From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 1 15:05:02 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149486 for opro ; Tue, 01 May 101 15:05:00 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988704488:20:14488:65; Tue, 01 May 2001 08:08:08 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2118411; 1 May 2001 8:07 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4186M300835 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 1 May 2001 09:06:22 +0100 Received: from inca.sle.sharp.co.uk (root@[193.114.241.3]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4186H500826 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 09:06:17 +0100 Received: from sharp.co.uk (aardog.sle.sharp.co.uk [192.16.16.173]) by inca.sle.sharp.co.uk (8.8.8+Sun/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA24568 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 09:03:29 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <3AEE6E8F.C76830BF@sharp.co.uk> Date: Tue, 01 May 2001 09:06:39 +0100 From: Graham Jones Organization: Sharp Laboratories of Europe X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (WinNT; U) X-Accept-Language: en,pdf MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Two separate questions - kernig &  hard spaces References: <149440@pilling.demon.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro David Pilling wrote: > > According to Graham Jones: > >1. With no text selected the "Modify Text" dialog should have a > >Kern option (according to the manual). > > This is an old one. A decision was made to change this behaviour after > the 1996 manual went to press, but before the first version of the program > appeared. Ooops, sorry, I didn't realise. I can't seem to find an option to apply kerning by hand - is that because there just isn't one at all? > >2. Hard spaces don't seem to produce a fixed length space in > >justified text! > > Some effort has gone into making this the way things work. Eh? But what if I want (and I quite often do) a fixed, normal length, space in some justified text? I can think of several examples where it is useful. Graham. PS. Sorry for posting the last message from my non sub-scribed account, I thought it would look like it came from this account! -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 1 15:05:13 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149490 for opro ; Tue, 01 May 101 15:05:11 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988717945:10:06270:69; Tue, 01 May 2001 11:52:25 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1125777; 1 May 2001 11:52 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f41Bog401960 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 1 May 2001 12:50:42 +0100 Received: from hobbit.iso.port.ac.uk (IDENT:exim@hobbit.iso.port.ac.uk [148.197.1.4]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f41Boc501957 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 12:50:38 +0100 Received: from [148.197.249.149] (helo=ARMless) by hobbit.iso.port.ac.uk with smtp (Exim 3.14 #2) id 14uYfz-0008Qx-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 01 May 2001 12:50:43 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Simon Young To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Tue, 01 May 2001 12:53:49 +0100 Subject: Re: Two separate questions - kernig & ? hard spaces Message-ID: <4a73d16663simon.young@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <3AEE6E8F.C76830BF@sharp.co.uk> References: <149440@pilling.demon.co.uk> <3AEE6E8F.C76830BF@sharp.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02d (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <3AEE6E8F.C76830BF@sharp.co.uk>, Graham Jones wrote: > Eh? But what if I want (and I quite often do) a fixed, normal length, > space in some justified text? I can think of several examples where it > is useful. Indeed, for example one uses a hard space to sepatate units from a number, so that the "word" of number and units remains unbroken. -- Simon A. Young BPharm MRPharmS PhD | Tel: 023-9284-3610 Lecturer in Pharmaceutics | Fax: 023-9284-3565 University of Portsmouth |e-mail: simon.young@port.ac.uk ================================================================== Please visit our web-site located at: http://www.sci.port.ac.uk/pharmacy/drug_del.htm http://userwww.port.ac.uk/youngs ================================================================== -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 1 15:05:35 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149492 for opro ; Tue, 01 May 101 15:05:34 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988712911:20:17377:69; Tue, 01 May 2001 10:28:31 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab2016980; 1 May 2001 10:28 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f41AOtQ01464 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 1 May 2001 11:24:55 +0100 Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f41AOp501461 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 11:24:52 +0100 Received: from [62.188.143.145] (helo=62.188.143.145) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 14uXIr-0001fp-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 01 May 2001 11:22:46 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: "Dr P.N.Young" To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Tue, 01 May 2001 06:28:11 +0100 Subject: Re: !POBar the end Message-ID: <4a73ae17c9pnyoung@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <149400@pilling.demon.co.uk> References: <149400@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02d (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <149400@pilling.demon.co.uk>, David Pilling wrote: > Hi, > >Thanks for trying it, and I am reassured. However, it gets odder. I > >have in front of me two bar-codes; one is on a letter from the Bank, > >put on by them, which is nearly the same as the one produced by POBar > >(just a few extra bars on the end in the Bank one). > Does it decode, and what to No, it gives 'bad four-bar sequence' errors. Best wishes, Peter. -- Peter \ / \ Prestbury, Cheltenham, Glos. Anne \ / __ __ \ England. Cecilia / / \ | | |\ | / _ \http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/pnyoung James / \__/ \_/ | \| \__/ \_____________ pnyoung@argonet.co.uk. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 1 15:06:03 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149498 for opro ; Tue, 01 May 101 15:05:59 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988722258:20:06349:82; Tue, 01 May 2001 13:04:18 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2129413; 1 May 2001 13:01 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f41CrBN02332 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 1 May 2001 13:53:11 +0100 Received: from blueyonder.co.uk (pcow035o.blueyonder.co.uk [195.188.53.121]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f41Cr7502329 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 13:53:07 +0100 Received: from goatly ([213.48.248.15]) by blueyonder.co.uk with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.687.68); Tue, 1 May 2001 12:54:38 +0000 Date: Tue, 01 May 2001 13:41:33 +0100 From: Bruce Goatly To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Two separate questions - kernig & ? hard spaces Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <4a73d16663simon.young@argonet.co.uk> X-Organization: Perfect Page X-Mailer: Messenger v1.41d for RISC OS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.61b User-Agent: POPstar/2.01b12 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R In message <4a73d16663simon.young@argonet.co.uk> Simon Young wrote: > In article <3AEE6E8F.C76830BF@sharp.co.uk>, Graham Jones > wrote: > > Eh? But what if I want (and I quite often do) a fixed, normal length, > > space in some justified text? I can think of several examples where it > > is useful. > > Indeed, for example one uses a hard space to sepatate units from a number, > so that the "word" of number and units remains unbroken. That's exactly right; we need to (be able to) distinguish between a non-breaking space and a *fixed* space; the two are not necessarily the same. And just because Quark uses expandable non-breaking spaces doesn't make it right. (Look at the difference between the front and back halves of Nature magazine, for example: the back half - Reviews, Articles and Letters - is set by an external typesetter using 3B2; the front half - all the newsy bits up to Brief Communications - is done in-house with Quark. The two packages treat the fixed space differently, and I know which I prefer.) Oh, dear. I hadn't realized that Ovation Pro did this. I was about to change over some of my professional scientific publications from Impression to OPro because of the greater flexibility of the latter; unfortunately, two of my clients won't accept a non-fixed space between number and unit (among other places). If I can't achieve it easily I'll have to stick with Impression for those jobs. Bruce Goatly -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 1 19:04:24 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149518 for opro ; Tue, 01 May 101 19:04:22 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988739767:10:22933:125; Tue, 01 May 2001 17:56:07 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1103296; 1 May 2001 17:55 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f41HsAV03590 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 1 May 2001 18:54:10 +0100 Received: from altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net (altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net [193.67.237.6]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f41Hs6503587 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 18:54:06 +0100 Received: from padua by altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net via 1Cust124.tnt30.rtm1.nl.uu.net [213.116.154.124] with SMTP for id TAA24012 (8.8.8/1.3); Tue, 1 May 2001 19:54:10 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <001501c0d267$e8c9fd30$4d01a8c0@padua> From: "Tonnie Demarteau" To: "Ovation Pro" References: <149440@pilling.demon.co.uk> <3AEE6E8F.C76830BF@sharp.co.uk> <4a73d16663simon.young@argonet.co.uk> Subject: Re: Two separate questions - kernig & ? hard spaces Date: Tue, 1 May 2001 19:54:53 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Tue 01 May, Simon Young wrote: ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2001 1:53 PM Subject: Re: Two separate questions - kernig & ? hard spaces > In article <3AEE6E8F.C76830BF@sharp.co.uk>, Graham Jones > wrote: > > Eh? But what if I want (and I quite often do) a fixed, normal length, > > space in some justified text? I can think of several examples where it > > is useful. > > Indeed, for example one uses a hard space to sepatate units from a number, > so that the "word" of number and units remains unbroken. There is a work-around by defining a style to apply tracking to a selection of a unit and the following number. Because a space and a non-broken space (ASCII 160) have also a proportional width, that differs from font to font, this tracking can't be the same for every font. For most fonts it is somewhere between 250 and 300 (em, I think, based on a scale of a design size of 1000). I have defined a style 'track 160 Trini(ty)' with the scope 'selection', that only contains 'text' --> 'tracking 250' switched on. For Homerton a style 'track 160 Homer(ton)' same scope, tracking 275. For condensed fonts, a lower value can be used, which you can find by trial and error ... Because there isn't a typed space (ASCII 32 nor ASCII 160) the 'space' created by the tracking remains a fixed white (or other background colour) and is part of the 'word'. So it remains unbroken. It isn't the nicest solution, but it works. Whether this also works in !pdf, I haven't tried ... mrs. Tonnie Demarteau - the Netherlands -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 1 22:10:51 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149521 for opro ; Tue, 01 May 101 22:10:49 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988743526:10:28047:68; Tue, 01 May 2001 18:58:46 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1027433; 1 May 2001 18:57 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f41Ikeb03977 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 1 May 2001 19:46:40 +0100 Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.90]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f41IkW503971 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 19:46:36 +0100 Received: from cartmell.demon.co.uk ([158.152.204.98]) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 14ufAO-000Cqp-0W for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 1 May 2001 19:46:32 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: John Cartmell To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Tue, 01 May 2001 19:47:47 +0100 Subject: Re: Two separate questions - kernig & ? hard spaces Message-ID: <4a73f74c9ajohn@cartmell.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <149512@pilling.demon.co.uk> References: <149512@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02d (RISC-OS/4.02) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <149512@pilling.demon.co.uk>, David Pilling wrote: > >Ooops, sorry, I didn't realise. I can't seem to find an option to apply > >kerning by hand - is that because there just isn't one at all? > There is a way, you use the key presses, Control and ; ' (or with > shift). Internally this works by applying some tracking, which some > people don't like. Having checked it (it's surprising what you miss!) I'd like to know why ' repeats but ; doesn't ? -- John Cartmell - Manchester, UK Fleur Designs -- FD Games - - - compact designer board games at: Acorn/RISC OS Show - - - Thornes Park Stadium, Wakefield 19th & 20th May 2001 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 1 22:10:52 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149522 for opro ; Tue, 01 May 101 22:10:49 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988741642:20:13935:80; Tue, 01 May 2001 18:27:22 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2120730; 1 May 2001 18:26 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f41I24403665 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 1 May 2001 19:02:04 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f41I1w503658 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 19:01:58 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 14ueTH-000Joe-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 1 May 2001 18:01:59 +0000 Date: Tue, 01 May 2001 18:28:14 GMT Message-Id: <149512@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Two separate questions - kernig & ? hard spaces X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >Ooops, sorry, I didn't realise. I can't seem to find an option to apply >kerning by hand - is that because there just isn't one at all? There is a way, you use the key presses, Control and ; ' (or with shift). Internally this works by applying some tracking, which some people don't like. >Eh? But what if I want (and I quite often do) a fixed, normal length, space >in some justified text? I can think of several examples where it is useful. I guess there are different ways of arguing as the postings above indicate. How about if I provided the following... A new entity in text, called 'space' which gives a fixed vertical and horizontal movement. There would be a dialogue box to enter the size of the shifts, a button to make it non-breaking and you could enter shifts either as absolute (feet and inches) or as a fraction of the text size. Then there would be a few more predefined macros {emspace} etc. to allow easy insertion with a key press. Feel free to make suggestions or tell me how Quark etc. does it. There might for the time being be a horrible workaround by applying tracking to a space. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 1 22:10:57 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149524 for opro ; Tue, 01 May 101 22:10:54 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988742510:20:28935:73; Tue, 01 May 2001 18:41:50 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2118786; 1 May 2001 18:41 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f41I22P03663 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 1 May 2001 19:02:02 +0100 Received: from mta01-svc.ntlworld.com (mta01-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.41]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f418WI501033 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 09:32:18 +0100 Received: from riscpc.at.home ([213.107.105.170]) by mta01-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.27 201-229-119-110) with SMTP id <20010501083224.IWKP283.mta01-svc.ntlworld.com@riscpc.at.home> for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 09:32:24 +0100 Date: Tue, 01 May 2001 09:32:06 +0100 From: John Pettigrew To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: hard spaces (was Re: two separate questions...) Message-ID: References: <149440@pilling.demon.co.uk> <3AEE6E8F.C76830BF@sharp.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <3AEE6E8F.C76830BF@sharp.co.uk> X-Organization: XL Cambridge User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.10d (MsgServe/1.10) (RISC-OS/4.02) X-Editor: Zap, using ZapEmail 0.22 (27 Nov 1998) patch-3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In a previous message, Graham Jones wrote: > David Pilling wrote: > > > > According to Graham Jones: > > >2. Hard spaces don't seem to produce a fixed length space in justified > > >text! > > > > Some effort has gone into making this the way things work. > > Eh? But what if I want (and I quite often do) a fixed, normal length, space > in some justified text? I can think of several examples where it is useful. Then you need an en or em space, or some other variant. A hard space is not a fixed-length space but a non-breaking space. That is, if I type 'test text' with a hard space between the words, OvPro will not put a line break between the words. This is very useful in lots of publishing work as it saves a lot of tedious mucking around to get the layout right. For example, if I write "the plank was 9 m long" then I don't want the "9" on one line and the "m" on the next line. What length of space do you need and why? That is, what is a 'normal' space in justified text? John -- John Pettigrew XL Cambridge - Contract and freelance editing and writing Life sciences specialist - molecular biology, genetics, biotechnology john@xl-cambridge.com http://www.xl-cambridge.com/ -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 1 22:11:03 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149526 for opro ; Tue, 01 May 101 22:10:59 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988743961:20:24737:68; Tue, 01 May 2001 19:06:01 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2024260; 1 May 2001 19:05 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f41I25H03666 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 1 May 2001 19:02:05 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f41I20503661 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 19:02:01 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 14ueTJ-000Joe-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 1 May 2001 18:02:02 +0000 Date: Tue, 01 May 2001 18:37:44 GMT Message-Id: <149514@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: OPro news (new manuals) X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Hi, When I bought Ovation Pro off Beebug (nearly two years ago now), I got all their stock, which included about 250 'packs' i.e. the boxes and manuals that come with Ovation Pro. Those packs are now exhausted and I've had to repackage the product. So Ovation Pro now comes with an A5 white PVC 3 ring binder in a slip case. (funnily enough just like the Impression packaging). The binder contains the manual as on the CD printed out. At the upcoming Wakefield show, there will be a couple of stands demoing Ovation Pro and they'll have copies of the new packs. Anyway this is very nice, a bit more of the Beebug legacy disposed of, and John van Vredenburch's hard work on the manual appears in print at last. If anyone wants a copy of the new manual then I've set a price of ukp 25 all inclusive. This seems high to me, but its a heavy item and a small print run. For most people using the manual on the CD will be the best thing. A lot of others don't like manuals or don't read them. or you can print it yourself. Turning to the script language manual. I can have some of these printed. Basically two formats are on offer. Either a wire bound manual (which is handy) or a set of 3 hole punched pages that will fit in the above binders (easy to change). If anyone is interested in a script language manual drop me an email. I'll see how high the level of interest is, and in what format (I'm unlikely to support both) before getting the script language manuals printed. Price would be less than 10 pounds all inc. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 1 22:11:20 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149531 for opro ; Tue, 01 May 101 22:11:18 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988745075:20:14565:66; Tue, 01 May 2001 19:24:35 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2112408; 1 May 2001 19:24 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f41JO1F04435 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 1 May 2001 20:24:01 +0100 Received: from alpha.netvision.net.il (alpha.netvision.net.il [194.90.1.13]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f41JNt504432 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 20:23:56 +0100 Received: from netvision.net.il (ras6-p16.jlm.netvision.net.il [62.0.150.16]) by alpha.netvision.net.il (8.9.3/8.8.6) with ESMTP id WAA18716 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 22:23:57 +0300 (IDT) Message-ID: <3AEF0D80.39264257@netvision.net.il> Date: Tue, 01 May 2001 22:24:48 +0300 From: Michael Ben-Gershon Organization: My Office X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.19 i686) X-Accept-Language: en-GB, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Two separate questions - kernig & ? hard spaces References: <149512@pilling.demon.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro David Pilling wrote: > How about if I provided the following... > > A new entity in text, called 'space' which gives a fixed vertical and horizontal > movement. There would be a dialogue box to enter the size of the shifts, a > button to make it non-breaking and you could enter shifts either as absolute > (feet and inches) or as a fraction of the text size. Then there would be > a few more predefined macros {emspace} etc. to allow easy insertion > with a key press. Sounds a great idea. On another topic, I am slowly converting old Impression docs to Ovation Pro, and find the Impression loader very reliable (even better now it gets the filename correct as well). Michael Ben-Gershon mybg@netvision.net.il -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 1 22:11:26 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149533 for opro ; Tue, 01 May 101 22:11:24 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988745322:20:18357:75; Tue, 01 May 2001 19:28:42 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2018728; 1 May 2001 19:28 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f41JRlt04494 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 1 May 2001 20:27:47 +0100 Received: from alpha.netvision.net.il (alpha.netvision.net.il [194.90.1.13]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f41JRf504491 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 20:27:42 +0100 Received: from netvision.net.il (ras6-p16.jlm.netvision.net.il [62.0.150.16]) by alpha.netvision.net.il (8.9.3/8.8.6) with ESMTP id WAA18722 for ; Tue, 1 May 2001 22:27:44 +0300 (IDT) Message-ID: <3AEF0E64.38E7C036@netvision.net.il> Date: Tue, 01 May 2001 22:28:36 +0300 From: Michael Ben-Gershon Organization: My Office X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.19 i686) X-Accept-Language: en-GB, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Page # of # References: <364281FA.231A@net.ntl.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=x-user-defined Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R This is a follow-on query to an old question: Pete Bready wrote (in November 1988!): > > Sam Smith wrote: > > > > Is there any way to get Ovation Pro to put "page x of y" > > automatically (ie, page 1 of 4 on the first page, 2 of 4 on the > > second etc). I have an applet (I think - it may be part of the > > main program) which adds page # (where # is the current page > > number) but not what page of how many. > We really need a FAQs list, this is the fourth or fifth time I've posted > this - I know how David P must feel at times. No problem however :-) > > Put the MERGE commands shown below into a file, set its type to OVPDDL, > open a blank Ovpro document and drag the OVPDDL file to it, then use > Misc/Insert/merge tag to insert the necessary merge fields. > > Then preview the document using File/Mail Merge, clicking on the 'First' > button > to see the results. > > Cheers > > Pete Bready > pbready@net.ntl.com > > MERGE_02={merge 901 "time" "{gettimestring(\"%24:%MI:%SE\",macv)}"} > MERGE_03={merge 902 "filename" "{fileinfo(currentfile(),macv)}"} > MERGE_04={merge 903 "numpages" "{int i,n,f,c;f=currentfile();c=documentchapters(f);for(i=0;i; Wed, 2 May 2001 01:21:15 +0100 Received: from ppp-3-188.5800-11.access.uk.worldonline.com ([62.64.180.188] helo=ghc) by mk-smarthost-1.mail.uk.worldonline.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #3) id 14ukOI-000192-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 02 May 2001 01:21:14 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Gavin Crawford To: "Ovation Pro" Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 01:21:12 +0100 Subject: Re: Two separate questions - kernig & ? hard spaces Message-ID: <4a7415d308gav@crawford-print.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <001501c0d267$e8c9fd30$4d01a8c0@padua> References: <149440@pilling.demon.co.uk> <3AEE6E8F.C76830BF@sharp.co.uk> <4a73d16663simon.young@argonet.co.uk> <001501c0d267$e8 User-Agent: Pluto/2.02d (RISC-OS/3.70) POPstar/2.02 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Another work-around is to create a Non-printing colour and apply that colour to a character of your chosen width, such as a capital M or N. Some problems you have to watch for though, is the spell checker not recognising the words, and any text that is exported will need to have the characters replaced with spaces. -- Gavin Crawford email: gav@crawford-print.co.uk web: www.crawford-print.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 2 14:10:57 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149555 for opro ; Wed, 02 May 101 14:10:56 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988765251:20:15153:67; Wed, 02 May 2001 01:00:51 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2127770; 2 May 2001 0:59 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f420wbH05929 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 2 May 2001 01:58:37 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f420wY505926 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 01:58:34 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 14ukyV-0003St-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 2 May 2001 00:58:39 +0000 Date: Tue, 01 May 2001 22:26:13 GMT Message-Id: <149543@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Page # of # X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R >However, it does not seem to work within page headers. Does anyone know of >a way to do this? It is very useful to be able to put page # of # on the >page header. Seemingly mail merge tags are not replaced in header/footers. Might be a bug, might be some sort of optimisation. Needs fixing anyway. The obvious workaround is to create your own header out of a text frame, probably not too much trouble. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 2 14:11:11 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149560 for opro ; Wed, 02 May 101 14:11:07 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988804499:10:29359:129; Wed, 02 May 2001 11:54:59 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id ab1103119; 2 May 2001 11:53 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f42BL6k08163 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 2 May 2001 12:21:06 +0100 Received: from msgrouter2.onetel.net.uk (IDENT:mirapoint@msgrouter2.onetel.net.uk [212.67.96.141]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f42BL2508160 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 12:21:02 +0100 Received: from bghill.onetel.net.uk (async39-13.nas.onetel.net.uk [212.67.109.39]) by msgrouter2.onetel.net.uk (Mirapoint) with SMTP id AAJ55458; Wed, 2 May 2001 12:21:00 +0100 (BST) Date: Wed, 2 May 2001 11:14:18 +0000 (GMT) From: "Bernard G. Hill" Subject: Re: Two separate questions - kernig & ? hard spaces To: Ovation Mail In-Reply-To: <149512@pilling.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=ISO-8859-1 X-Organization: Organisation name, location. Telephone/Fax? X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.46] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by omega.barnet.ac.uk id f42BL6l08163 On Tue 01 May, David Pilling wrote: >=20 > >Ooops, sorry, I didn't realise. I can't seem to find an option to appl= y > >kerning by hand - is that because there just isn't one at all? >=20 > There is a way, you use the key presses, Control and ; ' (or with shift= ). > Internally this works by applying some tracking, which some people don'= t like. >=20 > >Eh? But what if I want (and I quite often do) a fixed, normal length, = space > >in some justified text? I can think of several examples where it is us= eful. >=20 > I guess there are different ways of arguing as the postings above indic= ate. >=20 > How about if I provided the following... >=20 > A new entity in text, called 'space' which gives a fixed vertical and > horizontal movement. There would be a dialogue box to enter the size > of the shifts, a button to make it non-breaking and you could enter > shifts either as absolute > (feet and inches) or as a fraction of the text size. Then there would b= e > a few more predefined macros {emspace} etc. to allow easy insertion > with a key press. >=20 > Feel free to make suggestions or tell me how Quark etc. does it. >=20 > This would be an excellent solution to the problem. Within 'Pagemaker'=A9 en and em spaces are available by control key/keyboard, combinations, which I often found useful. Numbers in the old lead type are usually on an en body so an en space keeps numbers correctly spaced when used in situations such as telephone numbers. That is how we always did it in the old days anyway. If the proposed 'space' solution as suggested above is implemented, may I make a plea that the suggested en and em spaces be available as a pre-defined choice? Could control/spacebar and control/shift/spacebar be used for these? Perhaps we only need these two fixed spaces, as greater horizontal spaces are catered for by tabs, and vertical spaces by leading. Bernard. --=20 Bernard G. Hill Tel/Fax: 01633 880197 Zion, Church Road Undy, Caldicot =20 NP26 3EN=20 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 2 14:11:15 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149562 for opro ; Wed, 02 May 101 14:11:12 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988784106:20:24819:68; Wed, 02 May 2001 06:15:06 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2121171; 2 May 2001 6:13 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f426Cvb07048 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 2 May 2001 07:12:57 +0100 Received: from blueyonder.co.uk (pcow035o.blueyonder.co.uk [195.188.53.121]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f426Cs507045 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 07:12:54 +0100 Received: from goatly ([213.48.249.144]) by blueyonder.co.uk with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.687.68); Wed, 2 May 2001 06:14:47 +0000 Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 07:11:18 +0100 From: Bruce Goatly To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Two separate questions - kernig & ? hard spaces Message-ID: <9ee035744a%ovation@goatly.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <149512@pilling.demon.co.uk> X-Organization: Perfect Page X-Mailer: Messenger v1.41d for RISC OS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.61b User-Agent: POPstar/2.01b12 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In message <149512@pilling.demon.co.uk> you wrote: > A new entity in text, called 'space' which gives a fixed vertical and horizontal > movement. There would be a dialogue box to enter the size of the shifts, a > button to make it non-breaking and you could enter shifts either as absolute > (feet and inches) or as a fraction of the text size. Then there would be > a few more predefined macros {emspace} etc. to allow easy insertion > with a key press. Sounds like a good idea - meets the original perceived need and goes beyond it! > Feel free to make suggestions or tell me how Quark etc. does it. I've a nasty feeling that it doesn't - I'll try to check today while I'm over at Nature. Bruce Goatly -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 2 14:11:26 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149567 for opro ; Wed, 02 May 101 14:11:25 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988793163:20:09941:67; Wed, 02 May 2001 08:46:03 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2104593; 2 May 2001 8:45 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f428irE07559 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 2 May 2001 09:44:53 +0100 Received: from inca.sle.sharp.co.uk (root@[193.114.241.3]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f428io507556 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 09:44:50 +0100 Received: from sharp.co.uk (aardog.sle.sharp.co.uk [192.16.16.173]) by inca.sle.sharp.co.uk (8.8.8+Sun/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA10485 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 09:42:00 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <3AEFC918.6E96B8EA@sharp.co.uk> Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 09:45:12 +0100 From: Graham Jones Organization: Sharp Laboratories of Europe X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (WinNT; U) X-Accept-Language: en,pdf MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: hard spaces (was Re: two separate questions...) References: <149440@pilling.demon.co.uk> <3AEE6E8F.C76830BF@sharp.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R John Pettigrew wrote: > What length of space do you need and why? That is, what is a 'normal' space > in justified text? By "normal" length, I mean a space of the length you get in non-justified text for the font you are using. As others have noted they are needed for things like units after a measurement. I appreciate there is a difference between a non-breaking space and a fixed length space, but my experience with other software is that these have usually been made to be one and the same. And the printed manual said a hard space would insert a fixed length, non-breaking space. Graham. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 2 14:11:47 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149573 for opro ; Wed, 02 May 101 14:11:46 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988807297:20:11110:85; Wed, 02 May 2001 12:41:37 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2028596; 2 May 2001 12:28 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f42CKJB08415 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 2 May 2001 13:20:19 +0100 Received: from inca.sle.sharp.co.uk (root@[193.114.241.3]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f42CKF508411 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 13:20:15 +0100 Received: from sharp.co.uk (aardog.sle.sharp.co.uk [192.16.16.173]) by inca.sle.sharp.co.uk (8.8.8+Sun/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA13996 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 13:17:03 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <3AEFFB78.877D8584@sharp.co.uk> Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 13:20:08 +0100 From: Graham Jones Organization: Sharp Laboratories of Europe X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (WinNT; U) X-Accept-Language: en,pdf MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Two separate questions - kerning & ? hard spaces References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R "Bernard G. Hill" wrote: > > On Tue 01 May, David Pilling wrote: > > How about if I provided the following... > > > > A new entity in text, called 'space' which gives a fixed vertical and > > horizontal movement. There would be a dialogue box to enter the size > > of the shifts, a button to make it non-breaking and you could enter > > shifts either as absolute > > (feet and inches) or as a fraction of the text size. Then there would be > > a few more predefined macros {emspace} etc. to allow easy insertion > > with a key press. > > > > Feel free to make suggestions or tell me how Quark etc. does it. > > > If the proposed 'space' solution as suggested above is implemented, may > I make a plea that the suggested en and em spaces be available as a > pre-defined choice? Could control/spacebar and control/shift/spacebar be > used for these? > > Perhaps we only need these two fixed spaces, as greater horizontal > spaces are catered for by tabs, and vertical spaces by leading. I like the sound of the system David suggested, as long as easy to use defaults are set somewhere (ctrl-space etc sound nice if not already used). The complete system suggested may be very useful, for example in cases where the text reading direction is vertical - I don't think this can be done easily yet, though I haven't looked closely. In this case you would just use the new "space" in place of all normal spaces, either via an applet, or manually, or by binding them to the spacebar itself. Graham. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 2 17:49:22 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149592 for opro ; Wed, 02 May 101 17:49:21 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988814339:20:08975:298; Wed, 02 May 2001 14:38:59 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2121966; 2 May 2001 14:37 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f42E2e808865 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 2 May 2001 15:02:40 +0100 Received: from mail5.svr.pol.co.uk (mail5.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f429Ku507781 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 10:20:56 +0100 Received: from modem-15.flunitrazepam.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.95.143] helo=weatherpost.fsnet.co.uk) by mail5.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 14usof-0004pl-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 02 May 2001 10:21:02 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Ned Abell To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 10:19:53 +0100 Subject: Trapping? Message-ID: <4a74472474nedabell@enterprise.net> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Ive been asked by a printer to add trapping to some PS files because he cant guarantee registration. Ive looked at the manual and see the OP approach is to Overprint. When the colour tint is less than 90% overprinting can cause colour changes so in this case trapping could be a "good thing". However looking through the mail archives I see others think trapping as practiced by Qurk etc is "a very bad thing" :-) So has any one a work round when youve got say a mid yellow and a mid grey meeting being printed on white paper? -- besters.. Ned === -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 2 17:49:26 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149594 for opro ; Wed, 02 May 101 17:49:24 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988813584:10:29260:123; Wed, 02 May 2001 14:26:24 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1123341; 2 May 2001 14:26 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f42E2UY08856 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 2 May 2001 15:02:30 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f42E2P508852 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 15:02:25 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 14uxD4-000C3s-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 2 May 2001 14:02:30 +0000 Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 14:21:15 GMT Message-Id: <149576@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Two separate questions - kerning & ? hard spaces X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >The complete system suggested may be very useful, for example in cases where >the text reading direction is vertical - I don't think this can be done >easily yet A favourite game of mine, was to have a text frame at 90 degrees, and then fill it with text with a -90 degree rotation. You end up with upright text going down the page. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 2 17:49:31 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149596 for opro ; Wed, 02 May 101 17:49:28 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988815931:10:19724:64; Wed, 02 May 2001 15:05:31 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1102905; 2 May 2001 15:05 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f42E2SL08855 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 2 May 2001 15:02:28 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f42E2N508847 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 15:02:24 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 14uxD2-000C3s-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 2 May 2001 14:02:28 +0000 Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 14:17:32 GMT Message-Id: <149574@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: hard spaces (was Re: two separate questions...) X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >And the printed manual said a hard space would insert a fixed length, >non-breaking space. Oops. No one told me. I do think (now you've explained it) that a hard space having a fixed length is probably the best compromise. Typically when you don't want text split, you also don't want it spreading out. Alas when I was doing it I got into the programming side, something was wrong with the way hard spaces worked and I fixed it. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 2 17:49:34 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149597 for opro ; Wed, 02 May 101 17:49:32 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988816260:10:26378:91; Wed, 02 May 2001 15:11:00 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1115250; 2 May 2001 15:10 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f42E2h208866 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 2 May 2001 15:02:43 +0100 Received: from mta07-svc.ntlworld.com (mta07-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.47]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f428th507674 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 09:55:43 +0100 Received: from riscpc.at.home ([213.107.105.170]) by mta07-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.27 201-229-119-110) with SMTP id <20010502085549.CVUZ285.mta07-svc.ntlworld.com@riscpc.at.home> for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 09:55:49 +0100 Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 09:55:25 +0100 From: John Pettigrew To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: hard spaces (was Re: two separate questions...) Message-ID: References: <149440@pilling.demon.co.uk> <3AEE6E8F.C76830BF@sharp.co.uk> <3AEFC918.6E96B8EA@ In-Reply-To: <3AEFC918.6E96B8EA@sharp.co.uk> X-Organization: XL Cambridge User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.10d (MsgServe/1.10) (RISC-OS/4.02) X-Editor: Zap, using ZapEmail 0.22 (27 Nov 1998) patch-3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R In a previous message, Graham Jones wrote: > John Pettigrew wrote: > > What length of space do you need and why? That is, what is a 'normal' > > space in justified text? > > By "normal" length, I mean a space of the length you get in non-justified > text for the font you are using. As others have noted they are needed for > things like units after a measurement. Interesting. As you might have gathered, I work in publishing (for a variety of companies) and my experience is that publishers are ditching (mostly, have ditched) fixed spaces for units. They can also look very odd. In spacey text, the closer spacing before the unit can look good, but in tight text this produces a space that looks too wide. However, David's suggested solution sounds great - gives people the option, which has to be good. John -- John Pettigrew XL Cambridge - Contract and freelance editing and writing Life sciences specialist - molecular biology, genetics, biotechnology john@xl-cambridge.com http://www.xl-cambridge.com/ -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From chris.chorley@physics.org Wed May 2 22:29:12 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149609 for opro ; Wed, 02 May 101 22:29:10 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988823667:10:03598:36; Wed, 02 May 2001 17:14:27 GMT Received: from carbon.btinternet.com ([194.73.73.92]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1128540; 2 May 2001 17:14 GMT Received: from [62.7.12.241] (helo=deskpro.physics.org) by carbon.btinternet.com with esmtp (Exim 3.03 #83) id 14v0Cn-0000hS-00 for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk; Wed, 02 May 2001 18:14:26 +0100 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.0.20010502180652.009e58f0@mail.btinternet.com> X-Sender: chris.chorley@mail.btinternet.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 18:10:58 +0100 To: opro@pilling.demon.co.uk From: Chris Chorley Subject: script language manual Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed David, 1. I'll be sending for the OvPro manual. ukp25 doesn't seem too bad. 2. I'd also send for a script manual, prefer set of 3 hole punched pages that will fit in the above binders. If it's not too long before you've gauged reaction to the script manual offering, then I'll wait until that is available and order both. Thanks, Chris. From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 2 22:29:12 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149608 for opro ; Wed, 02 May 101 22:29:10 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988825267:20:06712:70; Wed, 02 May 2001 17:41:07 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2006340; 2 May 2001 17:40 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f42H1DF09879 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 2 May 2001 18:01:13 +0100 Received: from bonn.shuttle.de (bonn.shuttle.de [194.95.249.247]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f42GJP509692 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 17:19:33 +0100 Received: by bonn.shuttle.de (Postfix, from userid 10) id 916E817DC3; Wed, 2 May 2001 18:19:30 +0200 (CEST) Received: from hmg-koeln.de by Arktur.hmanngym.k.nw.schule.de with smtp (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m12mdjB-000fH3C; Tue, 2 May 100 16:32 MET DST Message-ID: <3AF00BB9.C115CD5D@hmg-koeln.de> Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 15:29:29 +0200 From: Jochen Konietzko Organization: Heinrich-Mann-Gymnasium X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.74 [de] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.16 i686) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Ctrl-C and Ctrl-V References: <149543@pilling.demon.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro I just tried to duplicate part of a page with Ctr-C and Ctrl-V; the copy contained none of the styles nor effects of the original. How can I copy text with all frills included? Cheers, Jochen Konietzko -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 2 22:29:16 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149611 for opro ; Wed, 02 May 101 22:29:14 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988824369:10:20997:88; Wed, 02 May 2001 17:26:09 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1021091; 2 May 2001 17:25 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f42H1MS09891 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 2 May 2001 18:01:22 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f42H1F509885 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 18:01:15 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 14v009-000C7I-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 2 May 2001 17:01:21 +0000 Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 18:01:35 GMT Message-Id: <149606@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: hard spaces (was Re: two separate questions...) X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >Could I ask you to follow your original suggestion and leave the proportional >hard space in? (Alas(?)) there is no question of changing it. To do so would break lots of documents. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 2 22:29:19 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149612 for opro ; Wed, 02 May 101 22:29:17 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988826778:20:12592:70; Wed, 02 May 2001 18:06:18 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2109704; 2 May 2001 18:05 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f42I4L610152 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 2 May 2001 19:04:21 +0100 Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f42I4H510149 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 19:04:17 +0100 Received: from [62.188.19.223] (helo=62.188.19.223) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 14v0wn-0004YJ-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 02 May 2001 19:02:09 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From:(Mijas Software) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Wed, 2 May 2001 18:58:20 +0100 X-Organization: ArgoNet, but does not necessarily reflect its views. X-Mailer: Posty - Voyager Email 1.24 for RISC OS 4.02 Subject: Re: Trapping? Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Wed 2 May 2001 (10:19:53 +0100), nedabell@enterprise.net wrote: > So has any one a work round when youve got say a mid yellow and a mid > grey meeting being printed on white paper? > I would have thought that yellow overprinted with grey would work quite well. -- ___ _ __ ___________________________________________ |\/| | | |_| (_ / Scientific/Education/Utilities - RISC OS 4 | | | _| | | __) Software / email: mijassw@argonet.co.uk - Developer ____________________________/ web: http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/mijassw/ -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 2 22:29:23 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149614 for opro ; Wed, 02 May 101 22:29:21 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988827075:20:19799:65; Wed, 02 May 2001 18:11:15 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2019265; 2 May 2001 18:10 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f42H1JI09889 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 2 May 2001 18:01:19 +0100 Received: from mta01-svc.ntlworld.com (mta01-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.41]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f42FK7509392 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 16:20:07 +0100 Received: from riscpc.at.home ([213.107.105.170]) by mta01-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.27 201-229-119-110) with SMTP id <20010502152013.RMSS283.mta01-svc.ntlworld.com@riscpc.at.home> for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 16:20:13 +0100 Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 16:19:55 +0100 From: John Pettigrew To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: hard spaces (was Re: two separate questions...) Message-ID: References: <149574@pilling.