-35.angband.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.111.35] helo=worthy) by cmailg2.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 15KJKD-0001Y7-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 11 Jul 2001 13:42:42 +0100 Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2001 13:42:19 +0100 From: Tim Howarth To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Screen update on Viewfinder Message-ID: <2b3166984a%tim@worthy.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <152771@pilling.demon.co.uk> X-Organization: Home X-Mailer: Messenger v1.41c for RISC OS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.67 User-Agent: POPstar/2.02 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R In message <152771@pilling.demon.co.uk> opro@pilling.demon.co.uk (David Pilling) wrote: > > >This is a blank document and I can clearly see the background clearing > >down the page. > >However I've now noticed that the area outside the default frame appears > >almost instantly..... > > Unless there are lines of text, then there is no way OPro will do > anything other than use a RISC OS block fill to fill in an area. Viewfinder must be doing something very odd then. I've just done a crude 'movie' of it (540kb, avi, 15fps) http://www.worthy.demon.co.uk/movies/op-vf.avi You can clearly see window furniture appears, then quickly white outside frame, then slowly the white area of the frame background, then quickly the text. Using a transparent frame, even though it actually clears to white, makes the frame background appear as fast as the outside frame white area. (Out of curiosity I just tried an old demo of Ovation 1 and it clears the background instantly.) > I said yesterday that OPro might do some intensive drawing to blank > out lines (when editing text or flowing), perhaps an easier way to > see it would be to mark some text, and either see how fast that redraws > when you toggle the window or when you actually do the marking. Marked text appears quickly, as does unmarked, it is the background drawing/clearing that is particularly slow. > In days gone by I put a lot of effort into ensuring that OPro screen > updates where as fast as those in Impression. I was expecting Impression to suffer with Viewfinder as I know (believe) it does all sorts of dodgy things to improve performance. > I imagine JK has debugging tools which tell him exactly what is going on > at any given time with drawing commands. It would be nice to record what is happening during the "wipe down screen" stage - I tried a screen grabber I have which can be triggered via an (ether)internet event as a result of a message from my PC but that doesn't get processed until all of "wiping" is done. > One idea if Viewfinder passes on a lot of small redraw areas instead of the > normal as large as possible one, then OPro might be a lot slower than Impression - a large set up time. Why would transparent frame background then draw instantly to white whereas a white (any colour) background is slow ? Very odd... -- ___ |im ---- ARM Powered ---- -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed Jul 11 20:10:36 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152814 for opro ; Wed, 11 Jul 101 20:10:34 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994857015:20:12933:70; Wed, 11 Jul 2001 13:10:15 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2125432; 11 Jul 2001 13:09 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6BDBs825132 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 11 Jul 2001 14:11:54 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from smtp1.pandora.be (hercules.telenet-ops.be [195.130.132.33]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f6BDBqp25129 for ; Wed, 11 Jul 2001 14:11:52 +0100 Received: (qmail 4842 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2001 13:09:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO riscpc.be) ([213.118.63.17]) (envelope-sender ) by hercules.telenet-ops.be (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; 11 Jul 2001 13:09:05 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Jan De Poorter To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2001 15:09:07 +0200 Subject: Re: Screen update on Viewfinder Message-ID: <4a9868a532jdp@pandora.be> In-Reply-To: <74034c984a.Tony@mk-net.demon.co.uk> References: <152771@pilling.demon.co.uk> <74034c984a.Tony@mk-net.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.03) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Tony van der Hoff wrote: > John recently posted on csaa on this subject: > ------------------------------------------- > Due to a short and fruitful collaboration between Zap maintainer > Darren Salt and Windfall Engineering, new versions of Zap's text > rendering engine ZapRedraw make use of new hardware accelerated > text drawing functions recently added to the ViewFinder software. > Making Zap's on screen performance the highest ever seen. > Writers and maintainers of text editors, if interested in making > their text editor fly, are kindly invited to contact me for details > of the relevant API calls. > John Kortink Windfall Engineering > http://www.windfall.nl > ------------------------------------------ > May be worth an email or two... Zapredraw 0.40 vf6 is available from the Zap download page. Go to http://www.zap.uk.eu.org/download.html and look on the 'development release site' of Darren Salt. Jan. -- Jan De Poorter Gent - Belgium mailto:jdp@pandora.be -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu Jul 12 13:20:20 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152881 for opro ; Thu, 12 Jul 101 13:20:16 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994904047:10:14300:65; Thu, 12 Jul 2001 02:14:07 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1014276; 12 Jul 2001 2:14 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6C2FVf26585 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 12 Jul 2001 03:15:31 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from finch-post-10.mail.demon.net (finch-post-10.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.38]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6C2FTp26582 for ; Thu, 12 Jul 2001 03:15:29 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by finch-post-10.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15KVxz-0008mw-0A for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 12 Jul 2001 02:12:35 +0000 Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2001 03:10:11 GMT Message-Id: <152874@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Screen update on Viewfinder X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >I've just done a crude 'movie' of it (540kb, avi, 15fps) >http://www.worthy.demon.co.uk/movies/op-vf.avi Great stuff. I've watched it. >You can clearly see window furniture appears, then quickly white outside >frame, then slowly the white area of the frame background, then quickly >the text. True. If you have a big opaque frame in the middle of the page (which is the usual scenario), OPro draws just the 4 small white rectangles around it and then renders the frame. Point being this is quicker than drawing one big rectangle (the page background) and then overdrawing most of it with the frame. Shows that I went to some lengths to optimise things. >Using a transparent frame, even though it actually clears to white, >makes the frame background appear as fast as the outside frame white >area. If the frame is transparent then OPro can't do the trick with the 4 rectangles and will draw the big filled rectangle of the page background. >Why would transparent frame background then draw instantly to white >whereas a white (any colour) background is slow ? Points to the routine for drawing the actual frame fill being slow. I'll have a look at the code and maybe talk to JK. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu Jul 12 13:20:48 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152887 for opro ; Thu, 12 Jul 101 13:20:44 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994923605:20:11753:65; Thu, 12 Jul 2001 07:40:05 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2011670; 12 Jul 2001 7:39 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6C7g1f27119 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 12 Jul 2001 08:42:01 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from cmailg7.svr.pol.co.uk (cmailg7.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.195.177]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6C7fwp27116 for ; Thu, 12 Jul 2001 08:41:58 +0100 Received: from modem-40.anarrima.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.107.40] helo=worthy) by cmailg7.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 15Kb3q-0004f7-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 12 Jul 2001 08:39:00 +0100 Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2001 08:38:00 +0100 From: Tim Howarth To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Screen update on Viewfinder Message-ID: <8d2ace984a%tim@worthy.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <152874@pilling.demon.co.uk> X-Organization: Home X-Mailer: Messenger v1.41c for RISC OS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.67 User-Agent: POPstar/2.02 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In message <152874@pilling.demon.co.uk> opro@pilling.demon.co.uk (David Pilling) wrote: > >You can clearly see window furniture appears, then quickly white outside > >frame, then slowly the white area of the frame background, then quickly > >the text. > > True. If you have a big opaque frame in the middle of the page (which > is the usual scenario), OPro draws just the 4 small white rectangles around it > and then renders the frame. Silly me, just realised you *must* be handling the drawing of the frame background in a sectional manner. Irregular frames ! You can't simply send a rectangle fill as a frame can be any old shape. (Whether OP draws background or sends a set of horizontal line fills I've no idea.) Ahhh, just played with Impression again and turned a frame into an irregular and it too draws slowly. Presumably because Impression differentiates between regular and irregular frames it uses a separate redraw mechanism. At least I've now got Impression to slow down ! > If the frame is transparent then OPro can't do the trick with the 4 > rectangles and will draw the big filled rectangle of the page background. Of course, it doesn't draw the frame background white it's just left white after doing a big rectangular background. > >Why would transparent frame background then draw instantly to white > >whereas a white (any colour) background is slow ? > > Points to the routine for drawing the actual frame fill being slow. It makes more sense now, with a little more thought (on my part!). > I'll have a look at the code and maybe talk to JK. I'm sure he would provide a test Viewfinder - or maybe even open to a bit of barter! When you used a Viewfindered RiscPC a normal one seems somewhat quaint ! -- ___ |im ---- ARM Powered ---- -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu Jul 12 13:30:17 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152893 for opro ; Thu, 12 Jul 101 13:30:13 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994940414:10:05952:70; Thu, 12 Jul 2001 12:20:14 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1101087; 12 Jul 2001 12:19 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6CCKOf27615 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 12 Jul 2001 13:20:24 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from finch-post-12.mail.demon.net (finch-post-12.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.41]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6CCKMp27612 for ; Thu, 12 Jul 2001 13:20:22 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by finch-post-12.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15KfPH-0006wm-0C for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 12 Jul 2001 12:17:23 +0000 Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2001 03:46:35 GMT Message-Id: <152876@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Screen update on Viewfinder X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Consulting the sources. It seems that a filled rectangular frame is filled not by a bbc_rectangle call, but by using the Draw module. I suspect things are done this way for consistency. It raises questions like is all Draw output slow. And how do things play with CC programs, which have their own fast version of the module. