From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 2 22:39:17 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152362 for opro ; Mon, 02 Jul 101 22:39:14 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 993915744:10:03065:65; Sat, 30 Jun 2001 15:42:24 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1002864; 30 Jun 2001 15:42 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5UFfd329860 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 30 Jun 2001 16:41:39 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5UFfav29857 for ; Sat, 30 Jun 2001 16:41:37 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 15GMrw-000KSJ-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 30 Jun 2001 15:41:12 +0000 Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 16:40:04 GMT Message-Id: <152360@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Anyone noticed this? X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >A subtlety that it took me a while to realise (so I'm thick!) is that if >you continually run OP directly from the new CD Although its a commendable feature that you can run OPro from the CD, its surely not time efficient, copying to disc would only take a minute or so. Running from CD must take a lot longer - find the CD, open the archive etc. And you're stuck at 2.60, 3 or 4 versions out of date. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 2 22:39:40 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152368 for opro ; Mon, 02 Jul 101 22:39:37 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 993943103:20:14798:65; Sat, 30 Jun 2001 23:18:23 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2014228; 30 Jun 2001 23:18 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f5UNFlL30959 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 1 Jul 2001 00:15:47 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from finch-post-11.mail.demon.net (finch-post-11.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.39]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f5UNFjp30956 for ; Sun, 1 Jul 2001 00:15:45 +0100 Received: from omba.demon.co.uk ([158.152.58.5]) by finch-post-11.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15GTxM-000MR6-0B for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 30 Jun 2001 23:15:16 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Jeremy C B Nicoll To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sat, 30 Jun 2001 23:13:53 +0100 Subject: Re: Anyone noticed this? Message-ID: <4a92f05337Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <152360@pilling.demon.co.uk> References: <152360@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.01g (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On 30 Jun, David Pilling wrote: > >A subtlety that it took me a while to realise (so I'm thick!) is that > >if you continually run OP directly from the new CD > Although its a commendable feature that you can run OPro from the CD, > its surely not time efficient, copying to disc would only take a minute > or so. Running from CD must take a lot longer - find the CD, open the > archive etc. > And you're stuck at 2.60, 3 or 4 versions out of date. That's so. But I'm running out of space on my original hard disk, and although I've fitted a new one I have had problems with partitioning it. I decided to use the new one just as 'scratch' storage until I'd finally decided on the partitioning scheme I'm going to use. It's important to leave enough space on the old disk to move any newer files that I've got onto it before I repartition the new one. That all boils down to me not getting around to properly installing OP when I don't absolutely have to. -- Jeremy C B Nicoll - my opinions are my own. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 2 22:41:09 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152385 for opro ; Mon, 02 Jul 101 22:41:08 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 993976976:20:22179:65; Sun, 01 Jul 2001 08:42:56 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2106382; 1 Jul 2001 8:42 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f618gLC31734 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 1 Jul 2001 09:42:21 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f618gJp31730 for ; Sun, 1 Jul 2001 09:42:19 +0100 Received: from [62.188.28.228] (helo=62.188.28.228) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 15Gcj2-0006s3-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sun, 01 Jul 2001 09:37:05 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: David Breakwell To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sun, 01 Jul 2001 09:31:28 +0000 (GMT) Subject: Re: Anyone noticed this? Message-ID: <4a932e5bb1davidb@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a92b6ef3fJeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> References: <13ddd5904a.John@g1rcw.demon.co.uk> <4a92b6ef3fJeremy@omba. User-Agent: Pluto/2.02b (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <4a92b6ef3fJeremy@omba.demon.co.uk>, Jeremy C B Nicoll wrote: > that means that - for the moment - every time I load OP from CD I > have to manually check that that thing is unset before I print anything. Cpuldn't you write a quick script to set all the settings you require? David -- --. --. --. --. : : --- --- .---------------------------------------------. |_| |_| | _ | | | | |_ | |Internet provider for all Acorn RISC machines| | | |\ | | | | |\| | | '---------------------------------------------' | | | \ |_| |_| | | |__ | davidb@argonet.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 2 22:41:21 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152391 for opro ; Mon, 02 Jul 101 22:41:18 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 993990448:20:13695:66; Sun, 01 Jul 2001 12:27:28 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2013453; 1 Jul 2001 12:27 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f61CR9332055 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 1 Jul 2001 13:27:09 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from anchor-post-30.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-30.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.88]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f61CR6p32052 for ; Sun, 1 Jul 2001 13:27:06 +0100 Received: from omba.demon.co.uk ([158.152.58.5]) by anchor-post-30.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15GgL4-000EWJ-0U for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sun, 1 Jul 2001 13:28:34 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Jeremy C B Nicoll To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sun, 01 Jul 2001 11:51:45 +0100 Subject: Re: Anyone noticed this? Message-ID: <4a9335b57fJeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a932e5bb1davidb@argonet.co.uk> References: <13ddd5904a.John@g1rcw.demon.co.uk> <4a92b6ef3fJeremy@omba. User-Agent: Pluto/2.01g (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On 01 Jul, David Breakwell wrote: > Couldn't you write a quick script to set all the settings you require? Yes of course; the problem is that except for using OP to print off its manuals etc I haven't got to the stage in my current programming project where I need OP working easily. Time is *much* better spent on the tech issues of what I want to do... -- Jeremy C B Nicoll - my opinions are my own. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 2 22:41:25 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152393 for opro ; Mon, 02 Jul 101 22:41:22 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994004133:20:05280:65; Sun, 01 Jul 2001 16:15:33 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2005146; 1 Jul 2001 16:15 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f61GEpb32357 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 1 Jul 2001 17:14:51 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from smtp03.wxs.nl (smtp03.wxs.nl [195.121.6.37]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f61GEnp32354 for ; Sun, 1 Jul 2001 17:14:49 +0100 Received: from delink.wxs.nl ([195.121.161.116]) by smtp03.wxs.nl (Netscape Messaging Server 4.05) with SMTP id GFSYFN02.0KS for ; Sun, 1 Jul 2001 18:14:11 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sun, 01 Jul 2001 18:12:53 +0200 Subject: Superscript bug Message-ID: <4a93531c12paul@delink.nl> In-Reply-To: <152074@pilling.demon.co.uk> References: <152074@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/1.14i (RISC-OS/4.02) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Dear all, Geoff Youngs was the first one to announce the superscript bug in 2.64. David Pilling answered: > Now you mention it ISTR this could be a long running saga, of Impression > working one way, and some people thinking different ways are right or > wrong A fair point, perhaps, but in previous versions the superscript option worked perfectly, as far as I remember. In version 2.64 it is absolutely useless, though. Can we expect a patch soon? Kind regards, Paul Sprangers -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 2 22:41:27 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152394 for opro ; Mon, 02 Jul 101 22:41:25 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994008903:10:04383:66; Sun, 01 Jul 2001 17:35:03 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1125918; 1 Jul 2001 17:34 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f61HYfU32526 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 1 Jul 2001 18:34:41 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from mserv1b.vianw.co.uk ([195.102.249.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f61HYcp32523 for ; Sun, 1 Jul 2001 18:34:38 +0100 Received: from [195.102.201.142] (helo=Caslon.english.co.uk) by mserv1b.vianw.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #5) id 15Gl6a-0001Yt-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sun, 01 Jul 2001 18:33:57 +0100 Received: from Gill (10.0.1.1) by Caslon.english.co.uk; Sun, 01 Jul 2001 18:22:35 +0100 Date: Sun, 01 Jul 2001 18:23:00 +0100 From: David Graddol To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Superscript bug Message-ID: <998759934a%Support@Gill.english.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a93531c12paul@delink.nl> X-Organization: The English Company (UK) Ltd X-Mailer: Messenger v1.41d for RISC OS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii User-Agent: POPstar/2.02 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro wrote: > > Dear all, > > Geoff Youngs was the first one to announce the superscript bug in 2.64. > David Pilling answered: > > > Now you mention it ISTR this could be a long running saga, of Impression > > working one way, and some people thinking different ways are right or > > wrong > > A fair point, perhaps, but in previous versions the superscript option > worked perfectly, as far as I remember. In version 2.64 it is absolutely > useless, though. Can we expect a patch soon? > Oh dear. Thanks for alerting me to this problem. A quick retrofit to 2.63 needed quickly methinks. The whole line of text which includes the superscript character seems to get lowered. David -- The English Company (UK) Ltd http://www.english.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 2 22:42:23 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152401 for opro ; Mon, 02 Jul 101 22:42:20 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994018795:20:10677:65; Sun, 01 Jul 2001 20:19:55 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2010548; 1 Jul 2001 20:19 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f61KJWm00326 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 1 Jul 2001 21:19:32 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from monsoon.mail.pipex.net (monsoon.mail.pipex.net [158.43.128.69]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f61KJTp00323 for ; Sun, 1 Jul 2001 21:19:29 +0100 Received: (qmail 13724 invoked from network); 1 Jul 2001 20:18:49 -0000 Received: from userke73.uk.uudial.com (HELO loopback) (62.188.209.47) by smtp-1.