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <149574@pilling.demon.co.uk> X-Organization: XL Cambridge User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.10d (MsgServe/1.10) (RISC-OS/4.02) X-Editor: Zap, using ZapEmail 0.22 (27 Nov 1998) patch-3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In a previous message, David Pilling wrote: > > >And the printed manual said a hard space would insert a fixed length, > >non-breaking space. > > Oops. No one told me. I do think (now you've explained it) that a hard > space having a fixed length is probably the best compromise. Typically when > you don't want text split, you also don't want it spreading out. Could I ask you to follow your original suggestion and leave the proportional hard space in? That is, leave the hard space as is, but also add the en space and em space macros, with the more complicated settings for those who want to delve. This seems most logical and flexible to me - you have the hard proportional space but also the hard fixed en and em spaces. I assume that no one can see a good reason to have a soft en or em space? How does that sound to others? John -- John Pettigrew XL Cambridge - Contract and freelance editing and writing Life sciences specialist - molecular biology, genetics, biotechnology john@xl-cambridge.com http://www.xl-cambridge.com/ -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 2 22:29:24 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149615 for opro ; Wed, 02 May 101 22:29:22 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988826155:10:03909:75; Wed, 02 May 2001 17:55:55 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1126617; 2 May 2001 17:55 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f42H1Lc09890 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 2 May 2001 18:01:21 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f42H1E509882 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 18:01:14 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 14v007-000C7I-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 2 May 2001 17:01:19 +0000 Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 17:56:08 GMT Message-Id: <149604@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Ctrl-C and Ctrl-VCtrl-C and Ctrl-V X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >I just tried to duplicate part of a page with Ctr-C and Ctrl-V; the copy >contained none of the styles nor effects of the original. >How can I copy text with all frills included? It depends. Say I have text in document A in style 'Bob',I copy it to document B. Document B also has a style called 'Bob' but with different attributes. If I have 'rename styles' ticked in OPro text choices, then on copying the text and document B gets a new style 'Bob0' but retains its appearance. If the rename styles option is not ticked then the text retains its style 'Bob' but doesn't look the same - since 'Bob' in document B isn't the same as in document A. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 2 22:29:27 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149616 for opro ; Wed, 02 May 101 22:29:25 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988828031:20:14039:65; Wed, 02 May 2001 18:27:11 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2114873; 2 May 2001 18:26 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f42IC3Z10254 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 2 May 2001 19:12:03 +0100 Received: from mk-smarthost-1.mail.uk.worldonline.com (mk-smarthost-1.mail.uk.worldonline.com [212.74.112.71]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f42IBw510250 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 19:11:58 +0100 Received: from ppp-1-74.5800-7.access.uk.worldonline.com ([62.64.158.74] helo=thosechurchills.screaming.net) by mk-smarthost-1.mail.uk.worldonline.com with smtp (Exim 3.22 #3) id 14v16S-000Pix-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 02 May 2001 19:11:57 +0100 Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 07:32:26 +0100 From: M P Churchill To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Two separate questions - kernig & ? hard spaces Message-ID: References: <149440@pilling.demon.co.uk> <3AEE6E8F.C76830BF@sharp.co.uk> <4a73d16663simon.young@argonet.co.uk> <4a7415d308gav@c In-Reply-To: <4a7415d308gav@crawford-print.co.uk> X-Organization: Home User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.50 (MsgServe/1.50) (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R In message <4a7415d308gav@crawford-print.co.uk> you wrote: > Another work-around is to create a Non-printing colour and apply that > colour to a character of your chosen width, such as a capital M or N. > > Some problems you have to watch for though, is the spell checker not > recognising the words, and any text that is exported will need to have > the characters replaced with spaces. > Is it not possible to have a font in which the space bar (or any other preferred character) gives a specific width character which has no lines in it? Then have that font installed as the default font used for the next character after pressing f11. If this would work, perhaps we need a font with a range of widths produced by pressing 1 to 9 for 9 different widths. Or does the 'system' detect any character with a width but no lines and either condense it to nothing or treat it as a space after all? (I may be revealing that I have almost no knowledge about font handling here!) -- Malcolm -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 2 22:29:29 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149617 for opro ; Wed, 02 May 101 22:29:27 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988828859:10:00347:65; Wed, 02 May 2001 18:40:59 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1109807; 2 May 2001 18:40 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f42IV8M10553 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 2 May 2001 19:31:08 +0100 Received: from typhoon.mail.pipex.net (typhoon.mail.pipex.net [158.43.128.27]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f42IV3510549 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 19:31:03 +0100 Received: (qmail 8230 invoked from network); 2 May 2001 18:31:08 -0000 Received: from userev12.uk.uudial.com (HELO RiscPC) (62.188.17.195) by smtp-2.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; 2 May 2001 18:31:08 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Steven Pampling To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 08:22:38 +0100 Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) Message-ID: <4a743c6857steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <149514@pilling.demon.co.uk> References: <149514@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R In article <149514@pilling.demon.co.uk>, David Pilling wrote: [Snip] > I've had to repackage the product. So Ovation Pro now comes with an A5 > white PVC 3 ring binder in a slip case. (funnily enough just like the > Impression packaging). The binder contains the manual as on the CD > printed out. A neater package for the shelves above the machines, I think my bank account may become a little lighter. [Snip] > Anyway this is very nice, a bit more of the Beebug legacy disposed of, > and John van Vredenburch's hard work on the manual appears in print at > last. > If anyone wants a copy of the new manual then I've set a price of ukp 25 > all inclusive. This seems high to me, but its a heavy item and a small > print run. I think you tend to underprice things a little (which is nice for my pocket) and this is realistic - have you seen the price of manuals and technical texts recently? > For most people using the manual on the CD will be the best > thing. A lot of others don't like manuals or don't read them. or you > can print it yourself. There are a number of people around the csa newsgroups who have said they won't buy OP while the manual isn't available in printed form. If you haven't already done so, an announcement to the newsgroups about the printed manual version would appear to be a good idea. -- Steve Pampling -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 2 22:29:39 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149621 for opro ; Wed, 02 May 101 22:29:37 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988833769:10:13670:64; Wed, 02 May 2001 20:02:49 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1125271; 2 May 2001 20:02 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f42K1r610970 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 2 May 2001 21:01:53 +0100 Received: from sand4.global.net.uk (sand4.global.net.uk [195.147.246.106]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f42K1o510967 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 21:01:50 +0100 Received: from pfbs06a02.client.global.net.uk ([195.147.150.252] helo=ianadunn.global.co.uk) by sand4.global.net.uk with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 14v2n1-0000Eq-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 2 May 2001 21:00:00 +0100 Date: Wed, 2 May 2001 19:38:10 +0100 (BST) From: Dr Ian Dunn Subject: Menu not present To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Dr Ian Dunn X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R Hey up Currently on 2.63 Somewhere in the proceess of moving to the CD , whilst loading the appln I now get a message something like " Menu not present " . Pressing enter allows the load the proceed ( seems about half way through ) and as far as I can tell all runs normally . Can I do anything to eradicate this message ? TIA Ian -- Dr Ian Dunn 010101 at last in the 21st Century Use RISC OS - You know it makes sense Derbyshire Area Risc Club (DARC) Derbyshire Area Risc Club (DARC) -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 2 22:29:43 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149623 for opro ; Wed, 02 May 101 22:29:40 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988836575:10:16259:66; Wed, 02 May 2001 20:49:35 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1101060; 2 May 2001 20:48 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f42KliV11245 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 2 May 2001 21:47:44 +0100 Received: from warrior-outbound.servers.plus.net ([212.159.14.227]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f42Kle511242 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 21:47:40 +0100 Received: (qmail 17397 invoked from network); 2 May 2001 20:47:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO tinshill.force9.net) (212.159.23.173) by warrior with SMTP; 2 May 2001 20:47:38 -0000 Date: Tue, 1 May 2001 20:18:09 +0100 (BST) From: Anthony Hilton Subject: Re: Two separate questions - kernig & ? hard spaces To: Ovation Pro List In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In on Tue 01 May, Bruce Goatly wrote: > In message <4a73d16663simon.young@argonet.co.uk> Simon Young wrote: > > > In article <3AEE6E8F.C76830BF@sharp.co.uk>, Graham Jones > > wrote: > > > Eh? But what if I want (and I quite often do) a fixed, normal length, > > > space in some justified text? I can think of several examples where it > > > is useful. > > > > Indeed, for example one uses a hard space to sepatate units from a > > number, so that the "word" of number and units remains unbroken. > > That's exactly right; we need to (be able to) distinguish between a > non-breaking space and a *fixed* space; the two are not necessarily the > same. I have a feeling that PageMaker 5 used to have options for en space and em space analogous to the en dash and em dash (or I may be dreaming as its nearly 4 years since I touched PM). Something like this would presumably suit Bruce and Graham - and probably others. Anthony Hilton -- ajh@tinshill.f9.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 2 22:29:46 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149624 for opro ; Wed, 02 May 101 22:29:45 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988834237:20:20583:64; Wed, 02 May 2001 20:10:37 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2019500; 2 May 2001 20:09 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f42K9Ec11024 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 2 May 2001 21:09:14 +0100 Received: from blueyonder.co.uk (pcow035o.blueyonder.co.uk [195.188.53.121]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f42K9A511021 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 21:09:10 +0100 Received: from goatly ([213.48.248.195]) by blueyonder.co.uk with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.687.68); Wed, 2 May 2001 20:11:13 +0000 Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 20:16:26 +0100 From: Bruce Goatly To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: hard spaces (was Re: two separate questions...) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <149606@pilling.demon.co.uk> X-Organization: Perfect Page X-Mailer: Messenger v1.41d for RISC OS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.61b User-Agent: POPstar/2.01b12 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R In message <149606@pilling.demon.co.uk> you wrote: > >Could I ask you to follow your original suggestion and leave the proportional > >hard space in? > > (Alas(?)) there is no question of changing it. To do so would break lots of > documents. Well, on reflection I can see a place for both types of non-breaking space. The expanding space is sometimes useful for forcing words onto a new line (I know this can be done with Shift-Return, but in OPro the remaining bit of line isn't justified, unlike in Quark), and the fixed one has already been discussed. My investigations into Quark have revealed that it can produce both a non-breaking en space and a non-breaking half-en space, which is better than I'd thought. Bruce Goatly -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 2 22:29:52 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149626 for opro ; Wed, 02 May 101 22:29:49 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988838741:20:18027:64; Wed, 02 May 2001 21:25:41 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2017419; 2 May 2001 21:24 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f42LORL11445 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 2 May 2001 22:24:27 +0100 Received: from host1.kbnet.co.uk (host1.kbnet.co.uk [194.168.148.2]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f42LON511442 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 22:24:24 +0100 Received: from kbnet.co.uk (dialup056.kbnet.co.uk [194.168.148.218]) by host1.kbnet.co.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id WAA03532 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 22:20:14 +0100 Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 21:15:00 +0100 From: Mike Williams To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Trapping? Message-ID: References: <4a74472474nedabell@enterprise.net> In-Reply-To: <4a74472474nedabell@enterprise.net> X-Organization: Akalat Publishing User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.10d (MsgServe/1.10) (RISC-OS/3.60) POPstar/2.02 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by omega.barnet.ac.uk id f42LOO511443 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In message <4a74472474nedabell@enterprise.net> you wrote: > Ive been asked by a printer to add trapping to some PS files because he > cant guarantee registration. Ive looked at the manual and see the OP > approach is to Overprint. When the colour tint is less than 90% > overprinting can cause colour changes so in this case trapping could be a > "good thing". However looking through the mail archives I see others think > trapping as practiced by Qurk etc is "a very bad thing" :-) > > So has any one a work round when youve got say a mid yellow and a mid grey > meeting being printed on white paper? > It is possible but not easy. You need to define a colour which is the sun of the two colours in CMYK terms. Then arrange for a Overprint is very good when setting black text over any kind of backdrop as it stops knockput of the background. Despite it bei Mike Williams Akalat Publishing -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 3 01:45:15 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149639 for opro ; Thu, 03 May 101 01:45:12 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988841451:10:18985:67; Wed, 02 May 2001 22:10:51 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1017827; 2 May 2001 22:09 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f42M9ad11679 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 2 May 2001 23:09:36 +0100 Received: from altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net (altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net [193.67.237.6]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f42M9W511676 for ; Wed, 2 May 2001 23:09:32 +0100 Received: from padua by altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net via 1Cust195.tnt32.rtm1.nl.uu.net [213.116.158.195] with SMTP for id AAA26304 (8.8.8/1.3); Thu, 3 May 2001 00:09:36 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <00cd01c0d354$c1d2b8a0$4d01a8c0@padua> From: "Tonnie Demarteau" To: "Ovation Pro" References: <149606@pilling.demon.co.uk> Subject: Re: hard spaces (was Re: two separate questions...) Date: Wed, 2 May 2001 21:59:49 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R On Tue 01 May, David Pilling wrote: > > >Eh? But what if I want (and I quite often do) a fixed, normal length, space > >in some justified text? I can think of several examples where it is useful. > > I guess there are different ways of arguing as the postings above indicate. > > How about if I provided the following... > > A new entity in text, called 'space' which gives a fixed vertical and > horizontal movement. There would be a dialogue box to enter the size of the > shifts, a button to make it non-breaking and you could enter shifts either as > absolute (feet and inches) or as a fraction of the text size. Then there would > be a few more predefined macros {emspace} etc. to allow easy insertion > with a key press. > and: > >Could I ask you to follow your original suggestion and leave the proportional > >hard space in? > > (Alas(?)) there is no question of changing it. To do so would break lots of > documents. I like (almost) everything, that contributes to greater flexibility. Towards old documents and documents, created in other programs. Towards old documents (and new ones) the offered solution is very nice. However *I* prefer entering shifts as emspaces, based on a em square (design size) of 1000 em. PostScript fonts and the derived dimensions and measurements like width in the fonts are based on this design size. Or is this what you describe as: 'as a fraction of the text size' ? Abolutes like inches, centimeters, points are my second choice. Towards documents or text, created in other programs (!Edit) that only 'know' a fixed width for ASCII 160, there should be a find&replace solution to replace the not-intended, but imported proportional space into a fixed space. Or can this already be done? mrs. Tonnie Demarteau - the Netherlands -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 3 13:23:28 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149649 for opro ; Thu, 03 May 101 13:23:26 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988871183:20:07813:64; Thu, 03 May 2001 06:26:23 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2107478; 3 May 2001 6:25 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f430gpE12218 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 3 May 2001 01:42:51 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f430gj512204 for ; Thu, 3 May 2001 01:42:45 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 14v7Ck-0000oq-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 3 May 2001 00:42:50 +0000 Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 22:34:45 GMT Message-Id: <149627@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Two separate questions - kernig & ? hard spaces X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >Is it not possible to have a font in which the space bar (or any other >preferred character) gives a specific width character which has no lines >in it? Yes. Not code 32 space (or code 160 non-breakng space) but you could have one or more blank characters that did the job. In fact I did wonder if fonts had such a thing. Wonder if Unicode spares a couple of its codes for the job. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 3 13:23:54 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149655 for opro ; Thu, 03 May 101 13:23:52 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988873333:20:27494:82; Thu, 03 May 2001 07:02:13 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2027068; 3 May 2001 7:01 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f430gtN12220 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 3 May 2001 01:42:55 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f430gl512208 for ; Thu, 3 May 2001 01:42:47 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 14v7Cm-0000oq-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 3 May 2001 00:42:52 +0000 Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 22:36:42 GMT Message-Id: <149629@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >I think you tend to underprice things a little (which is nice for my >pocket) and this is realistic - have you seen the price of manuals and >technical texts recently? I suppose so, but I think you've already paid for the program. (compare with Windows were nothing comes with a manual and you have to buy a book). Like Mr. Gates my business is not selling books, I am only offering this manual for the few people who really need it. >There are a number of people around the csa newsgroups who have said they >won't buy OP while the manual isn't available in printed form. Um well OPro has always shipped with a printed manual, just not necessarily an up to date one. >If you haven't already done so, an announcement to the newsgroups about the >printed manual version would appear to be a good idea. Oh do I have to. People will fall asleep. Actually the manual is a major piece of work. But not everyone likes reading them... >Experience at work and various home manuals (including the OP) suggests >wire bound is not up to the wear and tear and is difficult to re-enforce. 3 ring is less prone to this problem. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 3 13:24:06 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149658 for opro ; Thu, 03 May 101 13:24:04 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988870304:10:20930:69; Thu, 03 May 2001 06:11:44 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1020298; 3 May 2001 6:11 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f430gw112222 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 3 May 2001 01:42:58 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f430go512215 for ; Thu, 3 May 2001 01:42:50 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 14v7Cp-0000oq-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 3 May 2001 00:42:55 +0000 Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 22:47:59 GMT Message-Id: <149633@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: hard spaces (was Re: two separate questions...) X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >but in OPro the remaining bit of >line isn't justified, unlike in Quark), and the fixed one has already been Page 68 in the Reference Manual... Flush zone allows you to control justification of the last line in a paragraph Normally the last line of a justified paragraph is not justified. However, if the end of the line is near to the right margin, it may look better justified. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 3 13:24:08 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149660 for opro ; Thu, 03 May 101 13:24:07 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988872075:10:27423:78; Thu, 03 May 2001 06:41:15 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1026925; 3 May 2001 6:40 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f430gu612221 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 3 May 2001 01:42:56 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f430gm512212 for ; Thu, 3 May 2001 01:42:48 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 14v7Co-0000oq-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 3 May 2001 00:42:54 +0000 Date: Wed, 02 May 2001 22:45:50 GMT Message-Id: <149631@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Menu not present X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Brings to mind... The applet Newframe in Others.Breakwell.Applets.NewFrame will cause an error "Menu does not exist" when Ovation Pro starts if it is installed. The solution is to get hold of version 1.01 of the applet. Or replace writeicon(newf_window,1,string_menu(newf_menu,0)); with menudefstring(newf_menu,0,4,s); writeicon(newf_window,1,s); in the main() function at the end of the Library.NewFrame script David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 3 13:24:10 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149661 for opro ; Thu, 03 May 101 13:24:09 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988886172:20:16499:107; Thu, 03 May 2001 10:36:12 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2120774; 3 May 2001 10:36 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f43AYkD14163 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 3 May 2001 11:34:46 +0100 Received: from altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net (altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net [193.67.237.6]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f43AYg514160 for ; Thu, 3 May 2001 11:34:42 +0100 Received: from padua by altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net via 1Cust4.tnt18.rtm1.nl.uu.net [213.116.130.4] with SMTP for id MAA06953 (8.8.8/1.3); Thu, 3 May 2001 12:34:47 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <001901c0d3bc$db2d10d0$4d01a8c0@padua> From: "Tonnie Demarteau" To: References: <149645@pilling.demon.co.uk> Subject: Re: hard spaces (was Re: two separate questions...) Date: Thu, 3 May 2001 12:35:28 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R On Thu 03 May, David Pilling wrote: > >Towards old documents (and new ones) the offered solution is very nice. However > >*I* prefer entering shifts as emspaces, based on a em square (design size) of > >1000 em. PostScript fonts and the derived dimensions and measurements like width > >in the fonts are based on this design size. Or is this what you describe as: 'as > >a fraction of the text size'? > > Thats what I meant. We already use em's (for tracking). I know and I appreciate the possibility to use these units. > >Towards documents or text, created in other programs (!Edit) that only 'know' a > >fixed width for ASCII 160, there should be a find&replace solution to replace > >the not-intended, but imported proportional space into a fixed space. Or can > >this already be done? > > No it can't be done because as yet there is no fixed space. When I add it > you will be able to do this (um perhaps). (um perhaps)? Perhaps, a style/effect 'fixed space', that takes the width of the defined space (ASCII 32) of the currently used font to apply to the actually present -to big or to small- space (ASCII 32 or 160, non-broken or hard) ? Sadly, not every font has a width defined in ASCII 160. Not every font has the same width defined in ASCII 32 or 160. Not every font has (at least not visible) endash and emdash and also not always with the same ASCII codes ... Using absolutes or em units has one common disadvantage, when I *manually* have to enter the values. When I change fonts, font weights or sizes, the values don't get updated automatically. When I can't search them easily, I certainly can't replace or change them easily. When I have used a 'nice' e.g. 3 mm or 250 em in one font, it looks 'ugly' when I change the font to a condensed one, the fontsize to a larger or smaller one, or the weight from Medium to (Extra)Bold etc. Risc OS doesn't support Unicode fonts, so programs can't use fonts with more than 256 (minus the first 32) characters. All characters (and not always the sam e) are already defined in encodings to ensure switching fonts and PostScript printing can give the same result. Adding a 'new' char like 'fixed space' isn't a realistic option: at minimum all fonts on all computers should need updating. Creating a new font only containing widths seems to me 'impossible' to use. At minimum: how can I know which 'character' to use to get the width needed in the font in use? I am glad, I don't have to use 'justified' text :-) mrs. Tonnie Demarteau - the Netherlands -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 3 13:24:13 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149662 for opro ; Thu, 03 May 101 13:24:10 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988872699:10:13832:64; Thu, 03 May 2001 06:51:39 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1119752; 3 May 2001 6:51 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f431Dq212305 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 3 May 2001 02:13:52 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f431Dm512302 for ; Thu, 3 May 2001 02:13:49 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 14v7go-0002PO-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 3 May 2001 01:13:54 +0000 Date: Thu, 03 May 2001 02:05:33 GMT Message-Id: <149645@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: hard spaces (was Re: two separate questions...) X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >Towards old documents (and new ones) the offered solution is very nice. However >*I* prefer entering shifts as emspaces, based on a em square (design size) of >1000 em. PostScript fonts and the derived dimensions and measurements like width >in the fonts are based on this design size. Or is this what you describe as: 'as >a fraction of the text size'? Thats what I meant. We already use em's (for tracking). >Towards documents or text, created in other programs (!Edit) that only 'know' a >fixed width for ASCII 160, there should be a find&replace solution to replace >the not-intended, but imported proportional space into a fixed space. Or can >this already be done? No it can't be done because as yet there is no fixed space. When I add it you will be able to do this (um perhaps). David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 3 13:24:16 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149663 for opro ; Thu, 03 May 101 13:24:14 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988875341:10:18920:67; Thu, 03 May 2001 07:35:41 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1128529; 3 May 2001 7:34 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f437Y9x13542 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 3 May 2001 08:34:09 +0100 Received: from mserv1e.vianw.co.uk (mserv1e.vianw.co.uk [195.102.240.97]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f437Y0513539 for ; Thu, 3 May 2001 08:34:00 +0100 Received: from [194.119.179.59] (helo=Caslon.english.co.uk) by mserv1e.vianw.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #5) id 14vDci-0000bv-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 03 May 2001 08:34:04 +0100 Received: from Gill (10.0.1.1) by Caslon.english.co.uk; Thu, 03 May 2001 08:22:08 +0100 Date: Thu, 03 May 2001 08:22:17 +0100 From: David Graddol To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Trapping? Message-ID: <3a36c0744a%Support@Gill.english.co.uk> In-Reply-To: X-Organization: The English Company (UK) Ltd X-Mailer: Messenger v1.41d for RISC OS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by omega.barnet.ac.uk id f437Y5513540 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Mike Williams wrote: > In message <4a74472474nedabell@enterprise.net> you wrote: > > > Ive been asked by a printer to add trapping to some PS files because he > > cant guarantee registration. Ive looked at the manual and see the OP > > approach is to Overprint. When the colour tint is less than 90% > > overprinting can cause colour changes so in this case trapping could be a > > "good thing". However looking through the mail archives I see others think > > trapping as practiced by Qurk etc is "a very bad thing" :-) > > > > So has any one a work round when youve got say a mid yellow and a mid grey > > meeting being printed on white paper? > > > It is possible but not easy. You need to define a colour which is the sun of the two colours in CMYK terms. Then arrange for > I second what Mike Williams says about trapping: it is possible to do by handcrafting in simple cases but it is impracticable in more complex cases. Within the pre-press industry, there is a move away from managing trapping at the 'application end' (e.g. Quark) as workflows move from separated to composite. Trapping now often occurs further down the line, at the RIP, for example. However smaller printers/bureaus will still expect trapping to be in place and I guess that is the situation you have. When Cerilica announced Vantage I asked whether it would handle trapping. I recall the answer was 'no' and I still don't see trapping listed as a feature. David -- The English Company (UK) Ltd http://www.english.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 3 13:24:23 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149665 for opro ; Thu, 03 May 101 13:24:21 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988879304:10:10784:67; Thu, 03 May 2001 08:41:44 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1010614; 3 May 2001 8:41 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f438e8t13814 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 3 May 2001 09:40:08 +0100 Received: from blueyonder.co.uk (pcow029o.blueyonder.co.uk [195.188.53.123]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f438e4513811 for ; Thu, 3 May 2001 09:40:04 +0100 Received: from goatly ([213.48.249.232]) by blueyonder.co.uk with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.687.68); Thu, 3 May 2001 09:42:08 +0100 Date: Thu, 03 May 2001 09:17:18 +0100 From: Bruce Goatly To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: hard spaces (was Re: two separate questions...) Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <149633@pilling.demon.co.uk> X-Organization: Perfect Page X-Mailer: Messenger v1.41d for RISC OS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.61b User-Agent: POPstar/2.01b12 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R In message <149633@pilling.demon.co.uk> DP wrote: > >but in OPro the remaining bit of > >line isn't justified, unlike in Quark), and the fixed one has already been > > Page 68 in the Reference Manual... Thanks, I was sure it would be in there... > Flush zone allows you to control justification of the last line in a > paragraph Normally the last line of a justified paragraph is not justified. > However, if the end of the line is near to the right margin, it may look > better justified. What I was describing, though, was forcing text *within* a paragraph to start a new line. So the previous line wouldn't be the end of a paragraph and ought therefore to be justified, whatever the size of the flush zone. I'll have to check again on Quark's behaviour here, but I'm fairly sure it does as I described, illogical though it may seem. It really depends on what the purpose of Shift-Return is perceived to be, whether it be "Continue with current paragraph but start a new line" or "Finish the previous line prematurely and start a new line". The fact that OPro and Quark behave (I think) differently isn't cause for criticism if their underlying philosophies are different! So I'm not advocating a change to OPro in its behaviour in this respect, because an expanding non-breaking space can be used for the same purpose, only its effect is predictable regardless of justification setting. My previous comment was intended to add a "fine by me!" response to David's remark that such spaces wouldn't be removable from the coding of OPro. Sorry for gratuitously introducing the red herring about Shift-Return. Bruce Goatly -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 3 17:32:38 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149687 for opro ; Thu, 03 May 101 17:32:37 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988903592:20:00786:66; Thu, 03 May 2001 15:26:32 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2114850; 3 May 2001 15:25 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f43F6t214941 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 3 May 2001 16:06:55 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f43F6p514938 for ; Thu, 3 May 2001 16:06:51 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 14vKgy-000I1w-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 3 May 2001 15:06:56 +0000 Date: Thu, 03 May 2001 13:31:46 GMT Message-Id: <149671@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: hard spaces (was Re: two separate questions...) X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >Risc OS doesn't support Unicode fonts Unless you have the the version of the font manager which does. And I said it with an eye to Windows too. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 3 17:32:47 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149690 for opro ; Thu, 03 May 101 17:32:45 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988904497:20:24517:64; Thu, 03 May 2001 15:41:37 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2128110; 3 May 2001 15:41 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f43F6oR14936 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 3 May 2001 16:06:50 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f43F6k514933 for ; Thu, 3 May 2001 16:06:46 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 14vKgr-000I1w-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 3 May 2001 15:06:50 +0000 Date: Thu, 03 May 2001 13:28:42 GMT Message-Id: <149669@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Subject: Re: Ctrl-C and Ctrl-VCtrl-C and Ctrl-V X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >Sorry, I didn't express myself clearly; what I was trying to do was copy part of >the text from one chapter into another chapter of the SAME document. >Isn't using the Control keys an acceptable method there? Of course. What you say should work, and I can't see why it wouldn't. Perhaps my contrived example may show that things are not always simple. Maybe you could email me privately a small example. And could you please post to the list from the address you're subscribed from. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 3 17:32:50 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149691 for opro ; Thu, 03 May 101 17:32:48 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988905372:20:17214:80; Thu, 03 May 2001 15:56:12 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2016761; 3 May 2001 15:55 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f43F6kh14931 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 3 May 2001 16:06:46 +0100 Received: from bonn.shuttle.de (bonn.shuttle.de [194.95.249.247]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4382r513699 for ; Thu, 3 May 2001 09:02:53 +0100 Received: by bonn.shuttle.de (Postfix, from userid 10) id 133AC17DCB; Thu, 3 May 2001 10:02:57 +0200 (CEST) Received: from hmg-koeln.de by Arktur.hmanngym.k.nw.schule.de with smtp (Smail3.1.28.1 #6) id m12mrb8-000fHHC; Wed, 3 May 100 07:21 MET DST Message-ID: <3AF0DC34.2DD8B5C7@hmg-koeln.de> Date: Thu, 03 May 2001 06:19:00 +0200 From: Jochen Konietzko Organization: Heinrich-Mann-Gymnasium X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [de]C-CCK-MCD QXW0322b (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: de,en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Ctrl-C and Ctrl-VCtrl-C and Ctrl-V References: <149604@pilling.demon.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro David Pilling schrieb: > >I just tried to duplicate part of a page with Ctr-C and Ctrl-V; the copy > >contained none of the styles nor effects of the original. > >How can I copy text with all frills included? > > It depends. Say I have text in document A in style 'Bob', I copy it > to document B. Document B also has a style called 'Bob' but with different > attributes. If I have 'rename styles' ticked in OPro text choices, then > on copying the text and document B gets a new style 'Bob0' but retains > its appearance. > > If the rename styles option is not ticked then the text retains its style 'Bob' > but doesn't look the same - since 'Bob' in document B isn't the same as in > document A. > > David Pilling Sorry, I didn't express myself clearly; what I was trying to do was copy part of the text from one chapter into another chapter of the SAME document. Isn't using the Control keys an acceptable method there? Cheers, Jochen Konietzko -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 3 21:27:40 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149699 for opro ; Thu, 03 May 101 21:27:38 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988910466:10:04172:65; Thu, 03 May 2001 17:21:06 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1003553; 3 May 2001 17:20 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f43HJpT15656 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 3 May 2001 18:19:51 +0100 Received: from inca.sle.sharp.co.uk (root@[193.114.241.3]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f43HJh515653 for ; Thu, 3 May 2001 18:19:43 +0100 Received: from sharp.co.uk (aardog.sle.sharp.co.uk [192.16.16.173]) by inca.sle.sharp.co.uk (8.8.8+Sun/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA04395 for ; Thu, 3 May 2001 18:16:44 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <3AF1933E.35B414AC@sharp.co.uk> Date: Thu, 03 May 2001 18:19:58 +0100 From: Graham Jones Organization: Sharp Laboratories of Europe X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (WinNT; U) X-Accept-Language: en,pdf MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Ovation Pro List Subject: New applet - Japanese text input and kanji conversion Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro I've just uploaded a new applet for Ovation Pro which is able to provide Japanese kana text entry and also to display text in JIS encoding using the real kanji characters. The applet uses the Wadalab kanji committee fonts to provide the characters, these have been converted to RISC OS outline fonts using T1toFont and FontFiend. This very definitely early test grade software - I have made use of the fonts and applets, but it hasn't had a hard bashing yet. At the moment, due to space limitation I havne't put up the full fonts set (41 Mb in total) so only the kana text entry is possible. The other fonts are ready and I'll sort out where to put them when I have some more time spare. I suggest anybody interested should go to http://www.4ozNuff.org.uk and download what you find there. Have a play and let me know how you get on, how the fonts look etc. I'm sure the applet can be improved. Graham. PS. I am about to go away for a week, so I might not get a chance to reply to comments for that period. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 3 21:27:47 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149703 for opro ; Thu, 03 May 101 21:27:45 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988912661:10:01193:66; Thu, 03 May 2001 17:57:41 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1117151; 3 May 2001 17:57 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f43HuaL15871 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 3 May 2001 18:56:36 +0100 Received: from mailout04.sul.t-online.com (mailout04.sul.t-online.com [194.25.134.18]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f43HuS515868 for ; Thu, 3 May 2001 18:56:29 +0100 Received: from fwd04.sul.t-online.com by mailout04.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 14vNL3-00036J-03; Thu, 03 May 2001 19:56:29 +0200 Received: from veni (520042741018-0001@[217.0.115.127]) by fmrl04.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 14vNLH-1ZO3uKC; Thu, 3 May 2001 19:56:43 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Stefan Bellon To: Ovation Pro List Date: Thu, 03 May 2001 19:55:39 +0200 Subject: Re: New applet - Japanese text input and kanji conversion Message-ID: <4a74fa32cesbellon@sbellon.de> In-Reply-To: <3AF1933E.35B414AC@sharp.co.uk> References: <3AF1933E.35B414AC@sharp.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 Content-Type: text/plain X-Sender: 520042741018-0001@t-dialin.net Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <3AF1933E.35B414AC@sharp.co.uk>, Graham Jones wrote: [snip] > This very definitely early test grade software - I have made use of > the fonts and applets, but it hasn't had a hard bashing yet. Cool, at least it copes with all things I've thrown at it yet. Mind you, I've learnt Japanese six years ago and didn't use it since then, so I forgot lots of it. But the font looks nice and the conversion works really well as far as I can tell. :-) Greetings, Stefan. -- Stefan Bellon * * PGP 2.6 and GnuPG (OpenPGP) keys available from my home page Data file? No thanks, I prefer to date people -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 3 21:27:47 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149704 for opro ; Thu, 03 May 101 21:27:45 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988916153:20:05183:64; Thu, 03 May 2001 18:55:53 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2005005; 3 May 2001 18:55 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f43IoDh16121 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 3 May 2001 19:50:13 +0100 Received: from sand6.global.net.uk.noc.gxn.net (sand6.global.net.uk [195.147.246.105]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f43Io9516117 for ; Thu, 3 May 2001 19:50:09 +0100 Received: from pe4s06a02.client.global.net.uk ([195.147.150.229] helo=ianadunn.global.co.uk) by sand6.global.net.uk.noc.gxn.net with smtp (Exim 3.03 #1) id 14kAQL-0004UV-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Mon, 02 Apr 2001 20:55:39 +0100 Date: Thu, 3 May 2001 18:17:59 +0100 (BST) From: Dr Ian Dunn Subject: Re: Menu not present To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk In-Reply-To: <149631@pilling.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Dr Ian Dunn X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In on Wed 02 May, David Pilling wrote: > > Brings to mind... > > > The applet Newframe in Others.Breakwell.Applets.NewFrame will cause an > error "Menu does not exist" when Ovation Pro starts if it is installed. > The solution is to get hold of version 1.01 of the applet. > > Or replace > snip > > > > David Pilling that was it , uninstalling new frame 1.0 has resolved it for the moment thank you kind Sir Ian -- Dr Ian Dunn 010101 at last in the 21st Century Use RISC OS - You know it makes sense Derbyshire Area Risc Club (DARC) Derbyshire Area Risc Club (DARC) -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 3 21:28:07 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149709 for opro ; Thu, 03 May 101 21:28:05 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988920446:20:27209:67; Thu, 03 May 2001 20:07:26 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2115219; 3 May 2001 20:06 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f43K5tT16497 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 3 May 2001 21:05:55 +0100 Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f43K5p516494 for ; Thu, 3 May 2001 21:05:51 +0100 Received: from [62.188.142.104] (helo=62.188.142.104) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 14vPK9-0008Oa-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 03 May 2001 21:03:41 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Mr R O Davis To: Ovation Pro List Date: Thu, 03 May 2001 21:05:41 +0100 Subject: Re: New applet - Japanese text input and kanji conversion Message-ID: <4a75061a82rod@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a74fa32cesbellon@sbellon.de> References: <4a74fa32cesbellon@sbellon.de> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02c (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Ihave tried to load this exciting new applet but meet a problem. I have put Kanji into the Applets directory but when loading OvationPro I get an error message: unknown identifier refreshbutton at line 325 in ....library.zKanji and the Applet is not loaded so I cannot experiment further. What am I doing wrong? -- /\ _ \ |==============| / / / \__\ |===================| | Rodger Davis | /_/ / / / \ | rod@argonet.co.uk | |==============| / \_/\_/ /___) |===================| -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 4 13:40:57 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149731 for opro ; Fri, 04 May 101 13:40:54 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988956700:10:08717:70; Fri, 04 May 2001 06:11:40 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1112333; 4 May 2001 6:10 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f443Cfn17789 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 4 May 2001 04:12:41 +0100 Received: from smtp02.fields.gol.com (smtp02.fields.gol.com [203.216.5.132]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f443Ca517786 for ; Fri, 4 May 2001 04:12:36 +0100 Received: from tc-1-2-182.shinjuku.gol.ne.jp ([203.216.9.182] helo=plattir.gol.com) by smtp02.fields.gol.com with smtp (Magnetic Fields) id 14vW1I-0006AE-00 for ; Fri, 04 May 2001 12:12:41 +0900 Date: Fri, 4 May 2001 12:15:02 +0000 (GMT) From: "Ian R. Platt" Subject: Re: New applet - Japanese text input and kanji conversion To: Ovation Pro List In-Reply-To: <3AF1933E.35B414AC@sharp.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Organisation name, location. Telephone/Fax? X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] X-Abuse-Complaints: abuse@gol.com Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Thu 03 May, Graham Jones wrote: > I've just uploaded a new applet for Ovation Pro which is able to provide > Japanese kana text entry and also to display text in JIS encoding using the > real kanji characters. > The applet uses the Wadalab kanji committee fonts to provide the characters, > these have been converted to RISC OS outline fonts using T1toFont and > FontFiend. > Yup, kana/hiragana look OK (interesting to see some no longer in use: must be a Heian scholar out there somewhere in t.u-tokyo.ac.jp :-) ) Anyone know where there's a downloadable keyboard grid so that I can make up & print out a graphic to remind me where various things are? TIA Ian P. -- Ian Platt Risc OS4 + StrongARM = UK technology. Continuing to 'think differently':-) -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 4 13:40:57 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149732 for opro ; Fri, 04 May 101 13:40:54 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988958822:20:09978:64; Fri, 04 May 2001 06:47:02 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2009061; 4 May 2001 6:46 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f446jZB18481 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 4 May 2001 07:45:35 +0100 Received: from monsoon.mail.pipex.net (monsoon.mail.pipex.net [158.43.128.69]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f446jW518478 for ; Fri, 4 May 2001 07:45:32 +0100 Received: (qmail 29445 invoked from network); 4 May 2001 06:45:37 -0000 Received: from userac04.test-uk.uudial.com (HELO gtwywc97@ukgateway.net) (62.188.193.203) by smtp-1.