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu Jul 12 22:25:50 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152911 for opro ; Thu, 12 Jul 101 22:25:47 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994972536:10:29224:67; Thu, 12 Jul 2001 21:15:36 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id ab1107839; 12 Jul 2001 21:15 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6CLFQq28442 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 12 Jul 2001 22:15:26 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.92]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6CLFOp28439 for ; Thu, 12 Jul 2001 22:15:24 +0100 Received: from omba.demon.co.uk ([158.152.58.5]) by anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15Knkp-0001ex-0Y for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 12 Jul 2001 22:12:14 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Jeremy C B Nicoll To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2001 22:10:43 +0100 Subject: Re: Screen update on Viewfinder Message-ID: <4a991892b9Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <2b3166984a%tim@worthy.demon.co.uk> References: <152771@pilling.demon.co.uk> <2b3166984a%tim@worthy.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.01g (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On 11 Jul, Tim Howarth wrote: > I've just done a crude 'movie' of it (540kb, avi, 15fps) > http://www.worthy.demon.co.uk/movies/op-vf.avi I was curious having read about this effect so I tried to download this too. I'm using !Oregano. The file downloaded into my scrap directory without allowing me to specify where I should put it, then an erro rbox popped up saying there was no appropriate application to handle the file OK? So I clicked on OK and the downloaded file was deleted. Does anyone know how to stop Oregano doing such a stupid thing? What application would have/should have been able to display the movie? How do you create such a movie in the first place? -- Jeremy C B Nicoll - my opinions are my own. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri Jul 13 13:51:26 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152936 for opro ; Fri, 13 Jul 101 13:51:23 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 995005868:10:12155:73; Fri, 13 Jul 2001 06:31:08 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1110514; 13 Jul 2001 6:31 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6D6WEJ29132 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 13 Jul 2001 07:32:14 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from mail11.svr.pol.co.uk (mail11.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.23]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6D6WBp29129 for ; Fri, 13 Jul 2001 07:32:11 +0100 Received: from modem-79.annon-in-gelydh.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.116.79] helo=worthy) by mail11.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 15KwRi-00067r-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Fri, 13 Jul 2001 07:29:02 +0100 Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 07:28:50 +0100 From: Tim Howarth To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Screen update on Viewfinder Message-ID: <75ab4b994a%tim@worthy.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a991892b9Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> X-Organization: Home X-Mailer: Messenger v1.41c for RISC OS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.67 User-Agent: POPstar/2.02 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In message <4a991892b9Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> you wrote: > On 11 Jul, Tim Howarth wrote: > > > I've just done a crude 'movie' of it (540kb, avi, 15fps) > > http://www.worthy.demon.co.uk/movies/op-vf.avi > > Does anyone know how to stop Oregano doing such a stupid thing? No idea ! > What application would have/should have been able to display the movie? Windows Media Player on a PC or Replay on an Acorn if you have MovieFS which translates foreign movie formats. > How do you create such a movie in the first place? I pointed my PC's cheapo webcam at the screen, flipped to display the RiscPC screen and started recording. -- ___ |im ---- ARM Powered ---- -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri Jul 13 13:51:43 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152943 for opro ; Fri, 13 Jul 101 13:51:39 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 995013343:10:27107:71; Fri, 13 Jul 2001 08:35:43 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1026940; 13 Jul 2001 8:35 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6D8ahT29373 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 13 Jul 2001 09:36:43 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from apollo.le.ac.uk (apollo.le.ac.uk [143.210.16.125]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6D8aep29370 for ; Fri, 13 Jul 2001 09:36:40 +0100 Received: from happy.star.le.ac.uk ([143.210.36.58]) by apollo.le.ac.uk with smtp (Exim 3.16 #1) id 15KyOB-0005gc-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Fri, 13 Jul 2001 09:33:31 +0100 Received: (qmail 9567 invoked from network); 13 Jul 2001 08:33:52 -0000 Received: from xmm4.xra.le.ac.uk (143.210.40.54) by happy.star.le.ac.uk with SMTP; 13 Jul 2001 08:33:52 -0000 Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 09:33:34 +0100 (BST) From: Liam Gretton Subject: Re: Screen update on Viewfinder To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk In-Reply-To: <4a991892b9Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Space Research Centre, University of Leicester, UK X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Thu 12 Jul, Jeremy C B Nicoll wrote: > Does anyone know how to stop Oregano doing such a stupid thing? You've got the AVI filetype (&FB2 ?) listed as a runnable in Oregano's choices, but no application's been seen by the filer that's able to open the file once Oregano's downloaded it. Arguably, Oregano should notice this and offer you a save box instead, but otherwise, you can shift-click on the link which will force Oregano to display a save as dialogue box. > What application would have/should have been able to display the movie? MovieFS from Warm Silence Software, if the AVI codec used isn't too recent. -- Liam Gretton ljg@star.le.ac.uk Space Research Centre, http://www.src.le.ac.uk/ Physics and Astronomy Dept, phone +44 (0) 116 223 1039 University of Leicester, fax +44 (0) 116 252 2464 Leicester LE1 7RH, UK http://xmm4.xra.le.ac.uk/ -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri Jul 13 22:39:51 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152979 for opro ; Fri, 13 Jul 101 22:39:47 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 995059789:10:26727:73; Fri, 13 Jul 2001 21:29:49 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1026608; 13 Jul 2001 21:29 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6DLTW330587 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 13 Jul 2001 22:29:32 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.91]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6DLTTp30584 for ; Fri, 13 Jul 2001 22:29:30 +0100 Received: from omba.demon.co.uk ([158.152.58.5]) by anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15LARw-0007Kb-0X for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Fri, 13 Jul 2001 22:26:13 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Jeremy C B Nicoll To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 22:24:34 +0100 Subject: Re: Screen update on Viewfinder Message-ID: <4a999dad46Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <75ab4b994a%tim@worthy.demon.co.uk> References: <4a991892b9Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> <75ab4b994a%tim@worthy.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.01g (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R On 13 Jul, Tim Howarth wrote: > Windows Media Player on a PC or Replay on an Acorn if you have MovieFS > which translates foreign movie formats. Damn! I might have to find a power lead for that PC in the corner... -- Jeremy C B Nicoll - my opinions are my own. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Sat Jul 14 02:08:35 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152982 for opro ; Sat, 14 Jul 101 02:08:34 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 995063076:20:12173:67; Fri, 13 Jul 2001 22:24:36 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2115556; 13 Jul 2001 22:24 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6DMQE630738 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 13 Jul 2001 23:26:14 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.92]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6DMQCp30735 for ; Fri, 13 Jul 2001 23:26:12 +0100 Received: from omba.demon.co.uk ([158.152.58.5]) by anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15LBKo-00044L-0Y for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Fri, 13 Jul 2001 23:22:54 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Jeremy C B Nicoll To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 22:29:04 +0100 Subject: Re: Screen update on Viewfinder Message-ID: <4a999e169eJeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: References: <4a991892b9Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.01g (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On 13 Jul, Liam Gretton wrote: > You've got the AVI filetype (&FB2 ?) listed as a runnable in Oregano's > choices, but no application's been seen by the filer that's able to > open the file once Oregano's downloaded it. FB2 - yes. Runnable - yes (I've asked Castle *why* it is listed thus on the default !Oregano) > Arguably, Oregano should notice this and offer you a save box instead, > but otherwise, you can shift-click on the link which will force Oregano > to display a save as dialogue box. Shift-click may work on a link on an HTML page, but click &/ shift-click are the same think when the link is on a Pluto page. Whether or not an app is able to launch a viewer for an incoming file I do not believe that saving a copy of that file must be done by the viewer application; I've said that to Castle too. -- Jeremy C B Nicoll - my opinions are my own. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Sat Jul 14 14:22:35 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152987 for opro ; Sat, 14 Jul 101 14:22:33 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 995074053:10:24539:70; Sat, 14 Jul 2001 01:27:33 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1128594; 14 Jul 2001 1:27 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6E1T4B31009 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 14 Jul 2001 02:29:04 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from finch-post-10.mail.demon.net (finch-post-10.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.38]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6E1T1p31005 for ; Sat, 14 Jul 2001 02:29:01 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by finch-post-10.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15LEBh-0005oG-0A for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 14 Jul 2001 01:25:41 +0000 Date: Sat, 14 Jul 2001 02:12:29 GMT Message-Id: <152985@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Ovation Pro Script Language Manuals X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro As discussed some time ago, I've had a batch of the Ovation Pro Script Language Reference guide printed. These are primarily of interest to programmers. The material is a slightly updated version of what is on the CD. However the attraction is not the contents but having them in an easy to use package. There was some debate over the format, it turned out to be A5 wirebound (125 pages). The cost is ukp 5 fully inclusive (wherever you are in the world). David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Sat Jul 14 14:22:36 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152988 for opro ; Sat, 14 Jul 101 14:22:33 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 995074057:20:05985:67; Sat, 14 Jul 2001 01:27:37 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2005916; 14 Jul 2001 1:27 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6E1T1031006 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 14 Jul 2001 02:29:01 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from finch-post-10.mail.demon.net (finch-post-10.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.38]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6E1Sxp31001 for ; Sat, 14 Jul 2001 02:28:59 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by finch-post-10.