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; 1 Jul 2001 20:18:49 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Dave Symes To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sun, 01 Jul 2001 19:09:23 +0100 Subject: Re: Superscript bug Message-ID: <4a935dc66fdfs@ukgateway.net> In-Reply-To: <4a93531c12paul@delink.nl> References: <152074@pilling.demon.co.uk> <4a93531c12paul@delink.nl> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.04-pre1 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R In article <4a93531c12paul@delink.nl>, wrote: > Dear all, > Geoff Youngs was the first one to announce the superscript bug in 2.64. > David Pilling answered: > > Now you mention it ISTR this could be a long running saga, of > > Impression working one way, and some people thinking different ways > > are right or wrong > A fair point, perhaps, but in previous versions the superscript option > worked perfectly, as far as I remember. In version 2.64 it is absolutely > useless, though. Can we expect a patch soon? > Kind regards, > Paul Sprangers Indeedy, I've just tested this with Ov Pro 2.52 then 2.58 and 2.61 where the Super and Subscripts work correctly and don't modify the line space. Cheers Dave S -- _______________________________________________________________________ Dave Symes... dfs@ukgateway.net Also... df@dafs.freeserve.co.uk .. or... dave@triffid.co.uk http://www.dfs.ukgateway.net -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 2 22:42:56 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152410 for opro ; Mon, 02 Jul 101 22:42:53 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994082304:10:29834:278; Mon, 02 Jul 2001 13:58:24 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1117210; 2 Jul 2001 13:55 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f62DuGk01791 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 14:56:16 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from alpha.netvision.net.il (alpha.netvision.net.il [194.90.1.13]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f62Du9p01788 for ; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 14:56:10 +0100 Received: from netvision.net.il (ras4-p31.jlm.netvision.net.il [62.0.147.31]) by alpha.netvision.net.il (8.9.3/8.8.6) with ESMTP id QAA14318 for ; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 16:55:15 +0300 (IDT) Message-ID: <3B407D3C.DF4F5BBC@netvision.net.il> Date: Mon, 02 Jul 2001 16:55:08 +0300 From: Michael Ben-Gershon Organization: My Office X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.19 i686) X-Accept-Language: en-GB, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: DDL question References: <152074@pilling.demon.co.uk> <4a93531c12paul@delink.nl> <4a935dc66fdfs@ukgateway.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Is it possible to specify a document zoom value in a DDL file? Michael Ben-Gershon mybg@netvision.net.il -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 2 22:43:03 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152413 for opro ; Mon, 02 Jul 101 22:43:01 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994077500:20:18012:65; Mon, 02 Jul 2001 12:38:20 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2100939; 2 Jul 2001 12:38 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f62CafX01350 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 13:36:41 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from typhoon.mail.pipex.net (typhoon.mail.pipex.net [158.43.128.27]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f62Cacp01347 for ; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 13:36:38 +0100 Received: (qmail 8753 invoked from network); 2 Jul 2001 12:35:49 -0000 Received: from useral52.uk.uudial.com (HELO RPC) (62.188.134.125) by smtp-2.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; 2 Jul 2001 12:35:49 -0000 Date: Mon, 02 Jul 2001 09:38:41 +0100 From: Elma Alexander To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Can't add picture in 2,64 Message-ID: References: <152314@pilling.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <152314@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.10d (MsgServe/1.10) (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <152314@pilling.demon.co.uk> David Pilling wrote: > >Today I tried to add a picture to a text page, originally created in > >v2.64, but it only left it blank with the cross (+) lines on it. > > Main menu, view, options, tick pictures That did it - thanks, David. I'm thick :( Elly. -- Elma Alexander Email: elma.alexander@ukgateway.net - Fax: 0870 138 4996 Praising God & Country Music Elma's Window on the World: http://znap.to/Elly -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 2 22:43:12 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152416 for opro ; Mon, 02 Jul 101 22:43:10 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994097975:10:13967:70; Mon, 02 Jul 2001 18:19:35 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1115067; 2 Jul 2001 18:18 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f62IJbm02334 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 19:19:37 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from mk-smarthost-2.mail.uk.worldonline.com (mk-smarthost-2.mail.uk.worldonline.com [212.74.112.72]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f62IJZp02331 for ; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 19:19:35 +0100 Received: from ppp-2-52.5800-7.access.uk.worldonline.com ([62.64.159.52] helo=ghc) by mk-smarthost-2.mail.uk.worldonline.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #3) id 15H8Ge-000EaC-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Mon, 02 Jul 2001 19:17:53 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Gavin Crawford To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Mon, 02 Jul 2001 19:17:10 +0100 Subject: Re: Pictures in Opro Message-ID: <4a93e25314gav@crawford-print.co.uk> In-Reply-To: References: <21B2A2008F16D2118E7A00805F8BF7ECA99688@w12wnxu01.wn.bbc.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02d (RISC-OS/3.70) POPstar/2.02 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article , Gabriel Swords wrote: > In message > <21B2A2008F16D2118E7A00805F8BF7ECA99688@w12wnxu01.wn.bbc.co.uk> you > wrote: > >Gabriel Swords wrote : > > > > I have 3 pictures in an OPro document... all of them print to > > postscript, but only one of them will print to my LaserDirect (LPB8). > > > > What format are the pictures? > > > > Perhaps the two that don't print are in EPS form and only print to a > > device that understands postscript. > > > There are all Sprites saved from Photodesk 2.04 IIRC the LaserDirect uses the same sprite code as TurboDrivers. If it does then there is a maximum sprite size that it can handle. Are your sprites more than 4094 pixels in height or width as I think that is the limit it will cope with. (or it may be 2047 depending on the sprite mode). ArtWorks suffers from the same limits. Gav. -- Gavin Crawford email: gav@crawford-print.co.uk web: www.crawford-print.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 2 22:43:16 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152417 for opro ; Mon, 02 Jul 101 22:43:12 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994079757:20:15518:65; Mon, 02 Jul 2001 13:15:57 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2102341; 2 Jul 2001 13:15 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f62DG5801504 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 14:16:05 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from purple.paston.co.uk (purple.paston.co.uk [194.202.64.60]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f62DG2p01501 for ; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 14:16:02 +0100 Received: from paston.co.uk (angelwords.netkonect.co.uk [194.164.3.172]) by purple.paston.co.uk (Postfix) with SMTP id 32A3C2BD63 for ; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 14:19:02 +0100 (BST) Date: Mon, 02 Jul 2001 14:16:43 GMT From: Gabriel Swords To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Pictures in Opro Message-ID: <8b4fcc934a.angelwords@paston.co.uk> References: <60f23c924a.Elly@ukgateway.net> In-Reply-To: <60f23c924a.Elly@ukgateway.net> X-Organization: angelwords User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.50a (MsgServe/1.50) (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Hi, I have 3 pictures in an OPro document... all of them print to postscript, but only one of them will print to my LaserDirect (LPB8). I'm using version 2.58 of OP and 1.62 of Printers on a RPC with RO4.02 Any ideas? Please! Gabriel -- Gabriel Swords -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 2 22:43:28 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152419 for opro ; Mon, 02 Jul 101 22:43:21 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994080347:20:00496:70; Mon, 02 Jul 2001 13:25:47 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2000326; 2 Jul 2001 13:25 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f62DPK501572 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 14:25:20 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from gateh.kw.bbc.co.uk (gateh.kw.bbc.co.uk [132.185.132.17]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f62DPIp01569 for ; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 14:25:18 +0100 Received: from w1bhxi02.radio.bbc.co.uk ([10.48.8.92]) by gateh.kw.bbc.co.uk (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id f62DOPX13264 for ; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 14:24:25 +0100 (BST) Received: from w12wcxf01.wc.bbc.co.uk (unverified) by w1bhxi02.radio.bbc.co.uk (Content Technologies SMTPRS 4.2.1) with ESMTP id for ; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 14:24:24 +0100 Message-ID: <21B2A2008F16D2118E7A00805F8BF7ECA99688@w12wnxu01.wn.bbc.co.uk> From: Michael Hunter To: "'ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk'" Subject: RE: Pictures in Opro Date: Mon, 2 Jul 2001 14:24:23 +0100 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2448.0) Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Gabriel Swords wrote : >I have 3 pictures in an OPro document... all of them print to >postscript, but only one of them will print to my LaserDirect (LPB8). What format are the pictures? Perhaps the two that don't print are in EPS form and only print to a device that understands postscript. Michael > Michael Hunter This e-mail, and any attachment, is confidential. If you have received it in error, please delete it from your system, do not use or disclose the information in any way, and notify me immediately. The contents of this message may contain personal views which are not the views of the BBC, unless specifically stated. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 2 22:43:40 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152422 for opro ; Mon, 02 Jul 101 22:43:38 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994096287:20:03793:65; Mon, 02 Jul 2001 17:51:27 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2003660; 2 Jul 2001 17:51 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f62HolS02213 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 18:50:47 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from purple.paston.co.uk (purple.paston.co.uk [194.202.64.60]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f62Hojp02210 for ; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 18:50:45 +0100 Received: from paston.co.uk (angelwords.netkonect.co.uk [194.164.3.172]) by purple.paston.co.uk (Postfix) with SMTP id A448F2BD5B for ; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 18:53:43 +0100 (BST) Date: Mon, 02 Jul 2001 18:53:51 GMT From: Gabriel Swords To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: RE: Pictures in Opro Message-ID: References: <21B2A2008F16D2118E7A00805F8BF7ECA99688@w12wnxu01.wn.bbc.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <21B2A2008F16D2118E7A00805F8BF7ECA99688@w12wnxu01.wn.bbc.co.uk> X-Organization: angelwords User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.50a (MsgServe/1.50) (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In message <21B2A2008F16D2118E7A00805F8BF7ECA99688@w12wnxu01.wn.bbc.co.uk> you wrote: >Gabriel Swords wrote : > > I have 3 pictures in an OPro document... all of them print to > postscript, but only one of them will print to my LaserDirect (LPB8). > > What format are the pictures? > > Perhaps the two that don't print are in EPS form and only print to a device > that understands postscript. > There are all Sprites saved from Photodesk 2.04 -- Gabriel Swords -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 2 22:43:44 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152423 for opro ; Mon, 02 Jul 101 22:43:41 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994098011:20:26664:65; Mon, 02 Jul 2001 18:20:11 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2124445; 2 Jul 2001 18:20 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f62IKnP02354 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 19:20:49 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from sand6.global.net.uk.noc.gxn.net (sand6.global.net.uk [195.147.246.105]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f62IKkp02350 for ; Mon, 2 Jul 2001 19:20:46 +0100 Received: from p33s02a03.client.global.net.uk ([195.147.162.52] helo=loopback) by sand6.global.net.uk.noc.gxn.net with smtp (Exim 3.03 #1) id 15H8IM-0007BL-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Mon, 02 Jul 2001 19:19:39 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Dave Symes To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Mon, 02 Jul 2001 19:00:45 +0100 Subject: Re: Pictures in Opro Message-ID: <4a93e0d237dfs@ukgateway.net> In-Reply-To: References: <21B2A2008F16D2118E7A00805F8BF7ECA99688@w12wnxu01.wn.bbc.