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; 4 May 2001 06:45:37 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Ray Dawson To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Thu, 03 May 2001 19:04:58 +0100 Subject: Loading filetypes Message-ID: <4a74fb0d0arayd@argonet.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 Organization: MagRay Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R Is it possible to get Ovation Pro to load different filetypes and treat them as if they are text? I get a lot of PC files text type without extensions, which usually show as type DOS. Unfortunately OP won't load them with out them first being saved somewhere and retyped to text. It would be useful if I could just drop them into the OP window. Cheers, Ray D -- ..===================================. | M a g R a y Document Services | Ray Dawson Tel: 020 8864 7208 | the audio and braille specialists | rayd@argonet.co.uk '===================================' http://www.magray.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 4 13:41:02 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149734 for opro ; Fri, 04 May 101 13:40:59 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988962963:20:02189:103; Fri, 04 May 2001 07:56:03 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2001481; 4 May 2001 7:54 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f447sa418776 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 4 May 2001 08:54:36 +0100 Received: from inca.sle.sharp.co.uk (root@[193.114.241.3]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f447sW518773 for ; Fri, 4 May 2001 08:54:33 +0100 Received: from sharp.co.uk (aardog.sle.sharp.co.uk [192.16.16.173]) by inca.sle.sharp.co.uk (8.8.8+Sun/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA11595 for ; Fri, 4 May 2001 08:51:40 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <3AF2604F.2832D115@sharp.co.uk> Date: Fri, 04 May 2001 08:54:55 +0100 From: Graham Jones Organization: Sharp Laboratories of Europe X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (WinNT; U) X-Accept-Language: en,pdf MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: New applet - Japanese text input and kanji conversion References: <4a74fa32cesbellon@sbellon.de> <4a75061a82rod@argonet.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Mr R O Davis wrote: > > Ihave tried to load this exciting new applet but meet a > problem. > > I have put Kanji into the Applets directory but when loading > OvationPro I get an error message: Well, there are two possibilities (probably more). First question: which version of Ovation Pro are you using? David put a fix into 2.63 for a problem to do with DDL and fonts which was causing me a problem (not related to yours) so I have only tested on 2.63. I'm not sure how long "refreshbutton" has been in the script language. Secondly I may have used a function defined by another applet and not a basic part of the script language, but I think I am safe there having just checked the manual. Final desparation question - you did put the !Kanji application into Applets, not the Kanji archive? Graham. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 4 13:41:06 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149736 for opro ; Fri, 04 May 101 13:41:03 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988968464:20:04338:65; Fri, 04 May 2001 09:27:44 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2119308; 4 May 2001 9:26 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f449Pjm19162 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 4 May 2001 10:25:45 +0100 Received: from mail12.svr.pol.co.uk (mail12.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.215]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f449Pf519159 for ; Fri, 4 May 2001 10:25:41 +0100 Received: from modem-94.massachusetts.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.72.94] helo=jaycee) by mail12.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 14vbqM-00052B-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Fri, 04 May 2001 10:25:47 +0100 Date: Fri, 04 May 2001 10:22:43 GMT From: JayCee To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: RTF Message-ID: <4b9154754a.JayCee@jstp.freeserve.co.uk> User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.50 (MsgServe/1.50) (RISC-OS/4.03) POPstar/2.02 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Is it possible to export OPro files as RTF? I need to email a file to a PC user and as it includes strike out and coloured text areas I was hoping to be able to convert it to a Word file without losing the formatting or effects - any suggestions.... -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 4 13:41:44 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149743 for opro ; Fri, 04 May 101 13:41:43 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988979698:10:08595:71; Fri, 04 May 2001 12:34:58 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1008365; 4 May 2001 12:34 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f44CXX519815 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 4 May 2001 13:33:33 +0100 Received: from mta03-svc.ntlworld.com (mta03-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.43]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f44CXT519812 for ; Fri, 4 May 2001 13:33:29 +0100 Received: from localhost ([62.252.138.195]) by mta03-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.27 201-229-119-110) with SMTP id <20010504123334.RKWT283.mta03-svc.ntlworld.com@localhost> for ; Fri, 4 May 2001 13:33:34 +0100 Date: Fri, 04 May 2001 13:32:41 +0100 From: To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: RTF Message-ID: <677760754a.colin@cstage.argonet.co.uk> References: <4b9154754a.JayCee@jstp.freeserve.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4b9154754a.JayCee@jstp.freeserve.co.uk> X-Organization: Centre Stage User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.10 (MsgServe/1.10) (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R In message <4b9154754a.JayCee@jstp.freeserve.co.uk> JayCee wrote: > Is it possible to export OPro files as RTF? > David Breakwell has written an RTF exporter, !MakeRTF, which integrates seamlessly into OPro and put a third radio button on the 'save as' window - you can get it from him if you email him direct ie it's not on the resources site, at davidb@argonet.co.uk Hope this helps -- Colin Carnegie colinc@argonet.co.uk www.argonet.co.uk/users/cstage -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 4 17:42:54 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149756 for opro ; Fri, 04 May 101 17:42:51 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988983941:20:13575:64; Fri, 04 May 2001 13:45:41 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2112351; 4 May 2001 13:44 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f44Dh5Z20201 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 4 May 2001 14:43:05 +0100 Received: from mail1.svr.pol.co.uk (mail1.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.18]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f44Dh1520197 for ; Fri, 4 May 2001 14:43:01 +0100 Received: from modem-163.oregon.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.88.163] helo=jaycee) by mail1.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 14vfrN-0005yt-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Fri, 04 May 2001 14:43:06 +0100 Date: Fri, 04 May 2001 14:41:24 GMT From: JayCee To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: RTF Message-ID: References: <4b9154754a.JayCee@jstp.freeserve.co.uk> <677760754a.colin@cstage.argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <677760754a.colin@cstage.argonet.co.uk> User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.50 (MsgServe/1.50) (RISC-OS/4.03) POPstar/2.02 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In message <677760754a.colin@cstage.argonet.co.uk> you wrote: > > > Is it possible to export OPro files as RTF? > > > David Breakwell has written an RTF exporter, !MakeRTF, which integrates > seamlessly into OPro and put a third radio button on the 'save as' window - > you can get it from him if you email him direct ie it's not on the > resources site, at davidb@argonet.co.uk > > Hope this helps Thanks Colin, I have mailed David, looks like just what I want. JayCee -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 4 17:42:54 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149757 for opro ; Fri, 04 May 101 17:42:51 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988982366:10:25476:65; Fri, 04 May 2001 13:19:26 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1025076; 4 May 2001 13:18 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f44DIZL20017 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 4 May 2001 14:18:35 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f44DIV520014 for ; Fri, 4 May 2001 14:18:31 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 14vfTh-000Nkd-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Fri, 4 May 2001 13:18:37 +0000 Date: Fri, 04 May 2001 14:10:58 GMT Message-Id: <149752@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Loading filetypes X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >Is it possible to get Ovation Pro to load different filetypes and treat >them as if they are text? Yes, thats how it works... >as type DOS. Unfortunately OP won't load them with out them first being >saved somewhere and retyped to text. It would be useful if I could just >drop them into the OP window. I just created a DOS file in Edit, dragged it into OPro, you do get a warning message asking if you want to import something which is not text. Why might your copy work in a different way? Some of the transloaders are a bit too enthusiastic and will grab most types of file (and often crash). Or it could be you've fiddled with the impex() functions to twiddle what types OPro will load. I suspect one could use the script language to copy the text importer for another type. So that you could force DOS files to be loaded as text. (looks in wirebound script manual, ah yes page 98). David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 4 17:42:59 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149758 for opro ; Fri, 04 May 101 17:42:55 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988986696:20:10655:78; Fri, 04 May 2001 14:31:36 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2106908; 4 May 2001 14:30 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f44ETuV20450 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 4 May 2001 15:29:56 +0100 Received: from thick.mail.pipex.net (thick.mail.pipex.net [158.43.192.95]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f44ETm520447 for ; Fri, 4 May 2001 15:29:48 +0100 Received: (qmail 8828 invoked from network); 4 May 2001 14:29:36 -0000 Received: from userac47.test-uk.uudial.com (HELO loopback) (62.188.193.246) by smtp-3.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; 4 May 2001 14:29:36 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Dave Symes To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Fri, 04 May 2001 14:49:54 +0100 Subject: Re: Loading filetypes Message-ID: <4a75678902dfs@ukgateway.net> In-Reply-To: <149752@pilling.demon.co.uk> References: <149752@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.04-pre1 Content-Type: text/plain X-Editor: Zap 1.44 (14 Feb 2000) [TEST 1], ZapEmail 0.25 (18 Mar 2000) test-2 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Ray Dawson wrote: In article <149752@pilling.demon.co.uk>, David Pilling wrote: > >Is it possible to get Ovation Pro to load different filetypes and treat > >them as if they are text? > Yes, thats how it works... > >as type DOS. Unfortunately OP won't load them with out them first being > >saved somewhere and retyped to text. It would be useful if I could just > >drop them into the OP window. > I just created a DOS file in Edit, dragged it into OPro, you do get a > warning message asking if you want to import something which is not text. > Why might your copy work in a different way? Hi Ray, Works okay here on 2.63. Open an OvPro window, drop DOS file into that window... An "are you sure window..." appears [Yes] and the DOS text file loads okay in the OvPro window. For silliness sake I took a Word Doc file re-filetyped it to DOS and dropped that into the OvPro window, after the usual "Are you sure" it loaded okay... obviously not much of it was understandable, but it went in without problems. The only thing that comes to mind here... You do have to drop the file into an open OvPro window. Cheers Dave S -- _______________________________________________________________________ Dave Symes... dfs@ukgateway.net Also... df@dafs.freeserve.co.uk .. or... dave@triffid.co.uk http://www.dfs.ukgateway.net -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 4 17:43:03 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149760 for opro ; Fri, 04 May 101 17:43:01 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988988916:10:27952:64; Fri, 04 May 2001 15:08:36 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1102069; 4 May 2001 15:08 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f44F73Y20677 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 4 May 2001 16:07:03 +0100 Received: from mail5.svr.pol.co.uk (mail5.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f44F6w520673 for ; Fri, 4 May 2001 16:06:58 +0100 Received: from modem-163.beryllium.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.3.163] helo=weatherpost.fsnet.co.uk) by mail5.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 14vhAd-0004JQ-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Fri, 04 May 2001 16:07:04 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Ned Abell To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Fri, 04 May 2001 10:03:59 +0100 Subject: Re: Trapping? Message-ID: <4a754d5bd4ned@weatherpost.fsnet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <3a36c0744a%Support@Gill.english.co.uk> References: <3a36c0744a%Support@Gill.english.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On 03 May, David Graddol wrote: > Mike Williams wrote: > > In message <4a74472474nedabell@enterprise.net> I wrote: > > > > > Ive been asked by a printer to add trapping to some PS files because > > > he cant guarantee registration. [snip] > > > > > It is possible but not easy. You need to define a colour which is the > > sun of the two colours in CMYK terms. Then arrange for a thin, say > > 0.25pt, border between the two colours to be in the composite colour. > > With text it is easier to do in ArtWorks by setting the line colour of > > any text to be the composite colour. So a mid yellow might be 70% Y, a > > mid grey 50% black, the composite colour would be 70% yellow, 50% > > black. I have done it, it does work, but very time consuming for other > > than occasional use. > > > I second what Mike Williams says about trapping: it is possible > to do by handcrafting in simple cases but it is impracticable in > more complex cases. [snip] Many thanks for the positive responses. Ive now tried to simplify layout and use overprinting with Artworks generated text. I havnt seen the results yet but the printer says hes happy! -- besters.. Ned === -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 4 21:58:17 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149764 for opro ; Fri, 04 May 101 21:58:14 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988995373:20:11227:64; Fri, 04 May 2001 16:56:13 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2113775; 4 May 2001 16:56 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f44GeZT21101 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 4 May 2001 17:40:35 +0100 Received: from blueyonder.co.uk (pcow028o.blueyonder.co.uk [195.188.53.124]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f446Q4518338 for ; Fri, 4 May 2001 07:26:04 +0100 Received: from bgba01526.blueyonder.co.uk ([213.48.108.157]) by blueyonder.co.uk with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.687.68); Fri, 4 May 2001 07:28:05 +0100 Date: Thu, 3 May 2001 07:41:27 +0100 (BST) From: Barry Gray Subject: Re: hard spaces (was Re: two separate questions...) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk In-Reply-To: <3AEFC918.6E96B8EA@sharp.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Barry Gray E-mail: barrygray@blueyonder.co.uk X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.46] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Wed 02 May, Graham Jones wrote: > By "normal" length, I mean a space of the length you get in non-justified > text for the font you are using. As others have noted they are needed for > things like units after a measurement. I appreciate there is a difference > between a non-breaking space and a fixed length space, but my experience > with other software is that these have usually been made to be one and the > same. I was always taught (and I myself teach) that in SI there is no space between the quantity and the unit, for example 9m not 9 m, although of course nine metres but not usually 9 metres and never nine m. There is more about this on my web site - go to Main Index/ Tutoring/ SI and its units. But I do agree with the distinction between a non-breaking and a fixed-length space even if this was not a good example - in a distinguished recent History publication we had Henry at the bottom of one page and VIII on a line by itself on a new page.... (or perhaps this is more about widows and orphans, which IMHO OP does not handle particularly well). -- Barry Gray http://www.barrygray.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 4 21:58:24 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149769 for opro ; Fri, 04 May 101 21:58:21 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988996066:20:05403:65; Fri, 04 May 2001 17:07:46 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2005192; 4 May 2001 17:07 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f44H6w821273 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 4 May 2001 18:06:58 +0100 Received: from sand2.global.net.uk (sand2.global.net.uk [195.147.246.100]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f44H6t521270 for ; Fri, 4 May 2001 18:06:55 +0100 Received: from p9as01a07.client.global.net.uk ([195.147.225.155] helo=ianadunn.global.co.uk) by sand2.global.net.uk with smtp (Exim 3.16 #1) id 14vj2i-0000YW-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Fri, 04 May 2001 18:07:01 +0100 Date: Thu, 3 May 2001 22:34:30 +0100 (BST) From: Dr Ian Dunn Subject: Compo PCA and OP To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Dr Ian Dunn X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R Hey up I have just rediscovered the PCA part of Compo and on reading the manual I think I should be able to use them with OP . How please ? Ian -- Dr Ian Dunn 010101 at last in the 21st Century Use RISC OS - You know it makes sense Derbyshire Area Risc Club (DARC) Derbyshire Area Risc Club (DARC) -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 4 21:58:24 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149768 for opro ; Fri, 04 May 101 21:58:21 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 988997427:10:00078:65; Fri, 04 May 2001 17:30:27 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1029878; 4 May 2001 17:30 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f44H8N621299 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 4 May 2001 18:08:23 +0100 Received: from mail2.svr.pol.co.uk (mail2.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.210]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f44H8I521296 for ; Fri, 4 May 2001 18:08:19 +0100 Received: from modem-30.mercury.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.59.158] helo=kerslakej2.freeserve.co.uk) by mail2.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 14vj42-0006X8-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Fri, 04 May 2001 18:08:23 +0100 Date: Thu, 3 May 2001 18:56:48 +0100 (BST) From: John Percy Kerslake Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk In-Reply-To: <149629@pilling.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Organisation name, location. Telephone/Fax? X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R On Wed 02 May, David Pilling wrote: > > > >Experience at work and various home manuals (including the OP) suggests > >wire bound is not up to the wear and tear and is difficult to re-enforce. > > 3 ring is less prone to this problem. > > > David Pilling > Also with the 3 ring version could be kept up to date by e mailing replacement sections as ovation files for people to print out. -- J.P. Kerslake B.Sc., F.B.I.S. Pager 07626 - 235878 e-mail address:- Work = kerslake@sees.bangor.ac.uk Home = johnpercy@kerslakej2.freeserve.co.uk, Dyslexia Rules KO. RiscStation 64 meg 50 ns RAM. 9G HD, Ant INS. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 4 21:58:42 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149777 for opro ; Fri, 04 May 101 21:58:40 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989008197:20:04006:64; Fri, 04 May 2001 20:29:57 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2104382; 4 May 2001 20:28 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f44KPvS22080 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 4 May 2001 21:25:57 +0100 Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f44KPs522077 for ; Fri, 4 May 2001 21:25:54 +0100 Received: from [62.188.143.151] (helo=62.188.143.151) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 14vm71-0007bE-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Fri, 04 May 2001 21:23:39 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Mr R O Davis To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Fri, 04 May 2001 21:26:00 +0100 Subject: Re: New applet - Japanese text input and kanji conversion Message-ID: <4a758bccb2rod@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <3AF2604F.2832D115@sharp.co.uk> References: <4a74fa32cesbellon@sbellon.de> <4a75061a82rod@argonet.co.uk> <3AF2604F.2832D115@sharp.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02c (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <3AF2604F.2832D115@sharp.co.uk>, Graham Jones wrote: > Mr R O Davis wrote: > > > > Ihave tried to load this exciting new applet but meet a > > problem. > Well, there are two possibilities (probably more). First question: which > version of Ovation Pro are you using? David put a fix into 2.63 for a > problem to do with DDL and fonts which was causing me a problem (not > related to yours) so I have only tested on 2.63. I'm not sure how long > "refreshbutton" has been in the script language. Yes, that is part of the problem. I have tried it out with 2.60 and I don't get the error message. So the Aplet gets loaded and appears on the Applets menu. Alas the convert part of the menu is greyed out so that I can't do any converting though the fonts are loaded and if I select them in the normal OvPro way I get Hiragana or Katakana but one character at a time... I guess what is supposed to happen is that if I type ka ki ku ke ko I'm supposed to get four characters...? Am I still doing something wrong? -- /\ _ \ |==============| / / / \__\ |===================| | Rodger Davis | /_/ / / / \ | rod@argonet.co.uk | |==============| / \_/\_/ /___) |===================| -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Sat May 5 02:15:30 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149793 for opro ; Sat, 05 May 101 02:15:28 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989011362:10:14884:79; Fri, 04 May 2001 21:22:42 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1014378; 4 May 2001 21:22 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f44LLbp22293 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 4 May 2001 22:21:37 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f44LLX522290 for ; Fri, 4 May 2001 22:21:33 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 14vn18-000JUU-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Fri, 4 May 2001 21:21:38 +0000 Date: Fri, 04 May 2001 22:02:33 GMT Message-Id: <149779@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Compo PCA and OP X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Install the OPCA applet... David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Sat May 5 02:15:36 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149796 for opro ; Sat, 05 May 101 02:15:33 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989013397:20:22514:64; Fri, 04 May 2001 21:56:37 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2125023; 4 May 2001 21:55 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f44LMJV22307 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 4 May 2001 22:22:19 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f44LME522303 for ; Fri, 4 May 2001 22:22:14 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 14vn1o-000JUU-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Fri, 4 May 2001 21:22:20 +0000 Date: Fri, 04 May 2001 22:08:14 GMT Message-Id: <149787@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >Also with the 3 ring version could be kept up to date by e mailing >replacement sections as ovation files for people to print out. I'm hoping to make a fortune selling 3 hole punches... David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Sat May 5 14:17:13 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149802 for opro ; Sat, 05 May 101 14:17:11 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989050259:10:25562:69; Sat, 05 May 2001 08:10:59 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1025157; 5 May 2001 8:10 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4581In23999 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 5 May 2001 09:01:18 +0100 Received: from monsoon.mail.pipex.net (monsoon.mail.pipex.net [158.43.128.69]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f4581D523992 for ; Sat, 5 May 2001 09:01:13 +0100 Received: (qmail 25849 invoked from network); 5 May 2001 08:01:18 -0000 Received: from usercb47.uk.uudial.com (HELO RiscPC) (62.188.150.214) by smtp-1.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; 5 May 2001 08:01:18 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Steven Pampling To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Fri, 04 May 2001 20:34:39 +0100 Subject: Re: Loading filetypes Message-ID: <4a758718f8steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a75678902dfs@ukgateway.net> References: <149752@pilling.demon.co.uk> <4a75678902dfs@ukgateway.net> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <4a75678902dfs@ukgateway.net>, Dave Symes wrote: > For silliness sake I took a Word Doc file re-filetyped it to DOS and > dropped that into the OvPro window, after the usual "Are you sure" it > loaded okay... obviously not much of it was understandable, Sounds like a normal Word document ;-) -- Steve Pampling -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Sat May 5 14:17:13 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149801 for opro ; Sat, 05 May 101 14:17:10 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989049738:20:20845:64; Sat, 05 May 2001 08:02:18 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2125665; 5 May 2001 8:02 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4581JR24000 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 5 May 2001 09:01:19 +0100 Received: from monsoon.mail.pipex.net (monsoon.mail.pipex.net [158.43.128.69]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f4581E523996 for ; Sat, 5 May 2001 09:01:14 +0100 Received: (qmail 25852 invoked from network); 5 May 2001 08:01:20 -0000 Received: from usercb47.uk.uudial.com (HELO RiscPC) (62.188.150.214) by smtp-1.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; 5 May 2001 08:01:20 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Steven Pampling To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Fri, 04 May 2001 20:36:45 +0100 Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) Message-ID: <4a75874a3csteve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: References: <149629@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R In article , John Percy Kerslake wrote: > On Wed 02 May, David Pilling wrote: > > >Experience at work and various home manuals (including the OP) > > >suggests wire bound is not up to the wear and tear and is difficult > > >to re-enforce. > > 3 ring is less prone to this problem. > Also with the 3 ring version could be kept up to date by e mailing > replacement sections as ovation files for people to print out. and the bits you haven't replaced can be re-enforced with those little sticky circles... ....keep going Davids backing into a corner ;) -- Steve Pampling -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Sat May 5 14:17:28 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149809 for opro ; Sat, 05 May 101 14:17:27 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989061229:10:15541:64; Sat, 05 May 2001 11:13:49 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1116159; 5 May 2001 11:13 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f45BBjt24689 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 5 May 2001 12:11:45 +0100 Received: from mailout01.sul.t-online.com (mailout01.sul.t-online.com [194.25.134.80]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f45BBd524685 for ; Sat, 5 May 2001 12:11:40 +0100 Received: from fwd05.sul.t-online.com by mailout01.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 14vzyR-0007zg-09; Sat, 05 May 2001 13:11:43 +0200 Received: from veni (520042741018-0001@[217.0.115.160]) by fmrl05.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 14vzyd-0HehhQC; Sat, 5 May 2001 13:11:55 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Stefan Bellon To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sat, 05 May 2001 13:11:32 +0200 Subject: ImpDoc to OvnPro converter? Message-ID: <4a75dcdf18sbellon@sbellon.de> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 Content-Type: text/plain X-Sender: 520042741018-0001@t-dialin.net Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R Hi! Now that we have an Impression import filter we can convert single ImpDoc files to OvnPro ones. But has anybody written either an independent program or an applet which lets you convert whole directories of ImpDoc files to OvnPro ones? TIA. Greetings, Stefan. -- Stefan Bellon * * PGP 2.6 and GnuPG (OpenPGP) keys available from my home page We must proactively pursue enterprise-wide catalysts for change in order to efficiently foster long-term high-impact methods of empowerment to meet our deadlines. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Sat May 5 16:36:57 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149826 for opro ; Sat, 05 May 101 16:36:53 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989070495:20:21326:67; Sat, 05 May 2001 13:48:15 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2021059; 5 May 2001 13:47 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f45Dl2K25208 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 5 May 2001 14:47:02 +0100 Received: from smtp01.fields.gol.com (smtp01.fields.gol.com [203.216.5.131]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f45Dkv525205 for ; Sat, 5 May 2001 14:46:57 +0100 Received: from tc-1-2-158.shinjuku.gol.ne.jp ([203.216.9.158] helo=plattir.gol.com) by smtp01.fields.gol.com with smtp (Magnetic Fields) id 14w2Oj-0004CP-00 for ; Sat, 05 May 2001 22:47:01 +0900 Date: Sat, 5 May 2001 22:14:55 +0000 (GMT) From: "Ian R. Platt" Subject: Re: New applet - Japanese text input and kanji conversion To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk In-Reply-To: <4a758bccb2rod@argonet.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Organisation name, location. Telephone/Fax? X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] X-Abuse-Complaints: abuse@gol.com Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Fri 04 May, Mr R O Davis wrote: > In article <3AF2604F.2832D115@sharp.co.uk>, > Graham Jones wrote: > > Mr R O Davis wrote: > > > > > > Ihave tried to load this exciting new applet but meet a > > > problem. > > > Well, there are two possibilities (probably more). First question: which > > version of Ovation Pro are you using? David put a fix into 2.63 for a > > problem to do with DDL and fonts which was causing me a problem (not > > related to yours) so I have only tested on 2.63. I'm not sure how long > > "refreshbutton" has been in the script language. > > Yes, that is part of the problem. I have tried it out with 2.60 > and I don't get the error message. So the Aplet gets loaded and > appears on the Applets menu. I'm using 2.58 Loads OK, but... > > Alas the convert part of the menu is greyed out so that I can't do > any converting though the fonts are loaded and if I select them in > the normal OvPro way I get Hiragana or Katakana Hmm, that's the same for me - greyed out 'convert' > but one character > at a time... I guess what is supposed to happen is that if I type > ka ki ku ke ko I'm supposed to get four characters...? .... or five :-) > Am I still > doing something wrong? I get the number I type in, but can't convert to kanji. Ian P. -- Ian Platt Risc OS4 + StrongARM = UK technology. Continuing to 'think differently':-) -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 8 21:56:29 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149835 for opro ; Tue, 08 May 101 21:56:27 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989079843:10:02793:66; Sat, 05 May 2001 16:24:03 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1126844; 5 May 2001 16:23 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f45GMwu25855 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 5 May 2001 17:22:58 +0100 Received: from mail12.svr.pol.co.uk (mail12.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.215]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f45GMr525850 for ; Sat, 5 May 2001 17:22:53 +0100 Received: from modem-66.cobalt.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.26.66] helo=kerslakej2.freeserve.co.uk) by mail12.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 14w4pe-0000FF-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 05 May 2001 17:22:58 +0100 Date: Sat, 5 May 2001 16:13:07 +0100 (BST) From: John Percy Kerslake Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk In-Reply-To: <4a75874a3csteve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Organisation name, location. Telephone/Fax? X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Fri 04 May, Steven Pampling wrote: > In article , > John Percy Kerslake wrote: > > On Wed 02 May, David Pilling wrote: > > > > >Experience at work and various home manuals (including the OP) > > > >suggests wire bound is not up to the wear and tear and is difficult > > > >to re-enforce. > > > > 3 ring is less prone to this problem. > > > Also with the 3 ring version could be kept up to date by e mailing > > replacement sections as ovation files for people to print out. > > and the bits you haven't replaced can be re-enforced with those little > sticky circles... > > ...keep going Davids backing into a corner ;) Especally if your page numbering is chapter based eg in chapter 3 all pages are numbered 3.xx etc -- J.P. Kerslake B.Sc., F.B.I.S. Pager 07626 - 235878 e-mail address:- Work = kerslake@sees.bangor.ac.uk Home = johnpercy@kerslakej2.freeserve.co.uk, Dyslexia Rules KO. RiscStation 64 meg 50 ns RAM. 9G HD, Ant INS. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 8 21:56:30 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149834 for opro ; Tue, 08 May 101 21:56:27 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989076923:20:00404:64; Sat, 05 May 2001 15:35:23 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2110045; 5 May 2001 15:35 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f45FYQ325605 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 5 May 2001 16:34:26 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f45FYN525602 for ; Sat, 5 May 2001 16:34:23 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 14w44i-000MzG-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 5 May 2001 15:34:28 +0000 Date: Sat, 05 May 2001 14:23:06 GMT Message-Id: <149813@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: ImpDoc to OvnPro converter? X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >But has anybody written either an independent program or an applet >which lets you convert whole directories of ImpDoc files to OvnPro ones? This should be easy. Inside !TransIMP there is a file !Convert which takes two arguments and which means you can have a command like !Convert impression toddl So all you need is some sort of tool which will appply another program to each file in a directory. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 8 21:56:34 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149837 for opro ; Tue, 08 May 101 21:56:31 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989079046:20:23923:65; Sat, 05 May 2001 16:10:46 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2117621; 5 May 2001 16:10 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f45G1iC25762 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 5 May 2001 17:01:44 +0100 Received: from anchor-post-30.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-30.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.88]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f45G1e525758 for ; Sat, 5 May 2001 17:01:40 +0100 Received: from ypical.demon.co.uk ([158.152.78.65]) by anchor-post-30.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 14w4V8-0006AO-0U for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 5 May 2001 17:01:46 +0100 Date: Sat, 05 May 2001 16:13:11 +0100 From: Fred Bambrough To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) Message-ID: References: <149787@pilling.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <149787@pilling.demon.co.uk> X-Organization: @ypical User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.50 (MsgServe/1.50) (RISC-OS/4.02) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In message <149787@pilling.demon.co.uk> opro@pilling.demon.co.uk (David Pilling) wrote: > > >Also with the 3 ring version could be kept up to date by e mailing > >replacement sections as ovation files for people to print out. > > I'm hoping to make a fortune selling 3 hole punches... You'll need to sell more than three. -- Fred -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 8 21:56:39 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149839 for opro ; Tue, 08 May 101 21:56:36 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989092007:10:19066:69; Sat, 05 May 2001 19:46:47 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1120560; 5 May 2001 19:46 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f45JjZg26585 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 5 May 2001 20:45:35 +0100 Received: from mailout06.sul.t-online.com (mailout06.sul.t-online.com [194.25.134.19]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f45JjO526581 for ; Sat, 5 May 2001 20:45:25 +0100 Received: from fwd03.sul.t-online.com by mailout06.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 14w7zU-0004HY-01; Sat, 05 May 2001 21:45:20 +0200 Received: from veni (520042741018-0001@[217.0.115.42]) by fmrl03.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 14w7zj-0XvL5lC; Sat, 5 May 2001 21:45:35 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Stefan Bellon To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sat, 05 May 2001 21:30:21 +0200 Subject: Re: ImpDoc to OvnPro converter? Message-ID: <4a760a8a4fsbellon@sbellon.de> In-Reply-To: <149813@pilling.demon.co.uk> References: <149813@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 Content-Type: text/plain X-Sender: 520042741018-0001@t-dialin.net Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <149813@pilling.demon.co.uk>, David Pilling wrote: > >But has anybody written either an independent program or an applet > >which lets you convert whole directories of ImpDoc files to OvnPro > >ones? > This should be easy. Inside !TransIMP there is a file !Convert which > takes two arguments and > which means you can have a command like > !Convert impression toddl > So all you need is some sort of tool which will appply another program > to each file in a directory. That's nice. Thanks a lot for this hint! :-) Greetings, Stefan. -- Stefan Bellon * * PGP 2.6 and GnuPG (OpenPGP) keys available from my home page 100% of people born in 1839, who ate carrots, are dead. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 8 21:56:45 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149842 for opro ; Tue, 08 May 101 21:56:44 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989095152:20:17554:65; Sat, 05 May 2001 20:39:12 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2110600; 5 May 2001 20:39 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f45Kaq126829 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 5 May 2001 21:36:52 +0100 Received: from hose.mail.pipex.net (hose.mail.pipex.net [158.43.128.58]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f45Kal526822 for ; Sat, 5 May 2001 21:36:47 +0100 Received: (qmail 22706 invoked from network); 5 May 2001 20:36:52 -0000 Received: from useraa96.test-uk.uudial.com (HELO loopback) (62.188.193.97) by smtp-4.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; 5 May 2001 20:36:52 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Dave Symes To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sat, 05 May 2001 18:53:31 +0100 Subject: Re: Loading filetypes Message-ID: <4a7601ac90dfs@ukgateway.net> In-Reply-To: <4a758718f8steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> References: <149752@pilling.demon.co.uk> <4a75678902dfs@ukgateway.net> <4a758718f8steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.04-pre1 Content-Type: text/plain X-Editor: Zap 1.44 (14 Feb 2000) [TEST 1], ZapEmail 0.25 (18 Mar 2000) test-2 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <4a758718f8steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk>, Steven Pampling wrote: > In article <4a75678902dfs@ukgateway.net>, > Dave Symes wrote: > > For silliness sake I took a Word Doc file re-filetyped it to DOS and > > dropped that into the OvPro window, after the usual "Are you sure" it > > loaded okay... obviously not much of it was understandable, > Sounds like a normal Word document ;-) Funnily enough steve it was ;-) As per usual Word (Doncha just hate it), It had two short sentences that I'd written, plus yards and yards of the other config stuff... :-( cheers Dave S -- _______________________________________________________________________ Dave Symes... dfs@ukgateway.net Also... df@dafs.freeserve.co.uk .. or... dave@triffid.co.uk http://www.dfs.ukgateway.net -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 8 21:56:48 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149843 for opro ; Tue, 08 May 101 21:56:46 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989095097:10:04307:64; Sat, 05 May 2001 20:38:17 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1003861; 5 May 2001 20:37 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f45KatH26830 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 5 May 2001 21:36:55 +0100 Received: from hose.mail.pipex.net (hose.mail.pipex.net [158.43.128.58]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f45Kan526826 for ; Sat, 5 May 2001 21:36:50 +0100 Received: (qmail 22708 invoked from network); 5 May 2001 20:36:54 -0000 Received: from useraa96.test-uk.uudial.com (HELO loopback) (62.188.193.97) by smtp-4.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; 5 May 2001 20:36:54 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Dave Symes To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sat, 05 May 2001 19:02:56 +0100 Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) Message-ID: <4a7602896cdfs@ukgateway.net> In-Reply-To: <4a75874a3csteve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> References: <149629@pilling.demon.co.uk> <4a75874a3csteve.pampling@ User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.04-pre1 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <4a75874a3csteve.pampling@argonet.co.uk>, Steven Pampling wrote: > In article , > John Percy Kerslake wrote: > > On Wed 02 May, David Pilling wrote: > > > >Experience at work and various home manuals (including the OP) > > > >suggests wire bound is not up to the wear and tear and is difficult > > > >to re-enforce. > > > 3 ring is less prone to this problem. > > > Also with the 3 ring version could be kept up to date by e mailing > > replacement sections as ovation files for people to print out. > and the bits you haven't replaced can be re-enforced with those little > sticky circles... > ...keep going Davids backing into a corner ;) Mnnn! By why that **** awful 3 ring US standard thing. Mighta been better to supply it loose and unpunched so we could use the types of hole punches and folder we already have. I already have 1,2,4 and 6 but I sure don't have a Yankee three holer. Yea, yea... I know they are available, they're in my wholesale stationers catalogue, but that's another 20quid on top of the manual cost. Dave S -- _______________________________________________________________________ Dave Symes... dfs@ukgateway.net Also... df@dafs.freeserve.co.uk .. or... dave@triffid.co.uk http://www.dfs.ukgateway.net -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 8 21:57:12 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149854 for opro ; Tue, 08 May 101 21:57:09 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989145993:20:06061:64; Sun, 06 May 2001 10:46:33 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2005655; 6 May 2001 10:46 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f46Ak6429316 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 6 May 2001 11:46:06 +0100 Received: from finch-post-11.mail.demon.net (finch-post-11.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.39]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f46Ak3529312 for ; Sun, 6 May 2001 11:46:03 +0100 Received: from cartmell.demon.co.uk ([158.152.204.98]) by finch-post-11.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 14wM3E-00094v-0B; Sun, 6 May 2001 10:46:08 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: John Cartmell To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Cc: dfs@ukgateway.net Date: Sun, 06 May 2001 11:37:00 +0100 Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) Message-ID: <4a765d8b4ejohn@cartmell.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: References: <4a7602896cdfs@ukgateway.net> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02d (RISC-OS/4.02) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article , Ian R. Platt wrote: > Replying to John Kerslake, even if the pages are numbered as chapters, > you still have the problem: y0u still have to add the new additional > page between, say, 3.14 and 3.15. Unles you use decimal numbering: 4.1 4.2 4.3 4.4 etc are your original pages. If you want pages between 4.2 and 4.3 then you number them: 4.21 4.22 4.23 etc Of course if the original had more than 9 pages per chapter you might want to number them to 2 places of decimals originally - even bet if you ensure that the first place of decimal identifies the su-topic within the paragraph. Last hint is to identify the date of issue and version number of the manual on each page so that the most recent version can be easily identified. Last question: Why is it that nearly* every loose leaf manual that I have has never had update sheets whilst nearly every bound manual has had updates? *The one exception is Composition and the updates aren't on punched sheets! -- John Cartmell - Manchester, UK Fleur Designs -- FD Games - - - compact designer board games at: Acorn/RISC OS Show - - - Thornes Park Stadium, Wakefield 19th & 20th May 2001 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 8 21:57:25 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149860 for opro ; Tue, 08 May 101 21:57:22 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989152844:20:27615:65; Sun, 06 May 2001 12:40:44 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2120116; 6 May 2001 12:40 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f46CYpt29866 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 6 May 2001 13:34:51 +0100 Received: from smtp02.fields.gol.com (smtp02.fields.gol.com [203.216.5.132]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f46CYj529859 for ; Sun, 6 May 2001 13:34:45 +0100 Received: from tc-2-1-239.shinjuku.gol.ne.jp ([203.216.10.239] helo=plattir.gol.com) by smtp02.fields.gol.com with smtp (Magnetic Fields) id 14wNkO-0004Lb-00 for ; Sun, 06 May 2001 21:34:48 +0900 Date: Sun, 6 May 2001 21:36:02 +0000 (GMT) From: "Ian R. Platt" Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk In-Reply-To: <4a765d8b4ejohn@cartmell.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Organisation name, location. Telephone/Fax? X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] X-Abuse-Complaints: abuse@gol.com Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Sun 06 May, John Cartmell wrote: > In article , > Ian R. Platt wrote: > > Replying to John Kerslake, even if the pages are numbered as chapters, > > you still have the problem: y0u still have to add the new additional > > page between, say, 3.14 and 3.15. > Unles you use decimal numbering: > 4.1 > 4.2 > 4.3 > 4.4 > etc > are your original pages. > If you want pages between 4.2 and 4.3 then you number them: > 4.21 > 4.22 > 4.23 > etc > > Of course if the original had more than 9 pages per chapter you might want > to number them to 2 places of decimals originally - even bet if you ensure > that the first place of decimal identifies the su-topic within the > paragraph. > Last hint is to identify the date of issue and version number of the manual > on each page so that the most recent version can be easily identified. > > Last question: > Why is it that nearly* every loose leaf manual that I have has never had > update sheets whilst nearly every bound manual has had updates? > > *The one exception is Composition and the updates aren't on punched sheets! > S'well known fact: Pilling's Law ;-) Ian P. -- Ian Platt Risc OS4 + StrongARM = UK technology. Continuing to 'think differently':-) -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 8 21:57:29 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149861 for opro ; Tue, 08 May 101 21:57:26 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989139352:10:19401:71; Sun, 06 May 2001 08:55:52 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1115983; 6 May 2001 8:55 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f468sV928838 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 6 May 2001 09:54:31 +0100 Received: from smtp01.fields.gol.com (smtp01.fields.gol.com [203.216.5.131]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f468sQ528835 for ; Sun, 6 May 2001 09:54:26 +0100 Received: from tc-2-1-247.shinjuku.gol.ne.jp ([203.216.10.247] helo=plattir.gol.com) by smtp01.fields.gol.com with smtp (Magnetic Fields) id 14wKJC-0003qa-00; Sun, 06 May 2001 17:54:31 +0900 Date: Sun, 6 May 2001 08:08:35 +0000 (GMT) From: "Ian R. Platt" Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk cc: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk, Dave Symes In-Reply-To: <4a7602896cdfs@ukgateway.