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15LEBf-0005oG-0A for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 14 Jul 2001 01:25:39 +0000 Date: Sat, 14 Jul 2001 02:10:49 GMT Message-Id: <152983@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Screen update on Viewfinder X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro I would swear from previous experience that there is a way of saving an arbitrary url in Oregano. Something like playing it and then going backwards, or maybe just entering the URL and then using the menu to 'save'. (I'm talking here about the case where there's no link to click on) David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Sat Jul 14 14:22:44 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152991 for opro ; Sat, 14 Jul 101 14:22:41 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 995100196:10:19209:68; Sat, 14 Jul 2001 08:43:16 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1107438; 14 Jul 2001 8:43 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6E8hVh31608 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 14 Jul 2001 09:43:31 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from mailout01.sul.t-online.de (mailout01.sul.t-online.com [194.25.134.80]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6E8hRp31605 for ; Sat, 14 Jul 2001 09:43:28 +0100 Received: from fwd07.sul.t-online.de by mailout01.sul.t-online.de with smtp id 15LKy4-00008W-0A; Sat, 14 Jul 2001 10:40:04 +0200 Received: from veni (520042741018-0001@[217.0.115.108]) by fmrl07.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 15LKxy-0H2TtxC; Sat, 14 Jul 2001 10:39:58 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Stefan Bellon To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sat, 14 Jul 2001 10:39:27 +0200 Subject: Re: Ovation Pro Script Language Manuals Message-ID: <4a99db76bcsbellon@sbellon.de> In-Reply-To: <152985@pilling.demon.co.uk> References: <152985@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 Content-Type: text/plain X-Sender: 520042741018-0001@t-dialin.net Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R David Pilling wrote: [snip] > The cost is ukp 5 fully inclusive (wherever you are in the world). How can payment be done from Germany? I have heard that you can't accept EuroCheques anymore in UK. Is this true? What's the easiest way for me (and other people that don't live in the UK) to get hold of a copy? TIA. Greetings, Stefan. -- Stefan Bellon * * PGP 2.6 and GnuPG (OpenPGP) keys available from my home page ... A)bort R)etry G)et a stick and kill it. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Sat Jul 14 14:22:48 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152993 for opro ; Sat, 14 Jul 101 14:22:45 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 995102623:10:11071:65; Sat, 14 Jul 2001 09:23:43 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1122016; 14 Jul 2001 9:23 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6E9PSk31742 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 14 Jul 2001 10:25:28 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from cmailg7.svr.pol.co.uk (cmailg7.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.195.177]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6E9PPp31739 for ; Sat, 14 Jul 2001 10:25:25 +0100 Received: from modem-47.krypton.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.33.175] helo=kerslakej2.freeserve.co.uk) by cmailg7.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 15LLcd-0006rq-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 14 Jul 2001 10:22:00 +0100 Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2001 19:23:58 +0100 (BST) From: "John P. Kerslake" Subject: Oregano To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk In-Reply-To: <4a991892b9Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Organisation name, location. Telephone/Fax? X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Thu 12 Jul, Jeremy C B Nicoll wrote: > On 11 Jul, Tim Howarth wrote: > > > I've just done a crude 'movie' of it (540kb, avi, 15fps) > > http://www.worthy.demon.co.uk/movies/op-vf.avi > > I was curious having read about this effect so I tried to download this > too. I'm using !Oregano. The file downloaded into my scrap directory > without allowing me to specify where I should put it, then an erro rbox > popped up saying there was no appropriate application to handle the file > OK? So I clicked on OK and the downloaded file was deleted. > > Does anyone know how to stop Oregano doing such a stupid thing? > > What application would have/should have been able to display the movie? > > How do you create such a movie in the first place? > I just got the demo version to try it out. It willnot desplay text in the correct places -- J.P. Kerslake B.Sc., F.B.I.S. Pager 07626 - 235878 e-mail Home = johnpercy@kerslakej2.freeserve.co.uk, Dyslexia Rules KO. RiscStation 64 meg 50 ns RAM. 9G HD, Ant INS. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Sat Jul 14 16:31:03 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153010 for opro ; Sat, 14 Jul 101 16:31:02 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 995118997:10:13149:65; Sat, 14 Jul 2001 13:56:37 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1013093; 14 Jul 2001 13:56 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6EDw2832060 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 14 Jul 2001 14:58:02 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from finch-post-10.mail.demon.net (finch-post-10.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.38]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6EDw0p32057 for ; Sat, 14 Jul 2001 14:58:00 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by finch-post-10.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15LPsP-000E1M-0A for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 14 Jul 2001 13:54:33 +0000 Date: Sat, 14 Jul 2001 14:47:17 GMT Message-Id: <153002@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Ovation Pro Script Language Manuals X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >I have heard that you can't accept EuroCheques anymore in UK. Is this true? Yes this is true. My bank (and its the only one that matters for the porpoises of this discussion) changed from handling Eurocheques for free, to charging around 20 quid a time. This is double what they charge for any ordinary cheque drawn on a non-UK bank. So Eurocheques moved from being a very cheap way of handling payments to an expensive one. I wonder if post EMU there is a Euro zone wide clearing system for cheques. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Sat Jul 14 16:31:14 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153014 for opro ; Sat, 14 Jul 101 16:31:12 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 995122316:10:01345:66; Sat, 14 Jul 2001 14:51:56 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1115647; 14 Jul 2001 14:51 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6EErVF32197 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 14 Jul 2001 15:53:31 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from post.mail.nl.demon.net (post-10.mail.nl.demon.net [194.159.73.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6EErSp32194 for ; Sat, 14 Jul 2001 15:53:28 +0100 Received: from [212.238.81.99] (helo=neptune.demon.nl) by post.mail.nl.demon.net with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 15LQk5-0004M9-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 14 Jul 2001 14:50:01 +0000 Date: Sat, 14 Jul 2001 14:36:18 +0200 (BST) From: Nico ter Haar Subject: Re: Ovation Pro Script Language Manuals To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk In-Reply-To: <4a99db76bcsbellon@sbellon.de> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Neptune, the Netherlands. X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In on Sat 14 Jul, Stefan Bellon wrote: > David Pilling wrote: > > [snip] > > > The cost is ukp 5 fully inclusive (wherever you are in the world). > > How can payment be done from Germany? I have heard that you can't > accept EuroCheques anymore in UK. Is this true? What's the easiest way > for me (and other people that don't live in the UK) to get hold of a > copy? > Have your summer holidays in te UK :-) -- Nico ter Haar, StrongARM 202MHz / RISC OS 4 at home! Hoe stel ik mijn netwerk in --> riscos pagina's op de website mailto:nico@neptune.demon.nl http://www.neptune.demon.nl/ -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 17 22:56:19 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153017 for opro ; Tue, 17 Jul 101 22:56:16 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 995130838:10:23459:65; Sat, 14 Jul 2001 17:13:58 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1023378; 14 Jul 2001 17:13 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6EHFfk32496 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 14 Jul 2001 18:15:41 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from gadolinium.btinternet.com (gadolinium.btinternet.com [194.73.73.111]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6EHFdp32493 for ; Sat, 14 Jul 2001 18:15:39 +0100 Received: from [213.122.0.39] (helo=host213-122-0-39) by gadolinium.btinternet.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #9) id 15LSxe-000127-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 14 Jul 2001 18:12:11 +0100 Date: Sat, 14 Jul 2001 15:58:53 +0100 From: Brian Howlett To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Ovation Pro Script Language Manuals Message-ID: References: <153002@pilling.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <153002@pilling.demon.co.uk> X-Organization: The Terry Wogan Home for the Bewildered User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.50a (MsgServe/1.50) (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.04-pre1 X-Computer: Acorn RiscPC SA-110 X-no-markup: yes X-Editor: Zap 1.44 (14 Jan 2001) [TEST 4], ZapEmail 0.25 (19 Feb 2001) test-6 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro While perusing the newsgroup, I chanced upon the following comment(s) by David Pilling: [snip] > > So Eurocheques moved from being a very cheap way of handling payments > to an expensive one. > > I wonder if post EMU there is a Euro zone wide clearing system for > cheques. > I believe you can open UK bank accounts in Euros, which would allow you to handle cheques issued in that currency. I've no idea of the costs involved, though, but it would probably be worth asking your bank for info. -- Brian Howlett ------------------------------------------------- Watch out... ...you might get what you're after... -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 17 22:56:20 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153018 for opro ; Tue, 17 Jul 101 22:56:16 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 995124604:20:15000:65; Sat, 14 Jul 2001 15:30:04 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2126401; 14 Jul 2001 15:29 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6EFVgV32326 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 14 Jul 2001 16:31:42 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from hose.mail.pipex.net (hose.mail.pipex.net [158.43.128.58]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f6EDfop32031 for ; Sat, 14 Jul 2001 14:41:50 +0100 Received: (qmail 7790 invoked from network); 14 Jul 2001 13:38:23 -0000 Received: from useraw16.uk.uudial.com (HELO localhost) (62.188.138.162) by smtp-4.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; 14 Jul 2001 13:38:23 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Mark Fraser To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sat, 14 Jul 2001 09:47:01 +0100 Subject: Re: Screen update on Viewfinder Message-ID: <4a99dc2827mfraser@ukgateway.net> In-Reply-To: <4a991892b9Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> References: <152771@pilling.demon.co.uk> <2b3166984a%tim@worthy.demon.co.uk> <4a991892b9Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <4a991892b9Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk>, Jeremy C B Nicoll wrote: > On 11 Jul, Tim Howarth wrote: > > I've just done a crude 'movie' of it (540kb, avi, 15fps) > > http://www.worthy.demon.co.uk/movies/op-vf.avi > I was curious having read about this effect so I tried to download this > too. I'm using !Oregano. The file downloaded into my scrap directory > without allowing me to specify where I should put it, then an erro rbox > popped up saying there was no appropriate application to handle the file > OK? So I clicked on OK and the downloaded file was deleted. Try going to http://www.worthy.demon.co.uk/movies/ and clicking on the op-vf.avi file. -- How's it going, Mr. Peterson? Poor. I'm sorry to hear that. No, I mean pour. ___________________________________________ |\ /| ark Fraser /mfraser@ukgateway.net Mobile: 07977820478 | \/ | Somerset /www.mfraser.ukgateway.net ICQ:19835705 | |__________/Acorn SA RISC PC You know what the sig means! -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 17 22:56:23 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153019 for opro ; Tue, 17 Jul 101 22:56:20 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 995156260:10:06979:66; Sun, 15 Jul 2001 00:17:40 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1112326; 15 Jul 2001 0:17 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6F0H3600629 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 15 Jul 2001 01:17:03 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from anchor-post-30.