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.04-pre1 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article , Gabriel Swords wrote: > In message <21B2A2008F16D2118E7A00805F8BF7ECA99688@w12wnxu01.wn.bbc.co.uk> you wrote: > >Gabriel Swords wrote : > > > > I have 3 pictures in an OPro document... all of them print to > > postscript, but only one of them will print to my LaserDirect (LPB8). > > > > What format are the pictures? > > Perhaps the two that don't print are in EPS form and only print to a > > device that understands postscript. > > > There are all Sprites saved from Photodesk 2.04 Well there's your answer then...Perhaps you should put the sprites back in to !Paint and resave them... Dave S -- _______________________________________________________________________ Dave Symes... dfs@ukgateway.net Also... df@dafs.freeserve.co.uk .. or... dave@triffid.co.uk http://www.dfs.ukgateway.net -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 3 14:44:14 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152460 for opro ; Tue, 03 Jul 101 14:44:13 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994123167:20:26863:66; Tue, 03 Jul 2001 01:19:27 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2110574; 3 Jul 2001 1:19 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f631JQr03122 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 02:19:26 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f631JOp03119 for ; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 02:19:24 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 15HEpg-0006TB-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 01:18:28 +0000 Date: Tue, 03 Jul 2001 02:05:38 GMT Message-Id: <152453@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Superscript bug X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro OK, yes superscripts are clearly wrong, lines move down too much. It is still an interesting question though, should the height of any superscripts count as part of the line height? David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 3 14:44:36 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152463 for opro ; Tue, 03 Jul 101 14:44:24 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994145709:20:24668:67; Tue, 03 Jul 2001 07:35:09 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2127063; 3 Jul 2001 7:34 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f637Z3g03587 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 08:35:03 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from mserv1b.vianw.co.uk ([195.102.249.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f637Z0p03584 for ; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 08:35:00 +0100 Received: from [194.119.179.59] (helo=Caslon.english.co.uk) by mserv1b.vianw.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #5) id 15HKh6-0001Zh-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 03 Jul 2001 08:34:00 +0100 Received: from Gill (10.0.1.1) by Caslon.english.co.uk; Tue, 03 Jul 2001 08:29:38 +0100 Date: Tue, 03 Jul 2001 08:29:59 +0100 From: David Graddol To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Superscript bug Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <152453@pilling.demon.co.uk> X-Organization: The English Company (UK) Ltd X-Mailer: Messenger v1.41d for RISC OS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii User-Agent: POPstar/2.02 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro opro@pilling.demon.co.uk (David Pilling) wrote: > OK, yes superscripts are clearly wrong, lines move down too much. > > It is still an interesting question though, should the height of > any superscripts count as part of the line height? > Well, I would have thought it wasn't really much of a question. Surely, the position of a line of type containing a superscript should be exactly the same as one not containing a superscript. In other words, if a superscript were deleted it should make absolutely no difference to the rest of the line. Traditionally, a superscript is a small character hung from the top line - in other words it is entirely within the line height and does not alter it. If you place, say, a superscript 1 after a letter with an ascender such as 't', then you will see that the two are top aligned. That might be one principled difference between vertical shift and superscript. David -- The English Company (UK) Ltd http://www.english.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 3 14:45:25 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152468 for opro ; Tue, 03 Jul 101 14:45:21 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994154496:10:28682:65; Tue, 03 Jul 2001 10:01:36 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1028486; 3 Jul 2001 10:01 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f63A1PS03946 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 11:01:25 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from cmailg5.svr.pol.co.uk (cmailg5.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.195.175]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f63A1Mp03943 for ; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 11:01:22 +0100 Received: from modem-89.clam.dialup.pol.co.uk ([217.134.24.89] helo=SWebRPC1) by cmailg5.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 15HMyk-0001WM-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 03 Jul 2001 11:00:22 +0100 Date: Tue, 03 Jul 2001 10:51:32 +0100 From: Geoff Youngs To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Superscript bug Message-ID: <5ede37944a.Geoff@solutionsweb.co.uk> References: <152453@pilling.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <152453@pilling.demon.co.uk> X-Organization: solutions.web User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.50a (MsgServe/1.50) (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 X-Question: Do you really find headers very interesting? X-Editor: Zap 1.44 (15 May 2001) [TEST 5], ZapEmail 0.25 (20 Sep 2000) test-5 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In message <152453@pilling.demon.co.uk> opro@pilling.demon.co.uk (David Pilling) wrote: > OK, yes superscripts are clearly wrong, lines move down too much. > > It is still an interesting question though, should the height of > any superscripts count as part of the line height? Not by default. Not unless it affects the line height of the entire section. And even then not by default. The only situation I can think of in which you might want the line height to be altered by superscript text would be where you are editing an equation or trying fancy text effects. In the former case it's probably a bad idea (an equation editor would be more appripriate), but in the case of latter, while it might be useful, it is questionable whether it would be worth crowding interface with the option to use it. Yours, Geoff. -- Geoff Youngs, Technical Director // solutions.web - Internet Consultants \\ Tel. +44 (0) 23 9241 2340 // Web : http://www.solutionsweb.co.uk/ -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 3 14:45:29 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152469 for opro ; Tue, 03 Jul 101 14:45:28 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994154874:10:08888:89; Tue, 03 Jul 2001 10:07:54 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1125775; 3 Jul 2001 10:06 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f63A6QH04009 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 11:06:26 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from smtp01.wxs.nl (smtp01.wxs.nl [195.121.6.61]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f63A6Kp04006 for ; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 11:06:21 +0100 Received: from delink.wxs.nl ([195.121.161.157]) by smtp01.wxs.nl (Netscape Messaging Server 4.05) with SMTP id GFW6OO04.N4R for ; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 12:05:12 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Tue, 03 Jul 2001 12:00:46 +0200 Subject: Superscript bug Message-ID: <4a9438b6b6paul@delink.nl> In-Reply-To: References: <152453@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/1.14i (RISC-OS/4.02) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro David Graddol wrote: > Surely, the position of a line of type containing a superscript > should be exactly the same as one not containing a superscript. I definitively agree. Kind regards, Paul Sprangers -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 3 14:46:17 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152472 for opro ; Tue, 03 Jul 101 14:46:15 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994162170:10:18750:91; Tue, 03 Jul 2001 12:09:30 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1116889; 3 Jul 2001 12:09 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f63C9N904363 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 13:09:23 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from mta01-svc.ntlworld.com (mta01-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.41]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f63C9Lp04359 for ; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 13:09:21 +0100 Received: from RiscPC ([213.104.122.51]) by mta01-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.27 201-229-119-110) with SMTP id <20010703120818.UHBV351.mta01-svc.ntlworld.com@RiscPC> for ; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 13:08:18 +0100 Date: Tue, 03 Jul 2001 13:08:13 +0100 From: Pete Bready To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Superscript bug Message-ID: <9d6144944a.pbready@ntlworld.com> References: <152453@pilling.demon.co.uk> <4a9438b6b6paul@delink.nl> In-Reply-To: <4a9438b6b6paul@delink.nl> X-Organization: Home User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.50a (MsgServe/1.50) (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In message <4a9438b6b6paul@delink.nl> wrote: > > David Graddol wrote: > > Surely, the position of a line of type containing a superscript > > should be exactly the same as one not containing a superscript. > > I definitively agree. > Kind regards, > Paul Sprangers > Sounds sensible - you wouldn't really want to upset the line height for one line of a paragraph just because it contained a sub/superscript - it would look 'odd' and unbalanced! -- Pete Bready pbready@ntlworld.com -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 3 16:13:44 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152476 for opro ; Tue, 03 Jul 101 16:13:35 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994172061:10:28243:75; Tue, 03 Jul 2001 14:54:21 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1125531; 3 Jul 2001 14:51 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f63EnEw04642 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 15:49:14 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net (altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net [193.67.237.6]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f63EnAp04639 for ; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 15:49:11 +0100 Received: from padua by altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net via 1Cust92.tnt37.rtm1.nl.uu.net [213.116.168.92] with SMTP for id QAA08392 (8.8.8/1.3); Tue, 3 Jul 2001 16:48:05 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <002b01c103cf$4424a390$4d01a8c0@padua> From: "Tonnie Demarteau" To: "Ovation Pro" References: Subject: Re: Superscript bug Date: Tue, 3 Jul 2001 16:48:11 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R On Tue 03 Jul, David Graddol wrote: > opro@pilling.demon.co.uk (David Pilling) wrote: > > > OK, yes superscripts are clearly wrong, lines move down too much. > > > > It is still an interesting question though, should the height of > > any superscripts count as part of the line height? > > > > Well, I would have thought it wasn't really much of a question. > Surely, the position of a line of type containing a superscript > should be exactly the same as one not containing a superscript. > In other