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Organisation name, location. Telephone/Fax? X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] X-Abuse-Complaints: abuse@gol.com Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Sat 05 May, Dave Symes wrote: (Snip) > > Mnnn! By why that **** awful 3 ring US standard thing. > > Mighta been better to supply it loose and unpunched so we could use the > types of hole punches and folder we already have. > I already have 1,2,4 and 6 but I sure don't have a Yankee three holer. > Time to complete your collection then ;-) > Yea, yea... I know they are available, they're in my wholesale stationers > catalogue, but that's another 20quid on top of the manual cost. > Now how can 3 holes cost more than 2? You can, of course, punch 3 holes with a 2-hole punch: set paper at angle across the mouth of the punch, or, as you already point out Dave, make up a template & use the 1-hole punch 3 times :-) I agree it would be better for St David to supply unpunched. It would save him a bit too, omitting a process in the manufacturing chain. I'd be happy to pay the same. Replying to John Kerslake, even if the pages are numbered as chapters, you still have the problem: y0u still have to add the new additional page between, say, 3.14 and 3.15. Any new additions (rather than simple substitutions) have to be numbered xx.1 or xx.a). But that's nae se bad as it then shows you they are newer pages. > -- Ian Platt Risc OS4 + StrongARM = UK technology. Continuing to 'think differently':-) -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 8 21:57:35 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149865 for opro ; Tue, 08 May 101 21:57:33 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989145203:10:11807:71; Sun, 06 May 2001 10:33:23 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1011235; 6 May 2001 10:32 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f46AVrI29221 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 6 May 2001 11:31:53 +0100 Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f46AVn529218 for ; Sun, 6 May 2001 11:31:50 +0100 Received: from [62.188.17.253] (helo=62.188.17.253) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 14wLnB-0003Ox-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sun, 06 May 2001 11:29:33 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: David Breakwell To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sun, 06 May 2001 11:12:35 +0000 (GMT) Subject: Re: RTF Message-ID: <4a7660cde2davidb@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <677760754a.colin@cstage.argonet.co.uk> References: <4b9154754a.JayCee@jstp.freeserve.co.uk> <677760754a.colin@cstage.argonet.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02b (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <677760754a.colin@cstage.argonet.co.uk>, wrote: > David Breakwell has written an RTF exporter, !MakeRTF, which integrates > seamlessly into OPro and put a third radio button on the 'save as' > window - you can get it from him if you email him direct ie it's not on > the resources site, at davidb@argonet.co.uk Hello everyone Development of MakeRTF has been slow of late - the last version 3.04 made a few fixes and added support for a few more DDL commands (paragraphs indents and spacings). The next step was to add extra font and Unicode handling so that the mapping of fonts was user selectable and Dingbat type fonts could be used more effectively. I also wanted to add basic graphics support. These have not been done as I have gone back to developing a tool to communicate between the Acorn and my Handspring visor (Palm device). For those that were interested in the Palm - I can now download DBs and install Apps and read DBs from the Palm. I currently adding backup and restore and I will then release it. Can I take this opportunity to remind everyone that MakeRTF is careware - this means that if you find it useful then please make a donation to my Scout Group - details are in the Readme file Regards David -- --. --. --. --. : : --- --- .---------------------------------------------. |_| |_| | _ | | | | |_ | |Internet provider for all Acorn RISC machines| | | |\ | | | | |\| | | '---------------------------------------------' | | | \ |_| |_| | | |__ | davidb@argonet.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 8 21:57:51 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149868 for opro ; Tue, 08 May 101 21:57:50 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989150814:10:21810:64; Sun, 06 May 2001 12:06:54 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1021105; 6 May 2001 12:06 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f46C5bn29700 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 6 May 2001 13:05:37 +0100 Received: from snowstorm.mail.pipex.net (snowstorm.mail.pipex.net [158.43.192.97]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f46C5X529696 for ; Sun, 6 May 2001 13:05:33 +0100 Received: (qmail 20994 invoked from network); 6 May 2001 12:05:38 -0000 Received: from userah14.uk.uudial.com (HELO RiscPC) (62.188.132.199) by smtp-5.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; 6 May 2001 12:05:38 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Steven Pampling To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sun, 06 May 2001 11:23:32 +0100 Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) Message-ID: <4a765c5015steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: References: <4a7602896cdfs@ukgateway.net> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article , Ian R. Platt wrote: > You can, of course, punch 3 holes with a 2-hole punch: set paper at > angle across the mouth of the punch, or, as you already point out Dave, > make up a template & use the 1-hole punch 3 times :-) Now if the manual document was printed from a template that included the holes ready marked... -- Steve Pampling -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 8 21:57:54 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149867 for opro ; Tue, 08 May 101 21:57:38 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989178958:20:00060:64; Sun, 06 May 2001 19:55:58 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2118191; 6 May 2001 19:55 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f46JsVn31014 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 6 May 2001 20:54:31 +0100 Received: from warrior-outbound.servers.plus.net ([212.159.14.227]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f46JsQ531011 for ; Sun, 6 May 2001 20:54:27 +0100 Received: (qmail 22054 invoked from network); 6 May 2001 19:54:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO tinshill.force9.net) (212.159.23.165) by warrior with SMTP; 6 May 2001 19:54:25 -0000 Date: Sun, 6 May 2001 09:06:05 +0100 (BST) From: Anthony Hilton Subject: Re: Loading filetypes To: Ovation Pro List In-Reply-To: <4a7601ac90dfs@ukgateway.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In on Sat 05 May, Dave Symes wrote: > In article <4a758718f8steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk>, > Steven Pampling wrote: > > In article <4a75678902dfs@ukgateway.net>, > > Dave Symes wrote: > > > For silliness sake I took a Word Doc file re-filetyped it to DOS and > > > dropped that into the OvPro window, after the usual "Are you sure" it > > > loaded okay... obviously not much of it was understandable, > > > Sounds like a normal Word document ;-) > > Funnily enough steve it was ;-) > > As per usual Word (Doncha just hate it), It had two short sentences that > I'd written, plus yards and yards of the other config stuff... :-( > Try a simple experiment: write a sentence in Word, save as a Word doc, safe as RTF and save as text and compare file sizes - I think I have seen 10:1 for Doc:txt. The basic Word bloat nust be fairly constant, but there is a full second copy of the text in there if I remember correctly, so the effect is worst for short documents. Anthony Hilton -- ajh@tinshill.f9.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 8 21:57:58 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149871 for opro ; Tue, 08 May 101 21:57:56 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989196008:10:02030:67; Mon, 07 May 2001 00:40:08 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1128603; 7 May 2001 0:39 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f470aYh31745 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 7 May 2001 01:36:34 +0100 Received: from snowstorm.mail.pipex.net (snowstorm.mail.pipex.net [158.43.192.97]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f470aT531742 for ; Mon, 7 May 2001 01:36:31 +0100 Received: (qmail 6442 invoked from network); 7 May 2001 00:36:33 -0000 Received: from userco99.uk.uudial.com (HELO RiscPC) (62.188.156.29) by smtp-5.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; 7 May 2001 00:36:33 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Steven Pampling To: Ovation Pro List Date: Sun, 06 May 2001 21:49:57 +0100 Subject: Re: Loading filetypes Message-ID: <4a7695a9e0steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: References: <4a7601ac90dfs@ukgateway.net> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article , Anthony Hilton wrote: > Try a simple experiment: write a sentence in Word, save as a Word doc, > safe as RTF and save as text and compare file sizes - I think I have > seen 10:1 for Doc:txt. The basic Word bloat nust be fairly constant, but > there is a full second copy of the text in there if I remember > correctly, so the effect is worst for short documents. Turn off "Fast Save" and see what difference it makes. -- Steve Pampling -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 8 21:58:27 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149875 for opro ; Tue, 08 May 101 21:58:24 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989236312:10:23708:76; Mon, 07 May 2001 11:51:52 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1022789; 7 May 2001 11:50 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f47Bnks00835 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 7 May 2001 12:49:46 +0100 Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f47Bng500832 for ; Mon, 7 May 2001 12:49:42 +0100 Received: from [62.188.146.30] (helo=62.188.146.30) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 14wjU2-0003Wb-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Mon, 07 May 2001 12:47:23 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Mr R O Davis To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Mon, 07 May 2001 12:49:41 +0100 Subject: Re: New applet - Japanese text input and kanji conversion Message-ID: <4a76e80933rod@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: References: User-Agent: Pluto/2.02c (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro I have been trying a bit more with this applet having installed v260 of OvPro. I find I can now enter hiragana and katakana in all the four styles provided. There are two problems: 1. I don't get any icon on the icon-bar so I cannot switch from Latin characters from Kana. 2. More curious... I cannot enter the character ze in either Hiragana or Katakana. Se is OK. Either the 'ze' is missing from the fonts or for some reason the conversion process of z+e fails. Are these problems 'just me' or do the others trying out this brilliant applet find the same problems. P.S. I have found that there are some Cyrillic characters in the fonts... I wonder if there could be a modification when the icon 'switcher' works to allow these to be used? -- /\ _ \ |==============| / / / \__\ |===================| | Rodger Davis | /_/ / / / \ | rod@argonet.co.uk | |==============| / \_/\_/ /___) |===================| -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 8 21:58:51 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149883 for opro ; Tue, 08 May 101 21:58:49 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989254768:20:04204:66; Mon, 07 May 2001 16:59:28 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2126175; 7 May 2001 16:59 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f47GwZZ01775 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 7 May 2001 17:58:35 +0100 Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f47GwW501772 for ; Mon, 7 May 2001 17:58:32 +0100 Received: from [62.188.137.29] (helo=62.188.137.29) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 14woIp-0002oX-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Mon, 07 May 2001 17:56:08 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Mr R O Davis To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Mon, 07 May 2001 17:58:07 +0100 Subject: Re: New applet - Japanese text input and kanji conversion Message-ID: <4a77044635rod@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a76e80933rod@argonet.co.uk> References: <4a76e80933rod@argonet.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02c (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Me again... if anyone's out there! I find that of my two problems one other is solved. The icon to change from Latin characters to Kana is indeed there... it is on the bar at the top of the window in OvPro not where I was expecting it viz on the main icon bar at the bottom of the screen. The 'ze' problem persists, however. I have examined the fonts and the character seems to be there. So it must be that for some reason the conversion process of z+e = 'ze' fails. Now all I have to do (when the ze problem is sorted) is to try to find out how to get my button bar back as I like it ... in several rows... the upgrading from v256 to v260 has lost me my multirow button bar! -- /\ _ \ |==============| / / / \__\ |===================| | Rodger Davis | /_/ / / / \ | rod@argonet.co.uk | |==============| / \_/\_/ /___) |===================| -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 8 21:58:55 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149885 for opro ; Tue, 08 May 101 21:58:52 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989256416:20:09568:64; Mon, 07 May 2001 17:26:56 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2104694; 7 May 2001 17:26 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f47HGUj01895 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 7 May 2001 18:16:30 +0100 Received: from mail6.svr.pol.co.uk (mail6.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.212]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f47HGN501889 for ; Mon, 7 May 2001 18:16:23 +0100 Received: from modem-78.ruthenium.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.37.206] helo=kerslakej2.freeserve.co.uk) by mail6.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 14wocU-0003JK-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Mon, 07 May 2001 18:16:27 +0100 Date: Sun, 6 May 2001 18:59:29 +0100 (BST) From: John Percy Kerslake Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Organisation name, location. Telephone/Fax? X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Sun 06 May, Ian R. Platt wrote: > On Sun 06 May, John Cartmell wrote: > > In article , > > Ian R. Platt wrote: > > > Replying to John Kerslake, even if the pages are numbered as chapters, > > > you still have the problem: y0u still have to add the new additional > > > page between, say, 3.14 and 3.15. > > Unles you use decimal numbering: > > 4.1 > > 4.2 > > 4.3 > > 4.4 > > etc > > are your original pages. > > If you want pages between 4.2 and 4.3 then you number them: > > 4.21 > > 4.22 > > 4.23 > > etc > > > > Of course if the original had more than 9 pages per chapter you might want > > to number them to 2 places of decimals originally - even bet if you ensure > > that the first place of decimal identifies the su-topic within the > > paragraph. > > Last hint is to identify the date of issue and version number of the manual > > on each page so that the most recent version can be easily identified. > > > > Last question: > > Why is it that nearly* every loose leaf manual that I have has never had > > update sheets whilst nearly every bound manual has had updates? > > > > *The one exception is Composition and the updates aren't on punched sheets! > > > S'well known fact: > > Pilling's Law > > ;-) > > Ian P. yes you are quite correct. replacing an entier chapter Just to update one section would be a waste of paper. an X.Y.ZZ system is better. Post in haste repent while reading a lot of corrections. -- J.P. Kerslake B.Sc., F.B.I.S. Pager 07626 - 235878 e-mail address:- Work = kerslake@sees.bangor.ac.uk Home = johnpercy@kerslakej2.freeserve.co.uk, Dyslexia Rules KO. RiscStation 64 meg 50 ns RAM. 9G HD, Ant INS. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 8 22:06:29 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149891 for opro ; Tue, 08 May 101 22:06:27 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989355489:10:23494:66; Tue, 08 May 2001 20:58:09 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1123534; 8 May 2001 20:57 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f48Ks2x06075 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 8 May 2001 21:54:02 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f48Krw506072 for ; Tue, 8 May 2001 21:53:59 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 14xEUe-000FmN-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 8 May 2001 20:54:04 +0000 Date: Sat, 05 May 2001 21:20:23 GMT Message-Id: <149830@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R >and the bits you haven't replaced can be re-enforced with those little >sticky circles... Actually I should read the messages before replying. I meant that three ring is more substantial than two ring which needs the sticky circles. I'd imagine wire bound is stronger than any ring binder. I think the idea with wire bound is use it and then throw it away, they are much handier than ring binders (speaking as a programmer). David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 9 02:43:33 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149928 for opro ; Wed, 09 May 101 02:43:29 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989363085:10:06493:70; Tue, 08 May 2001 23:04:45 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1005470; 8 May 2001 23:03 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f48N0Cw06523 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 9 May 2001 00:00:12 +0100 Received: from mserv1c.vianw.co.uk (mserv1c.vianw.co.uk [195.102.240.33]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f48N08506520 for ; Wed, 9 May 2001 00:00:08 +0100 Received: from [194.119.179.59] (helo=Caslon.english.co.uk) by mserv1c.vianw.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #5) id 14xGSi-000004-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 09 May 2001 00:00:13 +0100 Received: from Gill (10.0.1.1) by Caslon.english.co.uk; Tue, 08 May 2001 23:37:37 +0100 Date: Tue, 08 May 2001 23:37:53 +0100 From: David Graddol To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) Message-ID: <7937a7774a%Support@Gill.english.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <149830@pilling.demon.co.uk> X-Organization: The English Company (UK) Ltd X-Mailer: Messenger v1.41d for RISC OS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro opro@pilling.demon.co.uk (David Pilling) wrote: > > >and the bits you haven't replaced can be re-enforced with those little > >sticky circles... > > Actually I should read the messages before replying. I meant that three ring > is more substantial than two ring which needs the sticky circles. > I'd imagine wire bound is stronger than any ring binder. > > I think the idea with wire bound is use it and then throw it away, they are > much handier than ring binders (speaking as a programmer). Yep. I'd second that. A three-ring binder sounds a pain, takes more room on the shelf as well as on the desk. A wirebound manual can usually lie flat with the relevant page open. David -- The English Company (UK) Ltd http://www.english.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 9 14:47:00 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149932 for opro ; Wed, 09 May 101 14:46:57 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989388671:10:04839:68; Wed, 09 May 2001 06:11:11 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1004716; 9 May 2001 6:10 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f491f6S07017 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 9 May 2001 02:41:06 +0100 Received: from blueyonder.co.uk (pcow024o.blueyonder.co.uk [195.188.53.126]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f466ce528473 for ; Sun, 6 May 2001 07:38:40 +0100 Received: from bgba01526.blueyonder.co.uk ([213.48.120.93]) by blueyonder.co.uk with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.687.68); Sun, 6 May 2001 07:40:33 +0100 Date: Sat, 5 May 2001 19:15:14 +0100 (BST) From: Barry Gray Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Barry Gray E-mail: barrygray@blueyonder.co.uk X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.46] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Thu 03 May, John Percy Kerslake wrote: > On Wed 02 May, David Pilling wrote: > > > > > > >Experience at work and various home manuals (including the OP) suggests > > >wire bound is not up to the wear and tear and is difficult to re-enforce. > > > > 3 ring is less prone to this problem. > > > > > > David Pilling > > > > Also with the 3 ring version could be kept up to date by e mailing > replacement sections as ovation files for people to print out. Good idea. The problem with all manuals, whether printed or on CD ROM, is that they go out of date so quickly, and the release notes issued with program revisions are really inadequate as manual updates. When I first started in computing, in the 1950s, the manual was a set of duplicated typewritten pages stapled together. It was kept up to date by the author telephoning you and you writing the amendments in by hand. By the middle sixties the manual was a loose leaf binder of printed pages which was kept up to date by you being sent replacement pages: throw away pages 2 and 3 and replace with new pages 2, 3 and 3a. A similar system exists today for, for example, Cromer's Manual for Heads of Science. Mind you, you pay iirc ukp80 pa for the service.... -- Barry Gray http://www.barrygray.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 9 14:57:07 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149939 for opro ; Wed, 09 May 101 14:57:05 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989402479:10:24113:73; Wed, 09 May 2001 10:01:19 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1024151; 9 May 2001 10:01 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f499xec08296 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 9 May 2001 10:59:40 +0100 Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f499xZ508290 for ; Wed, 9 May 2001 10:59:35 +0100 Received: from [62.188.17.71] (helo=62.188.17.71) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 14xQiV-0001a1-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 09 May 2001 10:57:11 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: "charles.hope" To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Wed, 09 May 2001 08:52:02 +0100 Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) Message-ID: <4a77d9f371charles.hope@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <149514@pilling.demon.co.uk> References: <149514@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02c (RISC-OS/4.02) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R On 01 May, David Pilling wrote: > If anyone wants a copy of the new manual then I've set a price of ukp 25 > all inclusive. This seems high to me, but its a heavy item and a small > print run. For most people using the manual on the CD will be the best > thing. I've just come across a CD manual designed for looking at on a monitor. I have always been irritated by having to scroll down a page and then go to the next one, but this manual from Wacom is formatted for landscape viewing, so you just have to go to "next page". Much easier to use. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 9 14:57:09 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149940 for opro ; Wed, 09 May 101 14:57:08 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989402479:10:24118:64; Wed, 09 May 2001 10:01:19 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1106160; 9 May 2001 10:00 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f499xhc08298 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 9 May 2001 10:59:43 +0100 Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f499xd508294 for ; Wed, 9 May 2001 10:59:39 +0100 Received: from [62.188.17.71] (helo=62.188.17.71) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 14xQiY-0001a1-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 09 May 2001 10:57:15 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: "charles.hope" To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Wed, 09 May 2001 10:58:26 +0100 Subject: RTF files Message-ID: <4a77e585dacharles.hope@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <149633@pilling.demon.co.uk> References: <149633@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02c (RISC-OS/4.02) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R I find that if I try to import an RTF File derived directly from a Word document, there is a lot of disc activity but no text appears in the frame. I can, however, load the RTF file into a new document and then copy it over to the one where I want it. If I take the same Word document, load it into EasiWriter and save as RTF from there, I can put this straight into the frame of an existing document. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 9 21:55:38 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149969 for opro ; Wed, 09 May 101 21:55:34 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989430813:20:11735:123; Wed, 09 May 2001 17:53:33 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2011384; 9 May 2001 17:53 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f49Hq8U09792 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 9 May 2001 18:52:08 +0100 Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f49F9P509328 for ; Wed, 9 May 2001 16:09:25 +0100 Received: from [62.188.145.235] (helo=62.188.145.235) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 14xVYL-0004Mt-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 09 May 2001 16:07:01 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Derrick Porter To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Wed, 09 May 2001 15:22:54 +0100 Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) Message-ID: <4a77fdbc6bdgporter@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <7937a7774a%Support@Gill.english.co.uk> References: <149830@pilling.demon.co.uk> <7937a7774a%Support@Gill.english.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.01f (RISC-OS/4.03) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <7937a7774a%Support@Gill.english.co.uk>, David Graddol wrote: > Yep. I'd second that. A three-ring binder sounds a pain, takes > more room on the shelf as well as on the desk. A wirebound manual > can usually lie flat with the relevant page open. Sorry, I disagree ... strongly. Although a wire bound-manual is more convenient to use, a ring-bound manual is much more convenient as far as adding updates is concerned. In my case I not only add updates in this manner but brief notes on how to do various things that I may have to do only once or twice a year. My memory is not too good and if I didn't have these working-notes I would have to start from scratch each time. My personal preference is for 4-ring A4 format, but 3-ring in a smaller page size is just about OK. As far as taking up space is concerned I have just done a quick count - I have 49 A4 ring binders on my shelves, ranging in size from 4 inches wide down to three quarters. One more wouldn't be a problem. A manual printed on plain A4 pages would be OK with me. I can easily punch holes and file it myself. If -- ___________________________________________________________________________ Derrick G Porter dgporter@argonet.co.uk Tel: +44 1798 81 2383 ..... in deepest Sussex ..... ___________________________________________________________________________ -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 9 21:55:42 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149972 for opro ; Wed, 09 May 101 21:55:39 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989430849:10:06398:92; Wed, 09 May 2001 17:54:09 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1116987; 9 May 2001 17:53 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f49HpxH09782 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 9 May 2001 18:51:59 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f49Hpt509779 for ; Wed, 9 May 2001 18:51:56 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 14xY81-0006Xt-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 9 May 2001 17:52:01 +0000 Date: Wed, 09 May 2001 18:19:42 GMT Message-Id: <149957@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R >I've just come across a CD manual designed for looking at on a monitor. I >have always been irritated by having to scroll down a page and then go to >the next one, but this manual from Wacom is formatted for landscape >viewing, so you just have to go to "next page". Much easier to use. Good idea, and a fair point. What happens when you print the Wacom manual out on A4 or A5 paper? In a way it shows the shortcomings of the program, in that one would like a HTML version of the manual or a version that prints out well on screen. Perhaps one for A5, and another for A4. But we only have one version, that took a huge amount of effort to produce, and changing the format would be another massive exercise. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 9 21:55:46 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149973 for opro ; Wed, 09 May 101 21:55:43 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989440068:20:23951:80; Wed, 09 May 2001 20:27:48 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2120116; 9 May 2001 20:27 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f49KR6n10429 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 9 May 2001 21:27:06 +0100 Received: from alpha.netvision.net.il (alpha.netvision.net.il [194.90.1.13]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f49KR0510426 for ; Wed, 9 May 2001 21:27:01 +0100 Received: from netvision.net.il (ras6-p126.jlm.netvision.net.il [62.0.150.126]) by alpha.netvision.net.il (8.9.3/8.8.6) with ESMTP id XAA32437 for ; Wed, 9 May 2001 23:27:03 +0300 (IDT) Message-ID: <3AF9A848.5B0D9C76@netvision.net.il> Date: Wed, 09 May 2001 23:27:52 +0300 From: Michael Ben-Gershon Organization: My Office X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.2.19 i686) X-Accept-Language: en-GB, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) References: <149830@pilling.demon.co.uk> <7937a7774a%Support@Gill.english.co.uk> <4a77d82c05steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Steven Pampling wrote: > > In article <7937a7774a%Support@Gill.english.co.uk>, > David Graddol wrote: > > Yep. I'd second that. A three-ring binder sounds a pain, takes > > more room on the shelf as well as on the desk. A wirebound manual > > can usually lie flat with the relevant page open. > > Unfortunately a wirebound manual.. > > 1. At the side of another wirebound manual starts mating... > 2. Gives you no clues on its spine what the contents are... 3. Often begins to 'lose' pages at its start and end, when they work free at the point the rings meet (if you see what I mean). Michael Ben-Gershon mybg@netvision.net.il -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 9 21:55:47 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149974 for opro ; Wed, 09 May 101 21:55:43 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989436110:10:16855:72; Wed, 09 May 2001 19:21:50 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1125144; 9 May 2001 19:21 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f49JKnA10179 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 9 May 2001 20:20:49 +0100 Received: from monsoon.mail.pipex.net (monsoon.mail.pipex.net [158.43.128.69]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f49JKk510176 for ; Wed, 9 May 2001 20:20:46 +0100 Received: (qmail 13001 invoked from network); 9 May 2001 19:20:52 -0000 Received: from useraj44.uk.uudial.com (HELO RiscPC) (62.188.133.173) by smtp-1.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; 9 May 2001 19:20:52 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Steven Pampling To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Wed, 09 May 2001 08:32:36 +0100 Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) Message-ID: <4a77d82c05steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <7937a7774a%Support@Gill.english.co.uk> References: <149830@pilling.demon.co.uk> <7937a7774a%Support@Gill.english.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <7937a7774a%Support@Gill.english.co.uk>, David Graddol wrote: > Yep. I'd second that. A three-ring binder sounds a pain, takes > more room on the shelf as well as on the desk. A wirebound manual > can usually lie flat with the relevant page open. Unfortunately a wirebound manual.. 1. At the side of another wirebound manual starts mating... 2. Gives you no clues on its spine what the contents are... -- Steve Pampling -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 10 01:47:50 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149982 for opro ; Thu, 10 May 101 01:47:49 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989444097:20:15012:76; Wed, 09 May 2001 21:34:57 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2013568; 9 May 2001 21:34 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f49LWdm10682 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 9 May 2001 22:32:39 +0100 Received: from finch-post-10.mail.demon.net (finch-post-10.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.38]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f49LWZ510679 for ; Wed, 9 May 2001 22:32:35 +0100 Received: from omba.demon.co.uk ([158.152.58.5]) by finch-post-10.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 14xbZY-000Bnj-0A for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 9 May 2001 21:32:41 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Jeremy C B Nicoll To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Wed, 09 May 2001 22:26:37 +0100 Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) Message-ID: <4a78248741Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <149830@pilling.demon.co.uk> References: <149830@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.01g (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On 05 May, David Pilling wrote: > I think the idea with wire bound is use it and then throw it away, they > are much handier than ring binders (speaking as a programmer). Speaking (also as a programmer, though not this platform) I don't have a problem with ring binders, whether 2- or n-rings, provided that the binder really *is* big enough for the manual - ie the whole manual can be on one or the other side of the opening in the rings, rather than only really being usable if you want to open it near the middle. It's certainly useful to be able to insert extra pages, even if they are just one's own notes so I'd never choose spiral binding. Spiral is however much better than conventional hardback textbook binding. I bought a duplexing laser printer recently and one big reason for getting it was that nearly no software comes with a real printed manual these days and I expect to physically print many soft manuals so I can read them in bed (I probably need to get a life too). Indeed one of the printer's own technical manuals is something like 800 pages long - though I might print that 2-up to save some paper. -- Jeremy C B Nicoll - my opinions are my own. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 10 02:03:24 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA149995 for opro ; Thu, 10 May 101 02:03:20 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989456176:20:18724:66; Thu, 10 May 2001 00:56:16 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2018336; 10 May 2001 0:55 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4A0j8511221 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 10 May 2001 01:45:08 +0100 Received: from anchor-post-31.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-31.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.89]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f49DMp509003 for ; Wed, 9 May 2001 14:22:51 +0100 Received: from barc.demon.co.uk ([194.222.19.11]) by anchor-post-31.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 14xTvd-0004oH-0V; Wed, 9 May 2001 14:22:57 +0100 Date: Wed, 9 May 2001 14:17:27 +0100 (BST) From: MikeWilson Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) To: Ovation Pro Chat list cc: Ovation Pro Chat list , David Pilling In-Reply-To: <149830@pilling.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Organisation name, location. Telephone/Fax? X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Sat 05 May, David Pilling wrote: > > >and the bits you haven't replaced can be re-enforced with those little > >sticky circles... > > Actually I should read the messages before replying. I meant that three ring > is more substantial than two ring which needs the sticky circles. I quite agree, a 3 ring A5 binder is much more stable than a 2 ring A5 binder. As far as the punching problem is concerned, I have a cheap 4 hold adjustable punch and it is easy to set this to punch 3 holes. > I'd imagine wire bound is stronger than any ring binder. > > I think the idea with wire bound is use it and then throw it away, > they are much handier than ring binders (speaking as a programmer). Indeed, but with a program where there are frequent update releases it is much easier to add new pages into a ring binder, 2 hole or 3. I will certainly be ordering a 3 ring manual from David. Mike. -- Mike Wilson 0113-253-3722 mike@barc.demon.co.uk Hoping to see you at Wakefield 2001 - The Acorn RISC OS Show Thornes Park Athletics Stadium, Wakefield - May 19/20 2001 See: http://www.wacg.org.uk/show/ for latest information -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 10 13:15:37 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150003 for opro ; Thu, 10 May 101 13:15:35 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989486289:10:12625:94; Thu, 10 May 2001 09:18:09 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id ab1012104; 10 May 2001 9:17 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4A9FCG12443 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 10 May 2001 10:15:12 +0100 Received: from mail6.svr.pol.co.uk (mail6.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.212]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4A9F8512440 for ; Thu, 10 May 2001 10:15:08 +0100 Received: from modem-60.maroon-clown.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.40.60] helo=modem-60) by mail6.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 14xmXK-0003jN-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 10 May 2001 10:15:11 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Ray Dawson To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Thu, 10 May 2001 10:14:34 +0100 Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) Message-ID: <4a786557c0rayd@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a77d82c05steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> References: <149830@pilling.demon.co.uk> <7937a7774a%Support@Gill.english.co.uk> <4a77d82c05steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 Organization: MagRay Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R In article <4a77d82c05steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk>, Steven Pampling wrote: > In article <7937a7774a%Support@Gill.english.co.uk>, > David Graddol wrote: > > Yep. I'd second that. A three-ring binder sounds a pain, takes > > more room on the shelf as well as on the desk. A wirebound manual > > can usually lie flat with the relevant page open. > Unfortunately a wirebound manual.. > 1. At the side of another wirebound manual starts mating... > 2. Gives you no clues on its spine what the contents are... 3. Always starts to unwind from the bottom if You have turned the pages back on it... Cheers, Ray D -- ..===================================. | M a g R a y Document Services | Ray Dawson Tel: 020 8864 7208 | the audio and braille specialists | rayd@argonet.co.uk '===================================' http://www.magray.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 10 14:54:47 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150025 for opro ; Thu, 10 May 101 14:54:45 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989498163:10:03359:89; Thu, 10 May 2001 12:36:03 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1107344; 10 May 2001 12:35 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4ACXDo13141 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 10 May 2001 13:33:13 +0100 Received: from mta01-svc.ntlworld.com (mta01-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.41]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4A9fS512628 for ; Thu, 10 May 2001 10:41:28 +0100 Received: from riscpc.at.home ([213.107.105.170]) by mta01-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.27 201-229-119-110) with SMTP id <20010510094134.XJZ283.mta01-svc.ntlworld.com@riscpc.at.home> for ; Thu, 10 May 2001 10:41:34 +0100 Date: Thu, 10 May 2001 10:41:07 +0100 From: John Pettigrew To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) Message-ID: <4ec667784a.john@xl-cambridge.com> References: <149830@pilling.demon.co.uk> <7937a7774a%Support@Gill.english.co.uk> <4a77d82c05steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> <4a786557c0rayd@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a786557c0rayd@argonet.co.uk> X-Organization: XL Cambridge User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.10d (MsgServe/1.10) (RISC-OS/4.02) X-Editor: Zap, using ZapEmail 0.22 (27 Nov 1998) patch-3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In a previous message, Ray Dawson wrote: > In article <4a77d82c05steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk>, > Steven Pampling wrote: > > In article <7937a7774a%Support@Gill.english.co.uk>, > > David Graddol wrote: > > > Yep. I'd second that. A three-ring binder sounds a pain, takes > > > more room on the shelf as well as on the desk. A wirebound manual > > > can usually lie flat with the relevant page open. > > Unfortunately a wirebound manual.. > > 1. At the side of another wirebound manual starts mating... > > 2. Gives you no clues on its spine what the contents are... > 3. Always starts to unwind from the bottom if You have turned the pages > back on it... It's sounding to me like people would quite like it unbound, so that they can use their preferred method. Personally, I'd use my comb-binding machine :-) John -- John Pettigrew XL Cambridge - Contract and freelance editing and writing Life sciences specialist - molecular biology, genetics, biotechnology john@xl-cambridge.com http://www.xl-cambridge.com/ -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 10 16:45:09 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150034 for opro ; Thu, 10 May 101 16:45:08 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989509045:20:20626:71; Thu, 10 May 2001 15:37:25 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2020399; 10 May 2001 15:37 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4AFNrv13675 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 10 May 2001 16:23:53 +0100 Received: from monsoon.mail.pipex.net (monsoon.mail.pipex.net [158.43.128.69]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f4AFNo513672 for ; Thu, 10 May 2001 16:23:50 +0100 Received: (qmail 4307 invoked from network); 10 May 2001 15:23:56 -0000 Received: from userev03.uk.uudial.com (HELO RiscPC) (62.188.17.186) by smtp-1.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; 10 May 2001 15:23:56 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Steven Pampling To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Thu, 10 May 2001 08:07:37 +0100 Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) Message-ID: <4a7859b87esteve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <3AF9A848.5B0D9C76@netvision.net.il> References: <149830@pilling.demon.co.uk> <7937a7774a%Support@Gill.english.co.uk> <4a77d82c05steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> <3AF9 User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <3AF9A848.5B0D9C76@netvision.net.il>, Michael Ben-Gershon wrote: > Steven Pampling wrote: > > > > In article <7937a7774a%Support@Gill.english.co.uk>, > > David Graddol wrote: > > > Yep. I'd second that. A three-ring binder sounds a pain, takes > > > more room on the shelf as well as on the desk. A wirebound manual > > > can usually lie flat with the relevant page open. > > > > Unfortunately a wirebound manual.. > > > > 1. At the side of another wirebound manual starts mating... > > 2. Gives you no clues on its spine what the contents are... > 3. Often begins to 'lose' pages at its start and end, when they work > free at the point the rings meet (if you see what I mean). I do see. The items I listed were the first two that came to mind. 4. It's all but impossible to update a wirebound manual. 5. If you do succeed on 4. the wire has been bent and you have 3. occurring virtually every time you handle the manual. -- Steve Pampling -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 10 19:54:58 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150036 for opro ; Thu, 10 May 101 19:54:56 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989514536:10:24597:73; Thu, 10 May 2001 17:08:56 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1023453; 10 May 2001 17:07 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4AH5uj14016 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 10 May 2001 18:05:56 +0100 Received: from cmailg7.svr.pol.co.uk (cmailg7.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.195.177]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4AH5q514013 for ; Thu, 10 May 2001 18:05:52 +0100 Received: from modem-218.colorado.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.57.218] helo=beeston12) by cmailg7.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 14xtsz-0004TQ-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 10 May 2001 18:05:58 +0100 Date: Thu, 10 May 2001 17:27:44 +0100 From: Robin Phillips To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: RTF Message-ID: <3908d784a%rphillips@beeston12.freeserve.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a7660cde2davidb@argonet.co.uk> X-Organization: home X-Mailer: Messenger v1.41d for RISC OS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.64b User-Agent: POPstar/2.03 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Dear David Breakwell, > > David Breakwell has written an RTF exporter, !MakeRTF, which integrates > > seamlessly into OPro and put a third radio button on the 'save as' > > window - you can get it from him if you email him direct ie it's not on > > the resources site, at davidb@argonet.co.uk I have now installed OvationPro 2.60 on my machine. I should be interested to have your MakeRTF add-on, please. I had an earlier version from you but did not get it working. This time I hope will succeed! [Not that the problem was your fault anyway...] I do look forward to being able to export RTF filea at last! Best wishes, Yours sincerely, Robin. -- Robin Phillips, 1, Newcastle Avenue, Beeston, Notts., NG9 1BT; Phone: +44 (0)115 922 4930 E-mail: rphillips@beeston12.freeserve.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 10 19:55:00 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150037 for opro ; Thu, 10 May 101 19:54:59 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989518434:10:16509:75; Thu, 10 May 2001 18:13:54 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1016153; 10 May 2001 18:13 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4AICcq14251 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 10 May 2001 19:12:38 +0100 Received: from monsoon.mail.pipex.net (monsoon.mail.pipex.net [158.43.128.69]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f4AICX514244 for ; Thu, 10 May 2001 19:12:33 +0100 Received: (qmail 26340 invoked from network); 10 May 2001 18:12:39 -0000 Received: from userfi37.uk.uudial.com (HELO RiscPC) (62.188.22.237) by smtp-1.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; 10 May 2001 18:12:39 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Steven Pampling To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Thu, 10 May 2001 19:08:29 +0100 Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) Message-ID: <4a7896397asteve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a786557c0rayd@argonet.co.uk> References: <149830@pilling.demon.co.uk> <7937a7774a%Support@Gill.english.co.uk> <4a77d82c05steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> <4a78 User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <4a786557c0rayd@argonet.co.uk>, Ray Dawson wrote: > In article <4a77d82c05steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk>, Steven Pampling > wrote: > > In article <7937a7774a%Support@Gill.english.co.uk>, David Graddol > > wrote: > > > Yep. I'd second that. A three-ring binder sounds a pain, takes more > > > room on the shelf as well as on the desk. A wirebound manual can > > > usually lie flat with the relevant page open. > > Unfortunately a wirebound manual.. > > 1. At the side of another wirebound manual starts mating... 2. Gives > > you no clues on its spine what the contents are... > 3. Always starts to unwind from the bottom if You have turned the > pages > back on it... Michael and I seem to have taken it to 5. So do you want this one listed as 6. or 3a (losing pages) ??? -- Steve Pampling -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 10 19:55:03 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150038 for opro ; Thu, 10 May 101 19:55:01 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989518434:10:16518:78; Thu, 10 May 2001 18:13:54 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1016176; 10 May 2001 18:13 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4AICdx14252 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 10 May 2001 19:12:39 +0100 Received: from monsoon.mail.pipex.net (monsoon.mail.pipex.net [158.43.128.69]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f4AICY514248 for ; Thu, 10 May 2001 19:12:34 +0100 Received: (qmail 26343 invoked from network); 10 May 2001 18:12:40 -0000 Received: from userfi37.uk.uudial.com (HELO RiscPC) (62.188.22.237) by smtp-1.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; 10 May 2001 18:12:40 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Steven Pampling To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Thu, 10 May 2001 19:11:02 +0100 Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) Message-ID: <4a78967517steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4ec667784a.john@xl-cambridge.com> References: <149830@pilling.demon.co.uk> <7937a7774a%Support@Gill.english.co.uk> <4a77d82c05steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> <4a User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R In article <4ec667784a.john@xl-cambridge.com>, John Pettigrew wrote: > It's sounding to me like people would quite like it unbound, so that > they can use their preferred method. Personally, I'd use my comb-binding > machine :-) Try re-doing that a few times (the holes break) As to chosen method of binding: Ovation Pro original manual is in a three ring binder with its own box all in a neat vinyl (no spine identifier though:( -- Steve Pampling -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 10 22:05:25 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150057 for opro ; Thu, 10 May 101 22:05:21 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989526145:10:17056:76; Thu, 10 May 2001 20:22:25 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1129249; 10 May 2001 20:21 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4AKKZr14786 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 10 May 2001 21:20:35 +0100 Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4AKKV514783 for ; Thu, 10 May 2001 21:20:31 +0100 Received: from [62.188.26.47] (helo=62.188.26.47) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 14xwsu-0001S1-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 10 May 2001 21:18:05 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: David Breakwell To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Thu, 10 May 2001 21:12:59 +0000 (GMT) Subject: Re: RTF files Message-ID: <4a78a71db9davidb@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a77e585dacharles.hope@argonet.co.uk> References: <149633@pilling.demon.co.uk> <4a77e585dacharles.hope@argonet.