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-30.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.88]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6F0H1p00626 for ; Sun, 15 Jul 2001 01:17:01 +0100 Received: from omba.demon.co.uk ([158.152.58.5]) by anchor-post-30.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15LZXN-0006wB-0U for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sun, 15 Jul 2001 01:13:29 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Jeremy C B Nicoll To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2001 00:45:26 +0100 Subject: Re: Ovation Pro Script Language Manuals Message-ID: <4a9a2e68f3Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <153002@pilling.demon.co.uk> References: <153002@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.01g (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On 14 Jul, David Pilling wrote: > >I have heard that you can't accept EuroCheques anymore in UK. Is this > >true? > Yes this is true. Paul Vigay, eg, uses www.uksharereg.com for this sort of thing; I realise that they take a commission, but I for one have no problem with paying extra to cover that provided I can set up an order online. (In this case I don't need the manual as I've printed the whole thing already). -- Jeremy C B Nicoll - my opinions are my own. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 17 22:56:34 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153024 for opro ; Tue, 17 Jul 101 22:56:30 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 995156266:20:18416:65; Sun, 15 Jul 2001 00:17:46 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2103331; 15 Jul 2001 0:17 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6F0HQN00641 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 15 Jul 2001 01:17:26 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from anchor-post-30.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-30.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.88]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6F0HNp00638 for ; Sun, 15 Jul 2001 01:17:23 +0100 Received: from omba.demon.co.uk ([158.152.58.5]) by anchor-post-30.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15LZXj-0006wB-0U for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sun, 15 Jul 2001 01:13:52 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Jeremy C B Nicoll To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2001 00:57:01 +0100 Subject: Re: Oregano Message-ID: <4a9a2f784cJeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: References: <4a991892b9Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.01g (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On 13 Jul, John P. Kerslake wrote: > On Thu 12 Jul, Jeremy C B Nicoll wrote: > > OK? So I clicked on OK and the downloaded file was deleted. > > > > Does anyone know how to stop Oregano doing such a stupid thing? > > > > What application would have/should have been able to display the > > movie? > > > > How do you create such a movie in the first place? > > > I just got the demo version to try it out. It will not display text in > the correct places I'm sorry - are you replying to my questions or something else? I don't understand what "demo version" you mean nor what text it is supposed to be displaying? -- Jeremy C B Nicoll - my opinions are my own. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 17 22:56:39 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153026 for opro ; Tue, 17 Jul 101 22:56:37 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 995156267:20:18419:65; Sun, 15 Jul 2001 00:17:47 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2103332; 15 Jul 2001 0:17 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6F0HJa00635 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 15 Jul 2001 01:17:19 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from anchor-post-30.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-30.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.88]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6F0HGp00631 for ; Sun, 15 Jul 2001 01:17:16 +0100 Received: from omba.demon.co.uk ([158.152.58.5]) by anchor-post-30.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15LZXb-0006wB-0U for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sun, 15 Jul 2001 01:13:45 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Jeremy C B Nicoll To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2001 00:53:03 +0100 Subject: Re: Screen update on Viewfinder Message-ID: <4a9a2f1b4fJeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a99dc2827mfraser@ukgateway.net> References: <152771@pilling.demon.co.uk> <2b3166984a%tim@worthy.demon.co.uk> <4a991892b9Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> <4a99dc2827mfr User-Agent: Pluto/2.01g (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On 14 Jul, Mark Fraser wrote: > Try going to http://www.worthy.demon.co.uk/movies/ and clicking on the > op-vf.avi file. That doesn't make any difference, !O still downloads the file into a scrap file without asking me where I'd want to put it. -- Jeremy C B Nicoll - my opinions are my own. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 17 22:56:56 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153033 for opro ; Tue, 17 Jul 101 22:56:55 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 995197517:10:27535:70; Sun, 15 Jul 2001 11:45:17 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1128672; 15 Jul 2001 11:45 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6FBk8N01770 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 15 Jul 2001 12:46:08 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from smtp2.pandora.be (tartarus.telenet-ops.be [195.130.132.34]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f6FBk5p01767 for ; Sun, 15 Jul 2001 12:46:05 +0100 Received: (qmail 18530 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2001 11:42:28 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO riscpc.be) ([213.118.63.17]) (envelope-sender ) by tartarus.telenet-ops.be (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for ; 15 Jul 2001 11:42:28 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Jan De Poorter To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2001 13:42:28 +0200 Subject: Re: Screen update on Viewfinder Message-ID: <4a9a700e45jdp@pandora.be> In-Reply-To: <4a9a2f1b4fJeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> References: <152771@pilling.demon.co.uk> <2b3166984a%tim@worthy.demon.co.uk> <4a991892b9Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> <4a99dc2827mfr User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.03) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Jeremy C B Nicoll wrote: > On 14 Jul, Mark Fraser wrote: > > Try going to http://www.worthy.demon.co.uk/movies/ and clicking > > on the op-vf.avi file. > That doesn't make any difference, !O still downloads the file into > a scrap file without asking me where I'd want to put it. Try shift-clicking on the op-vf.avi file. Jan. -- Jan De Poorter Gent - Belgium mailto:jdp@pandora.be -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 17 22:57:01 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153036 for opro ; Tue, 17 Jul 101 22:57:00 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 995218383:10:29508:130; Sun, 15 Jul 2001 17:33:03 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1122986; 15 Jul 2001 17:32 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6FHYRM02346 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 15 Jul 2001 18:34:27 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from mail2.svr.pol.co.uk (mail2.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.210]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6FHYPp02343 for ; Sun, 15 Jul 2001 18:34:25 +0100 Received: from modem-206.manganese.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.24.206] helo=kerslakej2.freeserve.co.uk) by mail2.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 15Lpj9-0001xD-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sun, 15 Jul 2001 18:30:43 +0100 Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2001 10:48:54 +0100 (BST) From: "John P. Kerslake" Subject: Re: Oregano To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk In-Reply-To: <4a9a2f784cJeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Organisation name, location. Telephone/Fax? X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Sun 15 Jul, Jeremy C B Nicoll wrote: > On 13 Jul, John P. Kerslake wrote: > > On Thu 12 Jul, Jeremy C B Nicoll wrote: > > > > OK? So I clicked on OK and the downloaded file was deleted. > > > > > > Does anyone know how to stop Oregano doing such a stupid thing? > > > > > > What application would have/should have been able to display the > > > movie? > > > > > > How do you create such a movie in the first place? > > > > > I just got the demo version to try it out. It will not display text in > > the correct places > > I'm sorry - are you replying to my questions or something else? I don't > understand what "demo version" you mean nor what text it is supposed to > be displaying? Sorry i just got the demo version of Oregano. It dispalyes the text all scrambled on every site i have tried. I think I will st -- J.P. Kerslake B.Sc., F.B.I.S. Pager 07626 - 235878 e-mail Home = johnpercy@kerslakej2.freeserve.co.uk, Dyslexia Rules KO. RiscStation 64 meg 50 ns RAM. 9G HD, Ant INS. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 17 22:57:05 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153037 for opro ; Tue, 17 Jul 101 22:57:02 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 995236861:10:23423:66; Sun, 15 Jul 2001 22:41:01 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1124906; 15 Jul 2001 22:40 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6FMggf03046 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 15 Jul 2001 23:42:42 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from scrabble.freeuk.net (scrabble.freeuk.net [212.126.144.6]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6FMgdp03043 for ; Sun, 15 Jul 2001 23:42:39 +0100 Received: from du-002-0233.freeuk.com ([212.126.156.233] helo=freeuk.com) by scrabble.freeuk.net with smtp (Exim 3.12 #2) id 15LuXL-0006ru-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sun, 15 Jul 2001 23:38:56 +0100 Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2001 23:27:20 +0100 From: Steve Fryatt To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Oregano Message-ID: <7a18ab9a4a.steve@steve.stevefryatt.org.uk> References: In-Reply-To: X-Organization: Home User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.50a (MsgServe/1.50) (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 X-Editor: Zap 1.44 (14 Jan 2001) [TEST 4], ZapEmail 0.25 (20 Sep 2000) test-5 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On 15 Jul, in message "John P. Kerslake" wrote: > Sorry i just got the demo version of Oregano. It dispalyes the text all > scrambled on every site i have tried. In which case it's not been installed properly. -- Steve Fryatt - Glasgow, Scotland http://www.stevefryatt.org.uk/ or http://www.tardis.ed.ac.uk/~stevef/ http://www.sfryatt.freeuk.com/ -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 17 22:57:30 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153046 for opro ; Tue, 17 Jul 101 22:57:25 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 995225030:20:21332:64; Sun, 15 Jul 2001 19:23:50 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2021199; 15 Jul 2001 19:23 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6FJPYn02572 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 15 Jul 2001 20:25:34 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from mail2.svr.pol.co.uk (mail2.