words, if a superscript were deleted it should make > absolutely no difference to the rest of the line. Traditionally > a superscript is a small character hung from the top line - in > other words it is entirely within the line height and does not > alter it. > If you place, say, a superscript 1 after a letter > with an ascender such as 't', then you will see that the two are > top aligned. I think, this is the 'main' issue: where to put the virtual top (superscript) and where to put the virtual bottom (subscript) ? Within the limits of the pointsize the measurements of the glyphs differ in different fonts. A capital H in Homerton hasn't the same height as a capital H in Trinity.Medium and a capital H in Trinity.Medium hasn't the same height as in Trinity.Bold or in Trinity.Medium.Italic. A capital in a font doesn't need to have the same height as a lower case character with an ascender (l or h). It can have the same heigt, it can be lower, it can be higher. That is part of the design of a specific weight. A composite capital like (capital + accent like ASCII 192) can have its accent above the A, but it can also been designed to have a smaller height. The same 'story' can be told about descenders. A bow of the lower case g doesn't need to be as low as the descender of the p. The only horizontal line *inside* fonts, that fonts share or have in common, is the baseline. Most fonts have already some (kind of) superscript glyphs defined like small 1,2,3 or trademark. Now, as I understand it, the question is, where the virtual top and bottom line should be placed, when superscript and subscript has to be *calculated for all fonts*. Both of course without altering the line height of the current font and fontsize. As an example: on a design size of 1000, heights in Trinity and Homerton are (about): xh lh Hh weight/style 460 670 682 Trinity.Bold 458 682 662 Trinity.Bold.Italic 448 682 662 Trinity.Medium 446 684 660 Trinity.Medium.Italic 542 730 730 Homerton.Bold 543 731 731 Homerton.Bold.Oblique 526 730 730 Homerton.Medium 526 730 730 Homerton.Medium.Oblique xh = x-height lh = lower case l height Hh = capital H height Other fonts have other heights, descenders other lowest values etc. A calculated virtual top and bottom can only be correct for *some* fonts, acceptable or 'wrong' for other fonts. To correct instances, where the result isn't acceptable, vertical shift can be of help ... > That might be one principled difference between > vertical shift and superscript. I think the difference is between what is defined in a font (proportional and different for every font) and what has to be calculated for common use. As Trinity.Medium is already the Basestyle and available for every user, my suggestion would be to use values, which are/seem correct for Trinity.Medium. Trademark (ASCII 141 in Trinity.Medium) seems a good starting point to me. mrs. Tonnie Demarteau - the Netherlands -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 3 22:30:52 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152491 for opro ; Tue, 03 Jul 101 22:30:49 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994193129:20:03845:65; Tue, 03 Jul 2001 20:45:29 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2003376; 3 Jul 2001 20:45 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f63KjC805214 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 21:45:12 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f63Kj9p05211 for ; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 21:45:10 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 15HX1f-0008FG-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 20:44:03 +0000 Date: Tue, 03 Jul 2001 19:43:28 GMT Message-Id: <152479@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Superscript bug X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro OK, OK, I'll put it back. Now where were you all when I was getting emails from someone ranting about what a mess superscripting was... Its a problem, everything is done for a reason, but its not always easy years later to recall what the reason was. Another bug has come to light and been fixed, so its worth doing another version. This one is to do with bad clipping on the join between pages when multiple pages are printed. It goes back a few versions. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 3 22:31:02 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152494 for opro ; Tue, 03 Jul 101 22:30:58 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994194486:20:22302:65; Tue, 03 Jul 2001 21:08:06 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab2110867; 3 Jul 2001 21:07 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f63L7ed05317 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 22:07:40 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from cmailg3.svr.pol.co.uk (cmailg3.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.195.173]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f63L7cp05314 for ; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 22:07:38 +0100 Received: from modem-186.iodine.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.44.186] helo=orchard-way) by cmailg3.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 15HXNN-0001LH-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 03 Jul 2001 22:06:30 +0100 Date: Tue, 03 Jul 2001 22:04:51 +0100 From: Alan Adams To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Superscript bug Message-ID: <318375944a.Alan.Adams@orchard-way.freeserve.co.uk> References: <002b01c103cf$4424a390$4d01a8c0@padua> In-Reply-To: <002b01c103cf$4424a390$4d01a8c0@padua> User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.10 (MsgServe/1.10) (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R In message <002b01c103cf$4424a390$4d01a8c0@padua> you wrote: > On Tue 03 Jul, David Graddol wrote: > > > opro@pilling.demon.co.uk (David Pilling) wrote: > > > > > OK, yes superscripts are clearly wrong, lines move down too much. > > > > > > It is still an interesting question though, should the height of > > > any superscripts count as part of the line height? > > > > > > > I think, this is the 'main' issue: where to put the virtual top (superscript) > and where to put the virtual bottom (subscript) ? > It is an nteresting point to discuss. However, in OPro I would think it had already been decided. Since the line spacing is already being shown, on screen and in print, there must surely have been calculated a top and bottom. (In other words the "bottom" of one line is the "top" of the next.) -- Alan Adams alan.adams@orchard-way.freeserve.co.uk http://www.nckc.org.uk/ -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed Jul 4 01:10:05 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152505 for opro ; Wed, 04 Jul 101 01:10:02 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994198213:20:10603:65; Tue, 03 Jul 2001 22:10:13 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab2129391; 3 Jul 2001 22:10 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f63MAqN05562 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 23:10:52 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f63MAop05559 for ; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 23:10:50 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 15HYMY-000G0u-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 22:09:42 +0000 Date: Tue, 03 Jul 2001 22:34:19 GMT Message-Id: <152495@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Superscript bug X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro I've put super/sub script back to rights. Aside from my intentions the whole lot had a mistake in it. So it was completely wrong. What I think I was going on about is that if you vertial shift some text upwards, it forces the current line of text down. However if you v shift downwards it overlaps the line below. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed Jul 4 01:10:12 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152506 for opro ; Wed, 04 Jul 101 01:10:09 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994200369:20:00267:65; Tue, 03 Jul 2001 22:46:09 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2110683; 3 Jul 2001 22:45 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f63MkhZ05664 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 23:46:43 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f63Mkfp05661 for ; Tue, 3 Jul 2001 23:46:41 +0100 Received: from [62.188.132.245] (helo=62.188.132.245) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 15HYqh-00014q-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 03 Jul 2001 23:40:52 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Phil Coates To: OvPro Date: Tue, 03 Jul 2001 23:43:30 +0100 Subject: Tables Message-ID: <4a947e8b0bphilco.g0coa@argonet.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02d (RISC-OS/4.02) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R Is there any list of hints for creating tables in Ovationpro. It still appears very difficult to create a table consisting of text frames, where the borders overlap. In some instances attempting to enter any text imediatly gives a text overflow in the frame. Any hints please, or is this still a problem.. Thanks in anticipation. Regards Phil -- This email has been sent from a RiscPC which does not run Windows, but it will more than likely read your files. philco.g0coa@argonet.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed Jul 4 13:58:52 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152515 for opro ; Wed, 04 Jul 101 13:58:47 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994224522:20:07539:65; Wed, 04 Jul 2001 05:28:42 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2007434; 4 Jul 2001 5:28 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f645TIe06214 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 4 Jul 2001 06:29:18 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f645TFp06211 for ; Wed, 4 Jul 2001 06:29:15 +0100 Received: from [62.188.156.152] (helo=62.188.156.152) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 15Hf8D-0005pA-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 04 Jul 2001 06:23:22 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Phil Coates To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2001 06:26:32 +0100 Subject: Re: Tables Message-ID: <4a94a37174philco.g0coa@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <152511@pilling.demon.co.uk> References: <152511@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02d (RISC-OS/4.02) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Cor you were up late David. I'll follow those instructions for now I do havea an early copy of tablemate, but was hoping that I could do the same in a basic way with Opro. Thanks again.. Phil -- This email has been sent from a RiscPC which does not run Windows, but it will more than likely read your files. philco.g0coa@argonet.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed Jul 4 13:59:05 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152516 for opro ; Wed, 04 Jul 101 13:58:47 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994210671:10:03649:71; Wed, 04 Jul 2001 01:37:51 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1104675; 4 Jul 2001 1:37 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f641bpm05932 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 4 Jul 2001 02:37:51 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f641bnp05929 for ; Wed, 4 Jul 2001 02:37:49 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 15Hbaq-0004ua-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 4 Jul 2001 01:36:40 +0000 Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2001 02:29:15 GMT Message-Id: <152511@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Tables X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >Is there any list of hints for creating tables in Ovationpro. Probably get a copy of tablemate. >It still appears very difficult to create a table consisting of text >frames, where the borders overlap. In some instances attempting to enter any >text imediatly gives a text overflow in the frame. A good idea would be to sort out the text flow setting on the frames you are using for cells. e.g. set it to none. I suppose you're hinting at the sort of bug where OPro gets its text flow wrong when frames overlie one another just right. That sort of thing is still! present. By setting the flow to none, or perhaps changing the stand off setting to zero you may get around that. Although in any case thats a good idea for a table. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed Jul 4 13:59:17 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152517 for opro ; Wed, 04 Jul 101 13:59:12 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994228429:10:02530:67; Wed, 04 Jul 2001 06:33:49 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1106861; 4 Jul 2001 6:33 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f646YZe06373 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 4 Jul 2001 07:34:35 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f646YXp06370 for ; Wed, 4 Jul 2001 07:34:33 +0100 Received: from [62.188.135.80] (helo=62.188.135.80) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 15Hg9O-0006Zj-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 04 Jul 2001 07:28:39 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Phil Coates To: OvPro Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2001 07:31:23 +0100 Subject: Table Message-ID: <4a94a96126philco.g0coa@argonet.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02d (RISC-OS/4.02) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Thanks for the posting David. Your suggestions have worked wonderfully. I have not encountered any serious difficulty with overlaying of the frame edges, except I usually counter it by the front or back position on the page, if that is the bug you are referring to. Thanks again. Regards Phil -- This email has been sent from a RiscPC which does not run Windows, but it will more than likely read your files. philco.g0coa@argonet.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed Jul 4 13:59:24 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152519 for opro ; Wed, 04 Jul 101 13:59:20 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994239724:10:06388:75; Wed, 04 Jul 2001 09:42:04 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1116601; 4 Jul 2001 9:41 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f649cPk06636 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 4 Jul 2001 10:38:25 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from mk-smarthost-2.mail.uk.worldonline.com (mk-smarthost-2.mail.uk.worldonline.com [212.74.112.72]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f649cMp06633 for ; Wed, 4 Jul 2001 10:38:22 +0100 Received: from ppp-5-171.5800-6.access.uk.worldonline.com ([62.64.157.171] helo=thosechurchills.screaming.net) by mk-smarthost-2.mail.uk.worldonline.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #3) id 15Hj50-00040j-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 04 Jul 2001 10:36:18 +0100 Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2001 09:06:26 +0100 From: M P Churchill To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Superscript bug Message-ID: References: <152495@pilling.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <152495@pilling.demon.co.uk> X-Organization: Home User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.50a (MsgServe/1.50) (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In message <152495@pilling.demon.co.uk> you wrote: > > I've put super/sub script back to rights. Aside from my intentions > the whole lot had a mistake in it. So it was completely wrong. > Ah! Good! I've just tried using v2.64 for a Chemistry text with lots of charges on ions as superscripts. It looked like the results I got from a Mac we used about 10 years ago which had the same error for superscripts! Is the corrected version available yet, please? -- Malcolm -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu Jul 5 01:32:48 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152547 for opro ; Thu, 05 Jul 101 01:32:46 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994286210:10:07282:65; Wed, 04 Jul 2001 22:36:50 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1007077; 4 Jul 2001 22:36 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f64MaBB07686 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 4 Jul 2001 23:36:11 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from anchor-post-31.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-31.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.89]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f64Ma9p07683 for ; Wed, 4 Jul 2001 23:36:09 +0100 Received: from cartmell.demon.co.uk ([158.152.204.98]) by anchor-post-31.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15HvFF-000H44-0V for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 4 Jul 2001 23:35:41 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: John Cartmell To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2001 23:28:31 +0100 Subject: Re: Tables Message-ID: <4a95010226john@cartmell.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <152511@pilling.demon.co.uk> References: <152511@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02d (RISC-OS/4.02) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R In article <152511@pilling.demon.co.uk>, David Pilling wrote: > >Is there any list of hints for creating tables in Ovationpro. > Probably get a copy of tablemate. This makes sense as Tablemate can be used to produce a table for anywhere a Draw file could be inserted. -- John Cartmell - Manchester, UK Fleur Designs -- compact designer board games -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu Jul 5 13:23:48 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152553 for opro ; Thu, 05 Jul 101 13:23:43 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994293220:20:05623:65; Thu, 05 Jul 2001 00:33:40 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2112230; 5 Jul 2001 0:33 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f650Xch07973 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 5 Jul 2001 01:33:38 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from mail6.svr.pol.co.uk (mail6.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.212]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f64MdRp07737 for ; Wed, 4 Jul 2001 23:39:27 +0100 Received: from modem-41.holmium.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.53.41] helo=localhost.com) by mail6.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 15HvHa-0002NO-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 04 Jul 2001 23:38:07 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Colin Wood To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Wed, 04 Jul 2001 23:31:54 +0100 Subject: Re: Superscript bug Message-ID: <4a95015124Colin@meldr.co.uk> In-Reply-To: References: <152495@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02c (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article , M P Churchill wrote: > In message <152495@pilling.demon.co.uk> you wrote: > > > > I've put super/sub script back to rights. Aside from my intentions > > the whole lot had a mistake in it. So it was completely wrong. > > > Ah! Good! I've just tried using v2.64 for a Chemistry text with lots of > charges on ions as superscripts. It looked like the results I got from > a Mac we used about 10 years ago which had the same error for > superscripts! Same thing occurred in an official publication on Chemistry for schools. The camera ready pages were produced on an Apple Mac just last year. Iirc, problems with line spacing whenever superscrip or subscript used - looks so untidy on a page of mainly text! -- ______________________________ __ / / _ |. _ \ /_ _ _| / Acorn SA RiscPC with RiscOS4 \__(_)||| ) \/\/(_)(_)(_| / and Dynalink 56k __________________________/ colin@meldr.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu Jul 5 13:24:25 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152562 for opro ; Thu, 05 Jul 101 13:24:23 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994330781:20:05184:97; Thu, 05 Jul 2001 10:59:41 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2115984; 5 Jul 2001 10:58 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f65AiWA08815 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 5 Jul 2001 11:44:32 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from cmailg2.svr.pol.co.uk (cmailg2.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.195.172]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f65AiTp08812 for ; Thu, 5 Jul 2001 11:44:29 +0100 Received: from modem-739.aerodactyl.dialup.pol.co.uk ([217.135.6.227] helo=magray.freeserve.co.uk) by cmailg2.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 15I6b7-0001Cb-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 05 Jul 2001 11:43:02 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Ray Dawson To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Thu, 05 Jul 2001 10:03:07 +0100 Subject: Re: Tables Message-ID: <4a953b1ba7rayd@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a95010226john@cartmell.demon.co.uk> References: <152511@pilling.demon.co.uk> <4a95010226john@cartmell.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 Organization: MagRay Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <4a95010226john@cartmell.demon.co.uk>, John Cartmell wrote: > In article <152511@pilling.demon.co.uk>, David Pilling > wrote: > > >Is there any list of hints for creating tables in Ovationpro. > > Probably get a copy of tablemate. > This makes sense as Tablemate can be used to produce a table for > anywhere a Draw file could be inserted. Tablemate supports OLE. If you insert a Tablemate table as a native file, Ctrl clicking on the table opens it up into Tablemate again for editing. Cheers, Ray D -- ..===================================. | M a g R a y Document Services | Ray Dawson Tel: 020 8864 7208 | the audio and braille specialists | rayd@argonet.co.uk '===================================' http://www.magray.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu Jul 5 22:27:16 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152592 for opro ; Thu, 05 Jul 101 22:27:14 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994362416:10:11276:67; Thu, 05 Jul 2001 19:46:56 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1011176; 5 Jul 2001 19:46 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f65JlNR10011 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 5 Jul 2001 20:47:23 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from warrior-outbound.servers.plus.net ([212.159.14.227]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f65JlLp10008 for ; Thu, 5 Jul 2001 20:47:21 +0100 Received: (qmail 3697 invoked from network); 5 Jul 2001 19:45:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO tinshill.force9.net) (212.159.17.126) by warrior with SMTP; 5 Jul 2001 19:45:41 -0000 Date: Thu, 5 Jul 2001 00:55:57 +0100 (BST) From: Anthony Hilton Subject: Re: Superscript bug To: Ovation Pro List In-Reply-To: <152495@pilling.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R In on Tue 03 Jul, David Pilling wrote: > > > What I think I was going on about is that if you vertial shift some text > upwards, it forces the current line of text down. However if you v shift > downwards it overlaps the line below. > Can you describe what vertical shift does in terms of the leading? I think I expect it to move the baseline within the overall leading set for the line, but I don't think that's how it works in Opro. Anthony Hilton -- ajh@tinshill.f9.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri Jul 6 17:54:20 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152636 for opro ; Fri, 06 Jul 101 17:54:18 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994424427:20:03851:73; Fri, 06 Jul 2001 13:00:27 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2118822; 6 Jul 2001 12:59 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f66CxWi11716 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 6 Jul 2001 13:59:32 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f66CxTp11712 for ; Fri, 6 Jul 2001 13:59:29 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 15IVB5-000GnX-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Fri, 6 Jul 2001 12:57:47 +0000 Date: Fri, 06 Jul 2001 03:04:12 GMT Message-Id: <152610@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Superscript bug X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R >Can you describe what vertical shift does in terms of the leading? I think I >expect it to move the baseline within the overall leading set for the line, >but I don't think that's how it works in Opro. I don't think it does. It lets you move the baseline of text up or down, as much as you like. As with sub/super scripts if you move the baseline up the effective height of the line (for leading purposes) is increased whilst if you move it down there is no change. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri Jul 6 21:42:51 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152647 for opro ; Fri, 06 Jul 101 21:42:40 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994442418:10:10221:66; Fri, 06 Jul 2001 18:00:18 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1118862; 6 Jul 2001 18:00 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f66I11Q12525 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 6 Jul 2001 19:01:01 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.91]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f66I0wp12522 for ; Fri, 6 Jul 2001 19:00:58 +0100 Received: from tarazen.demon.co.uk ([193.237.156.226] helo=tarazen) by anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15IZtR-000Mt4-0X for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Fri, 6 Jul 2001 18:59:54 +0100 Date: Fri, 06 Jul 2001 16:46:13 +0100 From: Jon Keates To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Superscript bug Message-ID: References: <152610@pilling.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <152610@pilling.demon.co.uk> X-Organization: Just as it comes User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.50a (MsgServe/1.50) (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 X-Editor: StrongEd 4.63 X-wotsthese: let me know Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R In message <152610@pilling.demon.co.uk> opro@pilling.demon.co.uk (David Pilling) once upon a time wrote : MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > >Can you describe what vertical shift does in terms of the leading? I think I > >expect it to move the baseline within the overall leading set for the line, > >but I don't think that's how it works in Opro. > > I don't think it does. It lets you move the baseline of text up or down, > as much as you like. As with sub/super scripts if you move the baseline > up the effective height of the line (for leading purposes) is increased > whilst if you move it down there is no change. > I know very little about such things, but I would have thought that if Lock to Grid was set then it should override all other minor alterations that affect baseline or leading, but it doesn't appear to as regards super/sub and V shift. -- Jon -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Sat Jul 7 01:50:33 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152664 for opro ; Sat, 07 Jul 101 01:50:29 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994459027:20:28391:67; Fri, 06 Jul 2001 22:37:07 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2118870; 6 Jul 2001 22:36 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f66Mbbg13017 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 6 Jul 2001 23:37:37 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from finch-post-11.mail.demon.net (finch-post-11.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.39]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f66MbZp13014 for ; Fri, 6 Jul 2001 23:37:35 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by finch-post-11.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15IeCP-000EVU-0B for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Fri, 6 Jul 2001 22:35:45 +0000 Date: Fri, 06 Jul 2001 21:52:12 GMT Message-Id: <152650@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Superscript bug X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >I would have thought that if Lock to Grid was set then it should override >all other minor alterations that affect baseline or leading, but it doesn't >appear to as regards super/sub and V shift. I believe lock to grid does work correctly, it locks the baseline of the line containing shifted text to the grid. It doesn't lock the baseline of the shifted text of course, how could it, since there may be many different shifts in one line. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Sat Jul 7 03:26:19 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152670 for opro ; Sat, 07 Jul 101 03:26:18 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994466901:20:27172:65; Sat, 07 Jul 2001 00:48:21 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2119916; 7 Jul 2001 0:48 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f670nds13253 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 7 Jul 2001 01:49:39 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from finch-post-12.mail.demon.net (finch-post-12.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.41]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f670nbp13249 for ; Sat, 7 Jul 2001 01:49:37 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by finch-post-12.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15IgGB-000JQs-0C for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 7 Jul 2001 00:47:47 +0000 Date: Fri, 06 Jul 2001 23:41:47 GMT Message-Id: <152661@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Ovation Pro 2.65 X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro OvationPro 2.65 is now available for testing, from http://www.davidpilling.net/ovationpro/upgrade/op265.zip I can but repeat my warning with 2.64... "I say for 'testing' because this version has some new features which may well have problems. One of the main new things is support for variable sized spaces in text, as a result documents saved from 2.64 or later won't load into earlier versions. So don't use this version to edit your lifes work just yet." 2.65 should fix the sub/superscript problems introduced in 2.64 and it also fixes a bad clipping problem with printing more than one page on a sheet of paper. You'll need a copy of Ovation Pro 2.60 or later to upgrade from. Don't all rush because this is a bit fiddly and I may have got it wrong. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Sat Jul 7 14:11:47 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152673 for opro ; Sat, 07 Jul 101 14:11:43 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994487708:20:11605:65; Sat, 07 Jul 2001 06:35:08 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2106848; 7 Jul 2001 6:35 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f676aAJ13755 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 7 Jul 2001 07:36:10 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net (altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net [193.67.237.6]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f676a7p13752 for ; Sat, 7 Jul 2001 07:36:07 +0100 Received: from padua by altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net via 1Cust51.tnt50.rtm1.nl.uu.net [213.117.18.51] with SMTP for id IAA15266 (8.8.8/1.3); Sat, 7 Jul 2001 08:34:16 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <001d01c106ae$f16419f0$4d01a8c0@padua> From: "Tonnie Demarteau" To: References: <152610@pilling.demon.co.uk> Subject: Re: Superscript bug Date: Sat, 7 Jul 2001 08:33:05 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Fri 06 Jul, Jon Keates wrote: > In message <152610@pilling.demon.co.uk> > opro@pilling.demon.co.uk (David Pilling) once upon a time wrote : > > >Can you describe what vertical shift does in terms of the leading? I think > > >I expect it to move the baseline within the overall leading set for the > > >line, but I don't think that's how it works in Opro. > > > > I don't think it does. It lets you move the baseline of text up or down, > > as much as you like. As with sub/super scripts if you move the baseline > > up the effective height of the line (for leading purposes) is increased > > whilst if you move it down there is no change. > > > > I know very little about such things, but I would have > thought that if Lock to Grid was set then it should override > all other minor alterations that affect baseline or leading, > but it doesn't appear to as regards super/sub and V shift. > As far as I know, there are *two* base lines: One in the font definition of the currently selected font (a guideline for all the characters in the font) and one in the document (the nearest horizontal line in the grid). When you set 'Lock to Grid' the baseline of the currently selected font is locked to the nearest horizontal line in the grid. As far as I understand it: Regardless, whether or not you have set 'Lock to grid' 1) the shape of the characters, 2) the angle of the verticals in the shape with the font base line 3) the angle of the whole shape with the font base line 4) the colour of the shape and the background of the character box 5) the width of each character (that is shape + 'white' space) and 6) their position in the fontbox (minimal height, needed for the largest shapes) can be manipulated without changing the choosen fontsize and leading. Maybe also other 'things'. Examples: 1) small caps and the (resized) small shapes, needed for subscript and superscript, changed aspect ratio (Condensed and Extended) 2) skewing (making Obliques or Slanted) 3) rotating 4) inverse or colour change (and font background blending) 5) auto kerning (making use of kerndata in the font) and tracking (adding 'white' space) 6) V-shift (moving the shape up or down) Notes: You also can apply a combination of 1 to 6. When you apply a large V-shift (up or down) to a selection, this selection can cross or even pass the line of text above or beneath this V-shifted selection Auto kerning can only be applied to paragraphs. mrs. Tonnie Demarteau - the Netherlands -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Sat Jul 7 16:20:01 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152684 for opro ; Sat, 07 Jul 101 16:20:00 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994514161:20:20662:67; Sat, 07 Jul 2001 13:56:01 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2126867; 7 Jul 2001 13:55 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f67DtS914386 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 7 Jul 2001 14:55:28 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f67DtQp14383 for ; Sat, 7 Jul 2001 14:55:26 +0100 Received: from userbk65.uk.uudial.com ([62.188.144.73] helo=argonet.co.uk) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 15IsRr-00025l-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 07 Jul 2001 14:48:40 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Tanner Family To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sat, 07 Jul 2001 14:48:43 +0100 Subject: Re: Superscript bug Message-ID: <4a965ced4attehtann@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <152610@pilling.demon.co.uk> References: <152610@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02d (RISC-OS/3.70) POPstar/2.01b12 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <152610@pilling.demon.co.uk>, David Pilling wrote: > >Can you describe what vertical shift does in terms of the leading? I > >think I expect it to move the baseline within the overall leading set > >for the line, but I don't think that's how it works in Opro. > I don't think it does. It lets you move the baseline of text up or down, > as much as you like. As with sub/super scripts if you move the baseline > up the effective height of the line (for leading purposes) is increased > whilst if you move it down there is no change. Hmm, When I worked on a professional typesetting system in the early 80s, superscript and subscript had no effect on the line leading. Where a typeface didn't have superscripts / subscripts, they were simulated by a reduced size and shoving the effective baseline up for the superscript and back down, or down for the subscript and back up. I don't think superscripts necessarily aligned with the cap height though. Or, indeed, subscripts with the descender. Cheers Tom Regards (PC) / Love from (non PC but nicer) [delete as applicable] Thos -- T. R. Tanner email: ttehtann@argonet.co.uk web page: http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/ttehtann Warning: Here be random taglines! .... If you know, you're a genius. If you answer, you're awesome. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 9 22:13:51 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152687 for opro ; Mon, 09 Jul 101 22:13:47 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994531318:10:15332:65; Sat, 07 Jul 2001 18:41:58 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1015026; 7 Jul 2001 18:41 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f67IgtJ14829 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 7 Jul 2001 19:42:55 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from alpha.netvision.net.il (alpha.netvision.net.il [194.90.1.13]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f67Ignp14826 for ; Sat, 7 Jul 2001 19:42:50 +0100 Received: from netvision.net.il (ras6-p5.jlm.netvision.net.il [62.0.150.5]) by alpha.netvision.net.il (8.9.3/8.8.6) with ESMTP id VAA01997 for ; Sat, 7 Jul 2001 21:40:53 +0300 (IDT) Message-ID: <3B4757AB.F593C647@netvision.net.il> Date: Sat, 07 Jul 2001 21:40:43 +0300 From: Michael Ben-Gershon Organization: My Office X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.19 i686) X-Accept-Language: en-GB, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: DDL question References: <152074@pilling.demon.co.uk> <4a93531c12paul@delink.nl> <4a935dc66fdfs@ukgateway.