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02b (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <4a77e585dacharles.hope@argonet.co.uk>, charles.hope wrote: > I find that if I try to import an RTF File derived directly from a Word > document, there is a lot of disc activity but no text appears in the > frame. I can, however, load the RTF file into a new document and then > copy it over to the one where I want it. > If I take the same Word document, load it into EasiWriter and save as > RTF from there, I can put this straight into the frame of an existing > document. I've not tried that (I don't have access to word @ home) but I guess this could be because my exporter includes style info - easiwriter RTF does not - and maybe word dislikes this ? That's the only major difference between the RTF I generate and the stuff Easiwriter makes. David -- --. --. --. --. : : --- --- .---------------------------------------------. |_| |_| | _ | | | | |_ | |Internet provider for all Acorn RISC machines| | | |\ | | | | |\| | | '---------------------------------------------' | | | \ |_| |_| | | |__ | davidb@argonet.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 10 22:05:27 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150056 for opro ; Thu, 10 May 101 22:05:21 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989526125:20:03131:71; Thu, 10 May 2001 20:22:05 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2001982; 10 May 2001 20:21 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4AKKfS14791 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 10 May 2001 21:20:41 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4AKKb514788 for ; Thu, 10 May 2001 21:20:37 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 14xwvS-000G84-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 10 May 2001 20:20:42 +0000 Date: Thu, 10 May 2001 19:59:15 GMT Message-Id: <150041@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R How about if we could agree on one format, it would be cheaper than producing lots... Or maybe the wonderful thing about having the manual on CD is that you can print and bind it yourself. Doing either manual at A4 and punching it into a ring binder should be easy enough. I suspect I'll have a batch of wire bound ones printed, low cost, easy to ship, and cheap to ship too. And maybe some 'fat' versions of the new ring bound manual i.e. including the script stuff. The latter would look nice. If there are any collectors of computer manuals. And in most organisations there is someone who collects manuals. How else to explain why they always vanish. (could be a new Dilbert character, the guy in the office packed with manuals). David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 11 01:49:33 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150071 for opro ; Fri, 11 May 101 01:49:31 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989532999:20:00726:74; Thu, 10 May 2001 22:16:39 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2000503; 10 May 2001 22:16 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4AMFDY15234 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 10 May 2001 23:15:13 +0100 Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4AL5P515074 for ; Thu, 10 May 2001 22:05:25 +0100 Received: from [62.188.19.72] (helo=62.188.19.72) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 14xxaK-0003Pw-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 10 May 2001 22:02:58 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: "Owl-Art Un-Ltd." To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Thu, 10 May 2001 22:00:47 +0100 Subject: Problems with printing drawfiles with large scale factor Message-ID: <4a78a5fffaowlart@owlart.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02b (RISC-OS/4.02) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro I have got a document which has two very simple drawfiles, both scaled to arounf 950%. However, when I come to print the document, they do not print. Everything else works perfectly, but not these. If I scale the drawfiles in Draw to approx the right size before dropping them into OPro, they will then print happily. Has anyone else come across this problem, and is there a workarod/fix other than scaling everything in Draw first? Andrew -- http://www.owlart.co.uk/ +----------------------------------------+---------------------------------+ | Owl-Art Un-Ltd. Design and Print Work | email: Sales@owlart.co.uk | | Coming to you on an Acorn RiscPC SA110 | Snail: 58 Newland Road, | | | Worthing, | | Business Cards, Invites, Newsletters, | West Sussex. | | Booklets, Programmes, Original Artwork | BN11 1JX. U.K. | +----------------------------------------+---------------------------------+ -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 11 01:49:34 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150070 for opro ; Fri, 11 May 101 01:49:31 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989532994:10:23473:65; Thu, 10 May 2001 22:16:34 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1023335; 10 May 2001 22:16 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4AMFGT15236 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 10 May 2001 23:15:16 +0100 Received: from mta03-svc.ntlworld.com (mta03-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.43]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4AJG8514574 for ; Thu, 10 May 2001 20:16:08 +0100 Received: from riscpc.at.home ([213.107.105.170]) by mta03-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.27 201-229-119-110) with SMTP id <20010510191615.NXZF283.mta03-svc.ntlworld.com@riscpc.at.home> for ; Thu, 10 May 2001 20:16:15 +0100 Date: Thu, 10 May 2001 20:15:45 +0100 From: John Pettigrew To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) Message-ID: References: <149830@pilling.demon.co.uk> <7937a7774a%Support@Gill.english.co.uk> <4a77d82c05steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> <4a786557c0rayd@argonet.co.uk> <4ec667784a.john@xl-cambridge.com> <4a78967517steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a78967517steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> X-Organization: XL Cambridge User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.10d (MsgServe/1.10) (RISC-OS/4.02) X-Editor: Zap, using ZapEmail 0.22 (27 Nov 1998) patch-3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In a previous message, Steven Pampling wrote: > In article <4ec667784a.john@xl-cambridge.com>, > John Pettigrew wrote: > > It's sounding to me like people would quite like it unbound, so that > > they can use their preferred method. Personally, I'd use my comb-binding > > machine :-) > > Try re-doing that a few times (the holes break) Not if you're careful. Anyway, I'd do it mainly because I have it, it's easy and I dont way more binders, especially as I have no 3-ring binder for a manual punched in that way (a possible flaw with supplying in that format, David). > As to chosen method of binding: Ovation Pro original manual is in a three > ring binder with its own box all in a neat vinyl ?? Which version? Do you mean the new one, because my OP manual is wire bound! John -- John Pettigrew XL Cambridge - Contract and freelance editing and writing Life sciences specialist - molecular biology, genetics, biotechnology john@xl-cambridge.com http://www.xl-cambridge.com/ -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 11 13:49:52 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150091 for opro ; Fri, 11 May 101 13:49:49 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989563700:10:06003:72; Fri, 11 May 2001 06:48:20 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1005664; 11 May 2001 6:47 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4B6kdD16525 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 11 May 2001 07:46:39 +0100 Received: from monsoon.mail.pipex.net (monsoon.mail.pipex.net [158.43.128.69]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f4B6ka516522 for ; Fri, 11 May 2001 07:46:36 +0100 Received: (qmail 21119 invoked from network); 11 May 2001 06:46:42 -0000 Received: from userbh01.uk.uudial.com (HELO RiscPC) (62.188.142.220) by smtp-1.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; 11 May 2001 06:46:42 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Steven Pampling To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Thu, 10 May 2001 23:30:21 +0100 Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) Message-ID: <4a78ae32efsteve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <150041@pilling.demon.co.uk> References: <150041@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <150041@pilling.demon.co.uk>, David Pilling wrote: > (could be a new Dilbert character, the guy in the office packed with > manuals). Sounds like my boss: no separate office he's just building a divider with manuals paperwork and CD's. -- Steve Pampling -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 11 13:49:56 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150092 for opro ; Fri, 11 May 101 13:49:53 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989563705:20:01172:64; Fri, 11 May 2001 06:48:25 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2000429; 11 May 2001 6:47 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4B6kiT16531 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 11 May 2001 07:46:44 +0100 Received: from monsoon.mail.pipex.net (monsoon.mail.pipex.net [158.43.128.69]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f4B6kd516526 for ; Fri, 11 May 2001 07:46:40 +0100 Received: (qmail 21117 invoked from network); 11 May 2001 06:46:40 -0000 Received: from userbh01.uk.uudial.com (HELO RiscPC) (62.188.142.220) by smtp-1.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; 11 May 2001 06:46:40 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Steven Pampling To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Thu, 10 May 2001 23:28:20 +0100 Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) Message-ID: <4a78ae03bbsteve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: References: <149830@pilling.demon.co.uk> <7937a7774a%Support@Gill.english.co.uk> <4a77d82c05steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> <4a User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article , John Pettigrew wrote: > In a previous message, Steven Pampling wrote: > > As to chosen method of binding: Ovation Pro original manual is in a > > three ring binder with its own box all in a neat vinyl > ?? Which version? Do you mean the new one, because my OP manual is wire > bound! Beebug version, and my manual /*was*/ wirebound originally. -- Steve Pampling -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 11 13:50:16 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150097 for opro ; Fri, 11 May 101 13:50:05 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989581040:10:10391:88; Fri, 11 May 2001 11:37:20 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1105639; 11 May 2001 11:36 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4BBZPh17354 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 11 May 2001 12:35:25 +0100 Received: from apollo.le.ac.uk (apollo.le.ac.uk [143.210.16.125]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4BBZL517351 for ; Fri, 11 May 2001 12:35:21 +0100 Received: from happy.star.le.ac.uk ([143.210.36.58]) by apollo.le.ac.uk with smtp (Exim 3.16 #1) id 14yBCh-0003o3-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Fri, 11 May 2001 12:35:27 +0100 Received: (qmail 3007 invoked from network); 11 May 2001 11:35:44 -0000 Received: from xmm4.xra.le.ac.uk (143.210.40.54) by happy.star.le.ac.uk with SMTP; 11 May 2001 11:35:44 -0000 Date: Fri, 11 May 2001 12:35:22 +0100 (BST) From: Liam Gretton Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk In-Reply-To: <150041@pilling.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Space Research Centre, University of Leicester, UK X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Thu 10 May, David Pilling wrote: > How about if we could agree on one format, it would be cheaper than > producing lots... I think I'll be happy with whatever format you choose. Ring bound or spiral bound sounds equally ok to me; I rarely use the manual, but I do like printed manuals, especially ones that can lay open flat at any page. > Or maybe the wonderful thing about having the manual on CD is that you can > print and bind it yourself. Doing either manual at A4 and punching it into > a ring binder should be easy enough. A PDF version would be very useful. I have the luxury/massive burden of three machines on my desk here, so I tend to keep electronic manuals on one of the Linux boxes so I can refer to it without cluttering my RISC OS desktop. I tried to create a PDF version by printing all the manual sections to a PS file, but the bloody 'append to file' option in !Printers appears to not work. Alternatively, I could concatenate the sections of the manual in OvPro itself, but I've not worked out how to do this yet. Ideally, I'd like a PDF manual with links in the contents and index pages to the relevant sections. -- Liam Gretton ljg@star.le.ac.uk Space Research Centre, http://www.src.le.ac.uk/ Physics and Astronomy Dept, phone +44 (0) 116 223 1039 University of Leicester, fax +44 (0) 116 252 2464 Leicester LE1 7RH, UK http://xmm4.xra.le.ac.uk/ -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 11 22:43:49 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150129 for opro ; Fri, 11 May 101 22:43:46 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989611063:10:20202:73; Fri, 11 May 2001 19:57:43 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1019486; 11 May 2001 19:56 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4BJuHw18787 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 11 May 2001 20:56:17 +0100 Received: from anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.92]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4BJuD518784 for ; Fri, 11 May 2001 20:56:14 +0100 Received: from cartmell.demon.co.uk ([158.152.204.98]) by anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 14yJ1Q-0009T7-0Y for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Fri, 11 May 2001 20:56:20 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: John Cartmell To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Fri, 11 May 2001 18:31:24 +0100 Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) Message-ID: <4a7916aa70john@cartmell.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: References: <4ec667784a.john@xl-cambridge.com> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02d (RISC-OS/4.02) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article , John Percy Kerslake wrote: > I have a 2 ring binder (tablemate) that opens & lies flat. the rings are > NOT attached to the spine but to the back cover. It is indeed excellent. What is missing is the updated info to add to the binder! -- John Cartmell - Manchester, UK Fleur Designs -- FD Games - - - compact designer board games at: Acorn/RISC OS Show - - - Thornes Park Stadium, Wakefield 19th & 20th May 2001 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 11 22:43:49 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150128 for opro ; Fri, 11 May 101 22:43:46 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989600781:20:26697:66; Fri, 11 May 2001 17:06:21 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2026359; 11 May 2001 17:05 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4BH5Ht18234 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 11 May 2001 18:05:17 +0100 Received: from cmailg3.svr.pol.co.uk (cmailg3.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.195.173]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4BH5C518231 for ; Fri, 11 May 2001 18:05:12 +0100 Received: from modem-124.radon.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.62.252] helo=kerslakej2.freeserve.co.uk) by cmailg3.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 14yGLt-0006rT-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Fri, 11 May 2001 18:05:17 +0100 Date: Thu, 10 May 2001 19:42:42 +0100 (BST) From: John Percy Kerslake Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk In-Reply-To: <4ec667784a.john@xl-cambridge.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Organisation name, location. Telephone/Fax? X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Thu 10 May, John Pettigrew wrote: > In a previous message, Ray Dawson wrote: > > > In article <4a77d82c05steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk>, > > Steven Pampling wrote: > > > In article <7937a7774a%Support@Gill.english.co.uk>, > > > David Graddol wrote: > > > > Yep. I'd second that. A three-ring binder sounds a pain, takes > > > > more room on the shelf as well as on the desk. A wirebound manual > > > > can usually lie flat with the relevant page open. > > > Unfortunately a wirebound manual.. > > > 1. At the side of another wirebound manual starts mating... > > > 2. Gives you no clues on its spine what the contents are... > > 3. Always starts to unwind from the bottom if You have turned the pages > > back on it... > I have a 2 ring binder (tablemate) that opens & lies flat. the rings are NOT attached to the spine but to the back cover. -- J.P. Kerslake B.Sc., F.B.I.S. Pager 07626 - 235878 e-mail address:- Work = kerslake@sees.bangor.ac.uk Home = johnpercy@kerslakej2.freeserve.co.uk, Dyslexia Rules KO. RiscStation 64 meg 50 ns RAM. 9G HD, Ant INS. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 11 22:43:53 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150130 for opro ; Fri, 11 May 101 22:43:50 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989614154:10:15150:77; Fri, 11 May 2001 20:49:14 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1014854; 11 May 2001 20:48 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4BKm1s19004 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 11 May 2001 21:48:01 +0100 Received: from altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net (altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net [193.67.237.6]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4BKlv519001 for ; Fri, 11 May 2001 21:47:57 +0100 Received: from padua by altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net via 1Cust115.tnt55.rtm1.nl.uu.net [213.117.28.115] with SMTP for id WAA12170 (8.8.8/1.3); Fri, 11 May 2001 22:48:03 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <006401c0da5b$d7dbcfc0$4d01a8c0@padua> From: "Tonnie Demarteau" To: References: Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) Date: Fri, 11 May 2001 22:20:39 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Fri, 11 May, Liam Gretton wrote: > > A PDF version would be very useful. I have the luxury/massive burden of > three machines on my desk here, so I tend to keep electronic manuals on one > of the Linux boxes so I can refer to it without cluttering my RISC OS > desktop. I tried to create a PDF version by printing all the manual sections > to a PS file, but the bloody 'append to file' option in !Printers appears to > not work. > As I recall correctly 'append to file' does work, but you have to start with that option already with the *first* print to file, not with the second. That is switch on 'append to file' and drag the icon -with the name you want- to a filer window before you make the first print. I can't give it a try (again) myself at this moment, but I have done it with files, where I printed the fonts first (downloading to the printer, in my case to the file) and appended the document afterwards. mrs. Tonnie Demarteau - the Netherlands. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 11 22:43:54 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150131 for opro ; Fri, 11 May 101 22:43:50 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989601580:20:20321:77; Fri, 11 May 2001 17:19:40 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2020171; 11 May 2001 17:19 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4BHJ5j18329 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 11 May 2001 18:19:05 +0100 Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4BHJ1518326 for ; Fri, 11 May 2001 18:19:01 +0100 Received: from [62.188.193.35] (helo=62.188.193.35) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 14yGWl-0000Lg-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Fri, 11 May 2001 18:16:32 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From:(Roger Foden) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Wed, 9 May 2001 21:41:19 +0100 X-Organization: ArgoNet, but does not necessarily reflect its views. X-Mailer: Posty - Voyager Email 1.24 for RISC OS 3.70 Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Wed 9 May 2001 (15:22:54 +0100), dgporter@argonet.co.uk wrote: > In article <7937a7774a%Support@Gill.english.co.uk>, > David Graddol wrote: > > > Yep. I'd second that. A three-ring binder sounds a pain, takes > > more room on the shelf as well as on the desk. A wirebound manual > > can usually lie flat with the relevant page open. > > Sorry, I disagree ... strongly. I second that! I've printed off the OvPro Manual from the CD, arranged to be two pages to an A4 sheet (landscape, sort of) put these into file pockets in an A4 4 ring file. The result is just what I want: four pages visible at once; physically strong and stable; stands upright on the shelf (unlike wire-bound volumes). I do not find the landscape layout any disadvantage - in many ways it is an advantage as the file can easily be propped open. Regards Roger Foden -- ___ n_ Roger & Jacki Foden \ ) (^o\. /^\ http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/roger.foden/ | | /_ / |___| roger.foden@argonet.co.uk / \/ \/ \_ _/ jacki.foden@argonet.co.uk __\__\___|o_____//_______ Walking or Botanising in Greece? sarpcsarpcsarpcsarpcsarpc Marengo Publications -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 11 22:44:04 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150135 for opro ; Fri, 11 May 101 22:44:02 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989616182:20:08121:66; Fri, 11 May 2001 21:23:02 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2007859; 11 May 2001 21:22 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4BLM0T19128 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 11 May 2001 22:22:00 +0100 Received: from altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net (altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net [193.67.237.6]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4BLLu519125 for ; Fri, 11 May 2001 22:21:56 +0100 Received: from padua by altrade.nijmegen.inter.nl.net via 1Cust125.tnt1.rtm1.nl.uu.net [213.116.96.125] with SMTP for id XAA13282 (8.8.8/1.3); Fri, 11 May 2001 23:22:02 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <000701c0da60$978734f0$4d01a8c0@padua> From: "Tonnie Demarteau" To: References: Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) Date: Fri, 11 May 2001 23:22:42 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Fri, 11 May, Liam Gretton wrote: > A PDF version would be very useful. I have the luxury/massive burden of > three machines on my desk here, so I tend to keep electronic manuals on one > of the Linux boxes so I can refer to it without cluttering my RISC OS > desktop. I tried to create a PDF version by printing all the manual sections > to a PS file, but the bloody 'append to file' option in !Printers appears to > not work. To 'append' to my previous reply (I forgot that part), there is also the possibility to make one or (more) PDF out of many. At least this can be done with the Acrobat editor. The format of the pages don't have to be the same. The imported PDF can be multipaged. Where it must be inserted can be choosen. Pages can also be replaced or deleted. > > Ideally, I'd like a PDF manual with links in the contents and index pages to > the relevant sections. If you want more than thumbnails of the pages (in PDF readers that supports that), there still will be a lot of work to do ... mrs. Tonnie Demarteau - the Netherlands -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 11 22:44:11 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150137 for opro ; Fri, 11 May 101 22:44:09 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989616753:20:24500:69; Fri, 11 May 2001 21:32:33 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2108379; 11 May 2001 21:32 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4BLW0r19202 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 11 May 2001 22:32:00 +0100 Received: from warrior-outbound.servers.plus.net ([212.159.14.227]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f4BLVt519199 for ; Fri, 11 May 2001 22:31:55 +0100 Received: (qmail 8390 invoked from network); 11 May 2001 21:31:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO tinshill.force9.net) (212.159.17.29) by warrior with SMTP; 11 May 2001 21:31:59 -0000 Date: Thu, 10 May 2001 21:51:00 +0100 (BST) From: Anthony Hilton Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) To: Ovation Pro List In-Reply-To: <4a78967517steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In on Thu 10 May, Steven Pampling wrote: > In article <4ec667784a.john@xl-cambridge.com>, > John Pettigrew wrote: > > It's sounding to me like people would quite like it unbound, so that > > they can use their preferred method. Personally, I'd use my comb-binding > > machine :-) > > Try re-doing that a few times (the holes break) > > As to chosen method of binding: Ovation Pro original manual is in a three > ring binder with its own box all in a neat vinyl (no spine identifier > though:( > Strange. My Opro manual is Wiro bound, the original Ovation manual was in a 3-ring binder (I still have the binder but have thrown the pages). Anthony Hilton -- ajh@tinshill.f9.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Sat May 12 13:12:17 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150150 for opro ; Sat, 12 May 101 13:12:12 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989648683:20:27319:64; Sat, 12 May 2001 06:24:43 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2112858; 12 May 2001 6:24 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4C1bAY19951 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 12 May 2001 02:37:10 +0100 Received: from orc.cs.waikato.ac.nz (orc.cs.waikato.ac.nz [130.217.241.22]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4C1b6519948 for ; Sat, 12 May 2001 02:37:06 +0100 Received: from modem38.slip.waikato.ac.nz ([130.217.97.137] helo=albion) by orc.cs.waikato.ac.nz with smtp (Exim 3.16 #6) id 14yOL6-00049U-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 12 May 2001 13:37:01 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Keith Hopper To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sat, 12 May 2001 13:08:07 +1200 Subject: OPro news (new manuals) Message-ID: <4a79407acakh@waikato.ac.nz> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02b (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro ... and I have a lovely set of A6 post binders ... Seriously! I am of the opinion that putting a piece of A5 card on top and bottom of a stack of pages, wrapping and posting that out - everyone can then do their own thing - could be the cheapest printed solution! Keith -- City Desk Waikato University [PGP key available if desired] -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Sat May 12 13:12:36 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150153 for opro ; Sat, 12 May 101 13:12:33 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989664939:20:23798:64; Sat, 12 May 2001 10:55:39 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2023645; 12 May 2001 10:55 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4CAsuH21395 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 12 May 2001 11:54:56 +0100 Received: from hose.mail.pipex.net (hose.mail.pipex.net [158.43.128.58]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f4CAsq521392 for ; Sat, 12 May 2001 11:54:52 +0100 Received: (qmail 25266 invoked from network); 12 May 2001 10:54:51 -0000 Received: from userab53.test-uk.uudial.com (HELO RiscPC) (62.188.193.153) by smtp-4.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; 12 May 2001 10:54:51 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Steven Pampling To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sat, 12 May 2001 09:40:06 +0100 Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) Message-ID: <4a7969dc04steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a79407acakh@waikato.ac.nz> References: <4a79407acakh@waikato.ac.nz> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <4a79407acakh@waikato.ac.nz>, Keith Hopper wrote: > ... and I have a lovely set of A6 post binders ... > Seriously! I am of the opinion that putting a piece of A5 card on > top and bottom of a stack of pages, wrapping and posting that out - > everyone can then do their own thing - could be the cheapest printed > solution! True. And the nice and cheap for David means he can afford to develop new features without asking for more... ....no we won't pursue that otherwise he'll be in the poorhouse. -- Steve Pampling -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Sat May 12 13:12:45 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150155 for opro ; Sat, 12 May 101 13:12:42 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989664949:20:24078:65; Sat, 12 May 2001 10:55:49 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2108242; 12 May 2001 10:55 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4CAt2l21402 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 12 May 2001 11:55:02 +0100 Received: from hose.mail.pipex.net (hose.mail.pipex.net [158.43.128.58]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f4CAsw521397 for ; Sat, 12 May 2001 11:54:58 +0100 Received: (qmail 25264 invoked from network); 12 May 2001 10:54:50 -0000 Received: from userab53.test-uk.uudial.com (HELO RiscPC) (62.188.193.153) by smtp-4.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; 12 May 2001 10:54:50 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Steven Pampling To: Ovation Pro List Date: Sat, 12 May 2001 09:36:57 +0100 Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) Message-ID: <4a7969922dsteve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: References: <4a78967517steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R In article , Anthony Hilton wrote: > Strange. My Opro manual is Wiro bound, the original Ovation manual was > in a 3-ring binder (I still have the binder but have thrown the pages). Ovation vs Ovation Pro. The original Ovation manual is around somewhere, but there are scrapped out manuals from work that provide the occasional 3 ring binder :-) Hence the non-standard format of the Ovation Pro manual. Recent ones have been 2 ring A5. -- Steve Pampling -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Sat May 12 18:08:23 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150172 for opro ; Sat, 12 May 101 18:08:20 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989676212:20:14441:64; Sat, 12 May 2001 14:03:32 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2118887; 12 May 2001 14:03 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4CE2nK22055 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 12 May 2001 15:02:49 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4CE2i522051 for ; Sat, 12 May 2001 15:02:44 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 14yZys-000AxE-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 12 May 2001 14:02:50 +0000 Date: Sat, 12 May 2001 14:14:34 GMT Message-Id: <150161@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro > Seriously! I am of the opinion that putting a piece of A5 card on top >and bottom of a stack of pages, wrapping and posting that out - everyone >can then do their own thing - could be the cheapest printed solution! But if thats what you want, all you need is a friend with a laser printer. For the sort of quantity we're talking about, the things are coming off a laser anyway. If shipping such stuff was worthwhile, if lasers were so hard to come by, someone would be able to do a .com business printing documents and posting them to people. I've just had a private email describing 3 ring binders as an abomination against humanity (this from someone who thinks Phillips screws are 'not bad'). I think things have gone far enough on this topic. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Sat May 12 18:08:23 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150173 for opro ; Sat, 12 May 101 18:08:21 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989676260:10:18197:64; Sat, 12 May 2001 14:04:20 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1017418; 12 May 2001 14:03 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4CE2kf22054 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 12 May 2001 15:02:46 +0100 Received: from cmailg6.svr.pol.co.uk (cmailg6.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.195.176]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4CAYj521330 for ; Sat, 12 May 2001 11:34:55 +0100 Received: from modem-61.fermium.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.69.189] helo=redhotant.com) by cmailg6.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 14yWjb-0007If-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 12 May 2001 11:34:52 +0100 Date: Sat, 12 May 2001 11:34:27 +0100 From: Mark Daniel To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Problems with printing drawfiles with large scale factor Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <4a78a5fffaowlart@owlart.co.uk> X-Organization: Mad Cow Software X-Mailer: Messenger v1.41d for RISC OS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.64b User-Agent: POPstar/2.02 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R "Owl-Art Un-Ltd." was let out long enough to write: > I have got a document which has two very simple drawfiles, both scaled to > arounf 950%. However, when I come to print the document, they do not > print. Everything else works perfectly, but not these. If I scale the > drawfiles in Draw to approx the right size before dropping them into > OPro, they will then print happily. > > Has anyone else come across this problem, and is there a workarod/fix > other than scaling everything in Draw first? > Yeah, I've had that one. Didn't find a fix other than doubleing and halfing the apropriate scales. See ya, Mark. -- You only get *B*est *S*oftware *E*ver from Mad Cow Software E-mail WWW http://madsoft.cjb.net ICQ UIN - 26495898 ------- >>How do you keep a turkey in suspense? -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Sat May 12 18:08:27 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150175 for opro ; Sat, 12 May 101 18:08:25 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989677106:10:02576:64; Sat, 12 May 2001 14:18:26 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1106432; 12 May 2001 14:17 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4CEHDO22178 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 12 May 2001 15:17:13 +0100 Received: from mail4.svr.pol.co.uk (mail4.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.211]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4CEH7522171 for ; Sat, 12 May 2001 15:17:07 +0100 Received: from modem-138.oxygen.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.7.138] helo=beeston12) by mail4.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 14yaCn-0003Nn-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 12 May 2001 15:17:14 +0100 Date: Sat, 12 May 2001 14:53:46 +0100 From: Robin Phillips To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Problem with using the Index to the CD manual Message-ID: <8c9386794a%rphillips@beeston12.freeserve.co.uk> X-Organization: home X-Mailer: Messenger v1.41d for RISC OS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.64b User-Agent: POPstar/2.03 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R Dear colleagues, I have recently needed several times to try and use the Index to the CD manual for the new OvationPro (I have version 2.63). I notice that after finding the entry you need you are given a PAGE number. This does not help me much to find the right FILE among those displayed in the directory. Wouldn't it be much better if the Index led us to the Filename? I suppose that some of these files are quite lengthy, so perhaps we need the filename followed by the page number. But really just giving the enquirer the page number is USELESS. Well, not useless, but it is rather time-consuming. Also, depressingly, I am starting to have my doubts about the index entries. I can find NOTHING under the heading Filters! Yours sincerely, Robin. -- Robin Phillips, 1, Newcastle Avenue, Beeston, Notts., NG9 1BT; Phone: +44 (0)115 922 4930 E-mail: rphillips@beeston12.freeserve.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Sat May 12 18:08:33 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150176 for opro ; Sat, 12 May 101 18:08:29 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989677108:10:02598:67; Sat, 12 May 2001 14:18:28 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1001578; 12 May 2001 14:17 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4CEHFN22179 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 12 May 2001 15:17:15 +0100 Received: from mail4.svr.pol.co.uk (mail4.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.211]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4CEH9522175 for ; Sat, 12 May 2001 15:17:09 +0100 Received: from modem-138.oxygen.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.7.138] helo=beeston12) by mail4.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 14yaCp-0003Nn-00; Sat, 12 May 2001 15:17:16 +0100 Date: Sat, 12 May 2001 15:05:39 +0100 From: Robin Phillips To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk, davidb@argonet.co.uk Subject: Advice on !MakeRTF needed please Message-ID: <36aa87794a%rphillips@beeston12.freeserve.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a64076d9cdavidb@argonet.co.uk> X-Organization: home X-Mailer: Messenger v1.41d for RISC OS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.64b User-Agent: POPstar/2.03 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Dear David Breakwell and OvPro colleagues, I have recently upgraded to Ovation pro 2.63, and have now obtained !MakeRTF so as to be able to produce output in RTF to e-mail to others. To do this I apparently have to load OvationPro and afterwards double-click on the !MakeRTF icon. After that it will function. I believe !MakeRTF is an example of an output filter, in word-processing terms. I can find NO entry about Filters, either IN or OUT in the index to the CD manual for OvPro. I want to fix things so that every time I load OvationPro the RTF output option is available without going back to the !MakeRTF icon and double-clicking it. I copied the !MakeRTF icon into the directory called Filters, where input filters like !TransIMP are kept, in the hope that like them it would work without further intervention. This seems not bo be the case. Can someone please advise where I should place this output filter, or what alterations I need to make to the Boot file etc so that it will be invoked automatically whenever OvationPro is loaded? May I suggest to David Breakwell (as any advice on the subject seems well-hidden in the manual!) that this information would be useful to more MakeRTF users if it were added to the !ReadMe file which comes with his add-on? With best wishes, Robin. P.S. I know this is a separate topic, but is anyone tackling the need to upgrade the !TransWORD filter? R.Ph. -- Robin Phillips, 1, Newcastle Avenue, Beeston, Notts., NG9 1BT; Phone: +44 (0)115 922 4930 E-mail: rphillips@beeston12.freeserve.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Sat May 12 18:08:53 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150184 for opro ; Sat, 12 May 101 18:08:51 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989679269:10:06737:66; Sat, 12 May 2001 14:54:29 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1006026; 12 May 2001 14:53 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4CEOFG22376 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 12 May 2001 15:24:15 +0100 Received: from mail3.svr.pol.co.uk (mail3.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.19]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4CEO7522373 for ; Sat, 12 May 2001 15:24:08 +0100 Received: from modem-19.gold.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.59.19] helo=kerslakej2.freeserve.co.uk) by mail3.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 14yaJZ-0006m2-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 12 May 2001 15:24:14 +0100 Date: Sat, 12 May 2001 12:29:02 +0100 (BST) From: John Percy Kerslake Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk In-Reply-To: <4a7916aa70john@cartmell.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Organisation name, location. Telephone/Fax? X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Fri 11 May, John Cartmell wrote: > In article , > John Percy Kerslake wrote: > > I have a 2 ring binder (tablemate) that opens & lies flat. the rings are > > NOT attached to the spine but to the back cover. > > It is indeed excellent. What is missing is the updated info to add to the > binder! > > -- > John Cartmell - Manchester, UK > Fleur Designs -- FD Games - - - compact designer board games at: > Acorn/RISC OS Show - - - Thornes Park Stadium, Wakefield > 19th & 20th May 2001 > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk > with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message > Yes and would anyone else like extra maths functions in table mate? ie a full set of scientific calculator functions? -- J.P. Kerslake B.Sc., F.B.I.S. Pager 07626 - 235878 e-mail address:- Work = kerslake@sees.bangor.ac.uk Home = johnpercy@kerslakej2.freeserve.co.uk, Dyslexia Rules KO. RiscStation 64 meg 50 ns RAM. 9G HD, Ant INS. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Sat May 12 18:08:58 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150186 for opro ; Sat, 12 May 101 18:08:56 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989681093:10:27691:64; Sat, 12 May 2001 15:24:53 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1111932; 12 May 2001 15:23 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4CEO8J22371 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 12 May 2001 15:24:08 +0100 Received: from mail3.svr.pol.co.uk (mail3.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.19]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4CEO1522368 for ; Sat, 12 May 2001 15:24:01 +0100 Received: from modem-19.gold.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.59.19] helo=kerslakej2.freeserve.co.uk) by mail3.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 14yaJQ-0006m2-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 12 May 2001 15:24:04 +0100 Date: Sat, 12 May 2001 12:31:16 +0100 (BST) From: John Percy Kerslake Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) To: Ovation Pro List In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Organisation name, location. Telephone/Fax? X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Thu 10 May, Anthony Hilton wrote: > In on Thu 10 May, Steven Pampling wrote: > > In article <4ec667784a.john@xl-cambridge.com>, > > John Pettigrew wrote: > > > It's sounding to me like people would quite like it unbound, so that > > > they can use their preferred method. Personally, I'd use my comb-binding > > > machine :-) > > > > Try re-doing that a few times (the holes break) > > > > As to chosen method of binding: Ovation Pro original manual is in a three > > ring binder with its own box all in a neat vinyl (no spine identifier > > though:( > > > > Strange. My Opro manual is Wiro bound, the original Ovation manual was in a > 3-ring binder (I still have the binder but have thrown the pages). > > Anthony Hilton yes and like tablemate the rings are on the backcover not the spine. -- J.P. Kerslake B.Sc., F.B.I.S. Pager 07626 - 235878 e-mail address:- Work = kerslake@sees.bangor.ac.uk Home = johnpercy@kerslakej2.freeserve.co.uk, Dyslexia Rules KO. RiscStation 64 meg 50 ns RAM. 9G HD, Ant INS. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon May 14 20:11:07 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150198 for opro ; Mon, 14 May 101 20:11:05 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989687604:20:28206:66; Sat, 12 May 2001 17:13:24 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2028026; 12 May 2001 17:13 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4CHC4M23200 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 12 May 2001 18:12:04 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4CHBw523196 for ; Sat, 12 May 2001 18:11:59 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 14ycw1-000LAc-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 12 May 2001 17:12:05 +0000 Date: Sat, 12 May 2001 18:12:32 GMT Message-Id: <150196@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Problems with printing drawfiles with large scale factor X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro I'd be interested to see (by private email) one of these problem Draw files (probably in an OPro doc, so as to preserve the situation). But bear in mind there's only so far you can stretch a piece of string. In other words there will be situations where scaling does go wrong. Depends on the specifics. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon May 14 20:11:08 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150199 for opro ; Mon, 14 May 101 20:11:05 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989687593:10:23915:66; Sat, 12 May 2001 17:13:13 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1023800; 12 May 2001 17:13 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4CHC3F23199 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 12 May 2001 18:12:03 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4CHBv523192 for ; Sat, 12 May 2001 18:11:57 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 14ycw0-000LAc-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 12 May 2001 17:12:04 +0000 Date: Sat, 12 May 2001 18:10:37 GMT Message-Id: <150194@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Problem with using the Index to the CD manual X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Yes it would be a good idea if the index included chapter numbers as well as pages. We might see if that can be done. Filters (are not part of OPro so they are not in the main manual), but they are covered in the CD Guide document. As to TransWord. Would be good to do more on it. I suspect that Rupert Thompson has moved away from OPro, or RISC OS. So it probably needs someone to talk to him about it. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon May 14 20:11:31 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150207 for opro ; Mon, 14 May 101 20:11:28 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989693135:10:28933:66; Sat, 12 May 2001 18:45:35 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1112375; 12 May 2001 18:45 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4CIix423628 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 12 May 2001 19:44:59 +0100 Received: from cmailg3.svr.pol.co.uk (cmailg3.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.195.173]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4CIit523625 for ; Sat, 12 May 2001 19:44:55 +0100 Received: from modem-131.nevada.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.79.131] helo=localhost) by cmailg3.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 14yeNx-0000sg-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 12 May 2001 19:45:02 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: DAVE HUBBLE To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sat, 12 May 2001 19:03:38 +0100 Subject: Transparent frames Message-ID: <4a799d73e4daveh@daveh.freeserve.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <147608@pilling.demon.co.uk> References: <147608@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/1.14i (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Please could someone tell me how I can make text and picture frames transparent. The answer is probably staring me in the face but I just cant see it. Cheers Dave -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon May 14 20:11:36 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150209 for opro ; Mon, 14 May 101 20:11:33 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989693716:10:06649:64; Sat, 12 May 2001 18:55:16 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1123851; 12 May 2001 18:55 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4CIQBT23592 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 12 May 2001 19:26:11 +0100 Received: from sand2.global.net.uk (sand2.global.net.uk [195.147.246.100]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4CIQ5523588 for ; Sat, 12 May 2001 19:26:05 +0100 Received: from p1fs02a03.client.global.net.uk ([195.147.162.32] helo=loopback) by sand2.global.net.uk with smtp (Exim 3.16 #1) id 14ye5j-0002yD-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 12 May 2001 19:26:11 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Dave Symes To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sat, 12 May 2001 19:09:24 +0100 Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) Message-ID: <4a799dfb16dfs@ukgateway.net> In-Reply-To: <150161@pilling.demon.co.uk> References: <150161@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.04-pre1 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <150161@pilling.demon.co.uk>, David Pilling wrote: > I've just had a private email describing 3 ring binders as an > abomination against humanity (this from someone who thinks Phillips > screws are 'not bad'). One question before this is closed... Are we talking Phillips screw heads or Pozidrive heads? (Different things BTW). ;-) Dave S -- _______________________________________________________________________ Dave Symes... dfs@ukgateway.net Also... df@dafs.freeserve.co.uk .. or... dave@triffid.co.uk http://www.dfs.ukgateway.net -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon May 14 20:11:46 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150213 for opro ; Mon, 14 May 101 20:11:43 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989694574:10:17527:64; Sat, 12 May 2001 19:09:34 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1017056; 12 May 2001 19:08 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4CIQ8023591 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 12 May 2001 19:26:08 +0100 Received: from sand2.global.net.uk (sand2.global.net.uk [195.147.246.100]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4CIQ3523584 for ; Sat, 12 May 2001 19:26:03 +0100 Received: from p1fs02a03.client.global.net.uk ([195.147.162.32] helo=loopback) by sand2.global.net.uk with smtp (Exim 3.16 #1) id 14ye5h-0002yD-00; Sat, 12 May 2001 19:26:09 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Dave Symes To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk, davidb@argonet.co.uk Date: Sat, 12 May 2001 19:05:40 +0100 Subject: Re: Advice on !MakeRTF needed please Message-ID: <4a799da38fdfs@ukgateway.net> In-Reply-To: <36aa87794a%rphillips@beeston12.freeserve.co.uk> References: <4a64076d9cdavidb@argonet.co.uk> <36aa87794a%rphillips@beeston12.freeserve.