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.210]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6FJPWp02569 for ; Sun, 15 Jul 2001 20:25:32 +0100 Received: from modem-684.blastoise.dialup.pol.co.uk ([217.135.34.172] helo=modem-684) by mail2.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 15LrSg-0001EP-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sun, 15 Jul 2001 20:21:50 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Ray Dawson To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2001 20:21:11 +0100 Subject: Re: Oregano Message-ID: <4a9a9a0d77rayd@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: References: <4a9a2f784cJeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 Organization: MagRay Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article , John P. Kerslake wrote: > > > I just got the demo version to try it out. It will not display text > > > in the correct places > > > > I'm sorry - are you replying to my questions or something else? I > > don't understand what "demo version" you mean nor what text it is > > supposed to be displaying? > Sorry i just got the demo version of Oregano. It dispalyes the text all > scrambled on every site i have tried. I think I will stick to fresco & > webster. This is a problem which occurs from time to time, but quitting Oregano and reloading usually sorts it out. *RMKill XTTFont before reloading helps as it's the fontmanager that gets screwed up. Don't let it put you off Oregano as it doesn't happen often and is fixable. Hopefully it will go in the next release. Cheers, Ray D -- ..===================================. | M a g R a y Document Services | Ray Dawson Tel: 020 8864 7208 | the audio and braille specialists | rayd@argonet.co.uk '===================================' http://www.magray.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 17 22:57:34 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153047 for opro ; Tue, 17 Jul 101 22:57:32 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 995226131:20:14862:78; Sun, 15 Jul 2001 19:42:11 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2014621; 15 Jul 2001 19:41 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6FJhrr02692 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 15 Jul 2001 20:43:53 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from sand2.global.net.uk (sand2.global.net.uk [195.147.246.100]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6FJhop02689 for ; Sun, 15 Jul 2001 20:43:50 +0100 Received: from pb9s11a07.client.global.net.uk ([195.147.235.186] helo=margetts.globalnet.co.uk) by sand2.global.net.uk with smtp (Exim 3.16 #1) id 15LrkO-00030f-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sun, 15 Jul 2001 20:40:08 +0100 Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2001 20:38:35 +0100 (BST) From: Peter Margetts Subject: Re: Oregano To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=ISO-8859-1 X-Organization: Organisation name, location. Telephone/Fax? X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] X-MIME-Autoconverted: from QUOTED-PRINTABLE to 8bit by omega.barnet.ac.uk id f6FJhpp02690 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by omega.barnet.ac.uk id f6FJhrs02692 In on Sun 15 Jul, John P. Kerslake wrote: large snip > Sorry i just got the demo version of Oregano. It dispalyes the text all= scrambled on e > very site i have tried. I think I will stick to fresco & webster.=20 Don't give up so easily, John. I have Fresco, Webster and Oregano. Oregan= o does still have its faults, but the Javascript implementation is much better than Fr= esco and so allows me to access sites such as HSBC's online banking. Fresco can't= handle it. I occasionally look at Webster if the other two fail to render a site. Oregano's major fault is the absence of a local cache. A new version ava= ilable soon? from Castle. I thought it well worth =A350 to be able to do online= banking. Not sure why your demo is scrambling text, but I bought the full version = at=20 Wakefield 2000 and upgraded it immediately via the website as per instruc= tions. Sorry this is OT. Pete --=20 Pete & Mitzi Margetts An oasis of Kiwi Kulture in the English Desert! =20 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 17 22:58:42 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153079 for opro ; Tue, 17 Jul 101 22:58:41 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 995367755:20:09495:64; Tue, 17 Jul 2001 11:02:35 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2009134; 17 Jul 2001 11:02 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6HB0Mb06157 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 17 Jul 2001 12:00:22 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6HB0Jp06154 for ; Tue, 17 Jul 2001 12:00:19 +0100 Received: from snave.demon.co.uk ([158.152.89.120]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 15MSWT-0001hE-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 17 Jul 2001 10:56:13 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Jack Evans To: Ovation Pro List Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2001 11:54:14 +0100 Subject: JPEGs in OPro Message-ID: <4a9b734fa6jack@snave.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: References: User-Agent: Pluto/2.02b (RISC-OS/4.02) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro I believe it is normal to be able to load JPEGs directly into OPro frames yet I cannot (either with V2.64 or earlier) unless ImageFS has already been loaded: the manual doesn't seem to give any guidance. If so, what is the missing factor? The info might be relevant to another problem I'm chasing. JPEG halftones in OP documents have suddenly decided to print out near-black on my Kyocera Postscript laser printer unless the PS button in the Print>Separations>Screen is OFF, which is a setting I would not expect to be concerned with as I'm not trying to produce separations. Regards Jack -- Jack Evans Bristol UK Authorised Installer RISC OS4 mailto:jack@snave.demon.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 17 22:58:50 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153083 for opro ; Tue, 17 Jul 101 22:58:49 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 995383004:20:07326:66; Tue, 17 Jul 2001 15:16:44 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2107477; 17 Jul 2001 15:16 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6HFHqZ06575 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 17 Jul 2001 16:17:52 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.91]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6HFHop06572 for ; Tue, 17 Jul 2001 16:17:50 +0100 Received: from snave.demon.co.uk ([158.152.89.120]) by anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15MWXX-0000MJ-0X for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 17 Jul 2001 16:13:35 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Jack Evans To: Ovation Pro List Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2001 15:12:20 +0100 Subject: JPEGs in OPro Message-ID: <4a9b8572ddjack@snave.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02b (RISC-OS/4.02) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by omega.barnet.ac.uk id f6HFHqa06575 On 17 Jul, jack@snave.demon.co.uk wrote: > I believe it is normal to be able to load JPEGs directly into OPro > frames yet I cannot (either with V2.64 or earlier) unless ImageFS has > already been loaded: the manual doesn't seem to give any guidance. > If so, what is the missing factor? This query still stands > The info might be relevant to another problem I'm chasing. JPEG > halftones in OP documents have suddenly decided to print out > near-black on my Kyocera Postscript laser printer unless the PS > button in the Print>Separations>Screen is OFF, which is a setting I > would not expect to be concerned with as I'm not trying to produce > separations. But this one is solved.=A0It's a clashing applet - apparently !ColSup. When that's loaded, the problem returns even tho' the Print setup button in the Print window is not depressed, ie one hasn't ventured into 'Separations' territory. Regards Jack --=20 Jack Evans Bristol UK Authorised Installer RISC OS4 mailto:jack@snave.demon.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 17 22:58:55 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153085 for opro ; Tue, 17 Jul 101 22:58:54 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 995392562:20:25910:64; Tue, 17 Jul 2001 17:56:02 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2025699; 17 Jul 2001 17:55 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6HHw2p06936 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 17 Jul 2001 18:58:02 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6HHvxp06932 for ; Tue, 17 Jul 2001 18:57:59 +0100 Received: from [62.188.131.36] (helo=RiscPC) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 15MYxV-0005GS-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 17 Jul 2001 18:48:34 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Steven Pampling To: Ovation Pro List Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2001 17:59:46 +0100 Subject: Re: JPEGs in OPro Message-ID: <4a9b94c6dcsteve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a9b734fa6jack@snave.demon.co.uk> References: <4a9b734fa6jack@snave.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <4a9b734fa6jack@snave.demon.co.uk>, Jack Evans wrote: > I believe it is normal to be able to load JPEGs directly into OPro frames > yet I cannot (either with V2.64 or earlier) unless ImageFS has already > been loaded: the manual doesn't seem to give any guidance. > If so, what is the missing factor? With ImageFS loaded OP is presented with a sprite to load into the frame, without ImageFS OP tries to load the JPEG using (IIRC) the SpriteExtend module. What version of SpriteExtend do you have loaded on your system? -- Steve Pampling -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 17 22:58:59 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153087 for opro ; Tue, 17 Jul 101 22:58:58 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 995401999:20:01362:64; Tue, 17 Jul 2001 20:33:19 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2117383; 17 Jul 2001 20:33 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6HKZFn07241 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 17 Jul 2001 21:35:15 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6HKZDp07238 for ; Tue, 17 Jul 2001 21:35:13 +0100 Received: from [62.188.15.99] (helo=62.188.15.99) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 15MbPi-0001xe-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 17 Jul 2001 21:25:50 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: David Breakwell To: Ovation Pro List Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2001 21:14:28 +0000 (GMT) Subject: Re: JPEGs in OPro Message-ID: <4a9bac1889davidb@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a9b8572ddjack@snave.demon.co.uk> References: <4a9b8572ddjack@snave.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02b (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R In article <4a9b8572ddjack@snave.demon.co.uk>, Jack Evans wrote: > > I believe it is normal to be able to load JPEGs directly into OPro > > frames yet I cannot (either with V2.64 or earlier) unless ImageFS has > > already been loaded: the manual doesn't seem to give any guidance. > > If so, what is the missing factor? > This query still stands What version of RISC OS are you using? -- --. --. --. --. : : --- --- .---------------------------------------------. |_| |_| | _ | | | | |_ | |Internet provider for all Acorn RISC machines| | | |\ | | | | |\| | | '---------------------------------------------' | | | \ |_| |_| | | |__ | davidb@argonet.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed Jul 18 14:50:41 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153120 for opro ; Wed, 18 Jul 101 14:50:39 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 995423334:10:09605:64; Wed, 18 Jul 2001 02:28:54 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1009470; 18 Jul 2001 2:28 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6I2Ugp07733 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 18 Jul 2001 03:30:42 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from finch-post-10.mail.demon.net (finch-post-10.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.38]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6I2Uep07730 for ; Wed, 18 Jul 2001 03:30:40 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by finch-post-10.