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R This message may have been missed in all the excitement about the super/subscripts, so I am repeating it! ------------------------------------------------------------------- Is it possible to specify a document zoom value in a DDL file? Michael Ben-Gershon mybg@netvision.net.il -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 9 22:14:05 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152693 for opro ; Mon, 09 Jul 101 22:14:03 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994534421:20:29199:65; Sat, 07 Jul 2001 19:33:41 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2103568; 7 Jul 2001 19:33 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f67JZFt14997 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 7 Jul 2001 20:35:15 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from mail11.svr.pol.co.uk (mail11.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.23]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f67JZDp14994 for ; Sat, 7 Jul 2001 20:35:13 +0100 Received: from modem-29.anfauglith.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.110.29] helo=worthy) by mail11.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 15IxpL-0001O0-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 07 Jul 2001 20:33:15 +0100 Date: Sat, 07 Jul 2001 20:33:10 +0100 From: Tim Howarth To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Screen update on Viewfinder Message-ID: <46767c964a%tim@worthy.demon.co.uk> X-Organization: Home X-Mailer: Messenger v1.41c for RISC OS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.67 User-Agent: POPstar/2.02 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R Whilst trying to covert some old Impression Publisher files to Ovation Pro on a RiscPC fitted with a Viewfinder graphics card the screen update seems very slow. Impression updates quickly even in 16m colour modes whereas OP seems very "floppy", pages seem to slowly appear rather than just appearing. Hmmmm, the easiest demonstration is when clicking a minimized doc to full screen height - with Impression, the window furniture hits the bottom of the screen then the contents appear, with OP the furniture appears then the window very slowly clears to backround (down the page) and text quickly appears in a single action. It looks as if OP clears the document area one line of text at a time (even with a blank page) does OP do its own screen clearing which is slow because of transfer across podule bus ? or is it simply that it clears a line at a time rather than a single rectangle ? Can OP be speeded up (apart from switching down colour depth) ? -- ___ |im ---- ARM Powered ---- -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 9 22:14:11 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152695 for opro ; Mon, 09 Jul 101 22:14:07 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994544568:20:24169:65; Sat, 07 Jul 2001 22:22:48 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2111212; 7 Jul 2001 22:22 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f67MO1V15253 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 7 Jul 2001 23:24:01 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from warrior-outbound.servers.plus.net ([212.159.14.227]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f67MNxp15250 for ; Sat, 7 Jul 2001 23:23:59 +0100 Received: (qmail 4662 invoked from network); 7 Jul 2001 22:21:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO tinshill.force9.net) (212.159.17.44) by warrior with SMTP; 7 Jul 2001 22:21:50 -0000 Date: Sat, 7 Jul 2001 23:13:52 +0100 (BST) From: Anthony Hilton Subject: Vertical shift (was Re: Superscript bug) To: Ovation Pro List In-Reply-To: <4a965ced4attehtann@argonet.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R In on Sat 07 Jul, Tanner Family wrote: > In article <152610@pilling.demon.co.uk>, > David Pilling wrote: > > > >Can you describe what vertical shift does in terms of the leading? I > > >think I expect it to move the baseline within the overall leading set > > >for the line, but I don't think that's how it works in Opro. > > > I don't think it does. It lets you move the baseline of text up or down, > > as much as you like. As with sub/super scripts if you move the baseline > > up the effective height of the line (for leading purposes) is increased > > whilst if you move it down there is no change. > > Hmm, When I worked on a professional typesetting system in the early 80s, > superscript and subscript had no effect on the line leading. Where a > typeface didn't have superscripts / subscripts, they were simulated by a > reduced size and shoving the effective baseline up for the superscript and > back down, or down for the subscript and back up. I don't think > superscripts necessarily aligned with the cap height though. Or, indeed, > subscripts with the descender. Sorry to confuse. I think I should have changed the subject with my first posting (above). I expect the sub/super script to work as Tom described. My enquiry was because vertical shift seems to increase the effective leading if taken beyond a particular point, for example a vertical shift of 50% for part of a line produces the effect that the rest of the line has been shifted down instead of pushing the vertically shifted bit into the line above, unless the text has been Locked to grid. I think it should behave the same regardless of whether lock to grid is ticked or not, to move the text relative to the normal baseline, and not move the baseline of any unshifted text in the line. Further playing reveals that once text has been locked to the grid, even if that option has been unticked again, the vertical shift does not affect the position of the rest of the line. OPro 2.62 - have I skimmed the announcements of changes in later versions and missed something which has affected this behaviour? I think that if I was wanting interesting, varied position within the line I would probably not expect to lock baselines to grid. (David, if I've previously asked about this and you've said it is not possible to change this behaviour I apologise, but the discussion on superscripts raised it in my mind again.) Anthony Hilton -- ajh@tinshill.f9.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 9 22:14:12 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152696 for opro ; Mon, 09 Jul 101 22:14:10 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994547125:10:24916:66; Sat, 07 Jul 2001 23:05:25 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1104611; 7 Jul 2001 23:05 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f67N6Dl15369 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 8 Jul 2001 00:06:13 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f67N6Ap15366 for ; Sun, 8 Jul 2001 00:06:10 +0100 Received: from omba.demon.co.uk ([158.152.58.5]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 15J17T-0002Jd-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 7 Jul 2001 23:04:11 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Jeremy C B Nicoll To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sun, 08 Jul 2001 00:00:54 +0100 Subject: Re: DDL question Message-ID: <4a968f7b1dJeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <3B4757AB.F593C647@netvision.net.il> References: <152074@pilling.demon.co.uk> <4a93531c12paul@delink.nl> <4a935dc66fdfs@ukgateway.net> <3B4757AB.F593C647@netvision. User-Agent: Pluto/2.01g (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On 07 Jul, Michael Ben-Gershon wrote: > This message may have been missed in all the excitement about the > super/subscripts, so I am repeating it! > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > Is it possible to specify a document zoom value in a DDL > file? Don't know. Why are you asking this in the middle of a thread about something else? Why not creat a new discussion thread? -- Jeremy C B Nicoll - my opinions are my own. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 9 22:14:26 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152701 for opro ; Mon, 09 Jul 101 22:14:24 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994584912:20:01174:65; Sun, 08 Jul 2001 09:35:12 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2129602; 8 Jul 2001 9:35 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f689aBx16063 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 8 Jul 2001 10:36:11 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from alpha.netvision.net.il (alpha.netvision.net.il [194.90.1.13]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f689a6p16060 for ; Sun, 8 Jul 2001 10:36:06 +0100 Received: from netvision.net.il (ras4-p129.jlm.netvision.net.il [62.0.147.129]) by alpha.netvision.net.il (8.9.3/8.8.6) with ESMTP id MAA11092; Sun, 8 Jul 2001 12:34:02 +0300 (IDT) Message-ID: <3B482900.C81FA63E@netvision.net.il> Date: Sun, 08 Jul 2001 12:33:52 +0300 From: Michael Ben-Gershon Organization: My Office X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.19 i686) X-Accept-Language: en-GB, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk, Jeremy C B Nicoll Subject: Re: DDL question References: <152074@pilling.demon.co.uk> <4a93531c12paul@delink.nl> <4a935dc66fdfs@ukgateway.net> <3B4757AB.F593C647@netvision. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Jeremy C B Nicoll wrote: > > On 07 Jul, Michael Ben-Gershon wrote: > > This message may have been missed in all the excitement about the > > super/subscripts, so I am repeating it! > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > Is it possible to specify a document zoom value in a DDL > > file? > > Don't know. Why are you asking this in the middle of a thread about > something else? Why not creat a new discussion thread? Why do you think this is in the middle of another thread? Did you care to look at the subject? All it has is 'DDL question'. Nothing else. All I was saying was that there had been an animated discussion of super/subscripts and that this other thread may have been overlooked in all the excitement. Before criticising so sharply, please pause for a moment and think. Michael Ben-Gershon mybg@netvision.net.il -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 9 22:14:36 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152706 for opro ; Mon, 09 Jul 101 22:14:33 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994590473:10:09142:67; Sun, 08 Jul 2001 11:07:53 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1008953; 8 Jul 2001 11:07 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f68B9HR16239 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 8 Jul 2001 12:09:17 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.91]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f68B9Ep16236 for ; Sun, 8 Jul 2001 12:09:14 +0100 Received: from omba.demon.co.uk ([158.152.58.5]) by anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15JCPg-000JBN-0X; Sun, 8 Jul 2001 12:07:45 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Jeremy C B Nicoll To: Michael Ben-Gershon Cc: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sun, 08 Jul 2001 11:57:43 +0100 Subject: Re: DDL question Message-ID: <4a96d11adaJeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <3B482900.C81FA63E@netvision.net.il> References: <152074@pilling.demon.co.uk> <4a93531c12paul@delink.nl> <4a935dc66fdfs@ukgateway.net> <3B4757AB.F593C647@netvision. User-Agent: Pluto/2.01g (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On 08 Jul, Michael Ben-Gershon wrote: > Jeremy C B Nicoll wrote: > > > > On 07 Jul, Michael Ben-Gershon wrote: > > > This message may have been missed in all the excitement about the > > > super/subscripts, so I am repeating it! > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > Is it possible to specify a document zoom value in a DDL > > > file? > > > > Don't know. Why are you asking this in the middle of a thread about > > something else? Why not creat a new discussion thread? > Why do you think this is in the middle of another thread? Did > you care to look at the subject? All it has is 'DDL question'. > Nothing else. Because a "thread" isn't just determined by subject. Each message that is written has a unique message-id, and when someone replies to an existing message the reply's header contains the information of what message it is being replied to. Your message was in reply to one on another thread. This would have happened because when you chose to write your post you had a current message in this other thread selected, so your news reader supposed you were writing a reply. The fact that you altered the subject has nothing to do with it. To post something that isn't a reply to an article already in a thread you need not to have an existing message selected. In *my* newsreader software I generally highlight the newsgroup name rather than a message within it to achieve this. The significance of this who-replied-to-what structure is that suitable software (eg !Pluto which I use) can then display the structure of the thread; in general this helps to show sub-threads and who replied to the sub-threads rather than the main thread. It also shows the structure regardless of the order in which replies arrive at the reader. > All I was saying was that there had been an animated discussion of > super/subscripts and that this other thread may have been overlooked > in all the excitement. > Before criticising so sharply, please pause for a moment and think. > Michael Ben-Gershon > mybg@netvision.net.il -- Jeremy C B Nicoll - my opinions are my own. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 9 22:14:39 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152707 for opro ; Mon, 09 Jul 101 22:14:37 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994597820:20:28905:65; Sun, 08 Jul 2001 13:10:20 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2028860; 8 Jul 2001 13:10 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f68DBB416420 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 8 Jul 2001 14:11:11 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from alpha.netvision.net.il (alpha.netvision.net.il [194.90.1.13]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f68DB5p16417 for ; Sun, 8 Jul 2001 14:11:06 +0100 Received: from netvision.net.il (ras6-p20.jlm.netvision.net.il [62.0.150.20]) by alpha.netvision.net.il (8.9.3/8.8.6) with ESMTP id QAA14319 for ; Sun, 8 Jul 2001 16:08:59 +0300 (IDT) Message-ID: <3B485B61.64DC18DD@netvision.net.il> Date: Sun, 08 Jul 2001 16:08:49 +0300 From: Michael Ben-Gershon Organization: My Office X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.19 i686) X-Accept-Language: en-GB, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: DDL question Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro This message may have been missed in all the excitement about the super/subscripts, so I am repeating it! It would seem that it somehow got mixed up in another thread which may have confused some of you! ------------------------------------------------------------------- Is it possible to specify a document zoom value in a DDL file? Michael Ben-Gershon mybg@netvision.net.il -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 9 22:15:04 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152713 for opro ; Mon, 09 Jul 101 22:15:03 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994664752:10:14969:67; Mon, 09 Jul 2001 07:45:52 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1127800; 9 Jul 2001 7:45 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f697ll917669 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 9 Jul 2001 08:47:47 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from stolly.southnet.co.nz (stolly.southnet.co.nz [202.49.115.1]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f697lhp17666 for ; Mon, 9 Jul 2001 08:47:43 +0100 Received: from danmccat.southnet.co.nz (p19.netserver1-dn.southnet.co.nz [202.36.220.149]) by stolly.southnet.co.nz (8.11.1/8.11.1) with SMTP id f697Nrq28347 for ; Mon, 9 Jul 2001 19:23:54 +1200 Date: Mon, 9 Jul 2001 20:22:58 +1300 (BST) From: Dan McCarthy Subject: Re: DDL question To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk In-Reply-To: <4a96d11adaJeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Organisation name, location. Telephone/Fax? X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.46] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Sun 08 Jul, Jeremy C B Nicoll wrote: > On 08 Jul, Michael Ben-Gershon wrote: > > Jeremy C B Nicoll wrote: > > The significance of this who-replied-to-what structure is that suitable > software (eg !Pluto which I use) can then display the structure of the > thread; in general this helps to show sub-threads and who replied to the > sub-threads rather than the main thread. It also shows the structure > regardless of the order in which replies arrive at the reader. > In my view a case of software being too damn clever for its own good. > Actually I wasn't aware of any of this - I thought to suject line was it. Who knows how much of my wisdom as been wound in on the wrong thread? ------- Dan McCarthy, 8 Kings Avenue, Dunedin, New Zealand. danmccat@deepsouth.co.nz THE STEEP BIRANCAS OPERATION - HEAT TREATED ICE -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon Jul 9 22:15:06 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152714 for opro ; Mon, 09 Jul 101 22:15:04 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994660936:20:24352:65; Mon, 09 Jul 2001 06:42:16 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2023813; 9 Jul 2001 6:41 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f696fBv17505 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 9 Jul 2001 07:41:11 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from cmailg1.svr.pol.co.uk (cmailg1.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.195.171]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f696f3p17502 for ; Mon, 9 Jul 2001 07:41:08 +0100 Received: from modem-121.south-dakota.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.92.121] helo=freeserve.co.uk) by cmailg1.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 15JUgv-0004js-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Mon, 09 Jul 2001 07:38:46 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: "Robin A. Hampshire" To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sun, 08 Jul 2001 19:13:51 +0100 Subject: Re: DDL question Message-ID: <4a96f9091brah@brushford.fsnet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <3B407D3C.DF4F5BBC@netvision.net.il> References: <152074@pilling.demon.co.uk> <4a93531c12paul@delink.nl> <4a935dc66fdfs@ukgateway.net> <3B407D3C.DF4F5BBC@netvision. User-Agent: Pluto/2.02d (RISC-OS/4.02) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <3B407D3C.DF4F5BBC@netvision.net.il>, Michael Ben-Gershon wrote: > Is it possible to specify a document zoom value in a DDL file? > Michael Ben-Gershon mybg@netvision.net.il The way I test for various features of DDL is to create a small OPro file containing just the feature to be tested, then save out as DDL. You can then inspect the DDL file in a text editor to see what's been created. Using that system, zoom factors do not seem to be saved out with DDL created by OPro. -- Robin Hampshire rah@brushford.fsnet.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 10 03:01:23 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152747 for opro ; Tue, 10 Jul 101 03:01:20 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994727505:10:09980:68; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 01:11:45 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1009937; 10 Jul 2001 1:11 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6A1Dk819407 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 02:13:46 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from finch-post-10.mail.demon.net (finch-post-10.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.38]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6A1Dcp19399 for ; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 02:13:38 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by finch-post-10.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15Jm3T-000LBK-0A for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 01:11:11 +0000 Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2001 02:04:23 GMT Message-Id: <152742@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Vertical shift (was Re: Superscript bug) X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >I think it should behave the same regardless of whether lock to grid is >ticked or not, to move the text relative to the normal baseline, and not >move the baseline of any unshifted text in the line. Ignore the bit about baseline grids. I believe the decision was made to make it work exactly the opposite way to what you suggest at some stage in the development - wish I could remember the logic, because interestingly Impression works the other way. You can of course change the leading if you want the text in one line to lie on top of another. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 10 03:01:23 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152748 for opro ; Tue, 10 Jul 101 03:01:20 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994727508:20:27112:65; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 01:11:48 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2127197; 10 Jul 2001 1:11 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6A1Cxg19382 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 02:12:59 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from finch-post-10.mail.demon.net (finch-post-10.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.38]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6A1Cvp19379 for ; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 02:12:57 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by finch-post-10.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15Jm2n-000LBK-0A for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 01:10:30 +0000 Date: Mon, 09 Jul 2001 22:21:45 GMT Message-Id: <152720@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: DDL question X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Sorry for missing the question, no DDL can't save doc zoom values. The idea was that DDL only saves document structure and nothing concerned with the appearance of the document. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue Jul 10 03:01:27 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA152749 for opro ; Tue, 10 Jul 101 03:01:24 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 994727505:10:10058:67; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 01:11:45 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1128456; 10 Jul 2001 1:11 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f6A1Djf19404 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 02:13:45 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: omega.barnet.ac.uk: majordomo set sender to owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk using -f Received: from finch-post-10.mail.demon.net (finch-post-10.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.38]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f6A1Dbp19395 for ; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 02:13:37 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by finch-post-10.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 15Jm3R-000LBK-0A for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 10 Jul 2001 01:11:09 +0000 Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2001 01:58:02 GMT Message-Id: <152740@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Screen update on Viewfinder X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >Impression updates quickly even in 16m colour modes whereas OP seems >very "floppy", pages seem to slowly appear rather than just appearing. I'm going to deny that OPro is slower than Impression. You need to tie down the problem area to something specific. For example if you've got OPro set up to render CMYK inks realistically then CMYK sprites will be much slower than Impression which is just blasting them onto screen without bothering about the colours. You can turn off this feature in OPro. But main the point is that this is something specific. >It looks as if OP clears the document area one line of text at a time >(even with a blank page) does OP do its own screen clearing which is >slow because of transfer across podule bus ? or is it simply that it >clears a line at a time rather than a single rectangle ? But why in the situation you describe, would *OPro* be clearing the screen? There are situations where OPro will rub out text areas a line at a time, but these are when editing text or moving frames around, not on any old screen refresh. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@li