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.04-pre1 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <36aa87794a%rphillips@beeston12.freeserve.co.uk>, Robin Phillips wrote: > I want to fix things so that every time I load OvationPro the RTF output > option is available without going back to the !MakeRTF icon and > double-clicking it. I copied the !MakeRTF icon into the directory > called Filters, where input filters like !TransIMP are kept, in the hope > that like them it would work without further intervention. This seems > not bo be the case. > Can someone please advise where I should place this output filter, or > what alterations I need to make to the Boot file etc so that it will be > invoked automatically whenever OvationPro is loaded? I'm a bit lazy... !MakeRTF is inside my OvPro Filters directory. I have a line in my desktop book file that auto runs it whenever I reboot the computer, so it's always available when and anytime I use OvPro. Filer_Run ADFS::HD4.$.OvationPro.Filters.!MakeRTF Cheers Dave S -- _______________________________________________________________________ Dave Symes... dfs@ukgateway.net Also... df@dafs.freeserve.co.uk .. or... dave@triffid.co.uk http://www.dfs.ukgateway.net -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon May 14 20:11:59 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150218 for opro ; Mon, 14 May 101 20:11:57 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989696086:10:07413:70; Sat, 12 May 2001 19:34:46 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1007354; 12 May 2001 19:34 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4CJXrX23986 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 12 May 2001 20:33:53 +0100 Received: from snowstorm.mail.pipex.net (snowstorm.mail.pipex.net [158.43.192.97]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f4CJXn523983 for ; Sat, 12 May 2001 20:33:50 +0100 Received: (qmail 12787 invoked from network); 12 May 2001 19:33:55 -0000 Received: from userfm16.uk.uudial.com (HELO gtwywc97@ukgateway.net) (62.188.24.104) by smtp-6.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; 12 May 2001 19:33:55 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Ray Dawson To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk, davidb@argonet.co.uk Date: Sat, 12 May 2001 20:33:07 +0100 Subject: Re: Advice on !MakeRTF needed please Message-ID: <4a79a5a50frayd@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <36aa87794a%rphillips@beeston12.freeserve.co.uk> References: <4a64076d9cdavidb@argonet.co.uk> <36aa87794a%rphillips@beeston12.freeserve.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 Organization: MagRay Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <36aa87794a%rphillips@beeston12.freeserve.co.uk>, Robin Phillips wrote: > To do this I apparently have to load OvationPro and afterwards > double-click on the !MakeRTF icon. After that it will function. > I believe !MakeRTF is an example of an output filter, in > word-processing terms. I can find NO entry about Filters, either IN or > OUT in the index to the CD manual for OvPro. > I want to fix things so that every time I load OvationPro the RTF > output option is available without going back to the !MakeRTF icon and > double-clicking it. I put MakeRTF inside the !OvnPro.Applets folder where it is booted every time OP is run. It works fine. Cheers, Ray D -- ..===================================. | M a g R a y Document Services | Ray Dawson Tel: 020 8864 7208 | the audio and braille specialists | rayd@argonet.co.uk '===================================' http://www.magray.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon May 14 20:12:03 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150221 for opro ; Mon, 14 May 101 20:12:02 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989708043:20:23116:64; Sat, 12 May 2001 22:54:03 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2022943; 12 May 2001 22:53 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4CLYla24597 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 12 May 2001 22:34:47 +0100 Received: from anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.92]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4CLYe524588 for ; Sat, 12 May 2001 22:34:40 +0100 Received: from cartmell.demon.co.uk ([158.152.204.98]) by anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 14yh2F-000EMD-0Y for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 12 May 2001 22:34:47 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: John Cartmell To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sat, 12 May 2001 22:35:14 +0100 Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) Message-ID: <4a79b0d33ejohn@cartmell.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a799dfb16dfs@ukgateway.net> References: <150161@pilling.demon.co.uk> <4a799dfb16dfs@ukgateway.net> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02d (RISC-OS/4.02) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <4a799dfb16dfs@ukgateway.net>, Dave Symes wrote: > One question before this is closed... Are we talking Phillips screw heads > or Pozidrive heads? (Different things BTW). ;-) Perhaps the reason I find the so bad is that I use whichever driver bit is to hand (invariably the wrong one). [Square is best!] -- John Cartmell - Manchester, UK Fleur Designs -- FD Games - - - compact designer board games at: Acorn/RISC OS Show - - - Thornes Park Stadium, Wakefield 19th & 20th May 2001 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon May 14 20:12:08 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150224 for opro ; Mon, 14 May 101 20:12:07 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989699777:10:06862:65; Sat, 12 May 2001 20:36:17 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1120247; 12 May 2001 20:35 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4CKXm324271 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 12 May 2001 21:33:48 +0100 Received: from finch-post-11.mail.demon.net (finch-post-11.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.39]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4CKXi524268 for ; Sat, 12 May 2001 21:33:44 +0100 Received: from cartmell.demon.co.uk ([158.152.204.98]) by finch-post-11.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 14yg5G-000BoQ-0B for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 12 May 2001 20:33:51 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: John Cartmell To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sat, 12 May 2001 21:35:29 +0100 Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) Message-ID: <4a79ab5ac2john@cartmell.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <150161@pilling.demon.co.uk> References: <150161@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02d (RISC-OS/4.02) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <150161@pilling.demon.co.uk>, David Pilling wrote: > I've just had a private email describing 3 ring binders as an > abomination against humanity (this from someone who thinks Phillips > screws are 'not bad'). At which point I declare the area of technology where American design remains supreme - screws [self-tapping with a square section inset in the head for positive grip]. Sun readers use Phillips screws and American designed operating systems - if only PC World stocked decent American imports... "I think things have gone far enough on this topic." Sorry! -- John Cartmell - Manchester, UK Fleur Designs -- FD Games - - - compact designer board games at: Acorn/RISC OS Show - - - Thornes Park Stadium, Wakefield 19th & 20th May 2001 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon May 14 20:12:14 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150226 for opro ; Mon, 14 May 101 20:12:10 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989701681:10:07839:74; Sat, 12 May 2001 21:08:01 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1129110; 12 May 2001 21:07 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4CL7Og24428 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 12 May 2001 22:07:24 +0100 Received: from mailout02.sul.t-online.com (mailout02.sul.t-online.com [194.25.134.17]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4CL7J524425 for ; Sat, 12 May 2001 22:07:19 +0100 Received: from fwd06.sul.t-online.de by mailout02.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 14ygbt-0005A2-01; Sat, 12 May 2001 23:07:33 +0200 Received: from veni (520042741018-0001@[217.80.101.149]) by fmrl06.sul.t-online.com with smtp id 14ygbp-2CnYUyC; Sat, 12 May 2001 23:07:29 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Stefan Bellon To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk, davidb@argonet.co.uk Date: Sat, 12 May 2001 23:04:57 +0200 Subject: Re: Advice on !MakeRTF needed please Message-ID: <4a79ae0d6fsbellon@sbellon.de> In-Reply-To: <4a79a5a50frayd@argonet.co.uk> References: <4a64076d9cdavidb@argonet.co.uk> <36aa87794a%rphillips@beeston12.freeserve.co.uk> <4a79a5a50frayd@argonet.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 Content-Type: text/plain X-Sender: 520042741018-0001@t-dialin.net Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <4a79a5a50frayd@argonet.co.uk>, Ray Dawson wrote: > In article <36aa87794a%rphillips@beeston12.freeserve.co.uk>, Robin > Phillips wrote: [snip] > > I want to fix things so that every time I load OvationPro the RTF > > output option is available without going back to the !MakeRTF icon > > and double-clicking it. > I put MakeRTF inside the !OvnPro.Applets folder where it is booted > every time OP is run. It works fine. s/booted/run/ and you are correct. Greetings, Stefan. -- Stefan Bellon * * PGP 2.6 and GnuPG (OpenPGP) keys available from my home page Never get between a programmer and the coffee machine -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon May 14 20:12:30 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150231 for opro ; Mon, 14 May 101 20:12:27 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989705375:10:07978:64; Sat, 12 May 2001 22:09:35 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1007595; 12 May 2001 22:08 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4CLYnp24598 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 12 May 2001 22:34:49 +0100 Received: from anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.92]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4CLYg524593 for ; Sat, 12 May 2001 22:34:42 +0100 Received: from cartmell.demon.co.uk ([158.152.204.98]) by anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 14yh2G-000EMD-0Y for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sat, 12 May 2001 22:34:49 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: John Cartmell To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sat, 12 May 2001 22:37:07 +0100 Subject: Re: Transparent frames Message-ID: <4a79b0ff58john@cartmell.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a799d73e4daveh@daveh.freeserve.co.uk> References: <147608@pilling.demon.co.uk> <4a799d73e4daveh@daveh.freeserve.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02d (RISC-OS/4.02) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <4a799d73e4daveh@daveh.freeserve.co.uk>, DAVE HUBBLE wrote: > Please could someone tell me how I can make text and picture frames > transparent. The answer is probably staring me in the face but I just > cant see it. Object -> Modify ... Fill colour -- John Cartmell - Manchester, UK Fleur Designs -- FD Games - - - compact designer board games at: Acorn/RISC OS Show - - - Thornes Park Stadium, Wakefield 19th & 20th May 2001 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon May 14 20:12:43 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150233 for opro ; Mon, 14 May 101 20:12:41 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989708420:10:28737:65; Sat, 12 May 2001 23:00:20 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1123652; 12 May 2001 22:59 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4CLYkn24596 for ovationpro-list; Sat, 12 May 2001 22:34:46 +0100 Received: from anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.92]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4CLYd524585 for ; Sat, 12 May 2001 22:34:39 +0100 Received: from cartmell.demon.co.uk ([158.152.204.98]) by anchor-post-34.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 14yh2E-000EMD-0Y; Sat, 12 May 2001 22:34:46 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: John Cartmell To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk, davidb@argonet.co.uk Date: Sat, 12 May 2001 22:33:28 +0100 Subject: Re: Advice on !MakeRTF needed please Message-ID: <4a79b0a9c0john@cartmell.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a79a5a50frayd@argonet.co.uk> References: <4a64076d9cdavidb@argonet.co.uk> <36aa87794a%rphillips@beeston12.freeserve.co.uk> <4a79a5a50frayd@argonet.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02d (RISC-OS/4.02) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <4a79a5a50frayd@argonet.co.uk>, Ray Dawson wrote: > I put MakeRTF inside the !OvnPro.Applets folder where it is booted every > time OP is run. It works fine. ...and the TransXXX filters? [where are they described in the manual? - I'm sure I've read it but...] -- John Cartmell - Manchester, UK Fleur Designs -- FD Games - - - compact designer board games at: Acorn/RISC OS Show - - - Thornes Park Stadium, Wakefield 19th & 20th May 2001 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon May 14 20:13:07 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150236 for opro ; Mon, 14 May 101 20:13:05 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989736800:10:02779:64; Sun, 13 May 2001 06:53:20 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1105182; 13 May 2001 6:53 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4D6olI26067 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 13 May 2001 07:50:47 +0100 Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4D6oX526064 for ; Sun, 13 May 2001 07:50:43 +0100 Received: from [62.188.28.119] (helo=bi11.argonet.co.uk) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 14ypfU-0001pw-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Sun, 13 May 2001 07:47:53 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Richard Torrens To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Sat, 12 May 2001 20:06:20 +0100 Subject: Re: OPro news (new manuals) Message-ID: <4a79a3317crichard@4qd.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a799dfb16dfs@ukgateway.net> References: <150161@pilling.demon.co.uk> <4a799dfb16dfs@ukgateway.net> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <4a799dfb16dfs@ukgateway.net>, Dave Symes wrote: > In article <150161@pilling.demon.co.uk>, > David Pilling wrote: > > I've just had a private email describing 3 ring binders as an > > abomination against humanity (this from someone who thinks Phillips > > screws are 'not bad'). > One question before this is closed... Are we talking Phillips screw heads > or Pozidrive heads? (Different things BTW). ;-) > Dave S Probably Supadriv... -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Richard Torrens 4QD manufacture speed controllers for battery electric motors. www site http://www.4QD.co.uk ---------- We use a RISC PC 32 bit RISC computer ---------------- -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon May 14 20:18:07 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150270 for opro ; Mon, 14 May 101 20:18:05 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989760746:20:07796:65; Sun, 13 May 2001 13:32:26 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2007676; 13 May 2001 13:32 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4DDVEs27058 for ovationpro-list; Sun, 13 May 2001 14:31:14 +0100 Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4DDVA527055 for ; Sun, 13 May 2001 14:31:10 +0100 Received: from [62.188.13.193] (helo=62.188.13.193) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 14yvvI-0003G9-00; Sun, 13 May 2001 14:28:37 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: David Breakwell To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk, davidb@argonet.co.uk Date: Sun, 13 May 2001 08:28:23 +0000 (GMT) Subject: Re: Advice on !MakeRTF needed please Message-ID: <4a79ec9f7cdavidb@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <36aa87794a%rphillips@beeston12.freeserve.co.uk> References: <4a64076d9cdavidb@argonet.co.uk> <36aa87794a%rphillips@beeston12.freeserve.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02b (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <36aa87794a%rphillips@beeston12.freeserve.co.uk>, Robin Phillips wrote: > I want to fix things so that every time I load OvationPro the RTF output > option is available without going back to the !MakeRTF icon and > double-clicking it. I copied the !MakeRTF icon into the directory > called Filters, where input filters like !TransIMP are kept, in the hope > that like them it would work without further intervention. This seems > not bo be the case. Create a !Boot (filetype Obey) file with the following entries in the !MakeRTF directory. IconSprites .!Sprites Set MakeRTF$Dir Set File$Type_C32 RTF Set ffxserver$DDL2RTF : -T &B25 &C32 -R MakeRTF$Dir David -- --. --. --. --. : : --- --- .---------------------------------------------. |_| |_| | _ | | | | |_ | |Internet provider for all Acorn RISC machines| | | |\ | | | | |\| | | '---------------------------------------------' | | | \ |_| |_| | | |__ | davidb@argonet.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon May 14 20:19:00 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150290 for opro ; Mon, 14 May 101 20:18:59 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989828109:20:19804:87; Mon, 14 May 2001 08:15:09 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2019700; 14 May 2001 8:14 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4E8CFv29634 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 14 May 2001 09:12:15 +0100 Received: from hose.mail.pipex.net (hose.mail.pipex.net [158.43.128.58]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f4E8CB529631 for ; Mon, 14 May 2001 09:12:11 +0100 Received: (qmail 7080 invoked from network); 14 May 2001 08:12:17 -0000 Received: from userac16.test-uk.uudial.com (HELO gtwywc97@ukgateway.net) (62.188.193.215) by smtp-4.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; 14 May 2001 08:12:17 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Ray Dawson To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk, davidb@argonet.co.uk Date: Mon, 14 May 2001 00:12:56 +0100 Subject: Re: Advice on !MakeRTF needed please Message-ID: <4a7a3d9af4rayd@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a79b0a9c0john@cartmell.demon.co.uk> References: <4a64076d9cdavidb@argonet.co.uk> <36aa87794a%rphillips@beeston12.freeserve.co.uk> <4a79a5a50frayd@argonet.co.uk> <4 User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 Organization: MagRay Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <4a79b0a9c0john@cartmell.demon.co.uk>, John Cartmell wrote: > In article <4a79a5a50frayd@argonet.co.uk>, > Ray Dawson wrote: > > I put MakeRTF inside the !OvnPro.Applets folder where it is booted > > every time OP is run. It works fine. > ..and the TransXXX filters? Mine are in Boot:Resources where any application can use them. Cheers, Ray D -- ..===================================. | M a g R a y Document Services | Ray Dawson Tel: 020 8864 7208 | the audio and braille specialists | rayd@argonet.co.uk '===================================' http://www.magray.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon May 14 20:19:03 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150291 for opro ; Mon, 14 May 101 20:19:01 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989830485:20:26673:66; Mon, 14 May 2001 08:54:45 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2025527; 14 May 2001 8:54 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4E8KLc29716 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 14 May 2001 09:20:21 +0100 Received: from holyrood.ed.ac.uk (holyrood.ed.ac.uk [129.215.16.14]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4E8KH529713 for ; Mon, 14 May 2001 09:20:17 +0100 Received: from alfred.ed.ac.uk (dialup-133.publab.ed.ac.uk [129.215.38.133]) by holyrood.ed.ac.uk (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAA15981 for ; Mon, 14 May 2001 09:20:23 +0100 (BST) Date: Mon, 14 May 2001 09:22:34 +0100 (BST) From: Alf Chamings Subject: Re: Problem with using the Index to the CD manual To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk In-Reply-To: <150194@pilling.demon.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Royal Infirmary of Edinburgh X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Sat 12 May, David Pilling wrote: > Yes it would be a good idea if the index included chapter numbers as well as pages. > We might see if that can be done. > Or put the page numbers in the file names? Alf -- Royal Infirmary of Edinburgh, EH3 9YW, UK tel +44 131 536 3251 fax +44 131 536 3283 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon May 14 20:19:06 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150292 for opro ; Mon, 14 May 101 20:19:04 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989833889:20:24108:65; Mon, 14 May 2001 09:51:29 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2023949; 14 May 2001 9:51 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4E9nh830045 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 14 May 2001 10:49:43 +0100 Received: from inca.sle.sharp.co.uk (root@[193.114.241.3]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4E9nd530042 for ; Mon, 14 May 2001 10:49:39 +0100 Received: from sharp.co.uk (aardog.sle.sharp.co.uk [192.16.16.173]) by inca.sle.sharp.co.uk (8.8.8+Sun/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA29487 for ; Mon, 14 May 2001 10:45:44 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <3AFFAA1A.396ECA6@sharp.co.uk> Date: Mon, 14 May 2001 10:49:14 +0100 From: Graham Jones Organization: Sharp Laboratories of Europe X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (WinNT; U) X-Accept-Language: en,pdf MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: hard spaces (was Re: two separate questions...) References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Barry Gray wrote: > I was always taught (and I myself teach) that in SI there is no space > between the quantity and the unit, for example 9m not 9 m, although of > course nine metres but not usually 9 metres and never nine m. There are some situations where it can be confusing if there is not a space between the value and the unit. I was recently typing a resistance of thirty ohms (30Ohm) and decided that in this case 30 Ohm was much better. Graham. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon May 14 20:19:18 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150297 for opro ; Mon, 14 May 101 20:19:17 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989844011:20:04254:63; Mon, 14 May 2001 12:40:11 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2100928; 14 May 2001 12:39 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4ECceQ30588 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 14 May 2001 13:38:40 +0100 Received: from inca.sle.sharp.co.uk (root@[193.114.241.3]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4ECca530585 for ; Mon, 14 May 2001 13:38:36 +0100 Received: from sharp.co.uk (aardog.sle.sharp.co.uk [192.16.16.173]) by inca.sle.sharp.co.uk (8.8.8+Sun/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA02425 for ; Mon, 14 May 2001 13:35:32 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <3AFFD1E6.30305@sharp.co.uk> Date: Mon, 14 May 2001 13:39:02 +0100 From: Graham Jones Organization: Sharp Laboratories of Europe User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; WinNT4.0; en-US; rv:0.9) Gecko/20010505 X-Accept-Language: en,pdf, ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: New applet - Japanese text input and kanji conversion References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Ian R. Platt wrote: > Hmm, that's the same for me - greyed out 'convert' I think I didn't explain this clearly enough in the documentation or web site - "Convert" is disabled unless you have one, or more, of the full Wadalab font sets installed. Since I haven't put any of these on the web yet you won't be able to use the conversion function. I hope to put one or two of the font sets up soon. In the future I may alter the applet to enable conversion all the time, but to warn if the required characters are unavailable. Graham. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon May 14 20:19:21 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150298 for opro ; Mon, 14 May 101 20:19:19 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989847619:20:19653:69; Mon, 14 May 2001 13:40:19 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab2019278; 14 May 2001 13:40 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4EDcPE30798 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 14 May 2001 14:38:25 +0100 Received: from mail1.hw.ac.uk (mail1.hw.ac.uk [137.195.170.11]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4EDcM530795 for ; Mon, 14 May 2001 14:38:22 +0100 Received: from mail-r1.hw.ac.uk ([137.195.101.211] ident=exim) by mail1.hw.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 14zIYO-00023M-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Mon, 14 May 2001 14:38:28 +0100 Received: from isambard.che.hw.ac.uk ([137.195.32.15]) by mail-r1.hw.ac.uk with smtp (Exim 3.16 #3) id 14zIYO-0006cm-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Mon, 14 May 2001 14:38:28 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Chris Johnson To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Mon, 14 May 2001 14:33:47 +0100 Subject: Re: Problem with using the Index to the CD manual Message-ID: <4a7a8c6b2bC.A.Johnson@hw.ac.uk> In-Reply-To: <8c9386794a%rphillips@beeston12.freeserve.co.uk> References: <8c9386794a%rphillips@beeston12.freeserve.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro John van Vredenburch has kindly mailed me a small Ovation Pro document that simply cross references the page numbers to the chapters containing those page numbers. This document is now on the alt site, and can be found either by using the "what's new" page, or looking in the miscellaneous section at the end of the Resource page. Chris... -- Chris Johnson mailto: C.A.Johnson@hw.ac.uk (at work) mailto: opro@chris-johnson.org.uk (at home) ovpro web site http://www1.che.hw.ac.uk/~ovpro/ -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon May 14 20:20:01 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150308 for opro ; Mon, 14 May 101 20:20:00 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989861511:20:25421:64; Mon, 14 May 2001 17:31:51 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2128768; 14 May 2001 17:31 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4EHUFs31583 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 14 May 2001 18:30:15 +0100 Received: from cmailg6.svr.pol.co.uk (cmailg6.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.195.176]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4EHUB531580 for ; Mon, 14 May 2001 18:30:11 +0100 Received: from modem-64.flonase.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.95.64] helo=beeston12) by cmailg6.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 14zMAj-0002Ln-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Mon, 14 May 2001 18:30:17 +0100 Date: Mon, 14 May 2001 18:30:01 +0100 From: Robin Phillips To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Bullets problem Message-ID: X-Organization: home X-Mailer: Messenger v1.41d for RISC OS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.64b User-Agent: POPstar/2.03 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R Dear colleagues, I am using OvationPro 2.63, and trying to learn how to insert bullet points, automatic paragraph numbering, and so on. I have read p.71 or the CD manual, and cannot reconcile it (and its illustration) with what is on the screen in front of me when I open a new document and hit ^F to get the modify format dialogue. I should be glad if someone could explain to me STEP BY STEP how to open a new document and turn on automatic bullet points, Presumably this also involves altering the font, as the bullets I want appear to be no, 108 in Selwyn (too large really), 143 in System, or 183 in Sidney (both rather small). It would be VERY helpful to have a corrected version of the text near the foot of p.71, seeing that it is evidently not up to date with the latest version. Is there any site established for us to get downloads of the corrections (which obviously will happen from time to time? Kind regards, Robin. -- Robin Phillips, 1, Newcastle Avenue, Beeston, Notts., NG9 1BT; Phone: +44 (0)115 922 4930 E-mail: rphillips@beeston12.freeserve.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon May 14 20:20:06 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150310 for opro ; Mon, 14 May 101 20:20:05 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989866748:20:19659:63; Mon, 14 May 2001 18:59:08 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab2019492; 14 May 2001 18:58 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4EIw4T31900 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 14 May 2001 19:58:04 +0100 Received: from finch-post-10.mail.demon.net (finch-post-10.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.38]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4EIw0531897 for ; Mon, 14 May 2001 19:58:00 +0100 Received: from obanphys.demon.co.uk ([158.152.51.151]) by finch-post-10.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 14zNXi-000MrH-0A for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Mon, 14 May 2001 18:58:07 +0000 Message-ID: Date: Mon, 14 May 2001 19:56:59 +0100 To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk From: Alan H Partridge Subject: Re: hard spaces (was Re: two separate questions...) References: <3AFFAA1A.396ECA6@sharp.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <3AFFAA1A.396ECA6@sharp.co.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike Integrated Version 5.01 S Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In message <3AFFAA1A.396ECA6@sharp.co.uk>, Graham Jones wrote >Barry Gray wrote: >> I was always taught (and I myself teach) that in SI there is no space >> between the quantity and the unit, for example 9m not 9 m, although of >> course nine metres but not usually 9 metres and never nine m. > >There are some situations where it can be confusing if there is not a space >between the value and the unit. I was recently typing a resistance of thirty >ohms (30Ohm) and decided that in this case 30 Ohm was much better. There should *always* be a space between the number and the unit. See http://www.npl.co.uk/npl/reference/si_conventions.html or http://physics.nist.gov/cuu/Units/rules.html Cheers, Alan. -- Remember what the dormouse said ... Alan H Partridge mailto:perdrix@obanphys.demon.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon May 14 22:27:16 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150332 for opro ; Mon, 14 May 101 22:27:14 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989874598:20:08160:64; Mon, 14 May 2001 21:09:58 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2108652; 14 May 2001 21:09 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4EL93X32294 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 14 May 2001 22:09:03 +0100 Received: from norwegia.access.ch (mail.access.ch [195.112.71.134]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4EL8w532290 for ; Mon, 14 May 2001 22:08:58 +0100 Received: from janvredenb.access.ch (megapop1-25.access.ch [212.161.128.25]) by norwegia.access.ch (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id XAA24004 for ; Mon, 14 May 2001 23:08:54 +0200 Date: Mon, 14 May 2001 23:02:01 +0200 (BST) From: Jhr JMAH van Vredenburch Subject: Re: hard spaces (was Re: two separate questions...) To: OVATIONP-L In-Reply-To: <3AFFAA1A.396ECA6@sharp.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: tevens Secretariaat Stichting Van Vredenburch; CIC member X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Mon 14 May, Graham Jones wrote: > Barry Gray wrote: > > I was always taught (and I myself teach) that in SI there is no space > > between the quantity and the unit, for example 9m not 9 m, although of > > course nine metres but not usually 9 metres and never nine m. > > There are some situations where it can be confusing if there is not a space > between the value and the unit. I was recently typing a resistance of thirty > ohms (30Ohm) and decided that in this case 30 Ohm was much better. Are you per chance contradicting yourself? Above is stated 9m and 9metres. It is then normal that you also state 30Ohm. In the latter case you can state it without a space if you use the Ohm symbol as to be found in the Sidney character set under no. 87. As you use the 'm' symbol for metres. JohnvV -- JM van Vredenburch tel +41 41 3706125 | RiscOS Schaedruetihalde 5 fax +41 41 3706120 | Computers CH - 6006 Luzern email janvredenb@access.ch | only :-) -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Mon May 14 22:27:20 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150333 for opro ; Mon, 14 May 101 22:27:18 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989874605:20:08521:63; Mon, 14 May 2001 21:10:05 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2008405; 14 May 2001 21:09 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4EL8rD32289 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 14 May 2001 22:08:53 +0100 Received: from norwegia.access.ch (mail.access.ch [195.112.71.134]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4EL8n532286 for ; Mon, 14 May 2001 22:08:49 +0100 Received: from janvredenb.access.ch (megapop1-25.access.ch [212.161.128.25]) by norwegia.access.ch (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id XAA24010 for ; Mon, 14 May 2001 23:08:55 +0200 Date: Mon, 14 May 2001 22:48:30 +0200 (BST) From: Jhr JMAH van Vredenburch Subject: Re: Problem with using the Index to the CD manual To: OVATIONP-L In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: tevens Secretariaat Stichting Van Vredenburch; CIC member X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Mon 14 May, Alf Chamings wrote: > On Sat 12 May, David Pilling wrote: > > Yes it would be a good idea if the index included chapter numbers as well as pages. > > We might see if that can be done. > > > Or put the page numbers in the file names? One topic appears on 7 different pages, mentioned in 7 different chapters. Accepting an average chapter length of 9 characters plus a hyphen plus 3 characters for the page number plus a comma to separate the entry from the following entry results in almost 100 characters. Add to that the item entered in the index you have about 125 to 140 characters on one (1) line. It is possible, but definitely not when using a 2 column A4 sized document. The present Index for OvPro version 2.60 has been more or less manually created because of technical problems. Next month I hope to create a complete new index. JohnvV -- JM van Vredenburch tel +41 41 3706125 | RiscOS Schaedruetihalde 5 fax +41 41 3706120 | Computers CH - 6006 Luzern email janvredenb@access.ch | only :-) -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 15 02:13:24 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150344 for opro ; Tue, 15 May 101 02:13:21 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989876650:20:06845:63; Mon, 14 May 2001 21:44:10 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2006696; 14 May 2001 21:44 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4ELP0H32399 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 14 May 2001 22:25:00 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4ELOr532390 for ; Mon, 14 May 2001 22:24:53 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 14zPpr-00093Q-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Mon, 14 May 2001 21:24:59 +0000 Date: Mon, 14 May 2001 22:15:27 GMT Message-Id: <150327@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Bullets problem X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro You're right that the CD manual is not up to date with version 2.63, the following text has been added to page 71, to explain the two new number formats. 123a numbers for all levels except the last for which a lower case letter is used. 123A the same but with an upper case letter. Beyond that the manual is correct. I don't know if I can do any better than I have done in the manual at explaining how to use bullets. In brief... Define a new style which you'd like to apply to the bullet e.g. a Symbol font and a point size for it. Define a new style which you're going to apply to the text you want bulleting. Go to the Format window, enable bulleting, and set the style you defined in the previous step for the bullet. Apply the second style defined above to the text you want auto bulleting. Yes eventually there will have to be a way of making updated manuals available. However new versions of OPro come with text files which outline changes. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 15 02:13:29 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150347 for opro ; Tue, 15 May 101 02:13:26 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989877997:10:23929:70; Mon, 14 May 2001 22:06:37 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1104653; 14 May 2001 22:06 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4EM36432660 for ovationpro-list; Mon, 14 May 2001 23:03:06 +0100 Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4EM32532657 for ; Mon, 14 May 2001 23:03:02 +0100 Received: from [62.188.10.122] (helo=62.188.10.122) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 14zQO0-0006wN-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Mon, 14 May 2001 23:00:18 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: "charles.hope" To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Mon, 14 May 2001 17:38:10 +0100 Subject: Re: RTF files Message-ID: <4a7a9d4cd9charles.hope@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a78a71db9davidb@argonet.co.uk> References: <149633@pilling.demon.co.uk> <4a77e585dacharles.hope@argonet.co.uk> <4a78a71db9davidb@argonet.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02c (RISC-OS/4.02) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On 10 May, David Breakwell wrote: > In article <4a77e585dacharles.hope@argonet.co.uk>, > charles.hope wrote: > > I find that if I try to import an RTF File derived directly from a Word > > document, there is a lot of disc activity but no text appears in the > > frame. I can, however, load the RTF file into a new document and then > > copy it over to the one where I want it. > > If I take the same Word document, load it into EasiWriter and save as > > RTF from there, I can put this straight into the frame of an existing > > document. > I've not tried that (I don't have access to word @ home) but I guess > this could be because my exporter includes style info - easiwriter RTF > does not - and maybe word dislikes this ? That's the only major > difference between the RTF I generate and the stuff Easiwriter makes. I think you're looking at this the wrong way round. I'm trying to import into Ov Pro, not from it. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 15 18:17:15 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150377 for opro ; Tue, 15 May 101 18:17:14 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989936463:20:21195:64; Tue, 15 May 2001 14:21:03 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2108207; 15 May 2001 14:20 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4FE2JM02733 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 15 May 2001 15:02:19 +0100 Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4FC6Z502398 for ; Tue, 15 May 2001 13:06:35 +0100 Received: from [62.188.151.80] (helo=62.188.151.80) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 14zdYR-0004f9-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 15 May 2001 13:03:57 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From:(Mijas Software) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Tue, 15 May 2001 11:46:38 +0100 X-Organization: ArgoNet, but does not necessarily reflect its views. X-Mailer: Posty - Voyager Email 1.24 for RISC OS 4.02 Subject: Re: RTF files Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Mon 14 May 2001 (17:38:10 +0100), charles.hope@argonet.co.uk wrote: > I think you're looking at this the wrong way round. I'm trying to > import (RTF) into Ov Pro, not from it. > You can import a single RTF (text) document into OPro by dropping the rtf file (suitably typed) onto the OPro icon bar icon, that is assuming you have the RTF import applet loaded. If you want to add the contents of an RTF file to an existing document, you need to import the rtf into a new document and then copy into your existing document. N.N.B With ImageFs2 loaded, Techwriter will import both text and (some types of) graphics from RTF files. You can then transfer to OPro. -- aoline@argonet.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 15 18:17:37 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150380 for opro ; Tue, 15 May 101 18:17:35 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989935673:10:07263:168; Tue, 15 May 2001 14:07:53 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1107223; 15 May 2001 14:07 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4FE2FT02728 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 15 May 2001 15:02:15 +0100 Received: from blueyonder.co.uk (pcow024o.blueyonder.co.uk [195.188.53.126]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4F7CX501604 for ; Tue, 15 May 2001 08:12:33 +0100 Received: from bgba01526.blueyonder.co.uk ([213.48.114.45]) by blueyonder.co.uk with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.687.68); Tue, 15 May 2001 08:14:39 +0100 Date: Tue, 15 May 2001 08:13:00 +0100 (BST) From: Barry Gray Subject: SI: was hard spaces To: OVATIONP-L In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Barry Gray E-mail: barrygray@blueyonder.co.uk X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.46] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Mon 14 May, Jhr JMAH van Vredenburch wrote: > On Mon 14 May, Graham Jones wrote: > > Barry Gray wrote: > > > I was always taught (and I myself teach) that in SI there is no space > > > between the quantity and the unit, for example 9m not 9 m, although of > > > course nine metres but not usually 9 metres and never nine m. > > > > There are some situations where it can be confusing if there is not a space > > between the value and the unit. I was recently typing a resistance of thirty > > ohms (30Ohm) and decided that in this case 30 Ohm was much better. > > Are you per chance contradicting yourself? > > Above is stated 9m and 9metres. It is then normal that you also > state 30Ohm. In the latter case you can state it without a space > if you use the Ohm symbol as to be found in the Sidney character set > under no. 87. As you use the 'm' symbol for metres. > > JohnvV > Keith Bamford wrote that I was wrong to teach that SI *explicitly* requires 9m not 9m and he is right (thanks Keith, and I have changed my web site), although this usage is very common indeed. There is of course a space in nine metres (and also in 9 metres and nine m, although these are not usually regarded as good English). The only time when there might be confusion with this usage is with l for litres but of course the litre is not a SI unit. But can anyone point me to a reference which *explicitly* states that in SI the use of 9m is wrong? FTR SI explicitly states that where a unit is names after a person the abbreviated unit is written as a capital but the full unit without, for example 10N but ten newtons, so you would write ohms not Ohms. -- Barry Gray http://www.barrygray.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 15 18:17:39 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150381 for opro ; Tue, 15 May 101 18:17:38 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989935693:10:08357:83; Tue, 15 May 2001 14:08:13 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1007886; 15 May 2001 14:07 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4FE2K702734 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 15 May 2001 15:02:20 +0100 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150362 for ovationp-l ; Tue, 15 May 101 14:50:09 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for ovationp-l@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989919901:10:14839:28; Tue, 15 May 2001 09:45:01 GMT Received: from mail11.svr.pol.co.uk ([195.92.193.23]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1014112; 15 May 2001 9:44 GMT Received: from modem-132.yellow-billed-loon.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.220.132] helo=localhost) by mail11.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 14zbN3-0004Hh-00 for ovationp-l@pilling.demon.co.uk; Tue, 15 May 2001 10:44:02 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Simon Jones To: OvationPro Mailing List Date: Tue, 15 May 2001 09:51:57 +0100 Subject: 2.60 bug/niggles/suggestion Message-ID: <4a7af673bfsimon.jones@capelinmedia.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02b (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.01b12 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R Some points have been driving me nuts since I started using 2.60 and 2.63, and I can't find anywhere where the issues are described (I won't mention the heart-wrenching issue of whether a manual should be wire or spiral bound. I'm happy with disc-based, but would like it to be hyperlinked (sorry David)): Bug (2.63 - this is not a problem in 2.60): start a new line, beginning with a nukber(full stop)(space)any words and finsih with(colon or semi-colon, and maybe some other punctuation)return - causes OPro to crash. Niggles: 1) Highlighting a word also highlights the SPACE in front of it - I preferred the previous action of highlighting the space AFTER. 2) Highlighting a paragraph includes the RETURN after it: this is not a problem (it is useful) until applying s style for which "paragraph apply" has been selected - because the paragraph following also gets the style applied, which is deeply annoying. 3) The auto-numbering seems not to be always-on and not an option - and it is often a real pain. The feature whereby the return takes you to the same point the previous para started (ie two tabs in , if that is how the previous para started) is however more use than hindrance. The auto-capitalisation of the first letter of a new para is also very annoying - to shift-char when wanted is so natural to most users that this feature is unnecessary. 4) Dictionary: the dictionary supplied with OPro dislikes words such as won't, don't etc, but happily suggests wont, dont and so on. This seems to contravene the rules of spelling I learnt some years ago! Can the dictionary be tweaked to include apostrophes, or will apostrophes always cause OPro to analyse separate parts of words? Suggestions: The issue of font families in all their many variants has been raised before. I would like to suggest that the Text Frame toolbar be made more intelligent, so that below the font name appears buttons for all the weights available (so as well as Normal. Bold and Italic we may sometimes get Black, Condensed, Cond, Light, Extnd etc. This means it needs to blank options that aren't available for the selected font. An alternative may be to have N,B,I as is, then a drop-down that is like the second drop-down of the font selection - ie showing all the wieghts for the available font - requires just one button, and it is easier to find the weight you want without going all through the font drop-down which is often very long (=slow). This sme pribcipal could be added to the Text window in Edit Style and the Modify Text (F6) menu. Cheers Simon -- Simon Jones - simon.jones@capelinmedia.co.uk - Clitheroe, Lancs Freelance Sound Recordist | http://www.capelinmedia.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 15 18:17:50 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150386 for opro ; Tue, 15 May 101 18:17:49 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989942294:10:19024:99; Tue, 15 May 2001 15:58:14 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1124602; 15 May 2001 15:57 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4FEqkU03141 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 15 May 2001 15:52:46 +0100 Received: from tvweb1.hiway.co.uk (root@tvweb1.hiway.co.uk [195.12.1.131]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4FEqg503138 for ; Tue, 15 May 2001 15:52:42 +0100 Received: from websrv.quantel.com ([195.12.20.51]) by tvweb1.hiway.co.uk (8.11.1/8.9.3) with ESMTP id f4FEqio12564 for ; Tue, 15 May 2001 15:52:44 +0100 Subject: Re: 2.60 bug/niggles/suggestion To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk From: Date: Tue, 15 May 2001 15:38:20 +0100 Message-ID: X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on Websrv/QuantelWeb(Release 5.0.6a |January 17, 2001) at 05/15/2001 03:57:21 PM MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro > Bug (2.63 - this is not a problem in 2.60): > start a new line, beginning with a nukber(full stop)(space)any words > and finsih with(colon or semi-colon, and maybe some other > punctuation)return - causes OPro to crash. Are you sure you haven't got an applet loaded that is causing this. My immediate thought is the !List (or whatever it was called) applet from Levens. This did something if you typed a colon. Just a thought Andy Ling -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 15 19:12:10 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150396 for opro ; Tue, 15 May 101 19:12:05 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989948088:10:18511:76; Tue, 15 May 2001 17:34:48 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1018483; 15 May 2001 17:34 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4FHXgG03674 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 15 May 2001 18:33:42 +0100 Received: from mta01-svc.ntlworld.com (mta01-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.41]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4FFLQ503232 for ; Tue, 15 May 2001 16:21:26 +0100 Received: from riscpc.at.home ([213.107.105.170]) by mta01-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.27 201-229-119-110) with SMTP id <20010515152134.QHO283.mta01-svc.ntlworld.com@riscpc.at.home> for ; Tue, 15 May 2001 16:21:34 +0100 Date: Tue, 15 May 2001 16:21:04 +0100 From: John Pettigrew To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: 2.60 bug/niggles/suggestion Message-ID: <98131a7b4a.john@xl-cambridge.com> References: <4a7af673bfsimon.jones@capelinmedia.