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15Mh2h-0003Nx-0A for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 18 Jul 2001 02:26:27 +0000 Date: Wed, 18 Jul 2001 03:19:57 GMT Message-Id: <153118@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: JPEGs in OPro X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >I believe it is normal to be able to load JPEGs directly into OPro frames >yet I cannot (either with V2.64 or earlier) unless ImageFS has already >been loaded: the manual doesn't seem to give any guidance. See the CD Guide document. It should (will) load JPEG's. Two things might stop it, you having too old a version of RISC OS (the SpriteExtend module being older than 0.99) or you having tweeked your copy to not load JPEG's. The file !OvnPro.Autorun.!Custom contains the script language that controls this. >The info might be relevant to another problem I'm chasing. JPEG halftones >in OP documents have suddenly decided to print out near-black on my >Kyocera Postscript laser printer unless the PS button in the >Print>Separations>Screen is OFF, which is a setting I would not expect to >be concerned with as I'm not trying to produce separations. Its been discussed here before. The solution is to set up the Post Script screening settings on the Print dialogue box correctly. Its been a bit of a saga for which I'm sorry, but this is the solution. Removing the colour supplement is not a good idea. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed Jul 18 17:59:08 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153146 for opro ; Wed, 18 Jul 101 17:59:04 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 995474051:20:10709:64; Wed, 18 Jul 2001 16:34:11 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2125076; 18 Jul 2001 16:33 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6IGXtq08991 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 18 Jul 2001 17:33:55 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6IGXrp08988 for ; Wed, 18 Jul 2001 17:33:53 +0100 Received: from [62.188.133.84] (helo=RiscPC) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 15Mu7V-0001FK-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 18 Jul 2001 17:24:17 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Steven Pampling To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Wed, 18 Jul 2001 08:33:09 +0100 Subject: Re: JPEGs in OPro Message-ID: <4a9be4bcf9steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <153118@pilling.demon.co.uk> References: <153118@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <153118@pilling.demon.co.uk>, David Pilling wrote: > See the CD Guide document. It should (will) load JPEG's. > Two things might stop it, you having too old a version of RISC OS > (the SpriteExtend module being older than 0.99) IIRC 0.99 is available in the copy of the original Acorn web site on ROL's site. I also seem to recall that it works with older copies of RO. -- Steve Pampling -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 23 22:24:25 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153273 for opro ; Mon, 23 Jul 101 22:24:23 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 995745285:10:18722:64; Sat, 21 Jul 2001 19:54:45 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1018610; 21 Jul 2001 19:54 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6LJtaQ15649 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 21 Jul 2001 20:55:36 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from mail6.svr.pol.co.uk (mail6.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.212]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6LJtOp15646 for ; Sat, 21 Jul 2001 20:55:34 +0100 Received: from modem-235.arkansas.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.55.235] helo=beeston12) by mail6.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 15O2la-0002Vf-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 21 Jul 2001 20:50:23 +0100 Date: Sat, 21 Jul 2001 20:51:46 +0100 From: Robin Phillips To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Type over-riding the margin, problem Message-ID: <51deb39d4a%rphillips@beeston12.freeserve.co.uk> X-Organization: home X-Mailer: Messenger v1.41d for RISC OS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.64b User-Agent: POPstar/2.03 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Dear colleagues, Can I ask for some help with a problem in Ovation Pro 2.63. I have a document where the margin has been set by a frame on the master page, and I am entering text into it, with enhanced justification and auto hyphenation switched on. Full justification is on. There are two places where a word which has been hyphenated by the system has over-ridden the right margin. This not only appears so on screen, but has also printed out on peper in exactly the same way. What has gone wrong with these two lines, and how should I correct it? Thanks in advance, Robin. -- Robin Phillips, 1, Newcastle Avenue, Beeston, Notts., NG9 1BT; Phone: +44 (0)115 922 4930 E-mail: rphillips@beeston12.freeserve.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 23 22:26:04 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153305 for opro ; Mon, 23 Jul 101 22:26:02 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 995906424:20:29412:65; Mon, 23 Jul 2001 16:40:24 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2122604; 23 Jul 2001 16:40 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6NGYqd18980 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 23 Jul 2001 17:34:52 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from obelix.spectraweb.ch (obelix.plusnet.ch [194.158.230.8]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6NGYmp18977 for ; Mon, 23 Jul 2001 17:34:49 +0100 Received: from janvredenburchsmile.ch (abo-be-1-2-dialup-59.spectraweb.ch [194.230.117.59]) by obelix.spectraweb.ch (8.9.3/8.9.3/SuSE Linux 8.9.3-0.1) with SMTP id SAA19680 for ; Mon, 23 Jul 2001 18:29:12 +0200 Date: Mon, 23 Jul 2001 18:25:15 +0200 (BST) From: Jhr JMAH van Vredenburch Subject: Re: Type over-riding the margin, problem To: OVATIONP-L In-Reply-To: <51deb39d4a%rphillips@beeston12.freeserve.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: CIC member; Secretariaat St. Van Vredenburch X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R On Sat 21 Jul, Robin Phillips wrote: snip > ............. There are two places where a word > which has been hyphenated by the system has over-ridden the right margin. > This not only appears so on screen, but has also printed out on peper in > exactly the same way. Does this problem remain if you save your document as a DDL file and load it back in again? JohnvV -- JM van Vredenburch, CH - 6006 Luzern **new email address** >From 29/06/2001 email: janvredenburch@smile.ch .. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 24 03:42:04 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153345 for opro ; Tue, 24 Jul 101 03:42:00 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 995925653:10:14429:65; Mon, 23 Jul 2001 22:00:53 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1111648; 23 Jul 2001 22:00 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6NM4op19488 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 23 Jul 2001 23:04:50 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from mail11.svr.pol.co.uk (mail11.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.23]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6NM4mp19485 for ; Mon, 23 Jul 2001 23:04:48 +0100 Received: from modem-240.fluorine.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.8.240] helo=beeston12) by mail11.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 15OnjS-00062U-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Mon, 23 Jul 2001 22:59:20 +0100 Date: Mon, 23 Jul 2001 19:03:45 +0100 From: Robin Phillips To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Type over-riding the margin, problem Message-ID: In-Reply-To: X-Organization: home X-Mailer: Messenger v1.41d for RISC OS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.64b User-Agent: POPstar/2.03 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Dear John vV, In message you wrote: > On Sat 21 Jul, Robin Phillips wrote: > > snip > > > ............. There are two places where a word > > which has been hyphenated by the system has over-ridden the right margin. > > This not only appears so on screen, but has also printed out on peper in > > exactly the same way. > > > Does this problem remain if you save your document as a DDL file and > load it back in again? I don't usually save anything in the DDL format, but I have now tried what you suggested. Not ONLY does the fault still display, but 2 other lines seem to be suffering from the same trouble too! I look forward to your further comments, and will obviously supply the actual file as an attachment if you wish. Nothing confidential in it. Best wishes, Robin. -- Robin Phillips, 1, Newcastle Avenue, Beeston, Notts., NG9 1BT; Phone: +44 (0)115 922 4930 E-mail: rphillips@beeston12.freeserve.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 24 13:45:29 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153358 for opro ; Tue, 24 Jul 101 13:45:27 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 995958086:10:15249:64; Tue, 24 Jul 2001 07:01:26 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1015074; 24 Jul 2001 7:01 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6O765o20327 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 24 Jul 2001 08:06:05 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6O763p20324 for ; Tue, 24 Jul 2001 08:06:03 +0100 Received: from [62.188.17.198] (helo=62.188.17.198) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 15Ow5r-0003EE-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 24 Jul 2001 07:55:00 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: David Breakwell To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Tue, 24 Jul 2001 07:52:36 +0000 (GMT) Subject: Saving files as RTF Message-ID: <4a9efd88cedavidb@argonet.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02b (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >> I remember David saying there was an applet to save out as rtf, but have >> not managed to find it. Any help or views on its efficiency? >> MArk You need !MakeRTF for this - its currently at version 3.04a and deals with most text attributes, styles and fonts. Its available direct from me at the address below and is 'careware' so if you find it useful a donation to my Scout Group should be considered. I'e mailed you a copy - le me know how you get on. David -- --. --. --. --. : : --- --- .---------------------------------------------. |_| |_| | _ | | | | |_ | |Internet provider for all Acorn RISC machines| | | |\ | | | | |\| | | '---------------------------------------------' | | | \ |_| |_| | | |__ | davidb@argonet.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 24 13:46:13 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153362 for opro ; Tue, 24 Jul 101 13:46:12 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 995942432:20:07891:64; Tue, 24 Jul 2001 02:40:32 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2007588; 24 Jul 2001 2:40 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6O2jVQ19938 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 24 Jul 2001 03:45:31 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from tvout.mail.uk.easynet.net (tvout.mail.uk.easynet.net [194.6.96.5]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6MCrRp16883 for ; Sun, 22 Jul 2001 13:53:27 +0100 Received: from ukonline.co.uk (tnt-1-244.easynet.co.uk [195.40.206.244]) by tvout.mail.uk.easynet.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 80DA762EE6 for ; Sun, 22 Jul 2001 13:48:05 +0100 (BST) Date: Sun, 22 Jul 2001 13:50:28 +0100 From: mark stephens To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Saving files as rtf Message-ID: <0322119e4a.markee@idrsolutions.com> References: <51deb39d4a%rphillips@beeston12.freeserve.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <51deb39d4a%rphillips@beeston12.freeserve.co.uk> X-Organization: IDRsolutions User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.50a (MsgServe/1.50) (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro I remember David saying there was an applet to save out as rtf, but have not managed to find it. Any help or views on its efficiency? MArk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed Jul 25 02:07:04 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153402 for opro ; Wed, 25 Jul 101 02:07:01 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 996016026:20:29981:64; Tue, 24 Jul 2001 23:07:06 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2113031; 24 Jul 2001 23:06 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6ON6R521614 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 25 Jul 2001 00:06:27 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from technetium.cix.co.uk (technetium.cix.co.uk [194.153.0.53]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6ON6Pp21611 for ; Wed, 25 Jul 2001 00:06:25 +0100 Received: (from cix@localhost) by technetium.cix.co.uk (8.11.2/8.11.2) id f6ON0Xd26925 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 25 Jul 2001 00:00:33 +0100 (BST) X-Envelope-From: Date: Wed, 25 Jul 2001 00:00 +0100 (BST) From:(E J Phillips) Subject: Fonts To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Cc: ejphillips@cix.compulink.co.uk Message-Id: X-Ameol-Version: 2.52.2000, Windows 98 4.10.2222 ( A ) Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Royal Mail specify Courier, Courier New or Brougham as ideal fonts to be read by their sorting equipment, alternatively Helvetica,Avant Garde, Franklin Gothic, Arial, Avalon or Frankfurt Gothic. What RiscPC (EFF) fonts are equivalent to these John Phillips. Cumbria in the North West -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed Jul 25 14:13:47 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153406 for opro ; Wed, 25 Jul 101 14:13:43 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 996049905:20:23245:67; Wed, 25 Jul 2001 08:31:45 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2105502; 25 Jul 2001 8:31 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6P8aLI22358 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 25 Jul 2001 09:36:21 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from daffodil.csv.warwick.ac.uk (root@daffodil.csv.warwick.ac.uk [137.205.192.30]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6P8aIp22355 for ; Wed, 25 Jul 2001 09:36:18 +0100 Received: from pansy.csv.warwick.ac.uk (root@pansy [137.205.192.19]) by daffodil.csv.warwick.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6P8UTq29917 for ; Wed, 25 Jul 2001 09:30:31 +0100 (BST) Received: from TREVOR ([137.205.186.55]) by pansy.csv.warwick.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f6P8UTo23849 for ; Wed, 25 Jul 2001 09:30:29 +0100 (BST) From: "Nick Kaijaks" To: Subject: RE: Fonts Date: Wed, 25 Jul 2001 09:26:51 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >Royal Mail specify Courier, Courier New or Brougham as ideal fonts to be >read by their sorting equipment, alternatively Helvetica,Avant Garde, >Franklin Gothic, Arial, Avalon or Frankfurt Gothic. What RiscPC (EFF) >fonts are equivalent to these Original foundries' versions on the left, RISC OS foundries/names on the right: Courier (Bitstream), Courier New (Monotyype), Brougham (Brother) = Corpus (Acorn) Helvetica (Linotype/Adobe), Arial (Monotype) = Homerton (Acorn), Swiss (EFF) Avant Garde (ITC), Avalon (Corel) = AvantG (CC), ITC Avant Garde (EFF) Franklin Gothic (ITC), Frankfurt Gothic (Corel) = ITC Franklin Gothic (EFF) To be honest, any even-featured sans serif face should be machine readable these days. Hope this helps, Nick -- Dr Nick Kaijaks, Pinxit Design - Information Design for Internet and print http://www.kaijaks.co.uk/ mailto:nick@kaijaks.co.uk Disclaimer: caveat internettor -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed Jul 25 14:14:19 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153413 for opro ; Wed, 25 Jul 101 14:14:15 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 996054213:10:17999:64; Wed, 25 Jul 2001 09:43:33 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1115516; 25 Jul 2001 9:43 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6P9kfW22562 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 25 Jul 2001 10:46:41 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net (altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net [193.67.237.6]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6P9kdp22559 for ; Wed, 25 Jul 2001 10:46:39 +0100 Received: from padua by altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net via 1Cust100.tnt35.rtm1.nl.uu.net [213.116.164.100] with SMTP for id LAA02959 (8.8.8/1.3); Wed, 25 Jul 2001 11:40:50 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <001901c114ed$f83e6d50$4d01a8c0@padua> From: "Tonnie Demarteau" To: "Ovation Pro" References: Subject: Re: Fonts Date: Wed, 25 Jul 2001 11:40:41 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Wed 25 Jul, E J Phillips wrote: > Royal Mail specify Courier, Courier New or Brougham as ideal fonts to be > read by their sorting equipment, alternatively Helvetica,Avant Garde, > Franklin Gothic, Arial, Avalon or Frankfurt Gothic. What RiscPC (EFF) > fonts are equivalent to these > Some equivalents for: Courier (Courier 10 Pitch BT of Bitstream) Corpus = Courier (Bitstream) not Monotype Courier (MCourier EvenWriter of EFF (also on EFF Professional Typography 2 CD Courier or Courier New (MCourier of Monotype) MCourier (DataFile Monotype collection) Helvetica Homerton SwissB (Beebug) bundeld with Ovation (Pro), also on CD - see CD Guide p 21 Swiss (EFF) AvantGarde (ITC Avant Garde Gothic) AvantG (CC/Acorn) bundled with Artworks, Impression Vogue (Beebug) bundeld with Ovation (Pro), also on CD - see CD Guide page 21 Franklin Gothic (ITC Franklin Gothic) FraGothic (iSV) 2500 fonts or DrawWorks Millenium Arial of Monotype Corporation is windows equivalent for Helvetica. RISC OS versions can be found in several PD collections. Consult eg. iconbar website. Avalon is CorelDRAW3 equivalent for ITC Avant Garde Gothic Frankfurt Gothic is CorelDRAW3 equivalent for ITC Franklin Gothic mrs. Tonnie Demarteau - the Netherlands -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu Jul 26 13:21:44 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153459 for opro ; Thu, 26 Jul 101 13:21:43 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 996139138:10:20538:148; Thu, 26 Jul 2001 09:18:58 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1107033; 26 Jul 2001 9:16 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6Q9JFT24688 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 26 Jul 2001 10:19:15 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.91]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6Q9JCp24685 for ; Thu, 26 Jul 2001 10:19:12 +0100 Received: from talibard.demon.co.uk ([158.152.207.34]) by anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15PhCh-000L8P-0X for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 26 Jul 2001 10:13:12 +0100 Date: Thu, 26 Jul 2001 10:13:55 +0100 (BST) From: Michael Talibard Subject: RE: Fonts To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Organisation name, location. Telephone/Fax? X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.46] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Wed 25 Jul, Nick Kaijaks wrote: [snip] > Helvetica (Linotype/Adobe), Arial (Monotype) = Homerton (Acorn), and Tonnie D. wrote something similar. Sorry if I'm being fussy, but fonts are worth being fussy about. Homerton is quite a close approximation to Helvetica, and seems to have been designed with that in mind. Arial, on the other hand, is only roughly equivalent, but is an excellent design in its own right. I have all three, and have just used Ovation to do a careful comparison: the Arial has many subtle differences, which seem to me to add up to something worth having. I got my Arial from LookSystems (ex Monotype) in a profusion of different weights, of which the Condensed is a favourite of mine; it is my everyday font in Edit and so I'm typing in it now. Sorry - this is getting rather off-topic, isn't it? -- Michael Talibard -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu Jul 26 15:06:06 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153470 for opro ; Thu, 26 Jul 101 15:06:03 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 996150785:20:06454:65; Thu, 26 Jul 2001 12:33:05 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2006334; 26 Jul 2001 12:32 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6QCbqQ25145 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 26 Jul 2001 13:37:52 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from daffodil.csv.warwick.ac.uk (root@daffodil.csv.warwick.ac.uk [137.205.192.30]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6QCbnp25141 for ; Thu, 26 Jul 2001 13:37:49 +0100 Received: from pansy.csv.warwick.ac.uk (root@pansy [137.205.192.19]) by daffodil.csv.warwick.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6QCVl603160 for ; Thu, 26 Jul 2001 13:31:47 +0100 (BST) Received: from TREVOR ([137.205.186.55]) by pansy.csv.warwick.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f6QCVko19371 for ; Thu, 26 Jul 2001 13:31:46 +0100 (BST) From: "Nick Kaijaks" To: Subject: RE: Fonts Date: Thu, 26 Jul 2001 13:28:10 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Michael Talibard wrote: >On Wed 25 Jul, Nick Kaijaks wrote: >[snip] > > Helvetica (Linotype/Adobe), Arial (Monotype) = Homerton (Acorn), >and Tonnie D. wrote something similar. > >Sorry if I'm being fussy, but fonts are worth being fussy about. The differences between the letterforms of Arial and Helvetica are unlikely to affect machine-reading for postal sorting. I'm also quite sure that fewer than 1% of desktop users or readers of published documents would be able to distinguish between them without reference samples. But, it's a fair point and a distinction I should still have drawn. Sorry to let standards slip. >Homerton is quite a close approximation to Helvetica, and seems >to have been designed with that in mind. Indeed, that's why it begins with H. They probably didn't do Arial because there aren't any Cambridge colleges beginning with A. In fact, maybe they should have moved to Oxford so they could use Oriel... >Arial, on the other hand, is only roughly equivalent, but is an excellent >design in its own right. I have all three, and have just used Ovation to do >a careful comparison: the Arial has many subtle differences, which seem >to me to add up to something worth having. As with all typography it's a matter of taste. There's a really nice article at: http://www.ms-studio.com/articles.html on the differences, from a point of view with which I'm inclined to agree. >Sorry - this is getting rather off-topic, isn't it? Well, to be fair, document layout would be difficult without type ;-) TTFN, Nick -- Dr Nick Kaijaks, Pinxit Design - Information Design for Internet and print http://www.kaijaks.co.uk/ mailto:nick@kaijaks.co.uk Disclaimer: caveat internettor -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu Jul 26 15:06:47 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153472 for opro ; Thu, 26 Jul 101 15:06:45 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 996152910:10:04785:72; Thu, 26 Jul 2001 13:08:30 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1004568; 26 Jul 2001 13:08 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6QDDoh25301 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 26 Jul 2001 14:13:50 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net (altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net [193.67.237.6]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6QDDlp25298 for ; Thu, 26 Jul 2001 14:13:47 +0100 Received: from padua by altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net via 1Cust71.tnt23.rtm1.nl.uu.net [213.116.140.71] with SMTP for id PAA21177 (8.8.8/1.3); Thu, 26 Jul 2001 15:07:43 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <000e01c115d4$093a4bb0$4d01a8c0@padua> From: "Tonnie Demarteau" To: "Ovation Pro" References: Subject: Re: Fonts Date: Thu, 26 Jul 2001 15:07:44 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Thu 26 Jul, Michael Talibard wrote: > On Wed 25 Jul, Nick Kaijaks wrote: > [snip] > > Helvetica (Linotype/Adobe), Arial (Monotype) = Homerton (Acorn), > and Tonnie D. wrote something similar. Windows is bundled with Arial to replace, or instead of, a Helvetica-like font. Whilst RISC OS comes with a Helvetica-like font Homerton. > Sorry if I'm being fussy, but fonts are worth being fussy about. I can't agree more. > Homerton is quite a close approximation to Helvetica, and seems > to have been designed with that in mind. Trinity, Homerton, Corpus are 'needed' for the default fontmapping to the default text fonts Times (Roman), Helvetica and Courier in PostScript output. > Arial, on the other hand, is only roughly equivalent, but is an excellent > design in its own right. Yes, Arial and Helvetica are different designs. Not only the shapes -very obvious the G R 2-, but also the widths of the characters. The