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a7af673bfsimon.jones@capelinmedia.co.uk> X-Organization: XL Cambridge User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.10d (MsgServe/1.10) (RISC-OS/4.02) X-Editor: Zap, using ZapEmail 0.22 (27 Nov 1998) patch-3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In a previous message, Simon Jones wrote: > Bug (2.63 - this is not a problem in 2.60): > start a new line, beginning with a nukber(full stop)(space)any words and > finsih with(colon or semi-colon, and maybe some other punctuation)return - > causes OPro to crash. not reproducible here using 2.63... Perhaps an applet is causing the problem? > Niggles: > 1) Highlighting a word also highlights the SPACE in front of it - I > preferred the previous action of highlighting the space AFTER. Again, not here HTH, John -- John Pettigrew XL Cambridge - Contract and freelance editing and writing Life sciences specialist - molecular biology, genetics, biotechnology john@xl-cambridge.com http://www.xl-cambridge.com/ -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 15 19:12:18 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150397 for opro ; Tue, 15 May 101 19:12:14 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989948090:10:18468:84; Tue, 15 May 2001 17:34:50 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1107654; 15 May 2001 17:34 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4FHXjN03675 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 15 May 2001 18:33:45 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4FHXd503671 for ; Tue, 15 May 2001 18:33:39 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 14zihe-000IN9-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 15 May 2001 17:33:46 +0000 Date: Tue, 15 May 2001 18:20:44 GMT Message-Id: <150389@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: 2.60 bug/niggles/suggestion X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R Firstly, can you (and John Pettigrew) please post to the list from the addresses you're subscribed from, and the list address is now ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk (not what you used). >start a new line, beginning with a nukber(full stop)(space)any words >and finsih with(colon or semi-colon, and maybe some other >punctuation)return - causes OPro to crash. and >3) The auto-numbering seems not to be always-on and not an option - and Sounds to me a bit like one of the auto numbering appletsbeing installed. >The auto-capitalisation of the first letter of a new para is also very Super shift applet? >4) Dictionary: the dictionary supplied with OPro dislikes words such as >won't, don't etc Oh no it doesn't. I think you've got another dictionary installed there. (probably from one of my other products, so I'm still guilty) David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 15 22:57:03 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150404 for opro ; Tue, 15 May 101 22:57:01 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989950716:20:00875:63; Tue, 15 May 2001 18:18:36 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2110204; 15 May 2001 18:18 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4FIHqe03983 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 15 May 2001 19:17:52 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4FIHn503980 for ; Tue, 15 May 2001 19:17:49 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 14zjON-000Mas-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 15 May 2001 18:17:55 +0000 Date: Tue, 15 May 2001 19:16:17 GMT Message-Id: <150398@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: 2.60 bug/niggles/suggestion X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R >Firstly, can you (and John Pettigrew) please post to the list from >the addresses you're subscribed from, and the list address is now >ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk (not what you used). In my impatience I said this wrong. Simon Jones posted to the wrong address. John Pettigrew, Barry Gray and Mijas Softwaare posted from non-subscribed addresses today. Sorry to go on about this, really its a software problem. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Tue May 15 22:57:17 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150410 for opro ; Tue, 15 May 101 22:57:14 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989962690:10:29562:69; Tue, 15 May 2001 21:38:10 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1029004; 15 May 2001 21:37 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4FLahx04657 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 15 May 2001 22:36:43 +0100 Received: from norwegia.access.ch (mail.access.ch [195.112.71.134]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4FLaa504653 for ; Tue, 15 May 2001 22:36:37 +0100 Received: from janvredenb.access.ch (megapop4-25.access.ch [212.161.128.217]) by norwegia.access.ch (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id XAA30543 for ; Tue, 15 May 2001 23:36:38 +0200 Date: Tue, 15 May 2001 18:51:07 +0200 (BST) From: Jhr JMAH van Vredenburch Subject: Re: SI: was hard spaces; and the 'ell' syndrome To: OVATIONP-L In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: tevens Secretariaat Stichting Van Vredenburch; CIC member X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Tue 15 May, Barry Gray wrote: snip a lot > FTR SI explicitly states that where a unit is names after a person the > abbreviated unit is written as a capital but the full unit without, for > example 10N but ten newtons, so you would write ohms not Ohms. Indeed! I overlooked that aspect. By the way: the chap's name was Ohm. He is honoured with the unit "ohm", which has a plural "ohms". The abbreviation for litre is no problem when handwritten. The character goes from mid-left to the right, then to the top and then down through the middle, etc. Clearly distinguishable from the number 1 (one). The first mechanical typewriters used the same key for 'one' and 'ell'. As was also done for 'zero' and the letter 'O'. I have a feeling that whoever created the ASCII set looked at the typewriter set of letters overlooked the marked differences to be found in a handwritten set. The question is whether this state of affairs must continue to be accepted for DTP work? Or that it is time to update the fonts used. Or demand such! Where I need to distinguish clearly in documents the difference between a number 1 and a letter ell, I use a font where the letter ell has been changed to resemble more the handwritten character. I fear this font is copyright protected but intend to discuss this problem with the copyright holders at Wakefield. JohnvV -- JM van Vredenburch tel +41 41 3706125 | RiscOS Schaedruetihalde 5 fax +41 41 3706120 | Computers CH - 6006 Luzern email janvredenb@access.ch | only :-) -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 16 14:03:13 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150437 for opro ; Wed, 16 May 101 14:03:09 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989967601:10:15551:65; Tue, 15 May 2001 23:00:01 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1116267; 15 May 2001 22:59 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4FMwYd04916 for ovationpro-list; Tue, 15 May 2001 23:58:34 +0100 Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4FMwU504913 for ; Tue, 15 May 2001 23:58:30 +0100 Received: from [62.188.17.117] (helo=62.188.17.117) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 14znjK-0004ov-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Tue, 15 May 2001 23:55:51 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: "charles.hope" To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Tue, 15 May 2001 18:47:23 +0100 Subject: Re: RTF files Message-ID: <4a7b2778f2charles.hope@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: References: User-Agent: Pluto/2.02c (RISC-OS/4.02) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On 15 May, Mijas Software wrote: > On Mon 14 May 2001 (17:38:10 +0100), charles.hope@argonet.co.uk wrote: > > I think you're looking at this the wrong way round. I'm trying to > > import (RTF) into Ov Pro, not from it. > > > You can import a single RTF (text) document into OPro by dropping the > rtf file (suitably typed) onto the OPro icon bar icon, that is assuming > you have the RTF import applet loaded. > If you want to add the contents of an RTF file to an existing > document, you need to import the rtf into a new document and then copy > into your existing document. That is what happens if the RTF document come from Word via a PC, but if I export it from Easiwriter as RTF, I can drop it straight into an existing document. My query was why the difference> > N.N.B With ImageFs2 loaded, Techwriter will import both text and > (some types of) graphics from RTF files. You can then transfer to OPro. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 16 14:03:17 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150439 for opro ; Wed, 16 May 101 14:03:15 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989968583:10:00248:65; Tue, 15 May 2001 23:16:23 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1108174; 15 May 2001 23:16 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4FNFpd05012 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 16 May 2001 00:15:51 +0100 Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4FNFk505009 for ; Wed, 16 May 2001 00:15:46 +0100 Received: from useraa47.uk.uudial.com ([62.188.130.47] helo=argonet.co.uk ident=Ian) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 14znzz-0005KA-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 16 May 2001 00:13:06 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Ian Gooding To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 00:13:38 +0100 Subject: Paranoia Message-ID: <4a7b45578cian.gooding@argonet.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R Is it just my setup? Whenever I forget myself and type my address and postcode into OPro, I get OPro freezing. It responds to break (thank goodness for RISC OS 4 :-)), and I can import a text file containing these details without a problem, but typing a line containing "SL3 7BJ" is enough to cause this. Is this the same "bug" as Simon Jones is reporting? Or have I stuffed my dictionary in some novel way? -- ian.gooding@argonet.co.uk tel: UK + (1753) 527903 http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/ian.gooding -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 16 14:03:49 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150451 for opro ; Wed, 16 May 101 14:03:46 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990005714:20:13328:229; Wed, 16 May 2001 09:35:14 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2111008; 16 May 2001 9:24 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4G9NTE06605 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 16 May 2001 10:23:29 +0100 Received: from mail11.svr.pol.co.uk (mail11.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.23]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4G9NP506602 for ; Wed, 16 May 2001 10:23:25 +0100 Received: from modem-56.saint-bernard.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.25.204.56] helo=localhost) by mail11.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 14zxWj-0008LR-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 16 May 2001 10:23:31 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Simon Jones To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 08:50:01 +0100 Subject: Re: 2.60 bug/niggles/suggestion Message-ID: <4a7b749e3fsimon.jones@capelinmedia.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <150389@pilling.demon.co.uk> References: <150389@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02b (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.01b12 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by omega.barnet.ac.uk id f4G9NQ506603 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by omega.barnet.ac.uk id f4G9NTF06605 Status: R In article <150389@pilling.demon.co.uk>, David Pilling wrote: > Simon Jones posted to the wrong address. > the list address is now > ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk (not what you used). Sorry,. Address book now updated :-) > >start a new line, beginning with a nukber(full stop)(space)any words > >and finsih with(colon or semi-colon, and maybe some other > >punctuation)return - causes OPro to crash. > and > >3) The auto-numbering seems not to be always-on and not an option - > >and > Sounds to me a bit like one of the auto numbering applets=A0being > installed. Thanks David and Andy and John - I've removed !List and all is happy!=20 > >The auto-capitalisation of the first letter of a new para is also > >very > Super shift applet? Guilty! > >4) Dictionary: the dictionary supplied with OPro dislikes words such > >as won't, don't etc > Oh no it doesn't. I think you've got another dictionary installed > there. (probably from one of my other products, so I'm still guilty) Possible - I can't remember whether 2.60 was completely clean, or absorbed a dictionary that had been used in earlier version. I guess I could re-install the dictionary from the 2.60 CD. Am I right in thinking that any words added to the dictionary will be lost (ie I can find the !HyphDict and !MainDict, and the absence of a !UserDict or suchlike suggests words are added to the main dictionary? Or is the UserDict stored in a different location within OPro? Many thanks=20 Cheers Simon -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 16 16:10:36 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150476 for opro ; Wed, 16 May 101 16:10:34 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990018359:20:12287:107; Wed, 16 May 2001 13:05:59 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2121683; 16 May 2001 13:01 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4GD1DN07302 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 16 May 2001 14:01:13 +0100 Received: from amersham.mail.uk.easynet.net (amersham.mail.uk.easynet.net [195.40.1.45]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4FIK9504020 for ; Tue, 15 May 2001 19:20:09 +0100 Received: from neil.dickson.ukonline.co.uk (tnt-10-375.easynet.co.uk [212.134.17.119]) by amersham.mail.uk.easynet.net (Postfix) with SMTP id B7C2917C1B for ; Tue, 15 May 2001 19:19:55 +0100 (BST) Date: Tue, 15 May 2001 19:01:00 +0100 From: Neil Dickson To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Bullets problem Message-ID: <50b8287b4a.neil@neil.dickson.ukonline.co.uk> References: In-Reply-To: X-Organization: Home User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.50 (MsgServe/1.50) (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In message Robin Phillips wrote: > I am using OvationPro 2.63, and trying to learn how to insert bullet > points, automatic paragraph numbering, and so on. I have read p.71 or the CD > manual, and cannot reconcile it (and its illustration) with what is on the > screen in front of me when I open a new document and hit ^F to get the modify > format dialogue. Mentioning that you couldn't get the illustation to reconcile jogged my memory to a problem I once had... I'd apparently failed to do something while upgrading as I eventually discovered that I didn't have the correct templates file installed. What is the timestamp on the file !OvnPro.!OvnResDir.UK.Templates ? (The one on the CD is 28 Jun 2000.) -- Neil Dickson -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 16 16:10:45 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150480 for opro ; Wed, 16 May 101 16:10:43 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990022774:20:10242:172; Wed, 16 May 2001 14:19:34 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2105055; 16 May 2001 14:16 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4GDbKe07487 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 16 May 2001 14:37:20 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4GDbD507479 for ; Wed, 16 May 2001 14:37:14 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 1501UO-000Dcn-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 16 May 2001 13:37:20 +0000 Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 14:31:19 GMT Message-Id: <150464@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Paranoia X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Hi, >Whenever I forget myself and type my address and postcode into OPro, I get >OPro freezing. It responds to break (thank goodness for RISC OS 4 :-)), One might bring up the stuff about "is it an applet", try Control + Escape and see if that regains control. >and I can import a text file containing these details without a problem, >but typing a line containing "SL3 7BJ" is enough to cause this. Is this >the same "bug" as Simon Jones is reporting? Or have I stuffed my >dictionary in some novel way? Well yes it could be an applet. But you're quite right it could be a dictionary problem. Use Edit dictionary and see if your postcode is in there. Sort of interesting that most things are word based, so one would expect SL3 to cause a crash (or 7BJ), anyway one triplet on its own. (unless you type it with a non-breaking space) David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 16 16:10:49 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150482 for opro ; Wed, 16 May 101 16:10:46 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990025335:20:11541:300; Wed, 16 May 2001 15:02:15 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2123570; 16 May 2001 14:58 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4GDbIw07486 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 16 May 2001 14:37:18 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4GDbC507475 for ; Wed, 16 May 2001 14:37:12 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 1501UE-000Dcn-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 16 May 2001 13:37:19 +0000 Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 14:28:09 GMT Message-Id: <150462@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: 2.60 bug/niggles/suggestion X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >Possible - I can't remember whether 2.60 was completely clean, or >absorbed a dictionary that had been used in earlier version. I think it would be a dictionary from something like Spell or CrossStar >I guess I could re-install the dictionary from the 2.60 CD. Am I right >in thinking that any words added to the dictionary will be lost Yes, correct. >(ie I >can find the !HyphDict and !MainDict, and the absence of a !UserDict or >suchlike suggests words are added to the main dictionary? Or is the >UserDict stored in a different location within OPro? UserDict should be in !UserWords (if you've installed it). When you add a word OPro will show you what you're adding it to. You can also look at the timestamp on !MainDict, and you can observe the number of words in it. The one which comes with OPro has about 60K words, the ones from my other programs, have around 130K. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 16 16:10:53 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150484 for opro ; Wed, 16 May 101 16:10:51 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990021414:10:15414:67; Wed, 16 May 2001 13:56:54 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1120183; 16 May 2001 13:56 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4GDbN307495 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 16 May 2001 14:37:23 +0100 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150448 for ovationp-l ; Wed, 16 May 101 14:03:38 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for ovationp-l@pilling.demon.co.uk id 989988572:10:12893:0; Wed, 16 May 2001 04:49:32 GMT Received: from snowy.kiwilink.co.nz ([202.27.215.2]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1116098; 16 May 2001 4:49 GMT Received: from timk.ns.planet.gen.nz (ppp-58.kiwilink.co.nz [202.27.215.124]) by snowy.kiwilink.co.nz (8.11.0/8.11.0) with SMTP id f4G4jqM22311 for ; Wed, 16 May 2001 16:45:53 +1200 (NZST) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Tim King To: OvationPro Mailing List Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 16:42:53 +1300 Subject: Re: 2.60 bug/niggles/suggestion Message-ID: <4a7b5dfe07tim@de-sig.co.nz> In-Reply-To: <4a7af673bfsimon.jones@capelinmedia.co.uk> References: <4a7af673bfsimon.jones@capelinmedia.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <4a7af673bfsimon.jones@capelinmedia.co.uk>, Simon Jones wrote: > 2) Highlighting a paragraph includes the RETURN after it: this is not a > problem (it is useful) until applying s style for which "paragraph > apply" has been selected - because the paragraph following also gets > the style applied, which is deeply annoying. Don't highlight the paragraph. It just has to contain the caret. Tim -- Tim King... de-Sig. +64 9 478.3114 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 16 18:07:48 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150488 for opro ; Wed, 16 May 101 18:07:46 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990026105:10:01353:65; Wed, 16 May 2001 15:15:05 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1029734; 16 May 2001 15:13 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4GDbTB07498 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 16 May 2001 14:37:30 +0100 Received: from blueyonder.co.uk (pcow035o.blueyonder.co.uk [195.188.53.121]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4G7B3506174 for ; Wed, 16 May 2001 08:11:03 +0100 Received: from bgba01526.blueyonder.co.uk ([213.48.114.99]) by blueyonder.co.uk with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.687.68); Wed, 16 May 2001 07:13:10 +0000 Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 08:11:45 +0100 (BST) From: Barry Gray Subject: Re: SI: was hard spaces - Thanks To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Barry Gray E-mail: barrygray@blueyonder.co.uk X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.46] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Mon 14 May, Alan H Partridge wrote: > In message <3AFFAA1A.396ECA6@sharp.co.uk>, Graham Jones > wrote > > > >Barry Gray wrote: > >> I was always taught (and I myself teach) that in SI there is no space > >> between the quantity and the unit, for example 9m not 9 m, although of > >> course nine metres but not usually 9 metres and never nine m. > > > >There are some situations where it can be confusing if there is not a space > >between the value and the unit. I was recently typing a resistance of thirty > >ohms (30Ohm) and decided that in this case 30 Ohm was much better. > > There should *always* be a space between the number and the unit. > > See http://www.npl.co.uk/npl/reference/si_conventions.html or > > http://physics.nist.gov/cuu/Units/rules.html > > Cheers, > > Alan. Thanks - have modified my web site and included a link to the first of these references. One of the nice things about the web is that if you make a mistake there is always someone willing to help you to put it right. Thanks to everyone. -- Barry Gray http://www.barrygray.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 16 18:07:54 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150490 for opro ; Wed, 16 May 101 18:07:52 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990029264:10:08116:82; Wed, 16 May 2001 16:07:44 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1007724; 16 May 2001 16:06 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4GG2c508332 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 16 May 2001 17:02:38 +0100 Received: from anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.91]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4GG2Z508329 for ; Wed, 16 May 2001 17:02:35 +0100 Received: from omba.demon.co.uk ([158.152.58.5]) by anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 1503l3-000Ic6-0X for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 16 May 2001 17:02:42 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Jeremy C B Nicoll To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 16:48:36 +0100 Subject: Re: 2.60 bug/niggles/suggestion Message-ID: <4a7ba06f0bJeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <150462@pilling.demon.co.uk> References: <150462@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.01g (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R On 16 May, David Pilling wrote: > UserDict should be in !UserWords (if you've installed it). When you add > a word OPro will show you what you're adding it to. You can also look > at the timestamp on !MainDict, and you can observe the number of words > in it. The one which comes with OPro has about 60K words, the ones from > my other programs, have around 130K. That - prhaps - implies that the other dictionaries are better than the OP one. Is there some central location one can install the biggest dictionaries, and indded any number of specific user ones, so that all your applications have access to the same set of dictionaries? That's presuming that they all work the same way... -- Jeremy C B Nicoll - my opinions are my own. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 16 21:58:17 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150504 for opro ; Wed, 16 May 101 21:58:15 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990035016:20:20307:69; Wed, 16 May 2001 17:43:36 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2019614; 16 May 2001 17:43 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4GHdOA08765 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 16 May 2001 18:39:24 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4GHdK508762 for ; Wed, 16 May 2001 18:39:20 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 1505Gh-000Hs1-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 16 May 2001 17:39:27 +0000 Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 18:13:32 GMT Message-Id: <150494@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: 2.60 bug/niggles/suggestion X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Hi, >That - prhaps - implies that the other dictionaries are better than the >OP one. Bigger yes, better perhaps not. >Is there some central location one can install the biggest dictionaries Yes, !Words. >and indded any number of specific user ones !UserWords (note different place to !Words for those on a network) >your applications have access to the same set of dictionaries? That's >presuming that they all work the same way... Well all 'mine' do. CrossStar, Ovation, Ovation Pro, Spell, Web Spell (anything that uses the Spell module), Word Square. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Wed May 16 23:07:43 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150515 for opro ; Wed, 16 May 101 23:07:42 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990050445:10:23413:64; Wed, 16 May 2001 22:00:45 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1128196; 16 May 2001 21:59 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4GLoLP09464 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 16 May 2001 22:50:21 +0100 Received: from pandora.chariot.net.au (mail.chariot.net.au [203.30.236.84]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4GLoE509461 for ; Wed, 16 May 2001 22:50:15 +0100 Received: from localhost.com (ppp-091.cust210-9-26.ghr.chariot.net.au [210.9.26.91]) by pandora.chariot.net.au (8.11.1/8.10.0) with SMTP id f4GLoHx23521 for ; Thu, 17 May 2001 07:20:17 +0930 Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 08:55:32 +0830 From: Peter Prewett To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: 2.60 bug/niggles/suggestion Message-ID: References: <150389@pilling.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <150389@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.50 (MsgServe/1.50) (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R > >4) Dictionary: the dictionary supplied with OPro dislikes words such as > >won't, don't etc > > Oh no it doesn't. I think you've got another dictionary installed there. > (probably from one of my other products, so I'm still guilty) > Just checked mine and it does the same so where do I start looking? I have not installed another dictionary so I am confused (again):-(( Cheers Peter -- Peter Prewett, Coromandel Valley, South Australia -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 17 01:50:40 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150524 for opro ; Thu, 17 May 101 01:50:37 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990052846:20:22447:65; Wed, 16 May 2001 22:40:46 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2107464; 16 May 2001 22:40 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4GMV8509624 for ovationpro-list; Wed, 16 May 2001 23:31:08 +0100 Received: from smtp.argonet.co.uk (madhatter.navaho.net [213.161.67.202]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4GMV2509621 for ; Wed, 16 May 2001 23:31:03 +0100 Received: from useran58.uk.uudial.com ([62.188.135.75] helo=argonet.co.uk) by smtp.argonet.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1) id 1509mF-0000rz-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Wed, 16 May 2001 23:28:21 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Ian Gooding To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 22:59:05 +0100 Subject: Re: Paranoia Message-ID: <4a7bc25a1aian.gooding@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <150464@pilling.demon.co.uk> References: <150464@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R In article <150464@pilling.demon.co.uk>, David Pilling wrote: > Hi, > >Whenever I forget myself and type my address and postcode into OPro, I > >get OPro freezing. It responds to break (thank goodness for RISC OS 4 > >:-)), > One might bring up the stuff about "is it an applet", try Control + > Escape and see if that regains control. Yep, it was an applet, as Control + Escape gave me "Script stopped" and returned control. Thanks again for diagnostic help :-) Interestingly, the freeze seems to be linked to my full postal address, not just post code, then pressing return. Any way I can find out which applet is at fault? I've got a number loaded but none ticked on the Applets menu. -- ian.gooding@argonet.co.uk tel: UK + (1753) 527903 http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/ian.gooding -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 17 01:50:43 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150526 for opro ; Thu, 17 May 101 01:50:42 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990060136:20:21992:64; Thu, 17 May 2001 00:42:16 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2114097; 17 May 2001 0:42 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4H0ax009993 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 17 May 2001 01:36:59 +0100 Received: from finch-post-10.mail.demon.net (finch-post-10.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.38]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4H0at509989 for ; Thu, 17 May 2001 01:36:55 +0100 Received: from ypical.demon.co.uk ([158.152.78.65]) by finch-post-10.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 150Bmm-0007Tx-0A for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 17 May 2001 00:37:01 +0000 Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 01:35:34 +0100 From: Fred Bambrough To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: 2.60 bug/niggles/suggestion Message-ID: References: <150494@pilling.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <150494@pilling.demon.co.uk> X-Organization: @ypical User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.50 (MsgServe/1.50) (RISC-OS/4.02) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In message <150494@pilling.demon.co.uk> opro@pilling.demon.co.uk (David Pilling) wrote: > > Hi, > > >That - prhaps - implies that the other dictionaries are better than the > >OP one. > > Bigger yes, better perhaps not. > > >Is there some central location one can install the biggest dictionaries > > Yes, !Words. > > >and indded any number of specific user ones > > !UserWords > > (note different place to !Words for those on a network) > > >your applications have access to the same set of dictionaries? That's > >presuming that they all work the same way... > > Well all 'mine' do. CrossStar, Ovation, Ovation Pro, Spell, Web Spell > (anything that uses the Spell module), Word Square. Don't know what the original questioner is using due to the list's lack of reference headers but don't forget that Messenger also uses this type of dictionary. Maybe overiding? -- Fred -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 17 13:16:54 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150529 for opro ; Thu, 17 May 101 13:16:51 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990060898:20:05323:66; Thu, 17 May 2001 00:54:58 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2113033; 17 May 2001 0:54 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4H0mCq10053 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 17 May 2001 01:48:12 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4H0m7510050 for ; Thu, 17 May 2001 01:48:07 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 150Bxe-000Mzk-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 17 May 2001 00:48:14 +0000 Date: Wed, 16 May 2001 23:20:30 GMT Message-Id: <150522@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: 2.60 bug/niggles/suggestion X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >Just checked mine and it does the same so where do I start looking? Look for !Words directories, there will be one inside !OvnPro unless you've moved it. >I have not installed another dictionary so I am confused (again):-(( So you're saying you've never installed any of those other pieces of software mentioned above? The dictionary supplied with OvationPro has 67578 words in it, including "don't" - look at the Edit dictionary window to confirm if this is yours. It is date stamped 24 Sep 1996 and 188663 bytes long. If you find its a bit longer than that then you've been adding words to it, and if it is a lot longer e.g. 130K then it is from another program. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 17 13:17:00 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150532 for opro ; Thu, 17 May 101 13:16:57 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990091015:10:29285:66; Thu, 17 May 2001 09:16:55 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1125607; 17 May 2001 9:16 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4H9Ci711434 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 17 May 2001 10:12:44 +0100 Received: from inca.sle.sharp.co.uk (root@[193.114.241.3]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4H9Ce511431 for ; Thu, 17 May 2001 10:12:40 +0100 Received: from sharp.co.uk (aardog.sle.sharp.co.uk [192.16.16.173]) by inca.sle.sharp.co.uk (8.8.8+Sun/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA11496 for ; Thu, 17 May 2001 10:09:32 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <3B039624.5000304@sharp.co.uk> Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 10:13:08 +0100 From: Graham Jones Organization: Sharp Laboratories of Europe User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; WinNT4.0; en-US; rv:0.9) Gecko/20010505 X-Accept-Language: en,pdf, ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Ovation Pro List Subject: Re: New applet - Japanese text input and kanji conversion References: <3AFFD1E6.30305@sharp.co.uk> <4a7aae4da1rod@argonet.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Mr R O Davis wrote: > I wonder if you spotted my problem that the character ze > is not converted.. is it just me? Yes I have noticed that, now that it has been pointed out. It's not just you - Ovation Pro doesn't like the '<' character in a string by itself ('<' happens to be 'ze' in the encoding used by the Wadalab fonts). I've updated the ZIP archive on the web to fix this. Of course there may be other characters which behave this way, though I haven't spotted any yet. The update also makes the applet slightly more informative if you don't have all the fonts necessary for converting JIS format text. There is also an OvProv document containing a Character table of all, I believe, the characters which can be typed in kana entry mode. I just tried to upload one of the full font sets, but there seems to be a fault in the archive so I will have to do that another day. Graham. -- http://4ozNuff.org.uk - Kanji applet for OvPro. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 17 13:17:04 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150534 for opro ; Thu, 17 May 101 13:17:01 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990091975:10:21316:107; Thu, 17 May 2001 09:32:55 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1107011; 17 May 2001 9:32 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4H9TM611508 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 17 May 2001 10:29:22 +0100 Received: from anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.91]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4H9TH511501 for ; Thu, 17 May 2001 10:29:17 +0100 Received: from omba.demon.co.uk ([158.152.58.5]) by anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 150K60-000994-0X for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 17 May 2001 10:29:25 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Jeremy C B Nicoll To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 10:28:31 +0100 Subject: Re: Paranoia Message-ID: <4a7c0178e5Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a7bc25a1aian.gooding@argonet.co.uk> References: <150464@pilling.demon.co.uk> <4a7bc25a1aian.gooding@argonet.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.01g (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On 16 May, Ian Gooding wrote: > In article <150464@pilling.demon.co.uk>, > David Pilling wrote: > > Hi, > > >Whenever I forget myself and type my address and postcode into OPro, I > > >get OPro freezing. It responds to break (thank goodness for RISC OS 4 > > >:-)), > > One might bring up the stuff about "is it an applet", try Control + > > Escape and see if that regains control. > Yep, it was an applet, as Control + Escape gave me "Script stopped" and > returned control. Thanks again for diagnostic help :-) > Interestingly, the freeze seems to be linked to my full postal address, > not just post code, then pressing return. Any way I can find out which > applet is at fault? I've got a number loaded but none ticked on the > Applets menu. This is why I suggested a while ago that DP might add to the "script-stopped" window the name of the script that was running... -- Jeremy C B Nicoll - my opinions are my own. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 17 13:17:48 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150540 for opro ; Thu, 17 May 101 13:17:46 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990095779:20:28636:71; Thu, 17 May 2001 10:36:19 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2117142; 17 May 2001 10:35 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4HAWTh11792 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 17 May 2001 11:32:29 +0100 Received: from mail11.svr.pol.co.uk (mail11.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.23]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4HAWO511789 for ; Thu, 17 May 2001 11:32:25 +0100 Received: from modem-53.dwarf-lion-fish.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.137.4.53] helo=localhost) by mail11.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 150L53-0001eO-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 17 May 2001 11:32:31 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Simon Jones To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 10:29:10 +0100 Subject: Re: 2.60 bug/niggles/suggestion Message-ID: <4a7c018823simon.jones@capelinmedia.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <150522@pilling.demon.co.uk> References: <150522@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02b (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.01b12 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R I wrote: > >Possible - I can't remember whether 2.60 was completely clean, or > >absorbed a dictionary that had been used in earlier version. and David replied: >I think it would be a dictionary from something like Spell or CrossStar Then in article <150522@pilling.demon.co.uk>, David Pilling quoted Jeremy Nicholl and wrote: > >Just checked mine and it does the same so where do I start looking? > Look for !Words directories, there will be one inside !OvnPro > unless you've moved it. > >I have not installed another dictionary so I am confused (again):-(( > So you're saying you've never installed any of those other pieces of > software mentioned above? > The dictionary supplied with OvationPro has 67578 words in it, > including "don't" - look at the Edit dictionary window to confirm if > this is yours. > It is date stamped 24 Sep 1996 and 188663 bytes long. > If you find its a bit longer than that then you've been adding words > to it, and if it is a lot longer e.g. 130K then it is from another > program. Now I /am/ confused: Although OPro (misc-spellcheck-dictionary) offers a !MainDict (containing 77647 words) and a !UserDict (contining 27 words!!), I can't find a !UserDict file ( contains just !HyphDict and !MainDict - which makes sense as DP earlier said that overwriting the !Maindict would lose all my words. The start of the file reads "Ovation Dictionary 0.00 (18-Jun-1990)" However !Opro.!Words.Dictionary.!MainDict, the one I thought I was having trouble with as it doesn't use apostrophes in can't, wouldn't etc, is date stamped 24 Sep 1996 and 188663 bytes long. Digging further, I find another !Words folder in !Boot.Resources - which starts to ring bells with a discussion sime time back, about using the same dictionary for a number of programmes. The !MainDict in there is 212k, date stamped 20 Nov 2000 and has 77647 words. However, the start of this file also reads "Ovation Dictionary 0.00 (18-Jun-1990)". So it seems both versions of !MainDict on my system originate from the same source - and the one in use has had lots of words added. What seems strange, is that the apostrophied words have mutated -especially as OPro lets you add and delete words, but not edit them! That's been a bit longwinded: I think the conclusion to my original question (without a tool to compare dictionaries, and to keep the longer list) is to simply edit the !MainDict that is in use as I find words that are not apostrophied. Thanks David et al. for your help. Cheers Simon -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 17 13:17:50 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150541 for opro ; Thu, 17 May 101 13:17:49 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990097312:20:07111:82; Thu, 17 May 2001 11:01:52 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2006678; 17 May 2001 11:01 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4HAwDl11929 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 17 May 2001 11:58:13 +0100 Received: from holyrood.ed.ac.uk (holyrood.ed.ac.uk [129.215.16.14]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4HAw9511926 for ; Thu, 17 May 2001 11:58:09 +0100 Received: from alfred.ed.ac.uk (dialup-133.publab.ed.ac.uk [129.215.38.133]) by holyrood.ed.ac.uk (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAA19445 for ; Thu, 17 May 2001 11:58:15 +0100 (BST) Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 11:58:16 +0100 (BST) From: Alf Chamings Subject: Cropped picture in ps/pdf To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Royal Infirmary of Edinburgh X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Dear All I have an OPro file containing a drawfile. Part of the drawing is cropped by reducing the size of the frame. The unwanted part of the picture includes a remnant of text from an original scanned image and this has been obscured in Draw by placing a white rectangle over the top of it. When the drawfile is imported into the OPro frame, the unwanted part is therefore obscured twice. The strange thing is that when I convert the page to pdf using either Ghostscript or RiScript, the unwanted area reappears and the text that should be over the top of it is obscured. I have sent this query to Cerilica, but having discovered that GhostScript - PS2PDF produces the same result, I wondered if the problem lay elsewhere. Any ideas? Alf -- Royal Infirmary of Edinburgh, EH3 9YW, UK tel +44 131 536 3251 fax +44 131 536 3283 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 17 13:17:52 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150542 for opro ; Thu, 17 May 101 13:17:51 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990099553:20:06254:77; Thu, 17 May 2001 11:39:13 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2006018; 17 May 2001 11:38 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4HBYe314284 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 17 May 2001 12:34:40 +0100 Received: from apollo.le.ac.uk (apollo.le.ac.uk [143.210.16.125]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4HBYa514281 for ; Thu, 17 May 2001 12:34:36 +0100 Received: from happy.star.le.ac.uk ([143.210.36.58]) by apollo.le.ac.uk with smtp (Exim 3.16 #1) id 150M3D-00024r-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 17 May 2001 12:34:39 +0100 Received: (qmail 8687 invoked from network); 17 May 2001 11:34:59 -0000 Received: from xmm4.xra.le.ac.uk (143.210.40.54) by happy.star.le.ac.uk with SMTP; 17 May 2001 11:34:59 -0000 Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 12:34:41 +0100 (BST) From: Liam Gretton Subject: Re: Cropped picture in ps/pdf To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Space Research Centre, University of Leicester, UK X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Thu 17 May, Alf Chamings wrote: > The strange thing is that when I convert the page to pdf using either > Ghostscript or RiScript, the unwanted area reappears and the text that > should be over the top of it is obscured. I assume you're checking your PDF file by viewing it on a RISC OS machine? Because of a limitiation of the drawfile format and renderer, none of the RO PDF viewers can correctly show 'clipped' regions, which is what you'll find you have in your PDF file. View it on another platform, and you'll find it looks exactly as you expect. This is a RISC OS problem - we need a newer draw module which is capable of clipping. Cerilica plan to make such a module available one day that will render files from Vantage, but I'd imagine this is a long way off yet. A workaround is to scale and crop your illustration to the frame size in draw before dropping it into OvPro; then the output PS/PDF file will not have a cropped picture. -- Liam Gretton ljg@star.le.ac.uk Space Research Centre, http://www.src.le.ac.uk/ Physics and Astronomy Dept, phone +44 (0) 116 223 1039 University of Leicester, fax +44 (0) 116 252 2464 Leicester LE1 7RH, UK http://xmm4.xra.le.ac.uk/ -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 17 13:17:57 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150544 for opro ; Thu, 17 May 101 13:17:55 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990100909:20:13522:64; Thu, 17 May 2001 12:01:49 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2107607; 17 May 2001 12:01 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4HBvHp14448 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 17 May 2001 12:57:17 +0100 Received: from inca.sle.sharp.co.uk (root@[193.114.241.3]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4HBvD514445 for ; Thu, 17 May 2001 12:57:13 +0100 Received: from sharp.co.uk (aardog.sle.sharp.co.uk [192.16.16.173]) by inca.sle.sharp.co.uk (8.8.8+Sun/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA14306 for ; Thu, 17 May 2001 12:54:03 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <3B03BCB2.8090906@sharp.co.uk> Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 12:57:38 +0100 From: Graham Jones Organization: Sharp Laboratories of Europe User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; WinNT4.0; en-US; rv:0.9) Gecko/20010505 X-Accept-Language: en,pdf, ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Cropped picture in ps/pdf References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Alf Chamings wrote: > The strange thing is that when I convert the page to pdf using either > Ghostscript or RiScript, the unwanted area reappears and the text that should > be over the top of it is obscured. An important question is to ask which viewer you are using? Ghostscript, RiScript, !PDF (old or new versions) or Acrobat? If you view the doc with Ghostscript or Acrobat and still see the hidden text then the problem would seem to be before creating the PDF doc. If the problem is just with RiScript or !PDF, then it probably is just the viewer. I wonder if the cropped white box is being optimized out of the postscript at any point? That would mean the PostScript driver was vaguely intelligent, so perhaps not. Graham. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 17 15:08:39 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150559 for opro ; Thu, 17 May 101 15:08:37 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990103400:20:28167:83; Thu, 17 May 2001 12:43:20 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2028286; 17 May 2001 12:42 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4HCXv214607 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 17 May 2001 13:33:57 +0100 Received: from mserv1d.vianw.co.uk (mserv1d.vianw.co.uk [195.102.240.96]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4HCXr514604 for ; Thu, 17 May 2001 13:33:53 +0100 Received: from [194.119.179.59] (helo=Caslon.english.co.uk) by mserv1d.vianw.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #5) id 150Myd-00045o-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 17 May 2001 13:33:59 +0100 Received: from Gill (10.0.1.1) by Caslon.english.co.uk; Thu, 17 May 2001 13:09:42 +0100 Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 13:09:31 +0100 From: David Graddol To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Cropped picture in ps/pdf Message-ID: <5036107c4a%Support@Gill.english.co.uk> In-Reply-To: X-Organization: The English Company (UK) Ltd X-Mailer: Messenger v1.41d for RISC OS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Alf Chamings wrote: > Dear All > > I have an OPro file containing a drawfile. Part of the drawing is cropped by > reducing the size of the frame. The unwanted part of the picture includes a > remnant of text from an original scanned image and this has been obscured in > Draw by placing a white rectangle over the top of it. When the drawfile is > imported into the OPro frame, the unwanted part is therefore obscured twice. > > The strange thing is that when I convert the page to pdf using either > Ghostscript or RiScript, the unwanted area reappears and the text that should > be over the top of it is obscured. > > I have sent this query to Cerilica, but having discovered that GhostScript - > PS2PDF produces the same result, I wondered if the problem lay elsewhere. > > Any ideas? Sounds like our old problem with clipping paths & Risc OS. If you create your PDF on a PC using Acrobat, then you will probably find that it all comes out OK. In other words, it is not a problem with the postscript generated by Risc OS. David -- The English Company (UK) Ltd http://www.english.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 17 15:08:45 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150560 for opro ; Thu, 17 May 101 15:08:43 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990102006:10:19996:67; Thu, 17 May 2001 12:20:06 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1018947; 17 May 2001 12:18 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4HCEMk14520 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 17 May 2001 13:14:22 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4HCEJ514517 for ; Thu, 17 May 2001 13:14:19 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 150Mfh-0006vb-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 17 May 2001 12:14:25 +0000 Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 01:51:37 GMT Message-Id: <150527@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Paranoia X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >Interestingly, the freeze seems to be linked to my full postal address, >not just post code, then pressing return. Any way I can find out which >applet is at fault? Only the hard way, involving doing a binary chop on turning applets on and off. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 17 18:10:01 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150565 for opro ; Thu, 17 May 101 18:09:58 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990108653:20:04626:65; Thu, 17 May 2001 14:10:53 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2004561; 17 May 2001 14:10 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4HE67K14997 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 17 May 2001 15:06:07 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4HE62514993 for ; Thu, 17 May 2001 15:06:02 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 150OPo-000K3r-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 17 May 2001 14:06:08 +0000 Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 13:26:22 GMT Message-Id: <150545@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: 2.60 bug/niggles/suggestion X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >I can't find a !UserDict file Inside !UserWords, which will be somewhere. (the quick way is to do F12, and then show OvationPro* to see all the paths.) >The start of the file reads "Ovation Dictionary 0.00 (18-Jun-1990)" This is the file format. Since there's only been one, it will always be the same. >I find another !Words folder in !Boot.Resources It would be a good idea to either have !Words and !UserWords in !Boot (if you want to share them) or inside !OvnPro (if you don't). And to only have one copy of each on your system. >That's been a bit longwinded: I think the conclusion to my original >question (without a tool to compare dictionaries Oh but you can... menu over the dictionary edit window will let you save the dictionary as a text file. You can then use standard text file compare tools. (of which there are many freely available). You also have the trick of merging dictionaries. Lets say you want one dictionary with all the words in. Just save one dictionary as text and drag/drop it into the edit window for the other. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 17 18:10:04 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150567 for opro ; Thu, 17 May 101 18:10:02 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990117367:10:00503:97; Thu, 17 May 2001 16:36:07 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1128096; 17 May 2001 16:35 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4HGX8W15668 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 17 May 2001 17:33:08 +0100 Received: from anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.91]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4HGX4515665 for ; Thu, 17 May 2001 17:33:04 +0100 Received: from omba.demon.co.uk ([158.152.58.5]) by anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 150Qi7-000JqC-0X for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 17 May 2001 17:33:11 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Jeremy C B Nicoll To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 17:06:34 +0100 Subject: Re: Paranoia Message-ID: <4a7c25ea12Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a7c0178e5Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> References: <150464@pilling.demon.co.uk> <4a7bc25a1aian.gooding@argonet.co.uk> <4a7c0178e5Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.01g (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R On 17 May, Jeremy C B Nicoll wrote: > This is why I suggested a while ago that DP might add to the > "script-stopped" window the name of the script that was running... (assuming that at the point where the script interpreter loads a script and starts to run it, it remembers its name - I suspect if one script calls/uses another etc that this might not be totally trivial) -- Jeremy C B Nicoll - my opinions are my own. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 17 18:10:05 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150568 for opro ; Thu, 17 May 101 18:10:02 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990109435:20:23267:66; Thu, 17 May 2001 14:23:55 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2122143; 17 May 2001 14:23 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4HEIeS15080 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 17 May 2001 15:18:40 +0100 Received: from cmailg7.svr.pol.co.uk (cmailg7.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.195.177]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4HEIX515075 for ; Thu, 17 May 2001 15:18:34 +0100 Received: from modem-220.iodine.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.44.220] helo=beeston12) by cmailg7.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 150Obw-0006HI-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 17 May 2001 15:18:40 +0100 Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 15:00:54 +0100 From: Robin Phillips To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Differing dictionaries Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <150494@pilling.demon.co.uk> X-Organization: home X-Mailer: Messenger v1.41d for RISC OS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.64b User-Agent: POPstar/2.03 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In message <150494@pilling.demon.co.uk> opro@pilling.demon.co.uk (David Pilling) wrote: > > Hi, > > >That - prhaps - implies that the other dictionaries are better than the > >OP one. > > Bigger yes, better perhaps not. > > >Is there some central location one can install the biggest dictionaries > > Yes, !Words. > > >and indeed any number of specific user ones > > !UserWords > > (note different place to !Words for those on a network) > > >your applications have access to the same set of dictionaries? That's > >presuming that they all work the same way... > > Well all 'mine' do. CrossStar, Ovation, Ovation Pro, Spell, Web Spell (anything > that uses the Spell module), Word Square. Thus discussion of dictionaries reminds me of the fact that whenever I am using Zap to write an e-mail it is using a different (and distinctly more primitive!) dictionary from the one in OvationPro. I do not know how (in Zap) to add words to its dictionary or alter them. I have a machine used by several members of the family, and it may be that some of them spell differently! I suspect the best arrangement might be for us to fix things so that Zap used the same dictionary as OvationPro, and we could easily add or alter words when using OvationPro and nothing else. How do I fix that? Best wishes, Robin. -- Robin Phillips, 1, Newcastle Avenue, Beeston, Notts., NG9 1BT; Phone: +44 (0)115 922 4930 E-mail: rphillips@beeston12.freeserve.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 17 19:05:48 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150577 for opro ; Thu, 17 May 101 19:05:45 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990120469:20:05083:74; Thu, 17 May 2001 17:27:49 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2121143; 17 May 2001 17:27 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4HHPEC15971 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 17 May 2001 18:25:14 +0100 Received: from mta05-svc.ntlworld.com (mta05-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.45]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4HHPA515968 for ; Thu, 17 May 2001 18:25:10 +0100 Received: from mcqueen ([62.252.168.183]) by mta05-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.27 201-229-119-110) with SMTP id <20010517172518.UAOB272.mta05-svc.ntlworld.com@mcqueen> for ; Thu, 17 May 2001 18:25:18 +0100 Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 18:25:32 +0100 From: Colin McQueen To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: 2.60 bug/niggles/suggestion Message-ID: References: <150389@pilling.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: X-Organization: The McQueen Family User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.10 (MsgServe/1.10) (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R In message Peter Prewett wrote: > > > >4) Dictionary: the dictionary supplied with OPro dislikes words such as > > >won't, don't etc > > > > Oh no it doesn't. I think you've got another dictionary installed there. > > (probably from one of my other products, so I'm still guilty) > > > Just checked mine and it does the same so where do I start looking? > mine too. If I use don't then it says its wrong and offeres dont If I use don`t then it says no errors Is this the problem? -- Colin McQueen : Using an Acorn StrongARM Risc PC Web Domain : http://www.mcqueen.uk.net/ BSc Zoology + Oceanography : PGCE : MSc in CBL/T -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 17 19:05:51 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150578 for opro ; Thu, 17 May 101 19:05:49 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990120630:10:06657:68; Thu, 17 May 2001 17:30:30 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1120056; 17 May 2001 17:30 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4HHRu016005 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 17 May 2001 18:27:56 +0100 Received: from mta05-svc.ntlworld.com (mta05-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.45]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4HHRp516002 for ; Thu, 17 May 2001 18:27:51 +0100 Received: from mcqueen ([62.252.168.183]) by mta05-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.27 201-229-119-110) with SMTP id <20010517172759.UBYA272.mta05-svc.ntlworld.com@mcqueen> for ; Thu, 17 May 2001 18:27:59 +0100 Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 18:28:24 +0100 From: Colin McQueen To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: RTF files Message-ID: <06682d7c4a.cmcqueen@cmcqueen.ntlworld.com> References: <4a7b2778f2charles.hope@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a7b2778f2charles.hope@argonet.co.uk> X-Organization: The McQueen Family User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.10 (MsgServe/1.10) (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R In message <4a7b2778f2charles.hope@argonet.co.uk> "charles.hope" wrote: > On 15 May, Mijas Software wrote: > > On Mon 14 May 2001 (17:38:10 +0100), charles.hope@argonet.co.uk wrote: > > > I think you're looking at this the wrong way round. I'm trying to > > > import (RTF) into Ov Pro, not from it. > > > > > You can import a single RTF (text) document into OPro by dropping the > > rtf file (suitably typed) onto the OPro icon bar icon, that is assuming > > you have the RTF import applet loaded. > > > If you want to add the contents of an RTF file to an existing > > document, you need to import the rtf into a new document and then copy > > into your existing document. > > That is what happens if the RTF document come from Word via a PC, but if I > export it from Easiwriter as RTF, I can drop it straight into an existing > document. > > My query was why the difference> > Does EW and OP use the clipboard or RAM transfer that may be different to loading from file?? Assuming you DO mean directly for EW>OP. -- Colin McQueen : Using an Acorn StrongARM Risc PC Web Domain : http://www.mcqueen.uk.net/ BSc Zoology + Oceanography : PGCE : MSc in CBL/T -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 17 19:51:32 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150583 for opro ; Thu, 17 May 101 19:51:30 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990123004:20:20816:67; Thu, 17 May 2001 18:10:04 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2020591; 17 May 2001 18:09 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4HI3E016209 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 17 May 2001 19:03:14 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4HI3A516206 for ; Thu, 17 May 2001 19:03:10 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 150S7J-000J0G-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 17 May 2001 18:03:17 +0000 Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 18:12:56 GMT Message-Id: <150572@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Paranoia X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >(assuming that at the point where the script interpreter loads a script >and starts to run it, it remembers its name it does not. > - I suspect if one script calls/uses another etc which they often do. >that this might not be totally trivial) which is why I've not done it. It's a good idea, but it is non-trivial. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 17 19:51:32 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150584 for opro ; Thu, 17 May 101 19:51:30 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990123324:10:01478:73; Thu, 17 May 2001 18:15:24 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1116184; 17 May 2001 18:14 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4HI9g816246 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 17 May 2001 19:09:42 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4HI9c516239 for ; Thu, 17 May 2001 19:09:38 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 150SDZ-000JNs-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 17 May 2001 18:09:45 +0000 Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 19:08:25 GMT Message-Id: <150579@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: 2.60 bug/niggles/suggestion X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >If I use don't then it says its wrong and offeres dont >If I use don`t then it says no errors Nice try, but sexy single quotes are not the problem, on my copy (with the genuine OPro dictionary) don't and don t check OK. I would guess ` is taken as splitting words, so it checks 'don' and 't' don is in the dictionary, and 't' will be accepted as long as the min check length is greater than 1. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 17 19:51:36 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150585 for opro ; Thu, 17 May 101 19:51:33 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990123274:20:02580:70; Thu, 17 May 2001 18:14:34 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2107766; 17 May 2001 18:14 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4HI9i716247 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 17 May 2001 19:09:44 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4HI9d516243 for ; Thu, 17 May 2001 19:09:39 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 150SDa-000JNs-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 17 May 2001 18:09:47 +0000 Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 19:11:02 GMT Message-Id: <150581@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: RTF files X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro I don't know if this is right, but my feeling is that there are two types of RTF file - sort of text and documents. That explains why some load one way and others another. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 17 21:37:12 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150587 for opro ; Thu, 17 May 101 21:37:09 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990126292:20:06653:73; Thu, 17 May 2001 19:04:52 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2006531; 17 May 2001 19:04 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4HJ1Sc16631 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 17 May 2001 20:01:28 +0100 Received: from mail6.svr.pol.co.uk (mail6.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.212]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4HJ1O516628 for ; Thu, 17 May 2001 20:01:24 +0100 Received: from modem-36.radon.dialup.pol.co.uk ([62.136.62.164] helo=kerslakej2.freeserve.co.uk) by mail6.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.13 #0) id 150T1b-0000Gr-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 17 May 2001 20:01:29 +0100 Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 19:33:19 +0100 (BST) From: John Percy Kerslake Subject: Re: Differing dictionaries To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Organisation name, location. Telephone/Fax? X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Thu 17 May, Robin Phillips wrote: > In message <150494@pilling.demon.co.uk> > opro@pilling.demon.co.uk (David Pilling) wrote: > > > > > Hi, > > > > >That - prhaps - implies that the other dictionaries are better than the > > >OP one. > > > > Bigger yes, better perhaps not. > > > > >Is there some central location one can install the biggest dictionaries > > > > Yes, !Words. > > > > >and indeed any number of specific user ones > > > > !UserWords > > > > (note different place to !Words for those on a network) > > > > >your applications have access to the same set of dictionaries? That's > > >presuming that they all work the same way... > > > > Well all 'mine' do. CrossStar, Ovation, Ovation Pro, Spell, Web Spell (anything > > that uses the Spell module), Word Square. > > Thus discussion of dictionaries reminds me of the fact that whenever I am > using Zap to write an e-mail it is using a different (and distinctly more > primitive!) dictionary from the one in OvationPro. > > I do not know how (in Zap) to add words to its dictionary or alter them. I > have a machine used by several members of the family, and it may be that some > of them spell differently! I suspect the best arrangement might be for us to > fix things so that Zap used the same dictionary as OvationPro, and we could > easily add or alter words when using OvationPro and nothing else. How do I > fix that? Good luck i cannot get ZapSpell to rember where its user dic is. After every shutdown it defalts back to not having one. yes I have put the User Dic into Zapspell.dictionary. -- J.P. Kerslake B.Sc., F.B.I.S. Pager 07626 - 235878 e-mail address:- Work = kerslake@sees.bangor.ac.uk Home = johnpercy@kerslakej2.freeserve.co.uk, Dyslexia Rules KO. RiscStation 64 meg 50 ns RAM. 9G HD, Ant INS. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Thu May 17 21:37:14 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150588 for opro ; Thu, 17 May 101 21:37:13 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990126301:20:07271:64; Thu, 17 May 2001 19:05:01 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2007157; 17 May 2001 19:04 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4HJ22t16638 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 17 May 2001 20:02:02 +0100 Received: from anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.91]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4HJ1x516635 for ; Thu, 17 May 2001 20:01:59 +0100 Received: from omba.demon.co.uk ([158.152.58.5]) by anchor-post-33.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 150T2E-0008VR-0X for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Thu, 17 May 2001 20:02:06 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Jeremy C B Nicoll To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 20:02:17 +0100 Subject: Re: Paranoia Message-ID: <4a7c360051Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <150572@pilling.demon.co.uk> References: <150572@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.01g (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On 17 May, David Pilling wrote: > >(assuming that at the point where the script interpreter loads a script > >and starts to run it, it remembers its name > it does not. No but it wouldn't be hard to have it stack that name, and presumably pop the stack whenever a script exited. Presumably error windows could then display the most recently called script's name, and perhaps also list the stack contents to show the order in which successive scripts were called. -- Jeremy C B Nicoll - my opinions are my own. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 18 01:26:13 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150601 for opro ; Fri, 18 May 101 01:26:11 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990143997:20:21252:64; Thu, 17 May 2001 23:59:57 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2109445; 17 May 2001 23:59 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4HNuA017775 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 18 May 2001 00:56:10 +0100 Received: from rhenium (rhenium.btinternet.com [194.73.73.93]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4HNu6517771 for ; Fri, 18 May 2001 00:56:06 +0100 Received: from [213.122.134.140] (helo=host213-122-134-140) by rhenium with smtp (Exim 3.03 #83) id 150Xcq-0003PF-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Fri, 18 May 2001 00:56:13 +0100 Date: Fri, 18 May 2001 00:28:20 +0100 From: Brian Howlett To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: 2.60 bug/niggles/suggestion Message-ID: <265c4e7c4a.Brian@Brian_Howlett.btinternet.com> References: <150579@pilling.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <150579@pilling.demon.co.uk> X-Organization: The Terry Wogan Home for the Bewildered User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.11 (MsgServe/1.11) (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 X-Computer: Acorn RiscPC SA-110 X-no-markup: yes X-Editor: Zap 1.43 (29 Oct 1999) ds-11, ZapEmail 0.24 (26 Aug 1999) patch-9 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro 'Twas on the 17 May 2001, a day I'll always remember, that David Pilling said : > >> If I use don't then it says its wrong and offeres dont If I use don`t >> then it says no errors > > Nice try, but sexy single quotes are not the problem, on my copy (with > the genuine OPro dictionary) don't and don t check OK. > > I would guess ` is taken as splitting words, so it checks 'don' and > 't' don is in the dictionary, and 't' will be accepted as long as the > min check length is greater than 1. > I've followed the instructions further up the thread and merged the dictionary that came with MPro and the one I have from OPro, and the merged dictionary now lives in !Words in !Boot.Resources, with the result that both programs use the same version, which correctly understands don't, won't, can't etc. -- Brian Howlett ---------------------------------------------- All electronic components run on smoke. If you let the smoke out, they stop working... -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 18 01:26:16 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150602 for opro ; Fri, 18 May 101 01:26:14 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990134230:10:01096:66; Thu, 17 May 2001 21:17:10 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1001077; 17 May 2001 21:17 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4HLEqH17282 for ovationpro-list; Thu, 17 May 2001 22:14:52 +0100 Received: from pandora.chariot.net.au (mail.chariot.net.au [203.30.236.84]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4HLEj517279 for ; Thu, 17 May 2001 22:14:46 +0100 Received: from localhost.com (ppp-197.cust210-9-26.ghr.chariot.net.au [210.9.26.197]) by pandora.chariot.net.au (8.11.1/8.10.0) with SMTP id f4HLEov05625 for ; Fri, 18 May 2001 06:44:50 +0930 Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 16:03:03 +0830 From: Peter Prewett To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: 2.60 bug/niggles/suggestion Message-ID: References: <150522@pilling.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <150522@pilling.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.50 (MsgServe/1.50) (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.03 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R In message <150522@pilling.demon.co.uk> you wrote: > > >Just checked mine and it does the same so where do I start looking? > > Look for !Words directories, there will be one inside !OvnPro > unless you've moved it. > > >I have not installed another dictionary so I am confused (again):-(( > > So you're saying you've never installed any of those other pieces of > software mentioned above? > > The dictionary supplied with OvationPro has 67578 words in it, > including "don't" - look at the Edit dictionary window to confirm if > this is yours. > > It is date stamped 24 Sep 1996 and 188663 bytes long. > > If you find its a bit longer than that then you've been adding words to it, > and if it is a lot longer e.g. 130K then it is from another program. > Could the trouble be that Messenger Pro requires their !Words dir to be put into ADFS::Hard.$.!Boot.Resources.!Words I have just had a look at the one in !Resources and it is an Ovation of 216k. I thought it came from RComp had a look at the latest release of Messenger and that words dictionary says it is Spell dated 1990 I now have 3 !Words on my system!! as I have Spell as well. I think it would be good if one could have a definitive one which every SW house uses as I am now totally confused (which is not unusual) in knowing which one is being used. Peter -- Peter Prewett, Coromandel Valley, South Australia -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 18 13:47:56 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150611 for opro ; Fri, 18 May 101 13:47:54 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990146921:10:17931:65; Fri, 18 May 2001 00:48:41 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1101709; 18 May 2001 0:47 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4I0jU317985 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 18 May 2001 01:45:30 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4I0jR517982 for ; Fri, 18 May 2001 01:45:27 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 150YOc-0000O3-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Fri, 18 May 2001 00:45:34 +0000 Date: Fri, 18 May 2001 01:37:28 GMT Message-Id: <150607@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: 2.60 bug/niggles/suggestion X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro >Could the trouble be that Messenger Pro requires their !Words dir to be >put into ADFS::Hard.$.!Boot.Resources.!Words Perhaps in the sense that the first !Words seen is likely to take precedence. >I now have 3 !Words on my system!! Yes but only by your choice. If you only want one (which would be a good idea) all you have to do is arrange for there to be just one. To put it another way Messenger, Spell, Ovation Pro all use the same format dictionaries in the same !Words directory. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 18 13:48:00 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150613 for opro ; Fri, 18 May 101 13:47:58 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990171247:10:16639:64; Fri, 18 May 2001 07:34:07 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1015606; 18 May 2001 7:32 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4I7V7419116 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 18 May 2001 08:31:07 +0100 Received: from snowstorm.mail.pipex.net (snowstorm.mail.pipex.net [158.43.192.97]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id f4I7V4519113 for ; Fri, 18 May 2001 08:31:04 +0100 Received: (qmail 25485 invoked from network); 18 May 2001 07:31:10 -0000 Received: from userbh55.uk.uudial.com (HELO RiscPC) (62.188.143.20) by smtp-5.dial.pipex.com with SMTP; 18 May 2001 07:31:10 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Steven Pampling To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Fri, 18 May 2001 07:47:43 +0100 Subject: Re: Paranoia Message-ID: <4a7c7695d9steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a7c360051Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> References: <150572@pilling.demon.co.uk> <4a7c360051Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.02e (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In article <4a7c360051Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk>, Jeremy C B Nicoll wrote: > No but it wouldn't be hard to have it stack that name, and presumably pop > the stack whenever a script exited. Presumably error windows could then > display the most recently called script's name, and perhaps also list the > stack contents to show the order in which successive scripts were called. Set a variable as the script starts, unset it as it completes. List order of scripts run?? Er, use !SysLog??? -- Steve Pampling -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 18 13:48:02 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150614 for opro ; Fri, 18 May 101 13:47:59 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990168366:20:17865:65; Fri, 18 May 2001 06:46:06 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2124461; 18 May 2001 6:45 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4I6hPG18922 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 18 May 2001 07:43:25 +0100 Received: from kx1-gui.server.which.net (kx1-gui.server.which.net [194.168.97.11]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4I6hL518919 for ; Fri, 18 May 2001 07:43:21 +0100 Received: from waddell.which.net ([213.105.52.1]) by kx1-gui.server.which.net (InterMail vK.4.03.02.00 201-232-124 license e70b2acfbd69d84cc925654164bd8fad) with SMTP id <20010518064329.GTZO24141.kx1-gui@waddell.which.net> for ; Fri, 18 May 2001 07:43:29 +0100 Date: Mon, 14 May 2001 11:19:49 +0100 (BST) From: John Waddell Subject: Re: hard spaces (was Re: two separate questions...) To: Ovation mail list In-Reply-To: <3AFFAA1A.396ECA6@sharp.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Is there not the protocol that units should be in lower case? If not, it might be a good idea? 30ohm. On Mon 14 May, Graham Jones wrote: > Barry Gray wrote: > > I was always taught (and I myself teach) that in SI there is no space > > between the quantity and the unit, for example 9m not 9 m, although of > > course nine metres but not usually 9 metres and never nine m. > > There are some situations where it can be confusing if there is not a space > between the value and the unit. I was recently typing a resistance of thirty > ohms (30Ohm) and decided that in this case 30 Ohm was much better. > -- John Waddell, Langbank, Renfrewshire -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 18 13:48:06 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150616 for opro ; Fri, 18 May 101 13:48:04 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990174025:20:22315:64; Fri, 18 May 2001 08:20:25 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2020512; 18 May 2001 8:18 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4I8FcO19350 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 18 May 2001 09:15:38 +0100 Received: from holyrood.ed.ac.uk (holyrood.ed.ac.uk [129.215.16.14]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4I8FX519343 for ; Fri, 18 May 2001 09:15:33 +0100 Received: from alfred.ed.ac.uk (dialup-133.publab.ed.ac.uk [129.215.38.133]) by holyrood.ed.ac.uk (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAA00551 for ; Fri, 18 May 2001 09:15:34 +0100 (BST) Date: Fri, 18 May 2001 09:17:39 +0100 (BST) From: Alf Chamings Subject: Re: Cropped picture in ps/pdf To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk In-Reply-To: <5036107c4a%Support@Gill.english.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Royal Infirmary of Edinburgh X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Thu 17 May, David Graddol wrote: > Sounds like our old problem with clipping paths & Risc OS. If you > create your PDF on a PC using Acrobat, then you will probably > find that it all comes out OK. In other words, it is not a > problem with the postscript generated by Risc OS. > Acrobat I have only in the reader form. I am not sure it would have cured the problem because the PS file still showed the problem (or not) depending on whether I viewed it in Riscript or GView. Don't suppose I'll buy Acrobat Distiller to find out! Alf -- Royal Infirmary of Edinburgh, EH3 9YW, UK tel +44 131 536 3251 fax +44 131 536 3283 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 18 13:48:07 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150615 for opro ; Fri, 18 May 101 13:48:03 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990173996:10:07414:71; Fri, 18 May 2001 08:19:56 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1006525; 18 May 2001 8:18 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4I8Fgu19351 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 18 May 2001 09:15:42 +0100 Received: from holyrood.ed.ac.uk (holyrood.ed.ac.uk [129.215.16.14]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4I8FZ519347 for ; Fri, 18 May 2001 09:15:35 +0100 Received: from alfred.ed.ac.uk (dialup-133.publab.ed.ac.uk [129.215.38.133]) by holyrood.ed.ac.uk (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAA00603 for ; Fri, 18 May 2001 09:15:41 +0100 (BST) Date: Fri, 18 May 2001 09:14:21 +0100 (BST) From: Alf Chamings Subject: Re: Cropped picture in ps/pdf To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Royal Infirmary of Edinburgh X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Thu 17 May, Liam Gretton wrote: > > A workaround is to scale and crop your illustration to the frame size in > draw before dropping it into OvPro; then the output PS/PDF file will not > have a cropped picture. > See also reply to Graham Jones comments. I tried this but when I went back to this rather old Draw file I remembered it had been produced by touching up an original sprite from a scanned image. The bits I didn't want were part of the sprite so I couldn't just select them out. Alf -- Royal Infirmary of Edinburgh, EH3 9YW, UK tel +44 131 536 3251 fax +44 131 536 3283 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 18 13:48:10 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150617 for opro ; Fri, 18 May 101 13:48:07 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990174252:20:27408:95; Fri, 18 May 2001 08:24:12 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2027598; 18 May 2001 8:23 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4I8FPs19341 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 18 May 2001 09:15:25 +0100 Received: from holyrood.ed.ac.uk (holyrood.ed.ac.uk [129.215.16.14]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4I8FL519338 for ; Fri, 18 May 2001 09:15:21 +0100 Received: from alfred.ed.ac.uk (dialup-133.publab.ed.ac.uk [129.215.38.133]) by holyrood.ed.ac.uk (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAA00522 for ; Fri, 18 May 2001 09:15:26 +0100 (BST) Date: Fri, 18 May 2001 09:11:27 +0100 (BST) From: Alf Chamings Subject: Re: Cropped picture in ps/pdf To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk In-Reply-To: <3B03BCB2.8090906@sharp.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-Organization: Royal Infirmary of Edinburgh X-Mailer: ANT RISCOS Marcel [ver 1.53] Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On Thu 17 May, Graham Jones wrote: > Alf Chamings wrote: > > > The strange thing is that when I convert the page to pdf using either > > Ghostscript or RiScript, the unwanted area reappears and the text that > > should be over the top of it is obscured. > > > An important question is to ask which viewer you are using? Ghostscript, > RiScript, !PDF (old or new versions) or Acrobat? > > If you view the doc with Ghostscript or Acrobat and still see the hidden > text then the problem would seem to be before creating the PDF doc. If the > problem is just with RiScript or !PDF, then it probably is just the viewer. > > I wonder if the cropped white box is being optimized out of the postscript > at any point? That would mean the PostScript driver was vaguely > intelligent, so perhaps not. > Thanks. Following yours and Liam's suggestions, I have experimented some more. First I had a reply from Nicholas van der Hoff at Cerilica who pointed me towards the clipping problem. I tried taking the text that should have been infront of the picture and putting it into carefully positioned new text frames around the picture. This worked. I have also tried viewing the PDF file from RiScript (the one with the problems) and viewing it on Acrobat Reader. This produced the same result. Looking at the PS file (output from OvPro) in GView did not show the problem, but loading the same PS into Riscript did show it. Alf -- Royal Infirmary of Edinburgh, EH3 9YW, UK tel +44 131 536 3251 fax +44 131 536 3283 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 18 13:48:19 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150619 for opro ; Fri, 18 May 101 13:48:17 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990178513:20:20265:65; Fri, 18 May 2001 09:35:13 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2110508; 18 May 2001 9:34 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4I9Wkt19811 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 18 May 2001 10:32:46 +0100 Received: from anchor-post-31.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-31.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.89]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4I9Wg519808 for ; Fri, 18 May 2001 10:32:42 +0100 Received: from mk-net.demon.co.uk ([194.222.12.18] helo=Tonys) by anchor-post-31.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #1) id 150gcr-000Hou-0V for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Fri, 18 May 2001 10:32:49 +0100 Date: Fri, 18 May 2001 10:30:21 +0100 From: Tony van der Hoff To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Cropped picture in ps/pdf Message-ID: References: In-Reply-To: X-Organization: CCC User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.10d (MsgServe/1.10) (RISC-OS/4.02) POPstar/2.02 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro On 18 May 2001, Alf Chamings wrote: [snip] > First I had a reply from Nicholas van der Hoff at Cerilica van der Walle. -- Tony van der Hoff | MailTo:tony@mk-net.demon.co.uk | MailTo:avanderhoff@iee.org Buckinghamshire, England | http:mk-net.demon.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 18 13:48:22 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150620 for opro ; Fri, 18 May 101 13:48:20 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990184134:20:28490:87; Fri, 18 May 2001 11:08:54 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2121631; 18 May 2001 11:08 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4IB5R420165 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 18 May 2001 12:05:27 +0100 Received: from mserv1d.vianw.co.uk (mserv1d.vianw.co.uk [195.102.240.96]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4IB5M520160 for ; Fri, 18 May 2001 12:05:22 +0100 Received: from [194.119.179.59] (helo=Caslon.english.co.uk) by mserv1d.vianw.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #5) id 150i4W-0004gP-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Fri, 18 May 2001 12:05:28 +0100 Received: from Gill (10.0.1.1) by Caslon.english.co.uk; Fri, 18 May 2001 12:04:04 +0100 Date: Fri, 18 May 2001 12:03:56 +0100 From: David Graddol To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Cropped picture in ps/pdf Message-ID: <22b8e7c4a%Support@Gill.english.co.uk> In-Reply-To: X-Organization: The English Company (UK) Ltd X-Mailer: Messenger v1.41d for RISC OS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Alf Chamings wrote: > On Thu 17 May, David Graddol wrote: > > > Sounds like our old problem with clipping paths & Risc OS. If you > > create your PDF on a PC using Acrobat, then you will probably > > find that it all comes out OK. In other words, it is not a > > problem with the postscript generated by Risc OS. > > > Acrobat I have only in the reader form. I am not sure it would have cured the > problem because the PS file still showed the problem (or not) depending on > whether I viewed it in Riscript or GView. > The problem is not with the Postscript. The problem is whether clipping paths specified in the postscript are honoured by the software producing or viewing the PDF. RiScript doesn't handle clipping paths so artwork will look wrong regardless of whether the PDF was produced on a RISC OS platform or not. I can't now remember whether Ghostscript produces OK PDFs or not. (Remember that they will look wrong when viewed in RiScript but do they look wrong when viewed in Acrobat?) David -- The English Company (UK) Ltd http://www.english.co.uk -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 18 14:43:02 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150623 for opro ; Fri, 18 May 101 14:43:00 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990190452:10:19265:238; Fri, 18 May 2001 12:54:12 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id ab1106085; 18 May 2001 12:53 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4ICps320565 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 18 May 2001 13:51:54 +0100 Received: from inca.sle.sharp.co.uk (root@[193.114.241.3]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4ICpo520562 for ; Fri, 18 May 2001 13:51:50 +0100 Received: from sharp.co.uk (aardog.sle.sharp.co.uk [192.16.16.173]) by inca.sle.sharp.co.uk (8.8.8+Sun/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA00080 for ; Fri, 18 May 2001 13:48:41 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <3B051B02.5000108@sharp.co.uk> Date: Fri, 18 May 2001 13:52:18 +0100 From: Graham Jones Organization: Sharp Laboratories of Europe User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; WinNT4.0; en-US; rv:0.9) Gecko/20010505 X-Accept-Language: en,pdf, ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Cropped picture in ps/pdf References: <22b8e7c4a%Support@Gill.english.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro David Graddol wrote: > I can't now remember whether Ghostscript produces OK PDFs or not. > (Remember that they will look wrong when viewed in RiScript but > do they look wrong when viewed in Acrobat?) All my experience shows that good PDF's are produced. Ghostscript does nothing special for RISC OS when handling postscript, and Postscript is Postscript whether produced on RISC OS or some other OS. It copes with PC produced PS files, so there is no reason RISC OS files should not convert correctly. PDF files from Ghostscript look fine in Acrobat, PDF+ on my Psion5, and when converted to some other format by Ghostscript itself. Graham. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 18 14:43:04 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150624 for opro ; Fri, 18 May 101 14:43:03 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990190668:10:26079:110; Fri, 18 May 2001 12:57:48 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1115300; 18 May 2001 12:57 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4ICtjJ20605 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 18 May 2001 13:55:45 +0100 Received: from apollo.le.ac.uk (apollo.le.ac.uk [143.210.16.125]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4ICtf520602 for ; Fri, 18 May 2001 13:55:41 +0100 Received: from happy.star.le.ac.uk ([143.210.36.58]) by apollo.le.ac.uk with smtp (Exim 3.16 #1) id 150jnI-0002k3-00 for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Fri, 18 May 2001 13:55:48 +0100 Received: (qmail 24057 invoked from network); 18 May 2001 12:56:10 -0000 Received: from ltsun0.star.le.ac.uk (HELO ltsun0) (143.210.36.50) by happy.star.le.ac.uk with SMTP; 18 May 2001 12:56:10 -0000 Date: Fri, 18 May 2001 13:56:10 +0100 (BST) From: Liam Gretton X-Sender: ljg@ltsun0 To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Cropped picture in ps/pdf In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R On Fri, 18 May 2001, Alf Chamings wrote: > Acrobat I have only in the reader form. I am not sure it would have cured the > problem because the PS file still showed the problem (or not) depending on > whether I viewed it in Riscript or GView. GView probably clips ok, as it's rendering to a sprite on RISC OS and so can use masks where necessary. -- Liam Gretton ljg@star.le.ac.uk Space Research Centre, http://www.src.le.ac.uk/ Physics and Astronomy Dept, phone +44 (0) 116 223 1039 University of Leicester, fax +44 (0) 116 252 2464 Leicester LE1 7RH, UK http://xmm4.xra.le.ac.uk/ -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 18 21:47:18 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150658 for opro ; Fri, 18 May 101 21:47:16 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990204617:20:11731:100; Fri, 18 May 2001 16:50:17 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2010576; 18 May 2001 16:49 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4IGknD21644 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 18 May 2001 17:46:49 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4IGkj521641 for ; Fri, 18 May 2001 17:46:45 +0100 Received: from pilling.demon.co.uk ([158.152.9.39]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 150nOv-000PcV-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Fri, 18 May 2001 16:46:53 +0000 Date: Fri, 18 May 2001 14:54:38 GMT Message-Id: <150628@pilling.demon.co.uk> From:(David Pilling) To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: Cropped picture in ps/pdf X-Mailer: ArcBM 1.11 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Presumeably the point is that GhostScript does do irregular clipping correctly, so any raster that comes out of it (whether it supports masks or not), e.g. the sprites displayed by the GView front end will be OK. David Pilling -- email: david@pilling.demon.co.uk web: http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/pilling web: http://www.pilling.demon.co.uk post: David Pilling, P.O. Box 22, Thornton Cleveleys, Blackpool. FY5 1LR. UK. fax: +44(0)870-0520-941 -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 18 21:47:37 2001 Received: from punt-11.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150666 for opro ; Fri, 18 May 101 21:47:35 GMT Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990211734:10:16009:72; Fri, 18 May 2001 18:48:54 GMT Received: from [194.82.200.3] ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1111922; 18 May 2001 18:48 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4IIG6c22119 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 18 May 2001 19:16:06 +0100 Received: from mta06-svc.ntlworld.com (mta06-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.46]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4IIG2522116 for ; Fri, 18 May 2001 19:16:02 +0100 Received: from riscpc.at.home ([213.107.105.170]) by mta06-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.02.27 201-229-119-110) with SMTP id <20010518181607.BHTG285.mta06-svc.ntlworld.com@riscpc.at.home> for ; Fri, 18 May 2001 19:16:07 +0100 Date: Fri, 18 May 2001 19:15:34 +0100 From: John Pettigrew To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: hard spaces (was Re: two separate questions...) Message-ID: <668fb57c4a.john@xl-cambridge.com> References: In-Reply-To: X-Organization: XL Cambridge User-Agent: Messenger-Pro/2.10d (MsgServe/1.10) (RISC-OS/4.02) X-Editor: Zap, using ZapEmail 0.22 (27 Nov 1998) patch-3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In a previous message, John Waddell wrote: > Is there not the protocol that units should be in lower case? If not, it > might be a good idea? 30ohm. No - depends on the unit. For example, the unit of magnetic field strength, the Tesla, is abbreviated to T, and there are many more examples. It's not that simple, I'm afraid. Besides, if it was then we'd only be able to have 26 different units, one for each letter of the alphabet. Re spaces - I was wondering what people do when units are combined as in "3 kg m^-3"? I'd say that could be very confusing to leave the spaces out ("3kgm^-3" could be read as "three per kilogramme cubed" because kgm is occasionally used as an abbreviation for kilogramme), and seems inconsistent (and would look odd) as "3kg m^-3". John -- John Pettigrew XL Cambridge - Contract and freelance editing and writing Life sciences specialist - molecular biology, genetics, biotechnology john@xl-cambridge.com http://www.xl-cambridge.com/ -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 18 21:48:01 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150675 for opro ; Fri, 18 May 101 21:48:00 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990215158:20:14848:279; Fri, 18 May 2001 19:45:58 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2015160; 18 May 2001 19:37 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4IJa1R22453 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 18 May 2001 20:36:01 +0100 Received: from tele-post-20.mail.demon.net (tele-post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.20]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4IJZv522450 for ; Fri, 18 May 2001 20:35:57 +0100 Received: from omba.demon.co.uk ([158.152.58.5]) by tele-post-20.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 2.12 #2) id 150q2b-0008pX-0K for ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk; Fri, 18 May 2001 19:36:02 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Jeremy C B Nicoll To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Date: Fri, 18 May 2001 20:34:58 +0100 Subject: Re: Paranoia Message-ID: <4a7cbcd459Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <4a7c7695d9steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> References: <150572@pilling.demon.co.uk> <4a7c360051Jeremy@omba.demon.co.uk> <4a7c7695d9steve.pampling@argonet.co.uk> User-Agent: Pluto/2.01g (RISC-OS/3.70) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro Status: R On 18 May, Steven Pampling wrote: > Set a variable as the script starts, unset it as it completes. > List order of scripts run?? Er, use !SysLog??? What is !Syslog? Where does one get it? -- Jeremy C B Nicoll - my opinions are my own. -- To unsubscribe from this list, email majordomo@lists.barnet.ac.uk with the words UNSUBSCRIBE ovationpro in the body of the message From owner-ovationpro@omega.barnet.ac.uk Fri May 18 21:48:04 2001 Received: from punt-21.mail.demon.net by pilling.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA150676 for opro ; Fri, 18 May 101 21:48:02 GMT Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for opro@pilling.demon.co.uk id 990217301:20:08718:93; Fri, 18 May 2001 20:21:41 GMT Received: from omega.barnet.ac.uk ([194.82.200.3]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id ab2125384; 18 May 2001 20:19 GMT Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) id f4IK5CZ22597 for ovationpro-list; Fri, 18 May 2001 21:05:12 +0100 Received: from blueyonder.co.uk (pcow025o.blueyonder.co.uk [195.188.53.125]) by omega.barnet.ac.uk (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f4IK59522594 for ; Fri, 18 May 2001 21:05:09 +0100 Received: from goatly ([213.48.145.72]) by blueyonder.co.uk with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.687.68); Fri, 18 May 2001 20:44:25 +0100 Date: Fri, 18 May 2001 20:39:22 +0100 From: Bruce Goatly To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Subject: Re: hard spaces (was Re: two separate questions...) Message-ID: <9a3bbd7c4a%ovation@goatly.demon.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <668fb57c4a.john@xl-cambridge.com> X-Organization: Perfect Page X-Mailer: Messenger v1.41d for RISC OS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Posting-Agent: RISC OS Newsbase 0.61b User-Agent: POPstar/2.01b12 Sender: owner-ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ovationpro@lists.barnet.ac.uk X-maillist: ovationpro In message <668fb57c4a.john@xl-cambridge.com> John Pettigrew wrote: > Re spaces - I was wondering what people do when units are combined as in > "3 kg m^-3"? I'd say that could be very confusing to leave the spaces out > ("3kgm^-3" could be read as "three per kilogramme cubed" because kgm is > occasionally used as an abbreviation for kilogramme), and seems inconsistent > (and would look odd) as "3kg m^-3". A space is *always* needed unless a solidus or slash (/) is used - otherwise "5 ms^-1" could be either 5 reciprocal milliseconds *or* 5 metres per second. There are good reasons for these