latter is important, when you have to exchange carefully designed documents with fontmapping, e.g. RTF or Word (map to TrueType font) or PostScript printing (map to PostScript /Type1 font). With an average difference of 0.5% a final layout can look quite different, when you aren't aware of this possible danger. Bitstream Courier and Monotype Courier are also different designs (very obvious the kind of serifs), but have the same widths (600 on a scale of 1000). > I have all three, and have just used Ovation to do > a careful comparison: the Arial has many subtle differences, which seem > to me to add up to something worth having. Homerton has the same widths as Helvetica, but not as Arial. It is a matter of preference, when you don't have to worry about exchange and layout disturbance. > I got my Arial from LookSystems (ex Monotype) in a profusion of > different weights, of which the Condensed is a favourite of mine; it > is my everyday font in Edit and so I'm typing in it now. I have these fonts too, but he 'default' 4 weights (Medium, Bold and Italics/Obliques), used on Windows, aren't part of these different wights. My favourite is Optima. For monospaced stuff Letter Gothic. But I have also (working) PostScript Type1 and TrueType fonts to make sure, that I can exchange/ print my documents, including printing to readable PDF files. > Sorry - this is getting rather off-topic, isn't it? My contribution even more. mrs. Tonnie Demarteau - the Netherlands -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu Jul 26 20:26:05 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153494 for opro ; Thu, 26 Jul 101 20:26:02 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 996169598:20:14429:64; Thu, 26 Jul 2001 17:46:38 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2125742; 26 Jul 2001 17:46 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6QHpe325873 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 26 Jul 2001 18:51:40 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from obelix.spectraweb.ch (root@obelix.plusnet.ch [194.158.230.8]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6QHpap25870 for ; Thu, 26 Jul 2001 18:51:36 +0100 Received: from janvredenburchsmile.ch (abo-be-1-1-dialup-127.spectraweb.ch [194.230.116.127]) by obelix.spectraweb.ch (8.9.3/8.9.3/SuSE Linux 8.9.3-0.1) with SMTP id TAA16762 for ; Thu, 26 Jul 2001 19:45:22 +0200 Date: Tue, 24 Jul 2001 23:21:05 +0200 (BST) From: Jhr JMAH van Vredenburch Subject: Re: Type over-riding the margin, problem To: OVATIONP-L In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: CIC member; Secretariaat St. Van Vredenburch X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Mon 23 Jul, Robin Phillips wrote: > I look forward to your further comments, and will obviously supply the actual > file as an attachment if you wish. Nothing confidential in it. I suggest you send it to me directly, not through the mailing list. I am a bit amazed about this problem. JohnvV -- JM van Vredenburch, CH - 6006 Luzern **new email address** >From 29/06/2001 email: janvredenburch@smile.ch -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu Jul 26 20:26:06 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153495 for opro ; Thu, 26 Jul 101 20:26:02 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 996173202:10:09237:64; Thu, 26 Jul 2001 18:46:42 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1104692; 26 Jul 2001 18:46 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6QIqS026030 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 26 Jul 2001 19:52:28 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from obelix.spectraweb.ch (root@obelix.plusnet.ch [194.158.230.8]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6QIqPp26027 for ; Thu, 26 Jul 2001 19:52:25 +0100 Received: from janvredenburchsmile.ch (abo-be-1-2-dialup-91.spectraweb.ch [194.230.117.91]) by obelix.spectraweb.ch (8.9.3/8.9.3/SuSE Linux 8.9.3-0.1) with SMTP id UAA24537 for ; Thu, 26 Jul 2001 20:46:11 +0200 Date: Thu, 26 Jul 2001 20:19:37 +0200 (BST) From: Jhr JMAH van Vredenburch Subject: RE: Fonts To: OVATIONP-L In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: CIC member; Secretariaat St. Van Vredenburch X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R On Wed 25 Jul, Nick Kaijaks wrote: > To be honest, any even-featured sans serif face should be machine readable > these days. I tend to agree. In the vast amount of correspondence these last years with my brother in England, I now always use Homerton. **Not** in bold type or italics anymore. Average 5 days delivery went down to approx. 3 days. And since I use the PoBar applet, he now generally receives my snail-mail within 36 hours (last 5 postings). Amazing, he lives in a small village near Mildenhall. We have now decided to test things out with a mailing using the the bar code or not. Report on the results will follow. I shall also try a similar test with mailings to The Netherlands. If you do not use the postal bar code, which must be inserted at 14 point, the question arises within what limits the font size should be? Using Homerton or a similar font. For the time being I tend to believe that the font size should be more or less vertically equal to the font size used for the bar code. As this seems to be the vertical distance that is used to distinguish between rows. At all times I do suggest, certainly if speed is important, to avoid any fancy fonts. Including bold or italic versions of any font. JohnvV -- JM van Vredenburch, CH - 6006 Luzern **new email address** >From 29/06/2001 email: janvredenburch@smile.ch -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri Jul 27 16:06:43 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153536 for opro ; Fri, 27 Jul 101 16:06:33 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 996239064:20:11870:65; Fri, 27 Jul 2001 13:04:24 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2011218; 27 Jul 2001 13:03 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6RD6LN27652 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 27 Jul 2001 14:06:21 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from finch-post-11.mail.demon.net (finch-post-11.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.39]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6QL8kp26275 for ; Thu, 26 Jul 2001 22:08:50 +0100 Received: from southfrm.demon.co.uk ([158.152.159.240] helo=localhost) by finch-post-11.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15PsHG-000Jpl-0B for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 26 Jul 2001 21:02:39 +0000 Date: Thu, 26 Jul 2001 20:30:09 +0100 From: Tim Powys-Lybbe To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Saving files as RTF Message-ID: References: <4a9efd88cedavidb@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a9efd88cedavidb@argonet.co.uk> X-Organization: South Farm, Calstone, Cale, Wilts (no house here!) User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.50a (MsgServe/1.50test) (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In message <4a9efd88cedavidb@argonet.co.uk> David Breakwell wrote: > >> I remember David saying there was an applet to save out as rtf, but have > >> not managed to find it. Any help or views on its efficiency? > > >> MArk > > You need !MakeRTF for this - its currently at version 3.04a and deals with > most text attributes, styles and fonts. Its available direct from me at > the address below and is 'careware' so if you find it useful a donation to > my Scout Group should be considered. > > I'e mailed you a copy - le me know how you get on. > > David > Just remembered to have another look at this. I have 3.02 but cannot get any "save as RTF" to appear on anything within my Ovation 2.60. Where can I get 3.04? regards, -- Tim Powys-Lybbe tim@powys.org For a patchwork of bygones: http://powys.org -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri Jul 27 16:06:48 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153537 for opro ; Fri, 27 Jul 101 16:06:43 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 996239119:10:28113:77; Fri, 27 Jul 2001 13:05:19 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1129034; 27 Jul 2001 13:04 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6RD6P327657 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 27 Jul 2001 14:06:25 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from finch-post-11.mail.demon.net (finch-post-11.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.39]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6RD6Np27654 for ; Fri, 27 Jul 2001 14:06:23 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by finch-post-11.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15Q7Dr-0004sL-0B for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Fri, 27 Jul 2001 13:00:07 +0000 Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2001 02:16:08 GMT Message-Id: <153513@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Saving files as RTF X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >Just remembered to have another look at this. I have 3.02 but cannot >get any "save as RTF" to appear on anything within my Ovation 2.60. ISTR you need a version later than 2.60, visit the upgrade page on my web site. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri Jul 27 21:44:09 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153552 for opro ; Fri, 27 Jul 101 21:44:06 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 996255660:20:03513:64; Fri, 27 Jul 2001 17:41:00 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2003242; 27 Jul 2001 17:40 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6RHke628305 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 27 Jul 2001 18:46:40 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6RHkbp28302 for ; Fri, 27 Jul 2001 18:46:37 +0100 Received: from [62.188.15.25] (helo=62.188.15.25) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 15QBVY-0000vQ-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Fri, 27 Jul 2001 18:34:40 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: David Breakwell To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2001 18:29:31 +0000 (GMT) Subject: Re: Saving files as RTF Message-ID: <4aa0c35a94davidb@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: References: <4a9efd88cedavidb@argonet.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02b (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article , Tim Powys-Lybbe wrote: > Just remembered to have another look at this. I have 3.02 but cannot > get any "save as RTF" to appear on anything within my Ovation 2.60. > Where can I get 3.04? > regards, !MakeRTF only integrates with OP 2.61 and above (when David Pilling first made the suitable changes to the main program). -- --. --. --. --. : : --- --- .---------------------------------------------. |_| |_| | _ | | | | |_ | |Internet provider for all Acorn RISC machines| | | |\ | | | | |\| | | '---------------------------------------------' | | | \ |_| |_| | | |__ | davidb@argonet.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Sat Jul 28 01:54:26 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA153558 for opro ; Sat, 28 Jul 101 01:54:24 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 996269201:20:05563:64; Fri, 27 Jul 2001 21:26:41 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2005361; 27 Jul 2001 21:26 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6RLWE328623 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 27 Jul 2001 22:32:14 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from kx1-gui.server.which.net (kx1-gui.server.which.net [194.168.97.11]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6RLWCp28620 for ; Fri, 27 Jul 2001 22:32:12 +0100 Received: from waddell.which.net ([213.105.52.27]) by kx1-gui.server.which.net (InterMail vK.4.03.02.00 201-232-124 license e70b2acfbd69d84cc925654164bd8fad) with SMTP id <20010727212552.CWBP24141.kx1-gui@waddell.which.net> for ; Fri, 27 Jul 2001 22:25:52 +0100 Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2001 21:43:50 +0100 (BST) From: John Waddell Subject: Re: Fonts To: Ovation mail list In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Wed 25 Jul, E J Phillips wrote: > Royal Mail specify Courier, Courier New or Brougham as ideal fonts to be > read by their sorting equipment, alternatively Helvetica,Avant Garde, > Franklin Gothic, Arial, Avalon or Frankfurt Gothic. What RiscPC (EFF) > fonts are equivalent to these > The iSV !Typography CD has Fragothic as a replacement for Franklin Gothic. -- John Waddell, Langbank, Renfrewshire -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message